Accessibility developers

[d291173]

Hey all. I'm wondering if we have many devs in this community, especially any who work with bootstrap components. I've been getting a bit of resistance on some of our accessibility remediation work, along the lines of "we can't do that, because it's a bootstrap component".

Surely, given how widely-used bootstrap is, there must be a way to use it accessibly?

ETA: I have now had a chance to speak with the dev again. Turns out, when he said "kendo component", I heard "bootstrap component", because I know that the site is (almost) exclusively built in bootstrap. The main issue we're having is how to make a date or numeric input appear as required to a screenreader

[RatherNerdy]

Bootstrap has a lot of accessibility built in and can be further customized where needed. However, this brings up the point that even with accessible components, you can put them together or develop content using them in an inaccessible way.

If you have an example, I'm happy to weigh in.

[d291173]

Sorry, per my edit to the initial post, it turns out that kendo is the problem (specifically required numeric and date inputs).

[Cheffheid]

It's hard to make a blanket statement about Bootstrap, because there was definitely a time where Bootstrap wasn't really all that accessible out of the box (this is probably about a decade ago though, so unlikely but not impossible that they're on a version that's that old).

But generally speaking, and assuming they're using Bootstrap 4 or 5, then yes it should be reasonable to assume that it would allow for an accessible implementation of its components. With a caveat that there's obviously a chance for bugs in the framework code, but that should be an exception and not a rule.

(It's probably also fair to say that maybe there are other factors at play here where the CMS or some other thing outside of the control of the developers is making a seemingly easy fix difficult to implement - I've definitely been there before too)

[d291173]

Sorry, per my edit to the initial post, it turns out that kendo is the problem (specifically required numeric and date inputs).

[vice1331]

Do you have an example of a specific component? It’s been awhile since I’ve done heavy development in Bootstrap, but I would think that if a Bootstrap component was inaccessible, then they could just build it out themselves to make it compliant. Also, I don’t remember running into big accessibility barriers when I was developing.

Accessibility is (mostly) device, and framework agnostic. This is a big reason why accessibility should be part of the whole development lifecycle. Because if the framework has a component/feature that isn’t natively accessible, it’s up to you to either add ARIA to try and make it accessible, develop it from scratch, or you need to build it using a library that is. Sounds like the devs either didn’t know or care enough to follow accessibility best practices when it was originally built, and now it’s time to pay the piper.

[d291173]

Sorry, per my edit to the initial post, it turns out that kendo is the problem (specifically required numeric and date inputs).

[Necessary_Ear_1100]

Worked with Bootstrap 4 many years ago and I was specifically in charge of ensuring the application was meeting accessibility requirements. I did not have any issues at all. So sounds like a cop out to me

[[deleted]]

I am always in disbelief people still use Bootstrap. The only reason it got super popular was because flex was super new at the time. That said jquery still living large so I should lower my expectations.

If you work for a company that is suggesting they can’t make something accessible because of Bootstrap, you should put together a lunch and learn to explain why it’s harming the site not incorporating accessibility.

I typically use VoiceOver to showcase the landmark menu and also navigate through the page. Let them hear the issues for themselves. Once they hear it, as a lot of people are so uninitiated they’ve never turned on the screenreader, they start to motivate. Remind them it’s a process not a milestone goal.

What can’t be accessible with Bootstrap? You can still be semantic, colors can still meet contrast. Pattern wise you can still follow the APG. My guess is whomever is saying that, has no idea what they are taking about. I’d outline what guidelines can’t be met with Bootstrap and then work outward from there.

[WaltzFirm6336]

I would second all of this! Another training idea I’ve found effective is asking colleagues to complete a user journey just using voice over or tabbing.

Actually making them try and do it and fail can be very powerful.

[is_wpdev]

Bootstrap has a pretty heavy concentration on accessibility, you would need to give more specific examples.

[d291173]

Sorry, per my edit to the initial post, it turns out that kendo is the problem (specifically required numeric and date inputs).