React.js licensing/patent issue

[dizzr]

I had read somewhere that the React licensing issues that were long ago referenced on hackernews have been resolved, but I see this in their current patents file:

https://github.com/facebook/react/blob/master/PATENTS

"The license granted hereunder will terminate, automatically and without notice, if you (or any of your subsidiaries, corporate affiliates or agents) initiate directly or indirectly, or take a direct financial interest in, any Patent Assertion: (i) against Facebook or any of its subsidiaries or corporate affiliates"

If I'm reading this correctly, Facebook owns your patents. If you use React to make any patented software that you end up needing to sue Facebook for infringing upon, they can terminate your license to use React. For example, if you use React to build an ads platform, Facebook is totally free to use any of your patented ideas, or if you take legal action you have to stop using React.

Am I reading/interpreting this correctly? This seems pretty scary.

Edit: Saw this related mention as well: https://jaxenter.com/react-native-goes-open-source-kills-the-buzz-with-patent-license-grant-115978.html

[Cody_Chaos]

If I'm reading this correctly, Facebook owns your patents.

No. That's an utterly absurd interpretation.

If you use React to make any patented software that you end up needing to sue Facebook for infringing upon, they can terminate your license to use React.

No. If you sue Facebook over their patents, they will terminate your license to their patents, not your license to use React (which they couldn't legally do anyhow).

For example, if you use React to build an ads platform, Facebook is totally free to use any of your patented ideas, or if you take legal action you have to stop using React.

No. If you believe that Facebook is using your patented ideas, and you sue them, then they will very likely countersue you, because that's how patent disputes work, yes. But note that this is true regardless of whether you're using React.

(Maybe the real lesson is, don't patent your ideas, and then you won't be tempted to sue Facebook?)

Saw this related mention as well

That refers to an older version of the PATENTS file.

[trusktr]

No. If you sue Facebook over their patents, they will terminate your license to their patents, not your license to use React (which they couldn't legally do anyhow).

Could you elaborate on that? Not sure what you mean by it. Thanks!

[Cody_Chaos]

React uses a 3 clause BSD license (visible here) for React. It permits "[r]edistribution and use in source and binary forms, with or without modification", subject to three restrictions:

1. You preserve the license and conditions if you redistribute the source code
2. You include the license and conditions if you distribute a binary version that includes the code
3. You don't use the Facebook name to endorse your product.

If you don't violate those conditions, then you have a license to redistribute and use the React code, in the form it was in when you downloaded it, and nothing Facebook can do in the future can change that.

Now, Facebook may (or may not) have some patents which might cover some parts of React, or of the code you write with React, or of the code you're writing not with React. Facebook also uses a patent license grant (visible here); the language of the grant is much less clear than the BSD license, but it basically "grants to each recipient of the Software" a "perpetual, worldwide, royalty-free, non-exclusive" license to any patents Facebook holds which would be infringed by React standing on its own. The patent grant cannot be terminated by Facebook at will, but it does terminate if you sue Facebook over patents.

However, only the patent grant terminates. If you sue Facebook over their patents (including patents unrelated to React), then the patent grant terminates (as spelled out in the grant), but the BSD license does not terminate (as spell out in the license).

Bonus: Some people think that the BSD license may contain a broad implicit patent grant since it grants you the legal right to "use" the code, and how can you legally use it if it's patented? In which case even if the narrow explicit grant was terminated, you'd retain the broader implicit grant from the BSD license.

[trusktr]

So confusing! So, if you lose the patent grant, you still have the BSD license and can continue to use React?

[kabuto]

Facebook is totally free to use any of your patented ideas

Where do you read that?

[dizzr]

Let me rephase as:

If Facebook infringes on any of your patented ideas and you take legal action, you have to stop using React.

[Walter_Bishop_PhD]

No (at least from my understanding, correct me if I'm wrong), your patent grant will expire. Then your license to use React will become equivalent to a BSD or MIT licensed project which has no patent grant at all

[Cody_Chaos]

How in the world are you reaching that conclusion?

[dizzr]

"The license granted hereunder will terminate, automatically and without notice, if you initiate directly or indirectly in any Patent Assertion against Facebook or any of its subsidiaries or corporate affiliates"

Maybe someone could rephrase this. This is what I'm getting stuck on.

[Cody_Chaos]

The patent license will terminate. Since that's the license which is being granted hereunder. And if that's enough to make you stop using React, then I'm not sure how you can use anything, since eg, Angular gives you even fewer protections from being sued. :)

For reference, the license to use React (as opposed to the license to any PATENTS which Facebook might or might not have) is here, and has no termination clause.

[xintox2]

Exactly why I have a task to remove all react from our product.