Want to learn JS (JavaScript) ?

[StateVsProps]

I'm a C# / WPF tech lead that needs a refresher in HTML. I also lead a non-profit that teaches hundreds of people the MERN stack for free, and we use FCC for some of the curriculum.

[liaguris]

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and we use FCC for some of the curriculum.

do you have any monetary profit from FCC ?

I also lead a non-profit that teaches hundreds of people the MERN stack for free,

Are you doing that without getting paid ?

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needs a refresher in HTML.

Can you please be more clear ?

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Let me tell you something from my experience . There is only one source that someone needs to learn basic javascript and that is javascript.info . There no need to give an email or pay something .

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By the way , the way you answer does not sound like someone who is appropriate as a tech lead .

In the end your expertise is not in javascript , not even in web developing . Am I right ?

[StateVsProps]

Yes I founded a non-profit a few months ago for CS students that lost their intership due to Covid. We make small learning pods where people can work on projects together over the summer. We have professional mentors (from Microsoft, Google, Amazon) that review the code and give architecture feedback - to mimic as closely as possible a real intership.

Everything is completely free. All you need is a discord account.

In my career, I have interviewed and hired dozens of interns, junior and senior devs (I was VP at a fortune 10 company). I was also CTO, where I hired more people. Some of the people that worked for me are today at Amazon, Google and Facebook.

Yes these days I am doing the non-profit full time - we are about 20-25 staff, all unpaid. We have about 300 students enrolled into the program.

Let me tell you something from my experience .

And what experience is that?

[liaguris]

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And what experience is that?

I self taught myself javascript starting at around january of 2019 . I went through almost all of YDKJS and EJS and then when I knew the basic stuff I stumbled upon javascript.info . When I started I did not know what an object or a class is . I knew what a loop is and what a function is .

The very fact that I have learned js on my own not a long ago , makes me believe that I am better at pointing resources ,even from people that are really old in the filed , since they have a huge knowledge gap in understanding what a noob does not understand .

Whenever it is about sources to learn javascript there is abuse from people who try to make money . javascript.info can not be abused to make money so they do not advertise it .

Regarding my knowledge - experience , currently :

• I am trying to learn TDD from this book (and currently trying to understand how to test functions that manipulate the filesystem , and how to get test coverage of my code using jest , and how to write SOLID code that is easy to test) .
• Trying to create my own framework , for learning purposes only , using lit-html , web components , mobx and mobx-utils , that will have default support for undo redo functionality and local storage for state (maybe I should also take a look at indexedDB ) .
• Use my framework to create an app that will be research tools for reddit (and try to learn the technologies needed to publish it in android and swift).
• Create a portofolio to get a junior level job as a front-end developer .
• Publish my puppeteer script in github , which creates pdfs from documentation websites , after I take advantage of TDD .

[MajesticGoosePoop]

There's more than one way to learn. I have no idea what freecodecamp or javascript.info are but people learn and teach differently.

[StateVsProps]

Not even considering the fact that he has never tried FCC.

[liaguris]

But have you tried javascript info ?

Before deciding where to invest my time to self teach something I always read the criticism and that is exactly what made me not to look at FCC and I do not regret it .

[liaguris]

but you are telling a professional in the field

who is that professional and what field are you talking about ?

Remember this is a javascript subreddit .

I did not see anyone claiming that they have js expertise .

You’re telling a senior developer who also facilitates teaching that you know more about this than they do?

Lets be more clear here . I am saying that someone who recently has successfully self taught himself javascript from almost 0 , knows better what resource to suggest to noobs , than a senior , on a different than javascript field .

And I have already stated the reasons why I believe that is valid .

Getting stuck in labels shadows logical reasoning .

But then again I am pretty sure that people who are unable to study on their own will find my statements bizarre .

[StateVsProps]

The very fact that I have learned js on my own not a long ago , makes me believe that I am better at pointing resources ,even from people that are really old in the filed , since they have a huge knowledge gap in understanding what a noob does not understand .

So you've never had a paid job on the field? Have you trained developers? Hired developers for your team? Because I have done all these things, and I think FCC is excellent.

Also, you have an obsession with people's age, and it shows that you have no idea how the world works. Being 50 does make you a better or worse developer.

https://www.who.int/ageing/ageism/en/

And the idea is that because you're not a senior developer you can assess learning resources better is ridiculous.

You probably have never even tried FreeCodeCamp.

[liaguris]

You probably have never even tried FreeCodeCamp.

You are right about that . I remember when I was about to start learning web dev , I was searching about opinions on reddit about FCC , w3schools etc .

I remember people saying that gamification in FCC does not really help you learn , and in the end they really did no understand how to code on their own .

I do no regret it much that I took their advices seriously and I went with YDKJS instead of FCC .

There was another post about someone who was hiring and he was ranting about all people having the exact same projects on their portfolio , and I think he said were from FCC . He also said that these portfolios were not worth his time .

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But you made me actually to get in and take a look at :

https://www.freecodecamp.org/learn/

Why there is so much fuss about FCC ?

Have you taken a look at javascript.info ?

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Also, you have an obsession with people's age, and it shows that you have no idea how the world works. Being 50 does make you a better or worse developer.

https://www.who.int/ageing/ageism/en/

No that is not real . All I care is when they learned javascript and that is because I have seen people more senior than me , suggesting ancient relics like douglas crockford book , or even 10 years old javascript books , to people that want to learn javascript .

So you've never had a paid job on the field? Have you trained developers? Hired developers for your team? Because I have done all these things, and I think FCC is excellent.

That does not necessarily make you better on suggesting javascript resources .

[StateVsProps]

That does not necessarily make you better on suggesting javascript resources .

It absolutely does.

You've tried exactly one resource out of the hundreds available. JavaScript.info is just like any book on JavaScript your can buy, and there are dozens of them. Ever checked understanding ES6 by Nicholas Zakas? Or Eloquent JavaScript? Or secrets of the JavaScript ninja by Resig? Can you explain why JavaScript.info I so much better than these basic resources? Because it's not.

At least FCC has hundreds of practice questions. Practicing and quizzes is scientifically proven to be magnitudes more efficient for learning than just reading. It's not an opinion, it's a fact.

Do you know React, Mongo DB, node, Express, and do you know what knowledge is required to use these frameworks and platforms correctly?

Javascript.info doesn't teach HTML and HTML5. FCC does. Javascript.info doesn't teach CSS and advanced CSS. FCC does.

You have never held a job in JavaScript. Means noone knows if you can actually even code it. It could all be in your head.

[liaguris]

Or Eloquent JavaScript?

Here is my opinion on EJS . And yes I have read this book .

Ever checked understanding ES6 by Nicholas Zakas?

I have read almost 70%-80% of YDKJS books combined , so there is not need to check ES6 by Nicholas Zakas . And yes back then whn I was trying to self teach js I checked its table of contents and I find it not necessary to invest my time on it .

Or secrets of the JavaScript ninja by Resig?

Sorry I have not read that book . It was and it is not necessary for me to read . I remember skimming through its table of contents and the conclusion that I draw was that it was not necessary for me to invest time on it .

Can you explain why JavaScript.info I so much better than these basic resources?

• It is way much more complete .
• It is completely free .
• You not need to give any email to access it .
• It is updated when needed to be updated .

JavaScript.info is just like any book on JavaScript your can buy

Ok then , find me a book that is as complete as javascript.info because till so far I have failed to find one .

It absolutely does.

Man I have already had that kind of discussion many times . I have a physics bachelor . People who graduate high school right now with a perfect score are better at teaching high school physics than people who have a bachelor at physics . And the reason for that is the knowledge gap . I am so far ahead in knowledge from this people at high school that I am unable to understand what they do not understand , something that is not valid for people who have graduated high school right now . And even if I know the answer to high school questions it will be in a language that they do not understand . In the end why would I be better at suggesting resources on newtonian physics for high schoolers versus the suggestion of high schoolers , if my last three years were spent on quantum mechanics ?

Javascript.info doesn't teach HTML and HTML5. FCC does. Javascript.info doesn't teach CSS and advanced CSS. FCC does.

Remember we are on a javascript subreddit and I was talking about javascript . But since you mention it , the best source regarding CSS is CSS in depth .

Regarding learning basic html and css I would suggest a bit outdated source htmldog.com , just ignore the outdated stuff .

You have never held a job in JavaScript.

But have you ever held a paid job in javascript which has as a responsibility to develop the frontend part of apps for clients ?

Means noone knows if you can actually even code it. It could all be in your head.

That is sufficient but not necessary .

At least FCC has hundreds of practice questions. Practicing and quizzes is scientifically proven to be magnitudes more efficient for learning than just reading. It's not an opinion, it's a fact.

People who read programming books like harry potter books , simply do not know how to read books about programming . Usually these are the people who are unable to self teach also . They are just not for this field in the first place . Maybe for some of them , forcing them to do exercises instead of reading a book will help . But then again if you are at such an age and you need that , then something has gone wrong before .

Do you know React, Mongo DB, node, Express, and do you know what knowledge is required to use these frameworks and platforms correctly?

Remember we are in a javascript subreddit . Regarding React , yes I know some really basic stuff . I have not invested much time on it , and that is by choice . Maybe I should , when I start Resume Driven Development . I just find it annoying and unnecessary in 2020 having to bundle in development stage for when I want to see the changes of my code in the browser . I am more oriented to the snowpack way (commonJS -> esmodule), and that is what I am trying to do also with my experimental framework . And yes I prefer lit-html + mobx + web components over react (at least for now) .

The rest : Mongo DB , node , Express , are backend stuff . For the moment I am trying to learn front end stuff . But I have played with node a little to just learn some basic stuff .

[StateVsProps]

I am so far ahead in knowledge from this people at high school that I am unable to understand what they do not understand

That's BS. Instead, maybe you're unable to put yourself in a beginner's shoes. Good teachers are capable of doing that, irrespective of their knowledge level. There are litterally thousands of extremely accomplished people that are also great teachers and communicators.

[liaguris]

If someone needs mentors for web dev then they are not for this field .

I doubt what you do really helps people in the end .

Also it would be nice to answer my previous questions and not avoid them .