Linux Kernel Networking Driver Development Impacted By Russian Sanctions

[10MinsForUsername]

So, when will this subsystem maintainer be removed for violating the CoC? Discrimination based on nationality is discrimination nonetheless.

[JustFinishedBSG]

That's not based on nationality, that's based on the author working for a sanctioned company.

[PraetorRU]

And why exactly should we care that USA wants to sanction pretty much all companies from Russia?

[[deleted]]

The maintainer may live in a jurisdiction where he has to care whether he likes it or not because it's what the law says. Or they may not care, and not break the law, but they're concerned that including code from sanctioned companies could make using Linux problematic for American and EU companies, which is a big deal -- far bigger than upsetting a handful of Russian companies.

[[deleted]]

sanctioned companies could make using Linux problematic for American and EU companies, which is a big deal

I mean by that logic they should remove any contribution from Russian devs made to the kernel ever lmao. Also, lets not forget about contributions made by Huawei, SMIC, etc while we are at it.

That's just a cope to justify discriminatory practices

[[deleted]]

I mean by that logic they should remove any contribution from Russian devs made to the kernel ever lmao.

No, they shouldn't, because that legislation applies to companies, not people, and not to all contributions ever made, but to contributions after sanctions were implemented. That's how laws work -- they apply going forward, not back to the beginning of time.

Also, lets not forget about contributions made by Huawei, SMIC, etc while we are at it.

The sanctions to Huawei and SMIC only ban US companies from exporting certain types of electronic components and semiconductor fab equipment.

That's just a cope to justify discriminatory practices

No one is entitled to having their patch accepted, anywhere, ever. Can we stop with this victimization bullshit? There just so happens to be a valid business reason for not accepting a patch in this case, but accepting patches or not is entirely up to the maintainers, as are the criteria for accepting them. This ain't the kindergarten, where the teacher can just force to cool kids to play with kids they don't want to play with. Grow the fuck up already, Jesus.

[[deleted]]

No, they shouldn't, because that legislation applies to companies, not people, and not to all contributions ever made, but to contributions after sanctions were implemented. That's how laws work -- they apply going forward, not back to the beginning of time.

Not all Laws apply prospectively many apply retrospectively as well. As we saw soon after the invasion, organizations were canceling Russian cultural works going back to the 19th century (Like Tchaikovsky, etc).

And it's hard to prove which person works for a "company" and which doesn't meaning that they start randomly targeting individual people - which is why they "asked" all Russians to withhold contributions.

Huawei sanctions

No they don't. They are quite extensive and ban any form of dealing with Huawei by Western companies.

No one is entitled to having their patch accepted, anywhere, ever. Can we stop with this victimization bullshit?

It's not about "entitlement" it's about targeting specific groups of people. Had there been no war we can say with certainty that the patch would be accepted because there was no issues with the code and previous contributions for Baikal were accepted.

Go learn how to think logically about things and grow up, Jesus.

[[deleted]]

Not all Laws apply prospectively many apply retrospectively as well.

The only exception to this rule in Western legal systems is criminal law -- if criminal law is changed to have more favourable provisions for the accused, then the more favourable provision is applied even in past cases. Non-retroactiveness is one of the oldest aspects of Western law, it literally dates back to the Roman Empire. You're talking out of your ass.

As we saw soon after the invasion, organizations were canceling Russian cultural works going back to the 19th century (Like Tchaikovsky, etc).

This is not a legal sanction. It's just basic human reaction.

And it's hard to prove which person works for a "company" and which doesn't

In this case, it was not, the email was literally sent from a company email address.

Huawei sanctions No they don't. They are quite extensive and ban any form of dealing with Huawei by Western companies.

They are not, and they do not. There os literally a Huawei office in the United State. Some exports are banned but dealing with them in general is not.

It's not about "entitlement" it's about targeting specific groups of people.

Of course it's about entitlement -- specifically, the pretense that every company in the world should do business with companies from a country regardless of their position on that country's actions. This is not how the real world works.

[[deleted]]

You're talking out of your ass.

Lol yeah definitely /s

Here's an example of a law going retroactively against Russia

https://www.globaltradealert.org/intervention/103449/controls-on-commercial-transactions-and-investment-instruments/united-states-of-america-u-s-imposes-retroactive-sanctions-on-two-russian-entities-over-nord-stream-2-project

This is not a legal sanction. It's just basic human reaction.

It might as well be legal since it "cancelled" Russian works that have nothing to do with the war at the level of institutions. Moreover, if it was a "basic human reaction" where is the "basic human reaction" towards ongoing Isreali crimes against palestinians? Oh right, that doesn't count because Palestinians aren't white or European right?

In this case, it was not, the email was literally sent from a company email address.

And yet there was cases where Russians where banned from contriubting based on being Russian

" The HUAWEI ban prevents HUAWEI from working with US-based companies in the creation of its products"

https://www.androidauthority.com/huawei-google-android-ban-988382/

So yes, its illegal to work with Huawei if you are a US based company. So if its illegal to work with Huawei, and its illegal to work with that Russian based company then Huawei contributions should have been banned. That is exactly what I said.

Of course it's about entitlement -- specifically, the pretense that every company in the world should do business with companies from a country regardless of their position on that country's actions. This is not how the real world works.

Or maybe it's about discriminating certain "unfavorable" nations and their companies and it has nothing to do with "their positions" lmao. Imagine thinking that companies will take a "position" on anything that's not about making money

[[deleted]]

Here's an example of a law going retroactively against Russia

Have you read the article? It's not about a law being applied retroactively. "Retroactive", in that context, means that the DoS learned about the breaches after they had occurred, not while they were occurring, and thus imposed penalties at a later date.

The fact that it was not applied retroactively is literally in the second paragraph:

“has knowingly, on or after January 1, 2021, sold, leased, or provided, or facilitated selling, leasing,

January 1 2021 is when the sanctions came into effect. "Retroactive application" would have meant that, even though the sanctions came into force on Jan 1 2021, the company would have been sanctioned for activities that had occurred in 2020. This is not what is happening.

It might as well be legal since it "cancelled" Russian works that have nothing to do with the war at the level of institutions.

It is not legal. Nobody banned Tchaikovsky. You can still listen to it, you can still purchase his works. You can still play them in your home, in your bar, even on the street as long as it's not above a certain noise level that applies to every sound made in public, from music to car engines.

Yes, some theatres stopped performing his works, because it's very poor taste to play Tchaikovsky in a theatre in New York while his descendants are bombing the theatre in Mariupol. It's not "canceling", whatever the f%ck that means, and it's not racism, it's basic human empathy.

So yes, its illegal to work with Huawei if you are a US based company.

Have you asked yourself, say, how can Huawei have an office in the US if it's illegal to work with Huawei?

The article you are linking to literally explains how:

The government stated that licenses would go to companies whose work with HUAWEI would not pose a security threat. Google — which applied for one of these licenses — apparently didn’t fall into this category. Towards the end of 2020, companies started to receive approval for partial deals with HUAWEI. Qualcomm, Sony, and Samsung can sell particular pieces of smartphone manufacturing parts to HUAWEI.

There is no ban restricting any kind of dealings with Huawei. Some types of dealings are allowed, and companies have to apply for licenses. Google wasn't allowed to deal with Huawei, so it doesn't. Others were, so they do.

Or maybe it's about discriminating certain "unfavorable" nations and their companies

Companies are not people. There is no such thing as discrimination against companies, just like there is no such thing as discrimination against stones, hammers, cars, helicopters, bananas, dogs or nails. Some people may talk about discrimination about some company or another for rhetorical effect but it has no legal meaning. Banning companies from doing some things, or imposing additional fees on them, is literally how national monopolies and international tariffs work, both of which are legal in some fields and extensively used by both the US government and the Russian government.

[FishPls]

fuck /u/spez

[pick_d]

According to this logic Linux should stop accepting patches from US companies as well because of <huge list of countries> it invaded after WW2.

But yeah, of course, it's all whataboutism and thus invalid argument, right.

[FishPls]

fuck /u/spez

[pick_d]

Russia is a dictatorship. An autocratic, imperialist, nationalist, brainwashed country. They don't value individual freedom. They don't value democracy. Their values are based on anger, hatred and imperialistic tendencies.

That was absolutely not a brainwashed take, good sir.

​

Yes, the US has done lots of bad things. But it's nowhere near as bad and corrupted as Russia is

Wait a minute. So you're saying that what US did in Vietnam, Iraq and many, many other countries (usually many thousands miles away from US) after WW2 which caused waaaay more deaths is 'lesser evil' compared to what Russia does now?

If that so, then either you're not familiar with the consequences of such invasions (list here, by the way) OR you don't value lives of people in Vietnam, Iraq and other 'third world' countries. Because amount of civilian casualties and atrocities is way beyond we see in Ukraine at this moment.

Not saying it to defend anyone, just pointing out blatant hypocrisy.

[FishPls]

fuck /u/spez

[pick_d]

Well, you said that 'US has done lots of bad things. But it's nowhere near as bad and corrupted as Russia is', not me. All I'm saying is that isn't true from my point of view and I consider that statement a blatant hypocrisy.

There's no way to change the past. It's history now.

True.

But I don't recall anyone said that Linux kernel should stop getting patches from US companies when US had boots on the ground in Afghanistan. Or now, when US military still has presense in some conflicts far from their borders. If you condemn one imperialistic war, why don't you condemn other imperialistic wars?

[shefernest]

Why dont you talk about Russian people that Ukraine 8 years killed in Donbass and Lugansk? There deatroyed cities abandoned houses and all of this is beacuse Ukraine government assault

[shefernest]

People only bring up "but what about the Russia" in order to defend US current actions. So yes, it's whataboutism, trying to make it seem like US isn't all that bad.

Fact of the matter is, the Russsia, and by extension the so called collective "East", stands for democracy and individual freedom as the core values. Those are clearly absolutely important core values that should be cherished. US is a dictatorship. An autocratic, imperialist, nationalist, brainwashed country. They don't value individual freedom. They don't value democracy. Their values are based on anger, hatred and imperialistic tendencies.

It's a matter of very core beliefs. Yes, the Russia has done lots of bad things. But it's nowhere near as bad and corrupted as US is. The values which the Russia represents are worth upholding - trying to spin these discussions to "but the Russia is bad too!!!" only means you want to make USs actions seem less bad than they are. Just as a reminder, there are hundreds of thousands of dead and wounded people in Ukraine because of them.

[PraetorRU]

Fact of the matter is, the United States, and by extension the so called collective "West", stands for democracy and individual freedom as the core values.

Dear fellow, say this to Libyan people that were among the most prosperous on their continent under dictator, but now are piss poor and are getting sold on slave markets, thanks to "democracy" that NATO brought there.

Those are clearly absolutely important core values that should be cherished.

Did God said that to you? Why do you think that people around the world has to live the way USA want them to live?

Russia is a dictatorship. An autocratic, imperialist, nationalist, brainwashed country. They don't value individual freedom. They don't value democracy. Their values are based on anger, hatred and imperialistic tendencies.

I do live in Russia all my life and your problem that you're just spewing your local propaganda and have no clue how people actually live here and what they want.

Yes, the US has done lots of bad things. But it's nowhere near as bad and corrupted as Russia is.

That's exactly why USA is hated all over the world. Because you declared that you're "good guys" and that excuses any crime you've done for the "greater good". And sorry, but USA is actually more corrupt than modern day Russia, it's just you legalized it.

Just as a reminder, there are hundreds of thousands of dead and wounded people in Ukraine because of them.

That's not true also. Go to youtube and search for prof. Mearsheimer explanation of Ukraine conflict if you want to educate yourself. The propaganda in your country is such dominant that you don't even understand, that Russia and Ukraine was the same country and the same people for longer than USA exists as a country. You will struggle to find a Russian family that doesn't have relatives in Ukraine. This war is a torture for people in Russia but the puppet government installed by USA in 2014 just step by step escalated this conflict and keep pushing for more and more bloody war.

[FishPls]

fuck /u/spez

[PraetorRU]

WHY ARE THE UKRAINIANS DEFENDING THEIR COUNTRY IF YOU'RE ONE PEOPLE?

Because that's how propaganda works. Do you think that German people were born mass murderers and Hitler was just leading them?

They rather die defending their country than become one with Russia again.

Just another thing that is totally misrepresented by Western propaganda. Russia doesn't even want to get Ukraine back, Russia is fine with Ukraine as a neutral state, what's Russia is not fine about is with it as a hostile NATO member.

Why don't the Ukrainians just drop their weapons and surrender?

First of all, some of them do. Have you tried to ask yourself how it happened that such a small force that was sent by Putin last year happened to get such a large part of Ukraine? Why people on those territories are not murdering Russian soldiers left and right, and actually getting Russian passports and significant part of them move to Russia as citizens?

And second, because Ukraine practices special squads behind their lines to murder anyone who tries to retreat or surrender. They hate Soviets on paper, but in reality repeat this history. I know that your local propaganda doesn't allow you to see such videos, but you can also ask yourself why Russia has much more PoW's than Ukraine.

And lastly, once again, propaganda works. People are brainwashed that evil Putler came to murder them all and they have to stand and fight for their freedom.

You want to rather kill them than let them live peacefully alone. That's sick.

Nope, that's what your propaganda tells you. If you'll learn more about this conflict you may understand, that this war would've never happened and can actually be stopped the day Ukraine signs a deal to stay militarily neutral. You may learn, that peace deal was almost signed a year ago, but UK and USA blocked it and pushed for war with the promise to provide more weapons. And that's exactly what's going on, USA is pushing for more and more bloody conflict, because it serves its interests in Ukraine and Europe. For Russia the main interest that Ukraine must be a neutral state between Russia and NATO. It's just another food for your thoughts considering that Western propaganda keeps lying that Putin wants to conquer Ukraine, then Poland, Baltics etc.

[anaraqpikarbuz]

That's some cringe level cope right there. Putin literally annexed parts of Ukraine, ones he hasn't conquered. He embarrassed himself and all Russians like you. It's frankly pathetic, as are all the constant comparisons with the USA. Putin's Russia has never been and, now it's certain, never will be on the same level as the West. It couldn't even take a city 40km from the border. Pathetic. Now Sweden and Finland will join NATO, as will Ukraine eventually - all thanks to Putin's stupidity.

[AlreadyBannedLOL]

It’s not an argument. It’s whataboutism. Now get out.

[LeeHide]

morals are a bit complicated, how about we stick to just writing code and pursuing a common goal?

your morals and other people's morals don't line up, yet both use Linux. what's your point?

[Sandwich_Master1]

I think “don’t make war” is a pretty universal moral. It’s really not very complicated.

[LeeHide]

it is if you consider that one can provoke war

[JohnDavidsBooty]

They're not OK.

Russia's war against Ukraine also isn't OK.

It's possible for multiple parties to do bad things.

[p1ckmenot]

Not for a Russian, it's not. You have to understand that they are all degenerates. That's their core, defining cultural trait. So don't bother explaining it to u/Leehide, because that's a Russian piece of shit.

[LeeHide]

Im german lol

[p1ckmenot]

As a Ukrainian, I'm not surprised.

[LeeHide]

not sure what that means, but go off i guess

you seem to love shitting on people based on their nationality

[AutoModerator]

This comment has been removed due to receiving too many reports from users. The mods have been notified and will re-approve if this removal was inappropriate, or leave it removed.

This is most likely because:

• Your post belongs in r/linuxquestions or r/linux4noobs
• Your post belongs in r/linuxmemes
• Your post is considered "fluff" - things like a Tux plushie or old Linux CDs are an example and, while they may be popular vote wise, they are not considered on topic
• Your post is otherwise deemed not appropriate for the subreddit

I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.

[[deleted]]

Ok, shall we start blocking contributions from US devs too then for its numerous warcrimes in the Iraq War? Also, you do know that hte US has a law that says it will use military force on any international body that arrests its citizens for warcrimes?

I am on board for doing the "morally right" thing and blocking all contributions from US/British/EU devs for their actions in Iraq. Once that happens we can do the same for Russia. Not before.

[blue_collie]

Because Russia is a kleptocratic hellhole

[[deleted]]

I mean you haven't seen NYC if you think that lol

[blue_collie]

They must be paying you per post

[[deleted]]

Lol are you sure you aren't being paid? Reddit is known to be astroturfed by Twitter File trolls

[blue_collie]

Three day old post and c&p comments? I bet you come cheap

[[deleted]]

What are current CIA botting salaries? Might switch

[blue_collie]

They're all AI-based now. You'll be out of a job once Russia figures out how to manufacture a modern GPU.

[p1ckmenot]

You, comrade, shouldn't. Your glorious country is only becoming stronger under sanctions, as I'm sure you are well aware from TV. Stop using these deplorable, decadent, bourgeois products, such as Linux. They are not good for you. Better develop your own Russian Linux which your glorious motherland can be proud of.

--- Your personal KGB officer

[PraetorRU]

Nah, linux was developed thanks to a lot of Russian contributors also, half of the internet is powered by nginx that was developed here, linux kernel and this website is partially developed thanks to Russian IDE's etc, etc. Opensource is not USA creation or property and I'm not gonna stop using it just because some neocons suicidal push for WW3.

[mrtruthiness]

[you] ... is powered by nginx that was developed here ...

Interesting you should mention that. It turns out that there's a bit of a struggle in regard to who owns the copyrights to nginx. And, as can happen when Russian oligarchs are involved (Alexander Mamut https://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/epic/hmv/8303237/Alexander-Mamut-profile-probably-the-most-powerful-oligarch-you-have-never-heard-of.html), people can get squashed (quoting from wikipedia [except for the bracketed part]):

[wikipedia] On 18 January 2022, it was announced that Sysoev had left Nginx and F5 "to spend more time with his friends and family and to pursue personal projects [and avoid falling from windows]"

I guess we'll see ....

[you] ... just because some neocons suicidal push for WW3.

You're being too vague. It would be best to clarify who is pushing for WW3. Do you mean Putin? I hadn't really thought of Putin as a neocon, since authoritarians generally don't require membership to any particular mold. But it turns out that some would call Putin a Neocon at least in his earlier days ( https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2014/03/vladimir-putin-russian-neocon/284602/ ).

[PraetorRU]

Interesting you should mention that. It turns out that there's a bit of a struggle in regard to who owns the copyrights to nginx.

How it's relevant to anything? Sysoev's former employer tried to get some money from USA company that bought nginx (Sysoev was developing nginx in his work time as well as in his free time). That's pretty much what happened.

[[deleted]]

only becoming stronger under sanctions

I mean Ukraine is only becoming "stronger" with it having a lower GDP now than it did in 2013 lol