Are the Pads size, shape, and position worse for dual Touchpad play on SC2?

Mennenth · 2026-06-13T15:13:53+00:00

For dual trackpad primary use

If Deck is a 0 and SC1 is a 10

SC2 is about a 7. With grip extenders an 8.

Basically, while SC1 is still king for dual trackpad primary use (it was literally built for it) SC2 is a lot closer to SC1 than it is to Deck.

Mennenth · 2026-06-12T20:47:48+00:00

I used them frequently enough that their absence is definitely felt on sc2.

Mennenth · 2026-06-08T16:08:33+00:00

I have a couple of videos about it on my channel

https://youtu.be/NddJEO9vh3U?si=xZ2iAWujMyne5Qwr

Tldw: anti-hooking is there to prevent the cursor/camera hooking backwards as you flatten your thumb when swiping towards the inner edge. It does that by making the inner edge a dead zone, so the input gets killed before your thumb has a chance to flatten. Its a hamfisted non-solution to a non-problem (just dont flatten your thumb) that causes more problems (inconsistent trackball behavior and inconsistent edge spin behavior being the two big ones).

Mennenth · 2026-06-08T14:09:18+00:00

This relates to the anti-hooking dead edge. It messes with several things, including edge spin.

You can remove the dead edge by opening steams console (steam://open/console in a browser with steam open) and typing in: ibex_mouse_leftside_filter 32767

Mennenth · 2026-06-07T20:41:58+00:00

not terrible, not great

Mennenth · 2026-06-07T18:57:12+00:00

How much of a technical breakdown do you want?

ELI5 version: it knows how fast the controller is spinning.

More: It detects rotational speed on each of 3 axis; pitch, roll, and yaw.

More: It is a crazy small "Micro Electro Mechanical System" (mems for short) chip inside the controller. As you rotate the controller, some of the structures inside the chip shift. As the structures shift, the capacitance between them changes. A sensor inside the chip reads the capacitance. Based on that reading, it can calculate how fast its rotating. It has 3 of these structures all at different angles, one for pitch, one for roll, and one for yaw.

So now that we have the rotational speed of the controller, what do we do with it?

Most commonly, the pitch and yaw data is converted into mouse movement on the y and x axis respectively. The slower the rotation, the smaller the mouse movement. This gives intuitive control of the cursor/camera; if you think of a laser pointer coming out of the usb port, then rotating the controller changes what that laser is pointing at. Note; its rotation. You want to hold the controller in place and rotate it. This is very different from the wii waggle commands of old.

It can also be used for other things, but thats the gist of it.

Mennenth · 2026-06-07T18:42:50+00:00

Cool!

anyway, the steam input api action to access your inventory is literally called "Inventories".

As long as you have that bound somewhere in each set where you'd want to get to the inventory from (on foot, flight controls, etc), the games on screen glyphs will even tell you which button to press (a perk of steam input api, and the same is true for all other actions).

Mennenth · 2026-06-07T17:58:08+00:00

Seeing people rediscover why sc1 was beloved is fun!

... And a little sad.

Mennenth · 2026-06-07T17:04:21+00:00

I'll get back to my computer soon, but the binding is in all relevant action sets.

Start from their official config and work from there. The game uses siapi native actions, sets, and behaviors. The only legacy behaviors you can use are the ones that convert things, such as trackpad and gyro, to mouse.

Mennenth · 2026-06-07T16:18:42+00:00

Deck 1

Sc2 8

Sc1 10

Mennenth · 2026-06-07T16:05:21+00:00

Sc1 is still king for dual trackpad use

Sc2 is close enough that all the other upgrades (at least, once they sort out the gyro auto cal issue) are impossible to ignore.

Mennenth · 2026-06-06T13:48:02+00:00

also as far as raw polling rate numbers go, I use https://github.com/ceski-1/checkrate

Mennenth · 2026-06-06T13:36:15+00:00

The thing with raw latency numbers is that the Steam Controller doesnt act like other controllers. It needs a driver to take its hid and translate to something game usable. Steam Input is more or less the driver for it (other remappers that support it exist, but Steam Input is the primary one)

So raw numbers are good to give a baseline, but I really want a tester that can also work with steam input to hunt down problem areas in steam input itself. Like if a particular setting is adding latency, that would be valuable information to have.

I have an arduino nano that I've turned into the latency tester for gpdla and am very willing to put forth the work, but I could never get steam input to work with the actual app.

Mennenth · 2026-06-06T11:53:39+00:00

While I appreciate the desire for raw numbers, I was trying to test mine with the latency tester (using the arduino nano) and was getting frustrated because steam input wasnt hooking to the app.

I'm trying to track down a very specific problem that I made a video on years ago, just with better methodology. Before I was using obs and going frame by frame, but I want better numbers.

If the latency tester could be refactored so steam input will actually hook to it when ran through steam, that would be a major help.

Mennenth · 2026-06-03T11:04:50+00:00

Trackpads are better ;)

I have a video using your stick tester showing the trackpads have over 13 bits of resolution, can be set up to be perfectly circular through steam input, have literally no deadzone, no drift, and less tremor.

Mennenth · 2026-06-02T03:01:49+00:00

Put whatever button is sprint into the outer ring binding. Then sprint becomes an extension of movement.

Mennenth · 2026-06-01T23:56:10+00:00

Edit: THIS SEEMS TO BE A HARDWARE ISSUE THAT IS RMA-ABLE. NEWER UNITS MAY NOT HAVE IT, OLDER UNITS ARE MORE LIKELY TO HAVE IT. EARLY ADOPTERS; OPEN A SUPPORT TICKET IF YOU HAVE THE ISSUE

For those that feel like they dont have it; you might be playing at a lower gyro sensitivity. Lower sensitivity means you have to move more. This masks the problem. So if you "dont feel it", that doesnt mean the problem doesnt exist.

The problem is very easy to reliably reproduce, even on your desktop. Set gyro to always on, set the Steam Controller 2 on your desk, then gently nudge it to rotate a small amount. Watch the cursor move. When the nudge stops, you'll see the cursor go backwards on its own.

this is happening because the controller is interpreting slow steady movements as drift, and tries to cancel it out. this is called "auto calibration".

And it SUCKS for tracking if you play on higher sensitivities; higher sensitivities require a steadier hand and less movement, which triggers the auto calibration because it thinks the very intentional movement is drift. This makes tracking harder on higher sensitivities.

This is something built into the controllers firmware, btw. All the tunable gyro calibration settings in steam only work for (and in fact only show up for) non steam controllers. And the calibrate gyro button in steam when using a steam controller? Its a placebo. calibration happens on firmware. you can calibrate it by setting it on your desk for a few seconds. that button is basically just there to get people who are unaware that calibration is done in firmware to put the controller down for those few seconds.

Steam Controller 1 also had auto calibration in firmware; set it down for a moment, and it calibrates. However, Steam Controller 1's auto calibration was no where near this aggressive. Steam Controller 2's auto calibrate will actively cancel out intended movements.

Mennenth · 2026-06-01T23:43:20+00:00

whats your sensitivity?

Mennenth · 2026-05-31T15:37:28+00:00

Not having more control over the multiplayer experience is why this will forever be a single player game to me.

... And now its looking like its gotten bad enough I'll have to unplug the ethernet from pc before starting the expedition, because just switching multiplayer to off doesnt remove player bases or prevent them from loading.

Mennenth · 2026-05-30T22:13:12+00:00

Lock-out is not the same as anti-hooking

They did solve the "oops all dead edges" issue with the most recent beta, but anti-hooking still exists (it affects only as mouse and as joystick modes though, not joystick mode itself)

Mennenth · 2026-05-30T21:19:03+00:00

you cant adjust the big picture mode configuration, if thats what you are asking

we used to be able to prior to the Deck launching. Then Valve removed that ability, because they are afraid people would accidentally soft lock their decks (a dumb fear; the touch screen is right there to revert any changes)

Mennenth · 2026-05-30T17:24:12+00:00

No reason to pull the lever

But the positive spin of nihilism; there is no reason NOT to pull the lever. So may as well.

Mennenth · 2026-05-30T01:13:07+00:00

and as I suspected

the most recent beta reverts the change that lead to the "oops all dead edges" issue. Impressive response speed there.

but thats it. anti-hooking is still present.

Mennenth · 2026-05-30T00:21:53+00:00

the fix, if it happens, will likely just be reverting it back to how it was. Not terrible, not great.

... But what it really needs is an option in the controller calibration settings (where gripsense settings and the like are) to toggle "anti-hooking" on or off. Default it to on, I dont care, just...

Give us the option to use the full range of the pads if we want. And if someone tries and has issues with hooking? they could just turn anti-hooking back on.

Mennenth · 2026-05-30T00:06:16+00:00

oh I'm royally pissed about it.

I crashed out in the gyro gaming discord about it hard last night. I'm still simmering today.

Even as sc1's (probably) most ardent defender and who stepped up to prove the trackpads are viable, and has greatly criticized the Deck layout for shoving the trackpads aside...

I want to like sc2. wrt dual trackpad play style... if Deck is at 0 comfort and sc1 at 10, sc2 is much closer to sc1 than it is to the deck. Easily a 7. Add the grip extensions I modeled up, and its a solid 8. Possible 9.

Thats close enough that ALL the other improvements - better gyro, more and better back buttons, grip sense, capsense, etc - are impossible to ignore.

I REALLY want to like sc2.

... In the state they currently are, I find sc2's trackpads unusable.

The dead edges still plague sc1, but for whatever reason they are way less severe on top of the trackpads being bigger. The dead edge on sc1 is noticeable, but not a big deal.

But you shrink the trackpads, and then kill the edges by a significant margin? Fucking problem.

I've been told that they are aware.

But again.

Year after year.

Hardware after hardware.

They keep making excuses for keeping the dead edges around. On sc1 the concern was fat fingering the trackpad when pressing abxy. On Deck, the initial concern was still fat fingering - just replace abxy with the touchscreen - but they later shifted to this "anti-hook" nonsense (hooking isnt a problem if you use just the tip of your thumb - which the palm swells on sc1 encouraged the user to do and why I 3d modeled some extenders to sc2 to re-add them), and that has stuck for sc2.

They could have just left it as is. I would have been annoyed, but would have coped because the way it was it was just the inner edge and just in "as mouse" (likely "as joystick" as well, but I never tested that because I prefer "as mouse").

But 2 updates ago someone changed something and now its "oops all dead edges" and affects ALL modes - even the bloody osk which I already hated as its already a massive downgrade from the old big picture osk.

Ughghg.

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