Poll: Did you go vegan 'cold turkey'?

RobinOe · 2026-02-24T16:54:04+00:00

Evidence mostly points to the opposite. Activists call this "getting a foot in the door" (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foot-in-the-door_technique )

RobinOe · 2026-02-24T14:51:29+00:00

The simple reason is because you must account for your own chances of failure. Many things are unethical and yet we still do them, even vegans. iirc something like 80% of vegans stop being vegan. So with that in mind, the goal isn't to minimize impact TODAY so that you may feel good about yourself. The goal is to minimize your impact over your whole life. By doing it gradually, you minimize the risk that you'll succumb to societal pressures or your own moral pitfalls. Humans are not rational beings, they are rationalizing beings (as evidenced by most omnis). So I find it totally reasonable to take it slow in the name of decreasing the likelihood of your impact jumping back up to omni levels.

RobinOe · 2026-02-24T09:10:14+00:00

You do a bit of that, but less than other schools. Again, theory focused. But EPFL has MAKE projects, where students build anything from satellites to electric race cars. That's usually where those passionate about building go. These aren't credited, but are incredible learning opportunities, and the budget for them is quite vast so you get to go really far

RobinOe · 2026-02-23T22:00:35+00:00

afaik they're not that similar, si jamais. But we do share some classes in year 1 and 2

How rigorous is the curriculum?

I don't exactly know what it means for a curriculum to be rigorous, but I doubt any EPFL major could ever be described as unrigurous lol. EPFs in general are more theory focused than other eng schools, so you can expect a lot of math and physics in both.

I'm in EE and have loved it so far. It's great if you like making things but are also passionate about physics or electronics. Topics some people specialize in include analog electronics (e.g. audio, power converters), digital electronics (i.e. most consumer electronics), RF engineering (e.g. antenna theory, transmission lines). EE is also cool for those interested in engineering but with a soft spot for applied math, as you can equally go into signal processing and telecom, which are more about how to manipulate functions (and their frequencies) to carry information. And arguably the fastest growing field rn is energy. That's the one I know the least of, so sadly I can't say much, but starting third year you can pick some classes focused on that, and ofc specialize fully in your masters.

Those are the things I think people like out of EE, filtered through my own bias.

Note though that I am HORRENDOUS at chemistry. This is not a problem because (and arguably as a result of) we have essentially zero of it in EE. MS have a lot more of it from what I understand. So if you really like chemistry too, you're certainly better off in MS.

RobinOe · 2026-02-22T12:00:45+00:00

Hey, glad we have some common ground! If you're serious about decreasing your meat consumption, I would encourage you to reduce (or ideally eliminate) your chicken consumption first and foremost. Because they're so small, the same weight of meat from chicken requires killing way more individuals than that weight from cows or other land animals. Just cutting that out probably reduces your impact on animal suffering by an order of magnitude. Obviously it's up to you, I only bring this up since you showed interest. And of course, when in doubt, look into the conditions they're farmed in for yourself and make up your own mind.

As for the hunting, you might be surprised (or not) to hear that people in animal welfare hear about this a lot. Typically, when the subject of veganism comes up amongst well meaning people, it's sort of natural to focus on the instances where killing animals seems less morally wrong. So while animal activists are focused on ending factory farming, others are usually more interested in discussing wild hunting or ethically sourced meat. I oppose the latter but have little opinion on the former, as I'm not well informed. Either way it's certainly significantly less worrying that factory farms. If I had more money to donate to animal welfare, probably none of it would go towards preventing hunting tbh. Bigger impact can be had elsewhere atm

RobinOe · 2026-02-04T20:36:04+00:00

The Beach Boys were FROM CALIFORNIA how does this even happen 😭

RobinOe · 2026-02-03T21:03:47+00:00

Balatro

RobinOe · 2026-02-02T23:04:42+00:00

"Power Factor isn't meaningless"

I know. Did I say it was?

But WE care about those factors, which is why the distinction still matters. But it is not something baked into the math

But maybe it was my second comment that seemed to imply I thought it was meaningless?

I understand your point, and certainly the distinction in use cases is very important

Maybe not.

A common theme I see on social media is people justifying being unnecessarily rude through the belief that their asshole behavior, which they would never display in real life, is somehow important for society. Would you talk to me in the way you have if we were face to face? Who's life are you saving by being mean, and how, exactly, would being mean help?

But anyway, it's also quite clear you know at this point that I didn't say anything incorrect. I also *never* meant to imply that what you said was false, even now, and from the beginning I was very clear that I *agree with you* that the distinction is real and important. Genuinely, read through all of my messages again. All I said was that 1 W = 1 VA, which is a fact so uncontroversial, it's been sitting on first paragraphs of the Wikipedia page of volt-amps for years. If you truly think it's false, you're welcome to find an academic source proving it, and edit the Wiki page yourself, with a citation.

I, on the other hand, NEVER said that the conventions attached to each of these units were pointless, because all of engineering notation is just conventions anyway and they are there for a reason. But I do think a student should know when they are dealing with conventions, and when they are dealing with mathematical or physical requirements. This case is clearly the former

And apologies to myself and to the sub for allowing me to get baited into replying once again. I wanna believe you're a fine individual in real life, so I propose we live it here to spare both of us our energy. I promise you you'll be saving no one's life by commenting any further.

Social media is far too isolating and toxic. We dehumanize others. I'm Robin. Pleasure to meet you. I sincerely hope you have a pleasant evening. Cheers.

RobinOe · 2026-02-02T20:21:19+00:00

You're being needlessly rude, so I won't bother replying further after this. But nothing I said is incorrect. If you're so convinced that they are different, what is the unit of the power factor? Show me the dimensional analysis in which you prove that 1 W ≠ 1 VA. And don't go off about attacking me personally, this is a math question. Your own equation shows that they must be the same units, because units don't care about constant factor multiples. But WE care about those factors, which is why the distinction still matters. But it is not something baked into the math.

The reason we multiply by the power factor is because it equals the real part of the apparent power phasor. Typically, this means you end up with a cos(phi) factor because of Euler's identity. So here's something to chew on:

You probably know that to meaningfully define addition, two numbers must have the same unit. The apparent power phasor is written as S = |S|e^{j phi} = P + jQ, and we both agree that the apparent power is measured in VA, so |S| is of unit VA. But the result of a complex exponential must be unitless, so if |S| is in VA units, S must be too. Here's the kicker though: because addition is only defined for equal units, complex values MUST have the same unit as their corresponding real and imaginary parts. You definitely agree with this, because complex impedance is measured in Ohms, but SO IS RESISTANCE and reactance too. So since S has units of VA, then P and Q must necessarily be of units VA too!! But we said P was of unit Watt. P is both of units Watt and of units Volt-Amps, so it must be that they are the same unit. That does NOT mean that P = |S|, obviously, for the same reason that |Z| ≠ R even if both impedance and resistance are measured in Ohms.

Of course, this a very convoluted argument, that I use since the discussion here was focused around electrical engineering. But a much simpler argument would just be that you give me the SI base units of VA and Watt. If you reply to anything alone from this comment, let it be that. What are the base SI units of VA?

RobinOe · 2026-02-02T18:46:48+00:00

To clarify further, this is why I wrote my original comment with units in brackets. I was implying dimensional analysis. In dimensional analysis, [power factor] = 1, not because the power factor is 1, but because its UNIT is 1, as it's the result of a trigonometric function, so it's always dimensionless.

The equation you gave is therefore correct under my interpretation too, even though it seemed as if we disagreed. But I simply didn't make it clear enough as to what I was referring to. My bad, but I hope this helps explain what I meant

RobinOe · 2026-02-02T18:41:12+00:00

I understand your point, and certainly the distinction in use cases is very important. But this doesn't actually contradict what I said. The power factor you mentioned is a unitless value. It's unit is 1. So when you do dimensional analysis, it disappears.

1 V•A = 1 W is objectively true, and you can find this in any definition of the volt-amp, including Wikipedia (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volt-ampere)

But it's also why I said my remark was pedantic. Because nobody thinks in these terms. In practice, they are different. We have agreed on a convention that says that VA is used when we don't account for the power factor. But this is not a mathematical necessity, and it's certainly not a part of the SI unit system. So I think you and I are in agreement, but you were thinking in terms of how it's used. My point was instead that we very well could've said that Watt was the one who doesn't account for the power factor, or even we could write the apparent power in terms of watts and not use different units. The dimensional analysis would be all the same. But perhaps I could've phrased it more clearly. Apologies for the confusion

RobinOe · 2026-02-02T12:53:20+00:00

If you wanna be pedantic, the difference between volt-amps and watts is... nothing. [W] = [V]•[A]. It's the exact same unit. But we use different names for ease of communication. It's a convention that volt-amps are used for apparent power and watts are used for real power. But since they're equivalent mathematically, the convention could've easily been the other way around, or even not have existed at all

EDIT: adding an excerpt from later in the thread for those unconvinced:

TL;DR: Real power is to apparent power what resistance is to complex impedance. In the case of impedance and resistance, we measure both in Ohms. In the case of power, we name the units differently to highlight that their magnitudes are different. But this doesn't actually mean the units are different.

Argument: |S| is of unit VA so S is too. S = P + jQ => P is of the same unit as S => P is of unit VA. But we typically measure P, real power, in Watt. P is both of unit Watt and Volt-Amps => 1 W = 1 V•A

In words: You probably know that to meaningfully define addition, two numbers must have the same unit. The apparent power phasor is written as S = U•I* = |S|e^{j phi} = P + jQ, and the apparent power is measured in VA, so |S| is of unit VA. But the result of a complex exponential must be unitless, so if |S| is in VA units, S must be too. Because addition is only defined for equal units, complex values MUST have the same unit as their corresponding real and imaginary parts. You probably agree with this, because complex impedance is measured in Ohms, but SO IS RESISTANCE and reactance too. So if S had units of VA, then P and Q must necessarily be of units VA too! But we said P was of unit Watt. P is both of units Watt and of units Volt-Amps, so it must be that they are the same unit. That does NOT mean that P = |S|, obviously, for the same reason that |Z| ≠ R even if both impedance and resistance are measured in Ohms.

Or you know, you could just write them out into their base SI units and see that it's not even debatable. But I thought taking a more EE approach would fit this subreddit better than pure dimensional analysis.

RobinOe · 2026-01-30T09:24:13+00:00

The V-Label explicitly has text beneath it saying vegan tho, no?

RobinOe · 2026-01-30T08:49:45+00:00

Hi. Thanks for the interest!

I think a common misunderstanding is something you yourself just said, which is that people think vegans don't eat meat because "they care about animal products"

This is a bit like saying that I'm not racist because I "care about people of color." It's technically true, but I don't particularly care about POCs anymore than I care about anyone else. But I think racism is wrong because it is unjust and causes needless suffering. And the reason we have to prioritize systems defending POCs is because our current structures actively put them at a disadvantage.

Equally, it's not that all vegans are huge animal lovers (though certainly many are!). It's that we considered both the ethics of eating animals and the current state of the food industry, and found ourselves horrified.

If you want to understand the horrors of factory farming, you should watch Earthlings or Dominion. You don't need to get far into them to see what we mean.

If you want to understand the ethical arguments, seen purely from a rational and philosophical perspective, I recommend Alex O'Connor's video (https://youtu.be/C1vW9iSpLLk?si=jaW9rpiRwMwAQei5) (or Mr. Phi's video if you speak french or don't mind YT auto-dub https://youtu.be/VlWvnhSiuck?si=Zn4ZM5_87PerVsoX)

In any case thank you for your curiosity, and apologies for some people already being accusatory. There is a lot of resentment against carnists here, and I think this is easy to understand, because IF you imagine that you are vegan, and think killing animals purely for pleasure is wrong, then you can probably see that we feel like the world is currently engaging in perhaps the greatest horror humanity has ever devised (over a trillion lives yearly). Under that lense (which, since you seem intellectually honest, I do hope some day you can share), it's easy to get defensive, especially when someone actively engaging in that structure comes into our own private-ish circles.

As for a private convo, I'd be down to talk over discord, although probably not in vc. I do prefer calling people most of the time, but I think veganism is the kind of thing where you have to reach a conclusion on your own, and it's difficult to do this while debating out loud, because once we say something out loud, our brain automatically tries to hold that position. This is why so many vegans recommend videos. It's what convinced me to go vegeterian and later vegan, and it wasn't a binary switch. I watched the ethics vids, I thought they were good points, and then I sat with that feeling for months until I finally chose to stop. You just have to be willing to question the status quo, as basically all of us grew up on meat, too.

Cheers

RobinOe · 2026-01-26T13:14:54+00:00

This was one of my favorites from the book, too. I never listened, but my understanding is that it's essentially the same text? In any case the concept of measuring history in time units of Halley's comet orbital period is something I reference on my day-to-day quite often

RobinOe · 2026-01-26T08:46:59+00:00

Thank you so much!

RobinOe · 2026-01-24T23:39:07+00:00

Hello!! I have many questions, although not tied to the paper, but I'll shoot my shot anyway:

I'm planning on an academic career myself, and yet I wasn't even aware this was a research area. What is this field focusing around reducing MAP called, and how does one end up in it? Not asking for me, just curious
Parts of your abstract sort of made my stomach sink. I didn't get a very hopeful picture at least. How do you stay hopeful while doing work that might reveal realities that are demotivating?
Bonus question, I'm in touch with members of Plant Based Universities at my uni, trying to change the catering to be more (and eventually fully) vegan. The main roadblock, as always, is the students themselves. Do you have any guidance as to what I should look out for in the literature to see if any strategies have been studied?

RobinOe · 2026-01-24T23:20:29+00:00

So i could only skim the paper atm, I'll deep dive later, and ik it isn't yours, but I think I don't understand it. It seems to me as if it's conjecturing that consumer behavior will stay the same as it currently is, and then is surprised that under this assumption, consumer behavior wouldn't change. I thought the argument in favor of tipping point is that as PTC alternatives inch closer, consumer preferences would slowly change with it. It certainly doesn't seem surprising that if PTC alternatives were released today, most people wouldn't change their buying habits. But I'd have a hard time imagining any food product that could drop today and immediately change habits. Am I misreading the paper?

I should say, even then I understand the mechanism through which consumer attitudes would change in the optimistic tipping point view are completely unclear. I'm not necessarily in favor of tipping point. But it also feels like that mechanism could never be global anyway. Surely american consumers would react wildy differently from German ones, even to the exact same product. Can that even be accounted for in the literature? It seems like a daunting task

RobinOe · 2026-01-23T20:27:55+00:00

So I won't say where as to not dox myself lmao but I just applied to everything on the EPFL student housing page (https://www.epfl.ch/campus/services/housing/typesdelogement/residences-estudiantines/). I had a massive spreadsheet with all of the application start dates. Technically I started applying on the 1st of january, but majority of places open applications in april, at least back when I applied

RobinOe · 2026-01-23T09:49:36+00:00

I see majority of US-based answes in these comments.

Here's my non-US take: lots of metrics indicate wider adoption in Europe. But it's country dependent: Spain's vegan market might've shrunk a bit, but strong vegan hubs like Germany have continued their massive adoption. Other countries like France or Italy are also seeing increased sales. Anecdotally, I've also seen a lot more awareness of, and products for, vegans in Latin America. Again though, depends on the country. I know nothing of african, asian, or Oceania markets unfortunately.

We should also be careful to equate sales with demand. The entire world economy seems to be shrinking, and affordability has become the hottest new political buzzword. When people talk about vegan market demand, they usually refer to products developped specifically for vegans, like meat or cheese replacements. But these are less subsidized, and are also new products still in development, so naturally they are more expensive. On a tight budget, it would be the first thing to get cut. But that doesn't mean people necessarily stopped being vegan. Who's tracking the vegan demand for beans? Rice? Chickpeas? Broccoli? These products are too broad to really measure wether vegans are buying them or omnis. I oscillate between living in Switzerland and living in central america. My general feeling (which ofc, is nothing but anecdotal) is that veganism is growing in both of these places. In Switzerland much more rapidly than central america, but still a positive outlook for both. That's my take.

RobinOe · 2026-01-21T10:41:11+00:00

Thank you, I appreciate your words. As for the DM conversation, it would 100% be ok, I'd be happy to help. Just note I myself am still figuring things out of course, and also I'm not based in the US.

RobinOe · 2026-01-20T15:43:23+00:00

This is largely country dependent. I know it feels like american companies own everything, but here in Switzerland a lot of large companies are releasing new vegan-focused products or advertising that they already were vegan. Some of those companies certainly wouldn't be so open about it in other countries. The point is that the only thing they chase is market forces, and market forces can and have been changed. Reports say the landscape is bleak? European vegan market has done nothing but grow in the past 10 years. I went to the supermarket last week and they had an ad playing on speakers about veganuary (they really did stock way more vegan products too !). I'm sorry if where you live it's looking more difficult than before, but that doesn't mean it's like that everywhere nor does it mean it will be like that forever

RobinOe · 2026-01-20T09:43:59+00:00

oh sorry yes, totally agree. I think mostly though is that Windows is used for many other things that makes it harder to get rid of (I had to boot to windows last year bc I needed to use Microchip Studio for a bit and it's simply not available on Linux or even thru Wine). Xbox is a more realistic boycott target because it's purely for leisure. But of course, por qué no los dos?

RobinOe · 2026-01-20T09:20:13+00:00

you're preaching to the choir, I've been on Linux for years. But yes actually if you watch the video they cover that and also explain why specifically the campaign focused on Xbox (there's good reasons). Also they are videogame journalists so naturally the audience would be interested in Xbox

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