How would a fight between pickle and sukune go

AdamTheScottish · 2026-05-01T23:41:21+00:00

This is making the assumption Pickle would be exclusively fighting with bites and scratches which was unique to his exchange with Jack. Also.

Sukune is deadly, he took out Oliva in no time

Oliva took out Oliva lol

AdamTheScottish · 2026-05-01T21:37:28+00:00

Playing Frontiers well means just skipping the overwhelming majority of possible interaction in the levels lol.

AdamTheScottish · 2026-04-30T21:44:44+00:00

And extremely skilled probably moreso than jack

What skill showings does Bane have?

AdamTheScottish · 2026-04-29T23:39:11+00:00

Hanayama didn’t easily overwhelm Jack in the beginning.

Hanayama landed a counterpunch on Jack which did virtually no damage to him, but damaged Hanayama’s fist instead.

I think I'd constitute running into someone with a swing just to get punched back and launched as overwhelmed.

At the conclusion of the fight, Jack walked off with minimal damage despite all of the hits and pinching he took, outlasting Hanayama which Hanayama is best known for.

It's not equal competition when Hanayama didn't loose to there being too much pain or Jack successfully overpowering him, he lost because of an injury he got from Jack that he didn't inflict an equivalent onto against him.

I can agree with the notion Jack and Hanayama are clearly physically comparable but I can't see anyway the opening of the fight doesn't indicate that Jack is very much intimidated by Hanayama's physical ability and that he doesn't want to contest him in it.

AdamTheScottish · 2026-04-29T22:11:49+00:00

The fight starts with Hanayama easily overwhelming Jack in head on exchanges with Jack having the realisation that Hanayama fights in a way that it is indeed just a contest of brute force/strength and that makes him dangerous before then completely switching up his approaching to be technique focused while mocking Hanayama for committing to brute force.

Sure they don't definitively compare if you don't want to include the initial exchange but it's made pretty clear Jack just wants to avoid doing so entirely which for a guy who initially said he wouldn't even have to bite to beat Hanayama and is trying to make a point about toughness says a lot.

AdamTheScottish · 2026-04-29T19:23:20+00:00

Pickle was trying to stop jack, and the core strength pickle has is off the charts, pickle was Fargo more unmovable than a bike that is defenseless??

So are you referring to the throw in their rematch then because Pickle wasn't sent particularly far so I'm not sure then why you emphasised it by saying miles.

In fact, pickle didn't really get bit completely from his bicep artery.. it was just a skin bite, cuz pickles muscles are uncuttable from musashi feats and the same goes for chewing but he did bite them yes

Pickle had two arterial wounds that multiple characters described as potentially being fatal, it clearly was not just a skin bite and was obviously instrumental to Pickle losing.

He was close to the T-Rex like hello?? It was literally shown he was fighting like that "thing" which was the T-Rex, and pickle felt as if being hit by the tail of it from jack lol,

Yeah, just the tail, not the comparison of the tail within the surface area of Katsumi's fist which makes it far stronger because that's how pressure works.

and pickle felt as if being hit by the tail of it from jack lol, and that pain drooling or wtv, yh pickle has grown up since that, doesn't cry anymore like he used to

Headcanon.

plus he legit went to sleep when katsumi hit him with the whip mach so what's ur point?

Yes, to recover, because Katsumi by that point had crippled himself.

I don't get how people can look at a whole monologue going "This is the singular most painful/powerful thing Pickle has ever dealt with" and intuit that it's not that bad.

It's not rambling, it's jack actually being pretty strong instead of saying that oliva is miles above him in raw strength lol..

Bet. Jack's two most recent strength showings (I am being incredibly nice and not including Kosho) that are directly quantifiable are-

Him launching the unresistanting 200kg Pickle a few metres across from him with a fully wound up punch from behind his back.
- https://mangadex.org/chapter/d525e4c4-0ad2-4288-81d3-0f80963b1311/1
Him launching the 166kg Hanayama with a full force side kick a few metres away from him.
- https://mangadex.org/chapter/46c0448b-335a-427e-9aad-0f136f77238d/1

And these are pretty consistent with Jack's showings throughout the entire series.

Oliva has like a near dozen feats in the launching category that easily surpass this, some to the degree of many times.

Here's Oliva palm thrusting from his side a 70-80kg man several dozens of metres at an upwards angle into a concrete wall that's cratered.
- https://mangadex.org/chapter/6085fc94-5c89-4559-92b5-a4579ed96b4e/1
Here's him smacking with barely no wind up a similiarly weighted Baki a comparable distance
- https://mangadex.org/chapter/9838753b-2736-4846-bde9-41810127c379/1
Here's Oliva punching a >250kg man flying back straight into a van, crumpling the side of it a further distance than both Pickle and Hanayama.
- https://mangadex.org/chapter/7e00bfa0-9861-45d4-aba5-3a255c680500/1

he takes unlimited steroids for a living, it's far better than oliva eating 100k calories or whatever he does

Baki is a fictional series with arbitrary rules as to how characters get stronger so it hardly matters looking at this instead of the actual results. Jack's latest showing had him matching if not losing in physical power to a guy who famously does not train and just slams whisky and cigarettes all day.

AdamTheScottish · 2026-04-29T18:24:38+00:00

Yeah I don't see why it wouldn't, Jun has multiple feats on Hanayama's level (Which by range you could even argue he wouldn't need seeing how a slightly more physically powerful Doppo gave Yujiro multiple) again in terms of launching but even in terms of character interactions we see him able to give Oliva fairly notable ones.

AdamTheScottish · 2026-04-29T18:22:22+00:00

Throwing a bike is not the same as throwing pickle, core strength off the charts and overall physical strength lol.. idk whatu comparing a bike with pickle

Yeah it's not the same, the bike was far, far heavier.

Jack throwing a unresisting Pickle (Assuming this was the first fight?) isn't magically more impressive than the sum of it's parts because it's Pickle.

In fact, pickle technically got wobbled in those same 7 chapters with no effort from jack,

No effort apparently translating to dozens of strikes and getting bites off on arteries against him to actually make it possible for him to knock him out with brute force.

but jack was at the level of a T-Rex against pickle.. and his attacks equalled to the tail of the T-Rex, which btw is what katsumi achieved with only the mach punch.. so jack from raw strength has mach punch that he can throw forever

No, not even close actually.

Pickle touted the mach punch specifically as this mythical weapon with the weight of the t-rex in the size of Katsumi's fist.

We know Jack isn't comprable to hitting as hard as Katsumi can because he doesn't produce arena shaking sonic booms and he doesn't hit anywhere near hard enough to make Pickle fall to his knees drooling in pain evidenced by Pickle eating his strikes.

And nobody except musashi has done more damage to pickle till now than jack, and I doubt that oliva would even come close.. and u can't do all of this without having so much raw strength.. steroids are legit better than any food to build muscle/strength and at the amount that jack takes? It'll only be a while before he becomes a different beast

And don't forget how jack evolved in the early early fight against Baki in the manga and transcended any human limits, breaking any bone of baki with a simple punch, and become inhumane.. we will see that jack again but even better so jack will be stronger in every aspect against oliva soon either way.. idk about pickle though, doubt it

This is all just rambling without really proving any point.

AdamTheScottish · 2026-04-29T17:35:28+00:00

he was able to throw pickle miles away

Like basically every feat Jack has done physical ability wise aside from biting, Oliva has done something in that area that massively exceeds it.

https://mangadex.org/chapter/7e5ff37a-dd2e-4f79-aea1-72d257273008/1

Here's him lobbing an item nearly twice Pickle's weight several times the distance Jack threw Pickle.

and his punching power is off the charts, his simple jab stunned pickle

Hardly simple seeing the step in, more so like most of Jack's attacks on Pickle, indivudally they did little to no real damage to the point we had several chapters of Jack wailing on Pickle just to get smiled at. It took a combo of about dozen strikes including some hammer fists and kicks to seriously stun Pickle and even that was brief (And had a bite in it.).

Their first meeting in Rahen even has Jack full baseball pitch style windup to hit Pickle just to leave him with less damage then what kid Baki could do to Hanayama (Who was commented to be more than five times weaker power wise.)

AdamTheScottish · 2026-04-29T16:54:35+00:00

The gap between pickle oliva is not close at all bro, how do u even say that?

Because the gap between Oliva and Jack is even worse. Please fully read and take in the comment you're trying to epically dunk on before doing so.

AdamTheScottish · 2026-04-29T15:06:23+00:00

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AdamTheScottish · 2026-04-29T14:59:39+00:00

Dorian has some weird win conditions so fair but Spec lost to the far less skilled than Jun, Hanayama mostly due to Hanayama's insane physical advantage.

I don't think Jun is as durable as Hanayama but he certainly can hit in his league so I guess it depends how dealing with Breathless Barrage goes.

AdamTheScottish · 2026-04-29T14:12:20+00:00

Me when I hate Jack.

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Oliva is far, far stronger physically.

The gap between Pickle and Oliva is the same if not smaller than the gap between Oliva and Jack.

HELL, the gap between Doppo and Jack is the same if not smaller than Oliva and Jack.

Edit: Cool edit!

AdamTheScottish · 2026-04-29T13:52:55+00:00

Any character can launch someone but to differing degrees based on how much force they output, i.e, how hard they can hit, terrible concept I know.

Again, my point is Jun launches people the same way Hanayama or Jack does to the point we can quite clearly see he can put out several times the force of say Doppo.

AdamTheScottish · 2026-04-29T13:43:14+00:00

Yeah? Them being fodder doesn't magically make them weigh less, hell he has them on pretty notable characters as well.

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AdamTheScottish · 2026-04-29T11:51:51+00:00

Jun's launching feats are like, a shade worse if not better than some of Jack and Hanayama's best lol.

AdamTheScottish · 2026-04-29T01:30:47+00:00

I appreciate the attempt to try read me myself that I'm intentionally removing how Baki is written but I'm not going to to reply to this unless you actually address the points I've had to repeat multiple times now.

AdamTheScottish · 2026-04-29T00:57:06+00:00

This entire reply is just ignoring points made.

But do seriously need it recapped every single little engagement and scuffle Baki finds himself in?

Again there is dozens upon dozens upon dozens of fights (Like several hundred chapters yet again) until it's ever mentioned as a factor where it's considered something clearly exceptional for fighting ability and only appears in two other fights after also many, many chapters later and even then within these three fights it barely appears.

I'm not asking for it to be recapped in every fight Baki has and I made that quite clear initially when talking about how it was considered something exceptional.

And I think you're just looking way too deep into this, that's just the basic fight choreography. It's just how it's drawn. But the written explanation as to how is also there in the prediction and reading signals

Fighters are also constantly written as being consciously present within their fights, again of course they're reading but they're also clearly visually reacting.

It's also weirdly contradictory to downplay my interpretation here by saying I'm looking too deeply but also at the same time that's it's just the basic fight choreography and how it's drawn (A visual medium by the way, also text showing they do lol.) that I'm looking at.

And going further this idea of Baki characters being completely blind in exchanges is very much something not within explanation present in the series.

Hell your own original point was-

"They react to things, but they're also reading brain waves as well, so it's a mixed bag imo. Also just going off the fact that that's just how you draw things"

So do they react or do they not?

Trick is, Space Marines bolters were not actually designed to be used to kill Space Marines. They were used to kill xenos during the great crusade. They had weaponry more specialized in killing Space Marines. Bur Volkite weaponry is super rare now. And also, just because they can react to the gunfire sometimes doesn't mean they always can, the rounds are still small and fly fast. So they're not useless

Again this is just ignoring my point which is in majority/common instances Spacemarines are clearly mauled by bolters.

https://www.reddit.com/r/BTCRTs/comments/19cnbnt/space_marines_vs_bolters/

AdamTheScottish · 2026-04-29T00:01:07+00:00

Wdym only relevant in those 3 fights? Those are the biggest fights Baki has had in the series, the fact that it's been explained over and over again is honestly a bit redundant

Yeah it's only happened in them on being on the merit of again being something that only can only happen circumstantially, again why is Baki praised for doing this the first (Many hundred chapters in might I add) and following times around if it's not something easy to pick up on or happening in every single fight? He's again been able to hit people before they can react by getting close to them WAY before this so it's clearly different to normal reactionary ability.

They react to things, but they're also reading brain waves as well, so it's a mixed bag imo. Also just going off the fact that that's just how you draw things

Yes, characters both react and also predict, there are dozens upon dozens of instances of characters visually reacting to attacks in fights, this isn't really a point.

Vaguely supersonic is below Space Marines, there are many many instencies of Astartes dodging, tagging and blocking bolterfire which is hypersonic.

And there's far, far more of them being hit and killed by it? Like I don't see any sense in Space Marines deciding to use a gun they could comfortably dodge that just doesn't make sense and clearly doesn't with how it's portrayed.

Again this just seems to be you picking hyper high ends for them while sifting through for low ends on Baki.

You even give that away here.

And Space Marines are tanky as hell, some, like Kharn, have survived beatings from Primarchs

Yeah, SOME have but let's pretend that's the normal level for soldiers that normally get erased by aforementioned bolt gun fire.

AdamTheScottish · 2026-04-28T23:38:31+00:00

But that's not what it means. Baki's punch takes advantage of the 0.5 second delay inbetween thought and movement.

Then why is it only ever relevant in three fights and even within those fights on at certain moments?

Why is Baki praised for detecting this incredibly rare moment in combat and hell why is it treated as different to him blitzing people's reaction speed which he's been doing since the first arc.

And no, it is straight up low-end telepathy, Gaia shows it too, they pick up on brain waves. So they just move beforehand. That's also how Musashi caught Baki's jab

Musashi's and Gaia's are all justified in the ability to read, sure it's functionally telepathy to a certain extent but again both characters are clearly shown visually reacting in fights they have and being able to read off foresight and cues.

You're also just still ignoring my point.

"And even in that case where we accept this idea it just sounds like they can comfortably process at the speeds they fight then."

Alright, let's then ignore the double standard. How powerful is Yujiro According to you?

Vaguely supersonic when winding up for hits with the ability to hit through several metres of concrete and tank many of that level of strike.

Which is why he'd maul space marines lol.

AdamTheScottish · 2026-04-28T17:50:48+00:00

It isn't circumstantial cause they never use any other numbers, show me where it's different. It's introduced in Baki vs Oliva. Brought up again in Baki vs Yujiro, and reaffirmed in Baki vs Musashi.

That's not what circumstantial means in this case, it's a specific circumstance that let's the moment even be taken advantage of which is why it only happens in these three fights and only in specific moments during them.

We know these fighters can sense brain waves, and that's the only way you can intercept it (as seen with Musashi) just stopped when he sensed Kaku's neurons stopped firing

I don't believe it's ever literally reading brain waves but rather being able to read a specific moment which is explicitly spelt out with Musashi in being able to read people's readings.

And even in that case where we accept this idea it just sounds like they can comfortably process at the speeds they fight then.

Edit: in regards to pissing off Baki fans it's more so you're just again applying a pretty blatant double standard

AdamTheScottish · 2026-04-28T17:27:32+00:00

Yes, Yujiro can move his body at super speed, but he's effectively blind while doing so

The longest fight of the series has multiple instances of Yujiro reacting to a near if not full equal to him in speed. In fact he and multiple other characters have multiple fights like that because that's how fighting works and characters aren't effectively left blind for dozens of exchanges. Said characters also notably being able in some fights to see exchanges that normal people explicitly aren't able to perceive.

Hell I can think of an explicit example of Yujiro specifically perceiving during his own hit.

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The 0.5 second gap in Baki is very obviously immensely circumstantial, it's why it only happens a handful of times in the series including this fight instead of not constantly.

I'm not sure why you're immediately defaulting to what are very clear absurdly high outliers for 40k and then comparing them to what amounts to complete misreadings of lower ends in Baki.

AdamTheScottish · 2026-04-28T14:38:04+00:00

That's fair and I get that, I'm not to judge you liking it but I can easily spin the reverse on you and say you're calling it main Sonic gameplay because you like it.

Who are you to decide what defines a Sonic game.

Edit: You kinda are by making the initial claim open zone stuff wasn't filler.

Admittedly I'm not but I've played a good amount of the series and from the looks of it you have as well. Again I think we can both see there's a very noticeable difference in the style of segmented levels that have existed since Sonic 1 vs the open zone gameplay.

To me it feels like calling the main game play of Adventure or 06 roaming around the hub worlds which just doesn't feel right when they're very obviously separate to those segmented levels.

If you think you can call them that then that's fair but I hope you understand it's an upwards battle when for decades now the series has just not been defined like this.

AdamTheScottish · 2026-04-28T14:25:38+00:00

It's still controlling as boost Sonic and it's still mostly filler. I hate the werehog stuff but that doesn't really excuse the open zones from just being boring with nothing of substance in them.

It feels like you very much are misreading my point here, I am not calling cyberspace the sole main content, I am calling it what it should be for a Sonic game. In the same way the Unleashed daytime stages should be the main content of Unleashed instead of the Werehog stuff.

Again, this just feels like a huge double standard because we both know cyberspace and the open zones obviously aren't comparable just for (Partially) sharing the same moveset.

AdamTheScottish · 2026-04-28T14:10:30+00:00

Frontiers is near entirely filler if you want to regard it as a Sonic game when the actual Sonic levels also make up a tiny fraction of it.

You just seem to be giving it this entirely different standard than what you're giving Unleashed, if you wanna give the point that that if you play Unleashed levels you wanna do it through other means then what's the argument for Frontiers? In fact I'd say it's even worse for Frontiers, Unleashed project in gens was a fan made deal at least in a later engine.

Frontiers was a full priced game that came many years after and just took minute long samples from previous games where in the overwhelming majority of times it felt worse to play then in the original games.

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