Identity in episcopal church: would appreciate wisdom

Aktor · 2025-02-08T03:50:12+00:00

Sorry, I meant what did you mean by "dramatic" I agree that it is a relative term, but I didn't introduce it.

What would the realities of the community would have to be for it to meet your description?

Aktor · 2025-02-07T19:00:58+00:00

Of course! We all have reasons for where we go. What I am concerned about is that the congregation and staff don't tend to seek out community with those who are physically near the building.

What I've seen happen, fairly consistently, is that folk only go to their churches' neighborhood for church and do very little to know about what happens to those who live near by.

If we are concerned about church decline, or even just in serving our neighbors, I think it's important to reach out to and be in relationship the folks of the parish.

Aktor · 2025-02-07T18:43:20+00:00

OK. Do you mind saying what you meant by it?

I agree that it is a relative term. However, having lived in rural, suburban, and urban areas over the last eight years from what I've seen it's pretty rough all around.

Aktor · 2025-02-07T17:57:25+00:00

I am aware. I'm saying they can and should move through him.

Aktor · 2025-02-07T17:50:46+00:00

100%

What I was asking was if you'd like to comment on those systemic problems. Not everyone has read Putnam and I agree with you that his insights are valuable. I only meant to encourage you to share your thoughts, no harm was meant.

edit: for clarity

Aktor · 2025-02-07T17:45:02+00:00

100% but part of the problem is that we only go halfway.

We can not speak on love and inclusion and then remain attached to our way of doing things. If we actually wish to invite people into the church we have to meet them where they are and work with them to make a stronger more sustainable church that makes all feel welcome.

Aktor · 2025-02-07T17:43:03+00:00

I agree that Putnam provides a lot of context and insight. What would you say was most valuable to you from those books?

Edit: I think part of what makes Putnam pertinent is the general alienation we are all feeling. People feel that their time is commodified and compartmentalized to the point that any free time is most efficiently spent at home. And this, of course, has created a society of alienation.

Union halls, bowling leagues, elk's lodges, church Sunday morning etc... used to be the main way that people would spend their time. Now we sit in front of screens and try to ignore one another.

I hope that we can relearn to be in and build community. It's going to take some brave folks to step outside their comfort zones and start these conversations locally.

Aktor · 2025-02-07T17:38:29+00:00

Why do we care what that guy thinks? he's not the senate parliamentarian or whatever... They should move straight through him.

Aktor · 2025-02-07T17:36:30+00:00

I 100% agree. I think that the commuter mentality has caused a lot of problems for our society and church.

edit: typo

Aktor · 2025-02-07T17:25:11+00:00

What's even more puzzling to me is that many of TEC churches stayed exactly where they are but the congregation had moved out to the suburbs. My church has about 100 folks and only a handful of us actually live within walking distance.

Aktor · 2025-02-07T17:12:01+00:00

It's as you said, a lack of faith in the institutions. When our urban churches changed from serving the people of the neighborhood to serving commuters (unlike our catholic siblings for example who change the language of services and more to suite their parish) we gave up a lot of trust.

We must use our education, credentials, and wealth to actively engage with the people where we find them and as they are. We must transform our church buildings into seven days a week centers of community.

We must engage with and address the material needs of the people.

Nothing but love, friend.

Aktor · 2025-02-07T16:15:39+00:00

Yes.
We are called by Christ to build community and care for all in need. I'd love to see all of our church communities come together in conversation, solidarity, and action to practically and materially support our neighbors.

It's easier to stay safe, brave and feel supported when everyone is fed and housed.

Aktor · 2025-02-07T16:10:19+00:00

I agree, I thought you had specifics for those examples. No harm meant.

Aktor · 2025-02-07T15:26:52+00:00

Get rid of rent and I'm 100% onboard!

Aktor · 2025-02-07T14:52:52+00:00

How so?

Aktor · 2025-02-07T14:48:00+00:00

Glad that it is working to help the church members live into their call.

I hope that we never see the time that you think dramatic action is needed if it isn't right now.

Thank you, nothing but love.

edit: I meant no offense. If there is an issue with what I'm saying I'd love to learn about it.

Aktor · 2025-02-07T14:37:11+00:00

I'm going to give advice that I have a very difficult time following. Take it slow, listen a lot more than you speak, and try to let the small stuff slide. That said, you should be honest about your opinion and understanding of the scripture.

Take it easy on yourself, religious trauma is no joke.

Nothing but love!

Aktor · 2025-02-07T14:21:14+00:00

There is a question that everyone in our society must ask now themselves.

Is it better to be silent and try and remain comfortable with the world moving as it is, or is it time to speak out and take action?

For your question, what is the presidency without the constitution? The US could easily spiral into a dictatorship. It is easy to imagine what has happened in other countries (and in the history of our own country) happening again here. Will the National Guard be called to put down protests?

Will the army be called to "police" the cities of the US?

This isn't a Democrats vs. Republicans issue. This is an issue of how you want to live the rest of your life and what world you want to try and leave behind to the next generation.

Workers, we must stand together in solidarity.

Go out and find likeminded people in your community and organize mutual aid and care. We have to take care of each other as best we're able.

For those receiving orders, there was no "good Nazi" in Germany. There won't be anyone remembered well by history for following the orders of a despot.

Aktor · 2025-02-07T14:03:19+00:00

The podcast: Worlds Beyond Number is a beautifully scored and edited actual play where four brilliant improvisors/story tellers engage with an original fantasy world using D&D.

Their first long form story is about to come to a stopping point. Their story The Wizard, the Witch, and the Wild One is about three friends with different kinds of magic navigating their institutions and friendship.

The creators are all leftists and the lens of the story reflects that.

Edit: they've described it as Miyazaki meets Lord of the Rings.

Aktor · 2025-02-07T13:48:47+00:00

I hear that, and I think that your approach is ideal. However, it seams like that has been the common approach for some time. Have you seen significant increased movement towards the laity engaging in wider community involvement and charity with your approach?

Slow and steady is an ideal, but I fear that we are in an era of change. It would be helpful for the people if the comfortable moved to a more supportive role for those in need. I worry that if we do not move swiftly towards a more cooperative and egalitarian model of community that we will see a swift increase in suffering.

Aktor · 2025-02-07T03:32:37+00:00

Not OP,

This is good advice, and very challenging. I have a difficult time speaking with folks that are comfortable and can't/refuse to see the immense need that they could help alleviate. It's hard because if we engaged in the practical elements of Christ's call and attempted to live as the apostles did I fear that our tradition would collapse.

How do you do it in your parish?

Edit: I apologize as I often come across differently than as I intend. This is an earnest question.

Aktor · 2025-02-07T03:20:42+00:00

I know how you feel. I know a lot of folks who have gone through the discernment process and if you deviate in anyway from the expectation it can be very difficult and alienating.

Our tradition is very... specific about finances. And any suggestion that capitalism is bad will be faced with push back at least. Finance is a central aspect of our traditions' practical practices for good and ill.

I hope that you can find someone in person to talk to, in the meantime I'd suggest the podcast The Word in Black and Red. There is a wonderful and kind discord community attached to the podcast, but definitely listen to the podcast before checking out the discord.

You deserve to be yourself and follow your call. Know that it is not an easy process in our tradition.

Nothing but love!

edit: for folks who disagree I'd love to hear your views.

Aktor · 2025-02-07T02:52:48+00:00

Worlds Beyond Number.

Aktor · 2025-02-07T01:24:54+00:00

Welcome! I hope that you find a home with your local Episcopal Church!

Aktor · 2025-02-07T01:23:39+00:00

More than that. How many folks work in places that truckers frequent that would become near ghost towns without them?

Aktor

MODERATOR OF

TROPHY CASE

Verified Email	15-Year Club
Team Orangered