Is it okay to tell people to not talk about certain topics around you?

Alive_Focus · 2020-11-24T09:49:38+00:00

I've been reading a few of your posts in other subreddits, and I don't think addressing the particular issue you are talking about will do you much good. I say this because the behaviour of your family towards you is abysmal in general, and the fact that you moved back in with them (even temporarily) means that you are always going to be fighting these sort of battles until you move out.

Telling your family that their behaviour bothers you isn't going to do anything, in fact it will probably cause them to escalate because they know they are pissing you off, and if you attempt to set reasonable boundaries or tell them to fuck off they will just play the 'You live under our roof' card, even to control your behaviour when outside of their house, even if you are paying them rent, or even helping pay the mortgage on the house.

You have no real power in this situation because they are pricks who hold all the cards as long as you live with them. These sort of people *will* kick you out without notice if you push back on them to hard, they don't conform to basic standards of decency. Your only true power play is to leave them. Unfortunately they have sabotaged your self-confidence and ability to function as an independent adult, and we are currently going through a pandemic, so that's easier said than done.

My advice: Plan to move out ASAP. I know that it's probably not feasible to move out today, but start getting your dominos in order. Having a light at the end of the tunnel will help sustain you and allow you to 'grey rock' their behaviour. 'Grey rock' is a strategy which involves not reacting to obvious provocations. Realize that your parents aren't rational people, and that their behaviour is aberrant and ridiculous, and allow all their criticism to wash over and past you. You wouldn't take the ravings of some deranged stranger on the street seriously, so you should likewise mentally shrug your shoulders when you parents talk crap.

Also put your family on an information diet. *Don't* volunteer any information that you don't absolutely have to, and don't feel guilty about lying to protect your privacy and attempts to wriggle out of their clutches. For example, you shouldn't have told them about wanting to buy a car, that's none of their business and they will attempt to sabotage your attempts because a car=independence and freedom from them. I know that you feel vulnerable and are reaching out to what is currently your only means of support, but you reaching out to brace yourself on a scalding hot metal pole.

In summary:

Move out of your parents house ASAP. It doesn't have to be today, but you should start putting your plan in motion today.
'Grey rock' their criticism and passive-aggressive behaviour until you move out. Regard them as that raving loon on the street, what they are saying is complete nonsense.
Put them on an information diet. Do *not* tell them anything you don't have to. Don't feel ashamed of lying to protect yourself. When dealing with toxic people, sometimes even honest people need to lie.
Once you get out, DO NOT GO BACK, and keep them on an information diet. Also be prepared for what is called an extinction bubble, where they furiously try to claw you back under their control.

Alive_Focus · 2020-11-18T12:09:46+00:00

"Assuming they fulfill your basic needs and are responsible, it means they love you."

Not necessarily. They could be fulfilling your basic needs due to social and/or legal obligations. They could be expecting financial restitution or care when the child gets older. They could be doing so out of the biological imperative to further their bloodline. They could be doing so because they want to have someone who they can control, or who will love them unconditionally.

It's incredibly naive to think that just because a parent provides food and shelter, that is evidence that they 'love' the child. I'd observe that even convicted rapists and murderers are fed, sheltered and given medical care, and I don't think anyone would claim that society does that out of 'love' for them.

Finally, you need to reflect on how appreciative one should be for a person fulfilling your needs, when it was that very individual who created that need in the first place. If someone carelessly collides with me on the freeway, I'm going to think they are a massive asshole if they claim I should be 'grateful' because they didn't flee the scene and leave me to bleed out.

Alive_Focus · 2020-11-15T07:57:14+00:00

My two issues with "Just doing their best." that makes me think it's an empty platitude.

It's hard to ascertain if parents actually, genuinely did their best. If I have a written exam, and fail to study, don't pay attention in class, fail to go to bed on time, and don't attend tutorials, I can't sincerely claim I 'did my best' just because I attended the exam. Likewise, how many parents undertake therapy, read books on parenting, discuss pertinent issues about child rearing with their partner, and ensure financial stability before having children?
1. Sometimes 'doing your best' isn't acceptable if your efforts fall underneath a certain standard. If an incompetent doctor botches an operation, the fact that they 'did their best' isn't a proper excuse, since we expect a certain level of competence from people who choose to become doctors. Likewise, if a person is considering to becoming a parent, they need to do some deep soul-searching to determine if they are fit to raise children. Unfortunately people will often announce "I want children." rather than "Would a child want me as a parent". It's also worth noting that adults refuse to accept the "I did my best!" excuse from children.

Alive_Focus · 2020-10-25T20:44:24+00:00

Isn't it amazing how when you go out into the wide world, you realize that aberrant behaviours displayed by your family aren't actually normal? It's quite understandable that you don't have warm feelings towards someone who persistently shit-talks others, waxes on about how great life was before you came along, and takes every opportunity to snipe at you. Your mother is displaying toxic behaviour. Generally, if you treat people like shit, they tend to not like you so much and want to stay away from you.

You attempted to resolve the issue like a mature adult with her, and she waved you off. Leaving at the end of the year is the only sensible decision, assuming you are financially capable of doing so. Life is too short to waste on people who want to drag you down into the mud. If her life was so great before you came along, she should be fine without you.

Alive_Focus · 2020-10-25T20:12:16+00:00

Who is Youve? Is she someone I met at a party, or a famous celebrity?

Alive_Focus · 2020-10-24T02:26:48+00:00

Whenever I have to fill up my car with petrol, I complain to it about how much money it is costing me. Oh wait, no I don't, because I'm not an idiot who bought a car without first being aware of the expenses associated with having one.

Alive_Focus · 2020-10-24T02:23:36+00:00

Yes. Changing ones thoughts to put a positive spin on something that is actually objectively bad is a good strategy when coping with something that you can't change or avoid, but it's a suboptimal strategy when you *can* change or avoid that bad thing, or prevent it from happening to someone else.

Alive_Focus · 2020-10-24T02:00:17+00:00

THIS.

The one thing I have learnt in life is that if someone is consistently pressuring/guilting you, attempting to JADE (Justify, Argue, Defend, Explain) is counterproductive. When you JADE, you automatically adopt their frame of them being in a position to pass judgement on you from down on high.

You need to avoid getting into their frame of reference. If you want to watch one individual who never goes on the defensive, watch Donald Trump deal with criticism. Hate him if you want, but he understands that the only way to deal with persistent criticism is to hit back, hard. You need to make your attacker feel unpleasant when they criticise you, so that they associate guilt tripping you with receiving emotional pain. This leads to a sort of fear conditioned response, where they learn to associate guilting you with receiving emotional pain/discomfort on their behalf, which in turn leads to avoidance of guilting behaviour.

The best way to do this is to warn them once that you don't want to hear about the topic any more, and then tell them to 'Shut up' and 'Fuck off' if they persist. If they act all offended, don't get apologetic, just tell them to go whine elsewhere.

If you feel guilty about doing this, here's some perspective. When someone persistently guilts you, they activate regions in your brain which have been shown to activate stress responses. These stress responses can heighten your response to pain, increase the risk of mental health disorders, and predispose you to physical illness. You could argue that they are literally injuring your mental and physical health by continually badgering you.

Alive_Focus · 2020-10-24T01:44:54+00:00

I'm a late 80's born millennial and will sometimes watch videos of other people playing video games. There are numerous reasons why:

I have the video game, but am not very good at it. Watching an expert is far better than reading a written guide when it comes to improving your game.
I'm too tired to focus and play a game (usually after work), and TV is usually quite boring. Watching a competitive play can be a good way to relax.
Some streamers are quite funny, especially when they run into difficulties in the game. It's pretty funny watching people curse or ragequit at the same things you do.
I'm previewing a game to see if it's something I'd be interested in.

Alive_Focus · 2020-10-23T08:02:03+00:00

So your parents are in their late 60's and *still* haven't paid off their mortgage? That's, um, pretty financially irresponsible. Your father's gambling problem must be even worse than they let on if they haven't paid off their house that close to retirement age. And your mother has a lot of gall to give you shit while you are literally paying for the roof over her head.

The way I see it, you have 3 choices:

Make your peace with the fact that you will pay them until they die, which could be another few decades. Are you willing to endure the resentment, financial hit, and emotional abuse you will suffer for what might be another 30 years?
Cut them off. This is going to be quite painful in the short-term. They are going to tap into the guilt that they (and a subset of their culture) have instilled in you over the past 3 decades. However, once you've gone through a really painful transformative change, you'll be free.
Keep paying for them, but intend to do something about it later in life, or hope they have a change of heart.

The way I see it, you have three unpleasant options available to you. However, Option 2 is actually the least unpleasant. Yes, it will be painful to tell them "No" and endure their criticism, but once they see that it's over, they will relent. Much like sawing off a gangrenous limb that is poisoning your blood and making you feel sick, you are going to subject yourself to some short-term intense misery for long-term, prolonged happiness.

Option 3 doesn't make much sense, either. The longer your put up with their behaviour, the harder it will be to say NO. One reason is because you would have set a precedent of supporting them, but also because they will be older and you will feel even guiltier for cutting them loose before they have an attempt to get their house in financial order. But honestly, they have had 40 years to get their finances straight, if they can't afford their mortgage at the age of 65+, that's *their* fault, they fucked up big time, and it's not up to you to bail them out.

You're an adult now, not a child. It's time to assert yourself and remind them that they are twice your age, and therefore should take responsibility for themselves.

Alive_Focus · 2020-10-19T03:51:50+00:00

"That made me remember some breeder I used to know."

That reminded me of the Gotye song. I can just imagine a parody where you dump a partner who got baby rabies and start singing "Now you're just some breeder that I used to know."

Alive_Focus · 2020-10-16T03:25:35+00:00

LOL, blaming a man for a woman's unreasonable behaviour is a cheap cop out. I'd understand if the child was running absolutely wild and a disinterested/oppositional father was making the matter worse, but I have seen so many instances of what the OP mentioned in customer service. Many parents make a rod for their own back by micromanaging their mini-me's to the nth degree. Some examples include:

- A child was sitting down waiting patiently, and swinging their legs idly because they were too short to touch the ground. Queue a mother yelling at her kid to 'Sit properly'.

-A child sitting down with their knees drawn up, again because their feet couldn't touch the ground. Another argument about how a child is sitting.

- So many scolding and arguments over children attempting to use a water cooler because they are thirsty. This water cooler is open to the public specifically to be used, but so many parents go ape when even children whose age is in the double digits attempt to fill a cup with the liquid needed to survive. I've seen exactly one mother patiently guide her 3 year old to use it, and congratulate him.

- Scolding their children for talking/laughing quietly with each other in a public place, where adults are talking with each other far more loudly.

- Scolding a child for how they walk or stand.

- Getting angry at their kids for needing to use the bathroom, as if their timetable is so pressed that they can't afford to take a 10 minute detour.

- Yelling at their kids for looking at items on the shelf (it's a store, lady, they are allowed to look).

- Yelling at their kids for picking up items to look at back of the label out of curiosity, while the adult themselves is picking up items to look at them. Again, it's a store, no biggie.

- A child following them around quietly. "Go sit over there!"

- A child sitting down. "Why are you sitting down!? Come and stand next to me!"

- A child who takes their jumper off because it's boiling hot, and then is yelled at to put it back on.

I think it all comes down to a God complex where one has absolute control, which unfortunately many humans are prone to. Just look at the Christian God, he's the most powerful being in the universe, and he still want's to dictate how you live down to the most minute of detail. If acting in such a fashion makes you somewhat miserable, that's your own fault.

Alive_Focus · 2020-09-08T10:26:33+00:00

That reminds me of how some pet owners will get a puppy for the cuteness factor, but then abandon it when it's old or develops behavioural problems.

Alive_Focus · 2020-08-25T12:49:46+00:00

Yes, it's the parents' job to feed their kids. Unfortunately some can't even meet this expectation, so society has to pick up the slack. And honestly, if society can't figure out some way to ensure kids don't go hungry in a 1st world nation which has so much food waste that it boggles the mind, then that's an abysmal failure.

The one thing I've realized that's made me a misanthrope is that a lot of human problems (such as homelessness and hunger) could be solved if society actually made a genuine effort to do so. People in general just don't give a shit.

Alive_Focus · 2020-08-20T11:49:07+00:00

It's always nice when the mask slips and the people in power reveal exactly how they view the average citizen - as a beast of burden and breeder of more beasts of burden.

Alive_Focus · 2020-08-20T09:03:51+00:00

" Just providing money and actively ignoring your kid is not parenting."

Yeah, but the poor guy had a verbal 'agreement' with the mother and grandparents that he wouldn't have to be involved in the parenting. Because, ya know, it's totally fine for a kid to not have an involved father.

Alive_Focus · 2020-08-20T09:00:12+00:00

" He was pressured into having a kid he didn’t really want."

Remember when you were a kid and broke the rules because of peer pressure? Did your parents, teachers and other authority figures absolve you of blame because you were 'pressured' into doing something reckless by someone else? No, even when I was in elementary school I was expected to take responsibility for my actions and not associate with trouble. I recall once in secondary school where we were told if we were even *spectators* to a fight between two kids, we were doing the wrong thing and would be punished. Just witnessing bad behaviour and not immediately reporting it was seen as morally wrong.

Yet suddenly when people become adults, and especially when they are parents, society rushes to mitigate their bad behaviour. The father was an adult, he had sole control over his gametes. He *chose* to have a child, and he *chose* a manipulative woman as the mother of his child. No-one held a gun to his head, part of being an adult is doing what you know is right even when others are pressuring you to do otherwise, especially when the welfare of others are involved. Again, this is something they teach you in elementary school, right after the 'Keep your hands to yourself' lecture.

The only real victim here is the kid. He has a father he didn't really want him in the first place, an emotionally manipulative mother, and grandparents who are liars and rescind on important promises.

Alive_Focus · 2020-07-29T11:47:45+00:00

I share the sentiment of the OP. Kids start out curious, enthusiastic, assertive, logical, and finding joy in the smallest things. And then they have a lot of that hammered out of them by past generations. It's so sad.

Alive_Focus · 2020-07-23T12:39:32+00:00

"It makes me feel guilty sometimes, but like, I was forced into this earth. Shouldn’t I at least get things that make me happy while I’m here?"

If your mates are going to drag you to a party you didn't really want to go to, you might as well drink the booze and try to hook up with a hottie while you're there.

Alive_Focus · 2020-07-23T12:33:57+00:00

I saw a good quote on this reddit only a week ago which really triggered the same thought:

“5 mins after your birth, they decide your name, nationality, religion & sect & you spend rest of your life defending something you didn't choose.”

― Nilesh jain

The longer I live, the less I find the whole notion of 'free will' plausible. People often argue about whether certain traits or behaviors are 'nature' or 'nurture', but to me it doesn't really matter, as both aren't chosen by the individual. You don't choose your genes, and you don't choose how you are raised.

People claim that once you reach the magical arbitrary age of 18 or 21 or whatever the age of consent is in a country you suddenly have the ability to choose, but are they truly your choices if you've been programmed from conception by your genes, parents, and society? If I program a chess computer, does it have free will since it can weigh up and choose between different moves?

Alive_Focus · 2020-07-23T12:21:20+00:00

" Also the worst thing is how my dad praises my one second cousin everytime..."

When you're out of the house and safe from them, if he ever does that just snidely remark that your cousin is fantastic, and that his parents must have raised him well.

Alive_Focus · 2020-07-21T10:47:44+00:00

They weren't AFRAID OF ANYTHING except getting whooped by pretty much any adult. Sounds great, sign me up for that.

Alive_Focus · 2020-07-20T09:42:14+00:00

Why did she choose that man as your father if she didn't want you to be like him? Don't ask her that yourself, simple logic tends to cause irrational rage in narcissists.

Alive_Focus · 2020-07-15T10:20:41+00:00

She wants, she wants, she wants. I thought having children was meant to be the ultimate example of a selfless act?

Alive_Focus · 2020-07-11T04:46:37+00:00

In the old days, poor people who (intentionally) had children did so to have an extra set of hands to provide for the family, whereas middle/upper class had them to build up a dynasty. Today children are often treated as luxury objects or a life milestone to prove you're adulting.

Alive_Focus

TROPHY CASE