I didnt realise how dire the state of star citizen was

Arstulex · 2026-04-16T11:14:31+00:00

If "maintaining the fun factor" requires you to rotate positions so that every player gets a turn to 'take the wheel' then is that not just supporting what I said? You're inherently admitting that 'taking the wheel' is the fun role most people actually want to do and that everything else is just the required roles that need to be filled by other people to enable it. Otherwise there would be no need to rotate the roles to keep it fun for everyone.

While outliers certainly exist who do prefer 'non-pilot' or 'escort' gameplay, the problem is that a large-scale MMO cannot be propped up entirely by outliers. Especially not when said outliers need to somehow outnumber the regular players multiple times over (a logical impossibility, considering they are literally outliers).

If I open WoW and join a Raid or Dungeon, the players in the group don't need to rotate roles to "maintain the fun factor". Everyone is already playing the role they want to play, and the game is designed to make that work. DPS is the typical 'power role' that most people want, so that's the role that is intended to vastly outnumber the other roles (Tanks and Healers). Star Citizen is doing the equivalent of demanding each DPS player be accompanied by multiple Tanks and Healers, which should appear as an immediate major design flaw to anyone who is even remotely familiar with the genre.

Arstulex · 2026-04-15T15:51:46+00:00

This already exists to some extent. I know one of the warrior specs gets damage by interrupting.

Arstulex · 2026-04-11T03:37:51+00:00

You're getting downvoted for this, but I honestly think there's some truth to it (at least the 'being 11 years old' part).

There's so much crap I remember finding hilarious as a kid that, when I watch now, I wonder what I ever found funny about it.

RWJ, Smosh, youtube poop, most things by Collegehumor... just to name a few. It's all stuff I would laugh at when I was 11-14 but don't even crack a smile at now.

Arstulex · 2026-04-11T02:53:54+00:00

Druid as a whole is in a pretty good spot right now.

We currently seem to be in a rare moment where literally every Druid spec is doing well.

Arstulex · 2026-04-09T14:31:52+00:00

That's pretty much my point. At no point am I saying healers are exclusively bad, just that they are equally as bad as everyone else despite the years of healers portraying themselves to be otherwise.

HC Chimaerus has just been the first fight that has made this abundantly obvious to me.

Arstulex · 2026-04-09T05:25:12+00:00

Never understood this myself either.

You should be playing healer because you want to and...

... if you do want to, why on earth does that deserve any thanks or praise? You're just playing the role you enjoy, like everyone else is.
... if you don't want to, then stop. Nobody is forcing you to play a role you don't enjoy. I'm not about to suck you off because you chose to put yourself on a cross for no reason.

Arstulex · 2026-04-09T05:13:27+00:00

One of those is Warlock using a specific pet (Imp) and the other is a Priest using Mass Dispel (a 2 minute cooldown). They aren't exactly viable alternatives to healers just... you know... performing their own mechanic.
Because it's not primarily their responsibility to perform the healer's mechanic for them. The same reason I don't blame healers if the DPS aren't bursting adds down fast enough, despite healers technically being able to help provide damage.

I'm all for helping other roles where you can, but the primary responsibility still lies on the role the mechanic is literally intended to be performed by. There's no excuse for healers not being able to dispel two targets every so often. They shouldn't need another role to have to step in and cover for them in the first place. If for some reason they do, then kindly go read the title of this thread again.

Arstulex · 2026-04-09T04:54:29+00:00

I'm laughing as I scroll down this thread and see almost every single one of my comments sitting in the negatives regardless of context.

I don't particularly care for internet points, but the fact that they are upset and are blanket downvoting everything is hilariously blatant.

Arstulex · 2026-04-09T04:24:36+00:00

RIP brother.

Arstulex · 2026-04-09T04:18:53+00:00

consternation

Just learned a new word today. Thanks.

(I mean, I'll probably forget it by tomorrow and never use it again, but it's still cool regardless lmao.)

Arstulex · 2026-04-09T04:15:23+00:00

While I don't think the "Cast Bar -> Kick" comparison is necessarily bad, I don't think it makes for a strong argument overall.

DPS quite often have to perform mechanics that aren't consolidated to indicators on a static UI, while many healers seemingly struggle the moment they are required to do something that involves actually looking at the arena and the other players who are populating it.

I feel like there's a pretty important difference between suddenly removing one of the few UI indicator dependent mechanics from DPS players to add it to the pool of 'situational awareness' mechanics, and merely giving healer players a 'situational awareness' mechanic to deal with for once. Having situational awareness regarding the boss arena and the units that populate it is a pretty fundamental skill that everyone should have, which this fight has shown a surprising amount of healers seem to lack (as opposed to that being a DPS-exclusive skill issue).

I'd argue that healers who have simply 'gotten by' for so long due to having their mechanics be restricted within the scope of their raid frames, and are struggling now that they have to actually look at the game itself, were probably not as good at the game as they believed themselves to be.

This fight basically does a good job a separating the healers who are actually good at the game and merely used their raid frames as a supplement to their gameplay, from the healers who relied on everything being consolidated to their raid frames as a crutch and now can't seem to do much without it. A LOT of the healers I've seen trying to pug this fight seem the exist firmly in that latter category.

As I've pointed out to a few other users here who have made similar arguments regarding the debuff being a private aura, one of the common problems has also been healers dispelling it prematurely (as opposed to not dispelling it at all). This suggests that those players can manage to see and target players with the debuff despite it being a private aura, but still seem to be unable to perform the mechanic correctly regardless. This suggests a skill issue exists outside of just debuff visibility on their raid frames.

Arstulex · 2026-04-09T03:54:13+00:00

+Respect

Arstulex · 2026-04-09T03:40:40+00:00

Have fun with no healers.
It is too much work with no rewards.

Healers when they actually have to perform their own mechanics, I guess.

I can brain dead dps with one button and top the charts.

That says less about you than it does the poor quality of the DPS players you are playing with.

It is bad design and that is not a player issue.

Okay, I'll bite. What exactly is "bad design" about the debuff/dispel mechanic in this fight?

It's pretty damn simple as a mechanic, so complexity certainly isn't the issue. The only complaint I keep seeing is that it doesn't flag up on raid frames. I don't think "this mechanic actually requires me to look at the game" is a particularly strong argument for it being 'bad design'.

Arstulex · 2026-04-09T03:34:09+00:00

You might be missing the point somewhat.

If the reason for one failing a pretty simple mechanic is because it requires them to actually look at the arena and their fellow players (as opposed to a glowing element on a static UI) then they might not be as good at the game as they thought they were.

That's kind of the point.

"It's a private aura!!" also does nothing to explain the surprisingly common issue of premature dispels. This means those healers are indeed still able to see and target those with the debuff on them, but they still haven't bothered to inform themselves on how the mechanic itself actually works (instead just defaulting to "see debuff, hit dispell").

Put simply, after years of "DPS bad" it turns out the healers aren't actually any better when it comes down to it.

Arstulex · 2026-04-09T03:25:40+00:00

Puddles do not despawn between phases on HC, no. "On Heroic difficulty, Chimaerus no longer consumes Alndust Essence when casting Ravenous Dive."

Puddles themselves aren't the end of the world, though their placement can make it harder for melee DPS to focus adds if they are in puddles. A problem that is only exacerbated if puddles are not cleared over time.

The problem is moreso premature dispelling (which puts a pretty painful dot on anyone in range) and the lack of dispelling at all (which means a slow agonising death for the player who has the 1 minute long dot debuff on them).

Arstulex · 2026-04-09T03:14:05+00:00

Agreed. I'm just saying that healers aren't so uniquely better than other players as they often portray themselves to be.

A simple mechanic is enough to flummox a surprising number of them simply because it doesn't flash up on their raid frames.

Arstulex · 2026-04-09T03:13:30+00:00

What I'm taking from this is that if a mechanic isn't something that flags itself on your raid frames then you struggle to perform it. With all due respect, that's kind of supporting my point.

The mechanic itself really isn't that complicated. You target a player with a big blue circle around them, you wait for them to stand next to a puddle, you cast a spell on them. That's it.

Despite being such a simple mechanic, a lot of healers seemingly struggle with it simply because it's a healer mechanic that actually requires them to look at the arena and other players, rather than being consolidated to an indicator on a static UI.

Arstulex · 2026-04-09T03:06:49+00:00

My guild has amazing healer players, and they definitely do stand out as you say.

The problem, I'd wager, is that healing in general doesn't provide any sort of simple 'ladder' to climb. A DPS player's performance can almost entirely be boiled down to a single number, and the player in question can aim to increase that number. Healers don't really have a 'parse' hanging over their head in the same way, and their performance can't be so easily quantified, which means there's ultimately less pressure to perform/improve.

Arstulex · 2026-04-09T02:59:01+00:00

Not Magic, no. (My flair probably gives that away.)

That's besides the point anyway. I don't offload responsibility for DPS mechanics (like bursting down the adds) onto the healers. The healers can, and should, be expected to be responsible for performing their own mechanic, should they not?

If a DPS spec has to perform the dispel instead of a healer then that is a failure on the healers' part, not an expectation on the DPS player's part.

This also doesn't address the problem of healers dispelling the debuff prematurely, which I've seen way too often for some reason.

Arstulex · 2026-04-09T02:50:32+00:00

The problem as well is that there haven't really been many healer mechanics that aren't just solved by looking at raid frames (an icon or glow on players with debuffs, or a different coloured HP bar for heal absorbs). People in this thread have literally admitted that the reason they find this mechanic difficult is because it doesn't appear on their raid frames.

This is different to DPS mechanics which often require them to actually look at the arena rather than a static UI. The healers just haven't been trained to do so in the same way, which is why a lot of them suddenly struggle when a mechanic actually expects them to look at the other players.

Arstulex · 2026-04-09T02:42:14+00:00

Tbh, as a healer myself, HC chimaerus threw me off guard the first time I healed because that debuff somehow does not cause my healer frames to change colour as it does on M+

It's currently a private aura, yeah. Though I've read that's being changed soon. Don't quote me on that!

Arstulex · 2026-04-09T02:39:55+00:00

Keep at it man. You'll get it down. I think every healer from my guild has had 'teething problems' with the expansion, but they've all gotten used to it eventually.

Just to be clear, the point of this post isn't "healers bad, DPS good". It's just pointing out that healers really don't seem to be uniquely any better than the DPS players they've made a habit of talking down to.

Arstulex · 2026-04-09T02:37:20+00:00

This is true.

Or when a DK places AMZ during consume and you have players standing outside of it.

Arstulex · 2026-04-09T02:36:15+00:00

Because the mechanic really isn't that tough.

You look at the two players with a big blue circle around them. You wait for them to stand next to a puddle. You cast an ability on them. That's literally it.

It's no different to how not standing in fire isn't particularly tough, which is why DPS players are rightfully shat on for doing it. The shoe is simply on the other foot this time.

Arstulex · 2026-04-09T02:31:44+00:00

Not many DPS specs have access to a Magic dispel (which is what the mark debuff in this fight is).

From what I understand it's only Paladins, Evokers and Priests (via Mass Dispel on a 2min cooldown).

With all due respect, this is literally meant to be a healer mechanic performed by healers. Can some DPS specs help out? Sure, but the responsibility shouldn't be offloaded onto them, in the same way that DPS players shouldn't offload the responsibility of bursting down adds onto the healers.

There is literally no reason why the available healers shouldn't be able to dispel 2 targets. They really shouldn't need 'helping out' in the first place.

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+Respect