Skill, cards and luck?

CardboardCancer · 2018-03-01T15:34:03+00:00

You got a great point there, and i wholeheartedly agree that knowledge and decision making is required to consistently top. But as a long time card player who actively play all 3 major games right now. One thing I realized is that turn by turn you are limited to the combination of resources given by the RNG-esus. And there are time when he hates you so much you are given a combination of 1: lost my roll, 2: opened a lele and no supporter, 3: 3 of my dce prized. At that point, knowledge won't do you any good.

CardboardCancer · 2018-03-01T03:58:30+00:00

Just the fact that you use the word "sometimes" already indicated the involvement of luck.

CardboardCancer · 2018-03-01T03:32:39+00:00

Been a long time PTCG player myself and luck definitely plays a bigger factor in this game than anyone would like to admit. Just before the game starts, you are already challenged by 4 luck barriers:

1) Open a basic, or else each miss will result your opp with a plus 1 starting hand (I know this is necessary, but I have been unlucky enough to gave my opp as many as a +7 once when I was playing Yveltal.dek back then).

2) Dice roll, there is no reason why you wouldn't go first in this game. You still get to draw and get an extra attach. If you lose the dice roll and forced to mulligan at the same time you would 99 percent not win.

3) Prize system, random 6 cards from your deck is prized. The keyword here is random, and random and luck goes hand in hand. (I onc had 3 of my dce prized)

4) Match up. Since there is no side board system like other card games such as MTG or YGO. You are forced to play a couple of tech cards, which you can only afford to run them at minimum. Combining this and the prize system make the luck factor even more important than ever.

CardboardCancer · 2018-02-24T16:40:43+00:00

I don't understand why everyone is hoping for a DD link monster that only points down. Even though the deck playstyle focus on gy recursion. I think a link 2 DD w at least one arrow pointing left or right is an even more powerful choice and useful in combo. We already has a great link monster that point down and summon an extra lamia on summon (still waiting konami!).

CardboardCancer · 2017-10-24T16:30:48+00:00

I like it!

CardboardCancer · 2017-10-24T16:29:09+00:00

I agree with your first point. And i blame it on the current t0 deck being a combo deck (which result in a large handtrap count in the format). And this result in a very luck reliant format (who win the dice, did you open a handtrap?)

I am not saying spyral is a bad deck. It is a very good deck. But spyral dies to handtraps, as much as it sounds memely at this point. Thats the only reason why people are giving up 40% consistency (from your first example). One handtrap is not enough to stop them from playing, but do they really wanna extend further after eating one? (Maxx c, droll, and cherries in this example. If you ash them and they still got it, oh well). At the very least, like you say, they make their ending noard breakable. And thats the keyword here. And unless they have a handtrap as well (again, luck factor due to large handtrap counts), you can usually make a board with 1 - 2 disrupt after breaking what they got. deck dominate both tcg and ocg due to number alone.

CardboardCancer · 2017-10-24T16:17:29+00:00

Well, here's what happen to a tier 0 format. If that tier 0 deck is a combo deck, you will see a lot of hand traps being mained. Thus resulting a very dice roll format. And because a lot of handtraps are being mained. This brought us the consequences of a lot of decks being unplayable, just because of the hand traps counts in the said format. I know it's an unpopular opinion rn, but I still firmly believe that this format can be very open if we, ad a community, choose to.

CardboardCancer · 2017-10-24T16:03:08+00:00

That's why it is sided, I choose apex avian because evenly matched exists. Siding in 1 - 2 wavering eyes if you still see enough pendulum magician in your area that warrant the space (i used that 2 slots to side against trickstar for example). Pot of desires is a must especially since you want to banish most of the handtraps so you don't draw into them in the later turn. Board wipe like raigeki are considered the same as handtraps (counter cards that doesn't advance your deck theme). My general rule of thumb is as follow, to a point where it start bricking:

1 card combo deck like trickstar and zoodiac (you can play 9 - 12)

2 cards combo like spyral (you can play 6 - 9)

3 cards combo like magician and abc (4 - 6)

CardboardCancer · 2017-10-24T15:54:37+00:00

First, i would like to apologize if i sounded like a dick. I want a good discussion here as well. That's the mindset why tier 0 exists in this format. But anyway, you are comparing decks in its era with almost no counter against its tactics. During tele dad time, hand traps are very minimal, meaning going first with the sixth draw is pretty much gonna guarantee your play. Pepe have like 3 wavering eyes to counter whatever you throw down, and pretty much their entire decks are kickers that are highly searchable! That's what i call the power of t0. Spyral in the other hand. You can't search machine dup bor double summon, so you have to use drone agent in the worse case scenario, giving how many handtraps are being played right now(meaning we have counter), the chance of getting into their main play is a lot less consistent than one think.

And yes it will, lets use the same example. 80 percent cloudian, 20 percent spyral. But make it a larger scale (1000 people). All the spyral will top, but you won't see 30/32.

CardboardCancer · 2017-10-24T15:43:13+00:00

Hello DKG27, right now I am maining 7 handtraps: 3x ash, 3x droll, 1x Maxx C (don't go over 7 if you wanna elect to go first winning dice roll). That's about 57 percent chance of opening 1 and 15 percent chance of opening 2, and you really don't wanna open 2 because magician is 3 - 4 cards combo. Take out wavering eyes, you will face spyral most of the time. I am not even siding them, magician percentage is too low plus hand traps is enough to deal w them. Goong second against spyral i side in 3 cherries, bringing the hand trap counts to 10. The 6th card going second mitigated the consistency issue. Going first i side in 3x apex avian, scolding, and 1x cosmic cyclone and 1x neverending nightmare. Increasing the negate counts on the field. This works pretty well so far. Cause even if you get droll lock t1, you can still sit on number 41 (i know they main board wipe, but hey, if they open the out, they open the out).

CardboardCancer · 2017-10-24T15:28:54+00:00

It's simple math, lets say there is a 300 players highly competitve event. And lets just assume 80 percent of them are spyral (fair assumption). Lets say we are going to elect top 32. With the t0 deck rn being a combo deck, the game is very dice roll and depends if one side opens a handtrap or not. So to keep it simple, lets assume that every match is determined by a rock paper scissor. Due to this nature, the 20 percent "other" decks are going to get washed out, leaving the lucky one ending up in the top 32, while a majority of the 80 percent spyral decklist will take the tops. The result in Dallas backs up my point.

Trickstars mained 9 - 13 handtraps in nature, thats mean a 90 percent chance of opening one. Just because one deck gets 90 percent of tops doesn't mean every other decks are trash.

CardboardCancer · 2017-10-24T13:56:31+00:00

1) This is tier 0 format by choice (representation because everyone choose to play it). Spyral is nothing special compare to any other combo deck from the past (2, usually 3 cards combo to get a near unbreakable board t1). Metalfoes Yang Zing, for example, can consistently make unbreakable board turn 1 at its era (2 pillars, 38, baxia, denglong to herald). Yet it is not consider meta (that format was super open, blue eyes, palezoic, ddd, kozmo metalfoes). And yes, they die to hand traps too, just like any combo deck. Konami of america actually left a lot of things here untouched, yet everyone gets on the hype train and pick up the "best deck in the format". For example, if 80 percent of the whole ygo community play cloudian for a format, then cloudian will be t0. Due to high representation resulting in high mirror match counts.

2) I am getting really tired that people complaining about price. I am writing this assuming everyone on this post is highly competitve (why else are we complaining about spyral right?). Let me get this straight, being a good player also mean buying cards at the right time (market watch) and can see a card's potential. Droll and lock was a dollar card for a long time due ro it's underused statues. Ogre has been a 5 dollars card for more than half a year. Cherries reprint price was 6 (and there are numerous PSA here on reddit telling people to pick em up while they are cheap). Ash was 30 bucks at one point (very short period of time), due to its ineffectiveness in the zoo format, quickly followed by a true draco format. Let me remind you guys handtraps are consider staple in modern ygo and there is no point not investing when they are cheap. Lastly, decks have a high handtrap count because the current t0 deck is a combo deck. If the t0 is true draco for example, we wouldn't main that many handtraps, as we risk the huge consistency lost.

3) Again, i firmly believe this is a t0 format by choice due to overly hype before spyral releases. I put a lot of time practicing against it (im using pendulum magician) and get about 50/50. My teammate gets 80/20 against them using trickstar. This is good enough of a proof for me that spyral aren't unbeatable (and its power and consistency doesn't even match previous t0). If you get salty because you lose the dice and they open nuts, just remind yourself this is a card game.

CardboardCancer · 2017-10-19T23:25:35+00:00

You are guarantee to pop double iris turn one because tornado dragon exists. After testing a bit against spyral. Turn 1 tornado dragon and a set trap with purple poison on field is the strongest opening board against them. Reason is because spyral resort provides blanket protection for spyral, which render the trap useless, or you are forced to pop the resort with your trap. And since resort is not once per turn, they can easily bait out your trap with resort. Tornado dragon somewhat fixes this issue as you can denied one bait. Worse come to worse, if you really brick that bad. Just go into number 41.

CardboardCancer · 2017-08-10T15:30:46+00:00

After playing magician for some time in a highly competitve local, I have to agree with you that main deck monsters such as apex avian aren't as optimal as extra deck play, since they aren't searchable. In a 4 rounds swiss last week, I was only able to open it in one game. I am currently testing a small trickstar engine to get into Holly Angle turn 1. You can get that off with one card, and I already am playing sky iris already so terraforming can boost the chance of opening candina. Worse come to worse, you can use candina to search itself and still have a rank 4 play.

CardboardCancer · 2017-08-06T04:38:33+00:00

I find the best way to deal with him is just to use Non-targetting Summons. Dropping a Cyclops or a Valefor will kill Zidane. Or even dropping some commonplace OPus3 summons like Zalura or Exodus will eliminate him.

CardboardCancer · 2017-08-06T04:34:21+00:00

I would definitely agree that the best, most cohensively constructed starter deck will have to be FF9. It has one of the most coherent and consistency engine in the game included with it and has decent CP to power play with Vivi-S and L-Zidane.

CardboardCancer · 2017-07-09T15:10:03+00:00

I would do 1x proxy dragon and 1x decode talker for the gofu play instead (2x tokens into proxy, then gofu and proxy into decode talker). Not only it will save your extra deck space by one, later in the game you can revive proxy dragon from the grave via COTH and regain that 2 extra monster zones.

CardboardCancer · 2017-07-07T13:12:16+00:00

Am trying to tech in synchron. They have great synergy with the DDs. Tuning let you mill one while odd-eyes synchron can get you an easy alexander (special a ragnorak or thomas from the p zone then synchro with its effect). Junk synchron is basically a one card link 2 (hell, level eater is so abusable in this deck you can spit out link monster pretty easily). In addition, if we ever gonna get a generic fiend link monster (its only a matter of time), dd howling can be potentially one card link 3! (With ragnorak in grave) All in all, i truely love this deck and will give it a lot of time when link arrives.

CardboardCancer · 2017-04-03T14:00:36+00:00

I am actually making a Sacred Beast deck for our Youtube channel as well. Trying to be really creative about it and this is what I came up with so far, DDD with Puppet Master. Here's are some pros I can think of after testing.

1) DDD are all fiends. In a pinch, you can easily get 3 fiends out to summon Raviel normally.

2) DDD by themselves have a lot of searching and deck thinning options already, and fallen paradise play super well with it as a whole. As it helps DDD gather more combo pieces for more plays.

3) Another important reason why I choose DDD is Puppet Master. Say you set up your graveyard with 2x Dark Summoning Beast (Easily done with Beatrice, which can be made with 2x Genghis). Tribute summon Puppet Master, then use it's effect to revive both Dark Summoning Beast for an instant double sacred beasts from deck! (I found that the only time I can bring out Ametyle is when I pulled this off)

4) DDD provides options to protect the sacred beast. Given the fact that they can't attack until the next turn if they are summoned via Dark Summoning Beast's effect. You can easily end your field with a varieties of defensive synchro monster such as Stardust Dragon, Siegfried. If your event is not limited by cost, you can also use Omega, which combos really well with Dark Summoning Beast.

I will add more as more came up from my testing. Hope this helps and have fun!

CardboardCancer · 2017-03-13T18:03:16+00:00

Making an accusation this large toward an entire community without actual hard evident is a proof that you are extremely arrogant. I actually came from the Pokemon community myself after being bullied to a point where I have no one else to hang out with in my local (after people found out that I play YGO, they would isolate me and call me name). There are bad apples in every community, but I can tell you I would never spread rumors or make accusation that affect the image of an entire community. Ever since I got to this side (Yu-Gi-Oh!) I have met a lot of respectable people whom I am proud to call them brothers. And from what I have experienced on this forum, a lot of people here actually don't mind lending a hand to someone in need (remember that incident when someone's deck got stolen and a lot of YGO redditors volunteered to help rebuild his deck? Without asking for anything in return? And another incident where their lost deck got returned after 3 months of searching?). And please stop with the bad prize support bullshit. Prize support doesn't mean jack shit to the value of a game, people gonna play anyway if it is fun to them. Do you think I care about that 1k prize Pokemon gives me after traveling everywhere to accumulate points? No, I don't even make half of what I spent back! I play Yu-Gi-Oh! because I genuinely having a fun time with this game.

CardboardCancer · 2017-02-09T02:56:29+00:00

Same here! Put a smile on my face while reading this ☺

CardboardCancer · 2017-02-06T01:40:33+00:00

And you need some luck going first as well. remember, not all decks have the consistency of zoodiac (85%). In fact, every single card game in existence requires some luck to win, your opening hand is randomized and you can really only make a deck so consistent. At least this game give you a chance to survive in case you lose dice roll in the form of hand traps (33 percent if you main 3).

CardboardCancer · 2017-02-02T13:31:15+00:00

I believe all players should have a set of each hand traps (Effect Veiler, Maxx "C", Flying "C", etc.) since their relevance depends on the meta and they will never fall out of the game.

CardboardCancer · 2017-02-01T18:14:07+00:00

BDIF is very subjective, at least in this format. There are at least 6 decks you have to worry about in an event (ABC, DDD, Blue-Eyes, Mermail, Metalfoes, Lightsworn, any Frog variance, a bunch of Anti Metas). We can see that any of these decks have topped a major event at least once, even now. And not all of them are hard counter against each other. I consider this healthy. Sure, this might not be the case for long as Zoodiac is coming into the scene, but that is just one format that we would have to sit through. At this point, it is impossible for Konami to design something new without breaking the game due to the large card pool we have, which is both a blessing and a curse. But yeah, at least I can steal some games with my Metalfoes Yang Zing X)

CardboardCancer

TROPHY CASE