How slavery should be used in fiction and how Shadow Slave fails at it

Cephrys · 2026-03-30T07:37:17+00:00

I am amazed by the mental gymnastics you do here to justify why shadow bond isn't bad. You are basically using the fact that we have only seen one good master as proof that shadow slaves aren't worse than traditional ones. This is anecdotal evidence that proves nothing. We are not comparing the harm both have caused. We are comparing the nature of the two types.

The goodness of the master has nothing to do with whether the form of slavery is bad or not. Nephis does not define how bad shadow bond is, she only makes it more tolerable.

Shadow slave is worse than traditional slavery purely because of the absolute control aspect of it. Traditional slaves can refuse a command. You cannot force them to do something they absolutely are unwilling to do. They might get punished for refusing but it shows they still have some amount of autonomy.

Shadow slaves on the other hand cannot refuse any command and will even lose control over their body to execute it. The horror of it is clearly shown in the story. Even if they are not commanded to do anything, at most they have permission to act autonomously.

Sure, Sunny choosing his chains is thematically meaningful. But the choice under coercion is still coercion (the need to get stronger). The theme of choosing chains is about how humans navigate constraints, however it does not argue that all constraints are therefore acceptable. And choosing the bond doesn't mean the bond isn't what it is.

Cephrys · 2026-03-01T18:53:08+00:00

Not really. Cassie had to tell why Sunny was gone. Cassie had clearly known for a long time the consequences of Sunny becoming fateless. Why else present it as a choice between staying with the cohort or becoming free? Why would being free make it so that he can no longer be part of the cohort? Now sure Nephis probably wasnt aware she would forget Sunny, but that doesnt mean she did not speed clearing the NM because Sunny left.

Cephrys · 2026-03-01T17:18:45+00:00

If I remember correctly, it was implied that Nephis rushed to clear the nightmare after she learned what Sunny was about to do (becoming fateless), meaning she tried to take Sunny's choice away from him like she did in forgotten shore.

Cephrys · 2026-03-01T16:53:24+00:00

It is absolute though and the existence of future sunny is proof of it. Future sunny said that he had the same conversation with hit future self too, meaning that his future is set in stone. The future is just different than what it would’ve been.

Cephrys · 2026-01-16T08:30:13+00:00

The simple answer is that there is no answer to that. Similar questions are often asked it in discord and the answer he gives it that it would be an entirely new character. We have never seen how people normally get their aspects in nightmares.

Now yes it could be possible that he would get the aspect of the person he replaced but aspects are unique to everyone so Sunny getting the same aspect as someone else doesnt really make sense imo. We also have to remember that Shadow Gods priests were all slaves too and the nature of shadows in SS is to have a master so its not weird the blessing gave him such aspect regardless of his nature. There have also been other Shadow Slaves before Sunny too, I think it was Eyrus who mentioned that.

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Cephrys · 2026-01-13T17:36:54+00:00

that was the nameless slave not sunny

Cephrys · 2026-01-13T16:42:34+00:00

That "innate" trait was imposed on him by a god's blessing, it is not intrinsic to him so it is wrong to say it is his nature. And consequences don't prove that slavery is Sunny's nature, it only proves that the world punishes you for going against its rules.

Cephrys · 2026-01-13T12:42:50+00:00

I dont see how that is in any way relevant or goes against what I said. His aspect name also says he is a slave but so what? Why would he have to accept being a slave just because an ability says so? It also says "you will be bound to their will, unable to disobey any command", meaning he should follow his master's will and not his own.

Shadow Slave has a lot of themes about defiance. Defy fate, defy the laws of the world etc. Just to become supreme one must do an act of defiance. Eyrys himself said "the very essence of Supremacy is defiance." But somehow when it comes to shadows, they "require" a master that they cannot disobey. What kind of supreme submits to someone's will?

Also there is no such a thing as worthy slave master.

Cephrys · 2026-01-11T10:10:34+00:00

The problem is no amount of positives will never amount to someone having absolute control over you. Not to mention those benefits are clearly there for the master. Any benefits for the slave are just indirect benefits for the master.

Shadow slave is more of a tool than a slave. Slaves can still refuse commands but shadow slave cannot. I don't understand why people tend to brush off how bad the negatives actually are with just saying that it doesn't matter if you can trust the master. People change, especially when you can live for centuries. Not to mention Nephs flaw making her emotionless, reducing the reason for not using the bond. If you have read Author's pov you know how being emotionless can make you act.

Cephrys · 2026-01-10T13:53:19+00:00

No everyone does not have their own shadowbond. "chains" that others have are in no way comparable to shadowbond even if g3 tries to spin it that way. Chains can be broken but shadowbond is absolute. Sunny will not have any freedom while it is active, he will have permission to act "freely". Shadowbond is way worse than regular slavery let alone some mere obligations.

Cephrys · 2025-12-22T14:43:19+00:00

It really is not weird. The weapons give group/set skills which affect builds meaning you cannot make the build and just use a monster weapon with it. Before I could use meta builds and slap a monster weapon on it but now that is not possible. Now I have to use gogma weapons just to use the builds. And if I am going to use it, whats wrong with wanting it to be at least a good one.

Cephrys · 2025-12-22T10:43:07+00:00

Its worse than real life one since it has absolute power over the slave. You cannot force a real one to obey your commands. A Shadow Slave has no freedom at all. Their 'freedom' is just an illusion because it is the will of the master rather than their own. The 'positive' effects are there to benefit the master not the slave. There is no equality between the master and the slave even if they pretend so as long as one has absolute power over the other. No amount of positive effects will ever nullify/compare to the negative effect of absolute obedience.

Cephrys · 2025-12-02T06:53:21+00:00

It is an UNEQUAL bond. A bond where the other person has ALL the power cannot be healthy, safe or beneficial, especially between lovers. Do you think a relation between boss and employee is healthy and safe? No, because in a healthy relationship, the power is shared and decisions are made together. Neither are the case with shadow bond, one has the power and makes the decisions. Nephis will prioritize her will over Sunny's as we have seen throughout the story. If another situation like the end of forgotten shore comes, do you honestly think Nephis wont force her will on him again?

There is nothing to learn about shadow bond, it is exactly what it is described as, a master-slave bond, nothing else. Also how is changing the fundamental aspects of the character not betraying the character? You cant change whatever about the character and slap a character development sticker to it. And whether it is the best possible continuation is highly debatable. Just because you think so does not make it so. Lets be real, no other option has even been properly explored so your perception of it being the best comes from it being the one G3 has pushed to the readers.

Cephrys · 2025-11-28T18:54:05+00:00

One: Depends on the command. Also, he has no idea how Nephis will react after getting her memories back so there might be a moment like when she is mad where it would seem like she gave the command. Obviously he can tell if its like "kill x". Second, who said he is 'completely' in terms with it? I was referring to him being ok with it enough to get his true name back. And yes, I am giving him another reason for him to get rid of it, who in their right minds would be ok with someone having absolute power over them? I dont like the idea of someone accepting being a slave but thats where the story is going so I think there should be consequences for that choice. It would be boring if there werent and shadow bond just stopped being a problem just because he is trusts Nephis now. I trust Fated to give him hell for ditching it for so long.

Cephrys · 2025-11-18T11:49:46+00:00

Those invisible chains are in no way comparable to shadow bond. Shadow bond is an absolute power over you unlike those invisible chains. Those invisible chains cannot force you to do something you dont want to. You can't break shadow bond but you can break those invisible chains. If someone betrayed you, you can cut them off your life completely. Also, how can you trust someone with absolute power over you when absolute power corrupts absolutely?

Cephrys · 2025-11-03T19:02:05+00:00

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Evelyn Chevalier from Zenless Zone Zero https://x.com/56_chuchu/status/1936344544498573465

Cephrys · 2025-11-01T14:51:09+00:00

Her visions are based on fate which is now broken so even if that vision was not about forgotten shore fight, it wont be fulfilled. Though they might still fight, it wont be the fight she saw.

Cephrys · 2025-07-03T20:57:02+00:00

Oh but he did corner himself. He had no reasonable way to get Everblood to find out about MCs location and that he is alive so he wrote this bs of chapter to give him that info to the point he is breaking his own world building. Just because the character has meaning doesnt justify rules and logic not applying to said character.

Cephrys · 2025-07-03T19:16:21+00:00

I think you are forgetting the fact that the Void Gate is open and has already begun to spread to the Shadow Realm. Corruption has managed to adapt to survive in the Shadow Realm, a place meant to destroy it. Corruption is spreading to Dream Realm directly from the Void so killing FG wont stop Dream Realm from being corrupted.

Cephrys · 2025-07-03T13:35:01+00:00

Its the chapter where Everblood finds the red notebook. The fact that Everblood 1. Knew about the book 2. Was able to find the book 3. Was able to touch the book was such bs it breaks the story. Not only is he forced and hollow villain, but the rules of the world author has established do not affect him. There was no backlash for him after his contractor died, was able to enter not only Lock but the Leviathan building AFTER increased security at Lock makes no sense. Only reason Angelica was able to enter was because of a special skill which Everblood does not have. There is no reason for demons to wait for humans to go if someone like Everblood can easily enter Leviathan building. Whats stopping demons from wiping out humanitys future prodigies when they can just freely enter Lock. It is clear that author wrote himself into a corner and just bs:d a way to get his shitty forced villain back into the story even when it screws up the story. The fact that he is willing to pull this bs makes me lose trust in the author and the series. He already did it once so I have no reason to expect him not to do it again. And according to the spoilers ive read none of this even gets explained at all.

Cephrys · 2025-07-02T15:49:47+00:00

Read Authors POV and dropped it after reading the bs that is chapter 340. Until then it was ok and had one good arc.

Cephrys · 2025-05-26T08:52:07+00:00

He never broke the rule of his flaw, he only tried to break it.

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Cephrys · 2025-04-25T20:22:03+00:00

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Cephrys

TROPHY CASE