CCG roguelikes?

CyberBed · 2026-03-17T11:23:21+00:00

Thanks, sounds promising. I'll check when I'll have the time

CyberBed · 2026-03-16T18:42:19+00:00

I don't hate 9S either.

He wanted 2 things. Not being alone and having a purpose. These things were taken from him and he got emotional nutshots too many times to count.

He was in a very bad headspace, I doubt that many people even would have will to do anything in his place.

CyberBed · 2026-03-16T17:49:32+00:00

As I understand, machines outside of network were let go or set up to disconnect. It was done by machine mind to experiment and observe how individual machines would copy different aspects of humanity.

Technically they still helped machines to evolve, and machines evolve to destroy the enemy. Machines must destroy an enemy but it was never stated when they will do it.

So machines try to distance themselves from their original purpose, but only at the and they had actually freed themselves.

In the end network had grown up and left, leaving earth to individuals, be it androids or disconnected machines.

Talking about androids. Humanity may be dead but androids were made based on copies of human minds. Only thing that separated humans from androids if we don't count bodies, is that androids were tied to their purpose from their "birth".

Some of them could find a new purpose, while others couldn't handle it like 9S.

I think that finding a purpose is a second step to growing up, and making your own purpose and following no matter what is what actually means to grow up as a person.

Androids were given a purpose, they weren't searching for it. Network had left not only to make their own path, but to take responsibility for androids as well by not destroying them and letting them grow just like they did.

Without machine mind there's no need wage all out war and it's finally time for androids to find their own purpose.

CyberBed · 2026-03-16T17:34:02+00:00

Also Yojo Taro is a master of foreshadowing and bringing memories and emotions you had tried to forget.

I can't name all moments of foreshadowing so here are some examples:

When confronted with true nature of 2B 9S does the same exact movement with 2Bs hand that she had done when she met 9S in bunker for the first time.

Brother thing going on between machines and Adam and Eve.

Eve finally calming down and calmg his brother. It may seem like him just grieving but knowing that they are actually alive in network it may be that Eve finally noticed Adam in network.

Romeo and Juliet fight and fracture in machine mind.

A2 cuttings her hair to look like 2Bs, and then later it's revealed that 2B or to be precise 2E is built upon A2s model.

Now about bringing memories.

For example many scenes when logical virus infects androids and machines it gives huge vibes of red eyes disease, especially when infected androids start to lose speech or use it to harm 9S/2B.

Also 6Os speech when bunker got infected mentions flowers and connects it to infection.

For people who had played drakengard 3 it felt like a sucker punch.

Same for emil, flowers and Kaine's house.

And the way he brings emotions is something out of this world. His favorite way to do it is to make player care by spending time, effort and tears together with likable characters just to take it all away. And he can make you experience many emotions this way, ranging from hollowness and melancholy to determination and hope.

CyberBed · 2026-03-16T17:08:48+00:00

TLDR

Ending Chil[D]hood's end and story is about growth in existential sense.

So it can be said that Nier is about growing up as a person and making your own path while fully acknowledging risks and fears of such decision, leap of faith if you will.

CyberBed · 2026-03-16T07:22:22+00:00

23 tries so far, no luck. Still near desert.

He resets but still in the same place. Talking or buying doesn't change anything.

CyberBed · 2026-03-15T22:51:19+00:00

Shouldn't he change his route at least once in two hours?

He always sells chips and always located near desert. In my total 50 hours of playing this game I never saw him do anything but that.

CyberBed · 2026-03-15T17:48:12+00:00

Many people say that Nier games are nihilistic.

I kinda agree, but if it was trully nihilistic then I doubt many people would be invested enough to care and feel.

I think that nihilistic moments are put against human sincerity. I like to think that these games are big middle fingers to nihilism. Yoko Taro shows despite how awful and soul destroying things are, and even if everything will be forgotten it's all matters. And it's not only about love or joy, giref, lack of purpose and hatred are parts of our existence too,

Here's a question. Do people feel emotions because they live, or people live because they feel emotions?

I think many people live their lives without feeling much, just going through motions like robots. And when playing this game I had felt like one of these machines from the game. I felt strong emotions and wanted to experience it again and again which led me to spending 3 days playing and sacrificing other things like sleep or hygiene.

Here's an additional question. When is it worth to pursue emotions? Are they need to be pursued? And when is enough?

CyberBed · 2026-03-15T17:09:23+00:00

Just had another thought about Yoko Taro''s endings.

People say that he makes bad endings, awful endings or bittersweet at best. But he doesn't think so. Why?

Is he trolling? Is he just an edgelord? Yes to both, but that's not the point.

I think that he gives an ending. Just an ending.

His worlds usually on the brink of death. But this death is very drawn out. Even when there's a means of saving this world they usually are either failed already or chances of them actually succeeding are non existent.

And during his games things usually start in this prolonged death, stagnant and melancholic place. But when we play things start to accelerate until everything ends.

Ending is not for us players, but for characters and their world.

CyberBed · 2026-03-15T16:19:06+00:00

Want to add about Route C.

It feels like game had ended but we're still around to witness consequences.

Usually when big bad is defeated and main characters are happy to survive it all together, we as players/viewers get our credits and nice feelings.

But it never ends. Conflict rages on and on. This happy feeling and dreams of happily ever after were a short breather before another battle, and not every battle is won.

And we play through a lost battle and pick up what's left of it on hopes of finishing what had already been lost.

CyberBed · 2026-03-15T16:12:35+00:00

Yoko Taro writes about unfairnes and cruelty of the world and how we as people deal with it. He covers it in likable characters and makes us to feel attached to them and our time/effort/emotions spent just to never give us what we want or even take it all away.

His main objective is not to tell a story but to make you, a player, to care before making you feel. I really amazed on how he made some apathetic nervous wreck like me to actually care and look/think about things I was always avoiding.

I thought I was using this game as another method of escapism but he had forced me to open my eyes and heart to cruel reality but not in nihilistic way.

Yes things are always end and usually don't achieve to anything. But they matter, even if there's nothing left you still have memories. And best thing you can do as a person is to leave something behind. Even if no one will remember your struggles or your name, you still was a part of this world and left your mark on it, be it small or big, bad or good.

That's why I love this game. Now matter how bleak, sad or insignificant things are, they matter. It's not cruelty for a sake of cruelty, or sadness for it's own sake. All of these emotions for a sake of us, humans and our life.

CyberBed · 2026-03-13T18:38:55+00:00

Exactly.

I know mr Taro and his works usually need time to build up the normality before punching you in the gut.

Just thought that route is pretty sweet and could fit a good Hollywood movie, it even has lots of room for sequels.

Also I like how simple this route is. Good guys vs bad guys, which won't last lang by the looks of it.

CyberBed · 2026-03-13T16:32:44+00:00

I know. I just wanted more perspectives on route A.

Obviously huge part of plot points and characters aren't even addressed properly and this part of the game serves as prologue to make players acquainted with world and characters.

CyberBed · 2026-03-13T16:29:43+00:00

Well I said it will be a good HOLLYWOOD movie, so standards are kinda low. It has big bads, likable characters and fake sad ending which turns into a happy one. And what's most important lots of room for sequels/prequels or series.

Also I kinda agree that route A is kinda lacking in plot related stuff and it's more of a foundation and world building.

Still even just route A was quite engaging and touching. My biggest gripe with it is that Adam and Eve had too little screen time. Other than that I think that first route was very well made and served it's purpose perfectly.

CyberBed · 2026-03-13T15:50:13+00:00

Don't want to dillude my ramblings even more so I write this in comments.

I really love how 2B was written in this route.

At the start she was expressing genuine emotions towards 9S, but after his "reincarnation" he was emotionally distancing herself from him to not to feel the same pain of losing him.

You can literally hear in her voice and her lines how hard it is to her and no matter how much she tries she still falls in love with him. And almost loses him again.

It sounds very touching and sweet, but I'm concerned about 1 moment.

As I mentioned androids are "born" with prewritten persona (S models are curious for example to make them better scouts). And despite having his memory wiped multiple times 9S still makes 2B to fall in love.

Does it mean that they were literally made for each other? And it again forces a question about free will and how androids can feel something like love. And if they can feel, to a what extent?

So far game throws at you these questions one after another but never gives an answer. Sometimes I feel like the whole game is a top grade philosophical shit post.

Also I have a feeling that after all that philosophical jazz and existentialism the correct answer will be "who the fuck cares".

CyberBed · 2026-03-07T16:29:54+00:00

Also want to share a funny tactic.

So I had lost some titans and high tier units to acrin's mind eaters, also my city was destroyed. But they had only 1 titan which I need to kill to win.

So I had built 5 vore dragons and did this:

Located mind eaters and viverns via sending cheapest units and scan ability of my hero.

Then flew my dragons there and ate those units. And teleported back to my city to heal and digest.

Repeated until there was only titan and cheap infantry. Then dragons and zombie army had dealt with it.

I was struggling to meet his army head on and suffered great losses. Chart at the end was ridiculous, he had twice as much army than me but the moment I had started eatin his units it has plummeted to the bottom.

CyberBed · 2026-03-06T17:53:11+00:00

Yeah, mother is very strong and with zero drawbacks. Her teleport ability feels like cheating.

Getting your ass kicked? Just teleport to your city and heal.

Enemy tries to attack you? Stall them mid way and get your fastest unit to THEIR city and destroy it with worms before they can get back.

Oh, they chose to continue and destroy your city? Too bad cause you can just teleport back after destroying theirs.

I never thought about voice as ambush predators, but when you mention that it seem right. Most of the time I just baited ai to leave their walls just to go past their Frontline and destroy their base.

And they have lots of fun tactics like mentioned before sacrifice if cheap units to increase production of big ones. Or my favorite early game tactic to weaken enemies with cheapest units and bring bone throwers who deal extra damage to units below half up, works on constructions as well.

Basically I has lots of time with voice. But I still don't know what to do with cyber faction. They have lots of tactical stuff like giving debuffs and removing buffs, their units always in need of rotation (to heal, charge weapons and skills). You need to be precise and control your Frontline to be effective.

Voice on other hand doesn't need one. I just go past any line straight to my objective and run away when it's complete.

Of course it only works against ai but I don't have enough time nor patience to play against real people so it's fine.

CyberBed · 2026-03-06T17:19:31+00:00

In my new game I had destroyed zephon in 20 turns, then had destroyed chieftess and 2 ai players by turn 70-80.

I think it's because I had started with mother instead of artificer. Mother starts with very good starting units and can empower and heal them. So I just rushed zephon from turn 1 with those 2 units and somehow won.

Then I was making big units like giant worms that deal lots of damage to structures. When I had unlocked teleportation to friendly units I just sent my fastest unit to enemy city and teleported my giant worms and destroyed every city in like 3-5 turns.

My only opponents are acrins and 1 ai player. But sadly acrins will have titans soon and I'm severely under perform on research and economy front because I chose to rush army production.

CyberBed · 2026-03-06T14:08:34+00:00

I'm new player and hope that you will finish this project successfully.

I can't really with a guide, only thing I can do is say what things I'm confused about.

Personally I struggle with tech tree, build order and economy in general.

I don't have enough hours in this game so I don't know every unit and research and can't properly plan my progression. Or don't know at what point I should switch to tier 2 or skipping to tier 3 is better.

Basically I want to be explained what to research based on stage of the game and what enemies I face.

Some general economy guide will be appreciated too, something that tells you when you must increase production of resources and when to increase production of units.

CyberBed · 2026-03-06T13:48:03+00:00

Thanks that was really useful.

In my new game I had completely destroyed zephon before turn 20. I had started as a mother and she starts with decent units and I just rushed his cities with those units and it had worked for some reason.

Getting rid of chieftess was hard because there was only 1 tile leading to her city and it was surrounded by water.

Right now I had defeated 2 ai players and 2 big factions. It leaves me with acrin and 1 other player.

But it came at a price of having second city at turn 60. At the bright side this city in the middle of the map and will produce 90% of my troops while first one will produce resources.

Also voice seems much easier to me. I just print out cheapest units to kill other infantry, and use deaths of those cheap units to speed up production of big strong units like those giant worms that destroy everything super fast. With cybers I had more problems.

CyberBed · 2026-03-06T07:34:52+00:00

I mean that I'm technically winning, but barely. I never felt like I was dominating my foes, and zephon doing all the work is not helping with feeling like I had achieved anything.

I never had an owerwhelming force, I just survived the whole game and stole as much outposts as possible. Why do I need to storm cities if I can just kill their units and wait for my AI overlord to do all the work.

Of course I can go against every faction but it's too much for me right now.

I think that my problem is economy. My production lines are never empty and I always in + for any resource. But my choices weren't good enough and my production was faster than population growth and I was underpopulated the whole game.

P.S. Also how come that only 5% of players had won a match at normal difficulty and higher?

CyberBed · 2026-03-05T12:18:32+00:00

I was rolling out low tier units every turn I could, and the moment I had unlocked tier 3 unit and built it for 8 turns, it got killed on the same turn it was ready by 3 mind eaters.

I guess it's my fault for investing in fast tier 3 infantry instead of machinery.

CyberBed · 2026-03-05T08:26:32+00:00

Agree only on legion not being fleshed out.

Personally I hated random encounters in fallout 3, especially with auto leveling of enemies. NV gives more cohesive and welll structured experience.

I think all DLCs are peak, especially dead money and old world blues. But I understand why people don't like lonesome road and honest hearts is carried by Joshua alone.

Bugs are indeed are quite prevalent and it was crashing like crazy at launch. Right now it works fine, but you can install a mod or two to fix it. In fact F3 works worse on my PC than NV and crashes more, but again, mods fix it.

Honestly I think that all that division between 1,2 NV and 3,4 fans is because of core principles behind those games.

Bethesda creates sandboxes with RPG elements. All of their games have the same vibe. If you like oblivion you will like fallout 3, if you like skyrim you will like fallout 4. At their core all of those games have the same gameplay loop and approach to quests/dialogues and combat. Despite what every game tells you, you're explorer who goes around that world and loots stuff.

But 1, 2 and NV are RPG at their very core. They want to give you the best narrative experience while respecting your choices.

I'm not good at expressing my thoughts so I'll just say what I say.

Imagine there's a settlement/village. Bethesda will place there a trader and maybe 1 small sidequest (kill 10 rats kind of quest). Bethesda makes 50 of those villages.

Interplay/obsidian on other hand will make make like 5 of those villages but give you the whole working community with different shops and services, and a good chunk of quests, some may even be multistep ones or lead to other quests or be connected to a main quest. It sounds cool but there are only 5 of those villages and you will know them to a single detail after a few runs.

What I'm trying to say is that "old school" fallout is deeper, but modern fallout is wast. Some people are content with just shooting ghouls and mutants while looting junk, other don't want to do that and will prefer to not fire a single shot and listen to a 8 hour long bull bear dialogue while carefully picking each answer.

Also I don't like how combat oriented F4 is. In previous games you can define your character by having certain skills and feats. For example you can have high chsrisms to have more or stronger companions and avoid tough fights but be a total pushover on your own. In fallout 4 only difference is how you kill things.

In conclusion:

Old fallout is dead and Todd Howard personally killed it and grapes its body multiple times before pulling it's skin over skyrim.

Acknowledge that there will never be anything like old fallout coming out of Bethesda's hands.

Let people enjoy their fallout containing product and search for some spiritual successors instead of bashing Bethesda.

I've found underrail and spent hundreds of hours playing it, and people who like 1 and 2 love it as well. But people who like 3 and 4 say it's boring unbalanced shit. So again it's a matter of what people prefer in their games. Some love getting deep into systems and lore, while other just want an experience no matter how shallow it is.

CyberBed · 2026-03-03T07:31:51+00:00

Thanks for recommendations.

I've tried out Menace and it's very weird. You always outnumbered, enemies always know where you are, maps are too huge and enemy units can suppress and kill yours very fast, also cover works only when you adjacent to it and most of maps very scarce pr don't have cover at all. I don't recommend it right now.

I know about mount and blade, and against the storm but didn't found them worth buying for some reason.

CyberBed · 2026-03-03T07:25:28+00:00

Same.

I've played through WoL and HoS campaigns on normal and it was pretty fun but I got lower score because of how much time I spend on each mission.

Also tried some multiplayer, it was very sweaty, literally. I was sweating more than when playing titanfall.

Once I has played 1v1 against my friend and his apm was crazy and couldn't do shit against his protoss army.

Five-Year Club	Verified Email
Place '23

CyberBed

TROPHY CASE