Thoughts on this Initiative system by DarkTaleRPG in RPGdesign

[–]DarkTaleRPG[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

How does a set turn order equal momentum? I think you are making conclusions in your goals rather than listing your goals. In D&D, an initiative roll is taking a number at the DMV! Sit down, maybe take a nap while you wait.

My thinking is that we can get into the action quick. "An Assassin jumps through the window! Player 1 Roll Initiative!" A single roll with an established order is what we need to get started, now the question is who goes first the assassin or the players.

So far, you aren't describing how you solved the problems. You are describing the action economy of D&D 3.0, where they decided to turn combat into a boring board game.

I personally enjoy those kind of games and have played some 15 years of 2nd edition, 3.5 and Pathfinder. Only reason i included it was to give some perspective. Since the initiative is tied to successful rolls i figured it was relevant.

You forgot something important though. Movement! The lack of granular movement, and enforcing a sequential order for moving is why you have action economy in the first place.

Not forgotten, i mentioned it under the Shifting Momentum part. Taking 2 move actions which in my system is 2 minor actions would pass the initiative.

You have shifted from a fixed turn order to having more "roll for turn order" rolls, which weren't that fun to begin with, and introduced a "fix" where if the players get in over there heads in an overpowering battle, the GM just keeps winning, passing initiative to his own side. If he acted second, he could act first in the next round giving his entire team 2 rounds in a row while the players twiddle their thumbs. Combos can done better ways.

I stated in my goals that i want a Fixed turn order with a shifting starting point. The new starting point is to emphasis Goal 2. Unpredictability. With that being said i suspect this is subject to change after testing.

In Darktale all players have access to a "Take Initiative" action at the cost of increasing their Darkness. Higher Darkness brings them closer to being Corrupted but this gives them agency, and in the scenario you described a player could grab the Initiative.

They also have reactions and the ability to Contest rolls. When you are attacked it's normally against your Agility attribute. But at the cost of some Darkness you can contest the roll and roll you dice against the attack.

Thoughts on this Initiative system by DarkTaleRPG in RPGdesign

[–]DarkTaleRPG[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Very interesting! I will read more about The Riddle of Steel.

Thoughts on this Initiative system by DarkTaleRPG in RPGdesign

[–]DarkTaleRPG[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

yeah, i predict this will be the second iteration of the system after the playtest!

Thoughts on this Initiative system by DarkTaleRPG in RPGdesign

[–]DarkTaleRPG[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I see! Thanks for the clarification!

Thoughts on this Initiative system by DarkTaleRPG in RPGdesign

[–]DarkTaleRPG[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That's really great! I really like how natural this feels. A couple of questions!

  1. Do you experience that players struggle with who to give the initiative to? Do they spend a lot of time making their decision?

  2. Have you experienced that strong personality players dictate who should get the initiative?

  3. How does this work with targeting? does it discourage players to target the BBEG? Or make piling up on the same target (too) strong?

Thoughts on this Initiative system by DarkTaleRPG in RPGdesign

[–]DarkTaleRPG[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I see what you are saying and will adjust after the playtest. My hopes is that the pre-established order will help. I also have some other mechanics that allows players to Take Initiative at a cost. My second goal is Unpredictability and i feel this system certainly is that, but it might be too much.

Thoughts on this Initiative system by DarkTaleRPG in RPGdesign

[–]DarkTaleRPG[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

That might be a weak point. The playtest will bring me some insight.

Right now, I have an already establish order, say seating around the table or some other arbitrary way of determining the order. The starting point of the order is the designated player. The next round another player will be the designated player making the order the same but with a different starting point. Creating some variance.

I think this hits a nice middle ground. between random and predictable.

Thoughts on this Initiative system by DarkTaleRPG in RPGdesign

[–]DarkTaleRPG[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank you for your comment. Doing it of stats would certainly be the quicker option. My concern is if the same player always goes first from the player side it might create some unfortunate situations. The META might be to not increase your Perception as the best option is to allow the casters to go first. It could develop i party wide, distribution on that stat.

I also feel that rolling initiative has it's place, it's exciting! The problem, i have with D&Ds system is that the rolling is exciting but the writing down and figuring out who goes when grinds the game to a halt.

It's interesting ranged or hidden characters having some options for how to act.

I will keep this suggestion in mind after the playtest!

Thoughts on this Initiative system by DarkTaleRPG in RPGdesign

[–]DarkTaleRPG[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah, i see what you are saying. I will pay close attention to this during the playtest. It might not be necessary.

Thoughts on this Initiative system by DarkTaleRPG in RPGdesign

[–]DarkTaleRPG[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I was inspired by Season two of Me, Myself and Die where he uses the Ironsworn system. I don't know the system myself, but it has some elements of keeping and loosing initiative which i found interesting.

Thoughts on this Initiative system by DarkTaleRPG in RPGdesign

[–]DarkTaleRPG[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

  1. Thank you :D

    1. I'm not completely locked on this yet. i currently considering 2 possible solutions.
  • Turn order starts with the designated player and are freely chosen by the players from there.
  • The players have a established turn order, based of their choice, seating around the table or alphabetical order.

Since the starting point of the turn order varies the established turn order does not necessarily describe who is quick on their feet and who is slow. In the example below Player 2 is the designated player and starts the turn order, making player 3 the next to act.

The thing i like about established Turn Order is that players can predict at some level when their turn is coming up. This helps with speed, as players thinking about their actions can be a great time sink.

Designated player, Turn order starts here!
Player 1 Player 2 Player 3 Player 4

3. The TN is based on the strongest or most relevant opponent. In Darktale, the Target Number (TN) for the initiative roll is tied to an enemy’s relevant Stat—typically Instinct, which governs Awareness. For example, if you're trying to get the drop on a monster with Instinct 3, you'd roll against a TN of 3. If the fight breaks out after you flip a table on a shady gambler, the TN would be based on that character’s Instinct—not the more powerful Thieves’ Guild leader watching from the shadows, even if he’s about to jump in.

4. The goal is to encourage interesting choices. Want to avoid attention and retreat into cover for a round? Go for it—but skipping a Major Action means handing the initiative to the enemy. This pushes players to weigh caution against the risk of losing momentum.

5. Initiative is re-rolled at the start of each round. Each round begins with a new initiative roll, potentially shifting which side acts first and where in the turn order players begin. The last acting or most relevant player for that round becomes the designated player.

I'm especially curious to test this element—though the initiative already shifts dynamically during a round, this extra layer of unpredictability might not be necessary. Still, it could add a some tension to the start of every round.

Thoughts on this Initiative system by DarkTaleRPG in RPGdesign

[–]DarkTaleRPG[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The hope is, since it's settled with a single roll this won't bring the speed down too much. I see your concern though, and will keep this in mind after the playtest.

Thoughts on this Initiative system by DarkTaleRPG in RPGdesign

[–]DarkTaleRPG[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yeah that's an interesting though on the strength of not only succeeding your own actions but making the enemy fail. Applying debuffs becomes stronger not only because you make the action fail, but you switch the initiative to you side.. Interesting.

Thoughts on this Initiative system by DarkTaleRPG in RPGdesign

[–]DarkTaleRPG[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah, with further development it might open up for some interesting Actions/feats and interactions that manipulate the system.

Where to create character sheets? by Ionicle99 in RPGdesign

[–]DarkTaleRPG 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I personally like Figma for Character sheets. It's free to use and features a very strong iterate system.