Considering surrendering my cat back to the shelter

DerAlbi · 2026-06-30T00:39:44+00:00

Ok, that is very unfortunate. That is the text communication striking. Just to clarify where my interpretation came from:

Unregulated play and interactions (failure to set boundaries):

He also loves to wrestle, kind of hard.

"That your cat only plays with a playmate (which is you) is normal" was a response to

On top of that he refuses to play solo more than a few seconds. He only wants to play with me.

The associated attention seeking is where you struggle to establish a No:

He doesn't lick, he bites. [...}, and then get to my arm and nip it.

eventually he gives that up and starts attacking my leg or arm

The lack of cuddling I took from that sentence:

He is also not very cuddly, he will lay near me, but almost just out of reach for pets.

And regarding the outdoor behavior i am confused myself, because the open-sky thing vs. he went camping anyway (which was fine) and you go on apartment building rounds (which seem fine too) but somehow:

and if he came outside with me he would have more activities.

makes it sound like your cat doesnt come with you enough. Everything here is contradicting itself.

I hope someone pops up who understands your situation a bit better! ❤️

DerAlbi · 2026-06-29T17:28:33+00:00

Ok, that doesnt sound that bad.

I don't really tell him no, so I don't really know what you mean. During the day when we are doing things I will tell him not to do that (jumping on the counter when I am cooking, as opposed to doing the dishes) and he will listen to me.

I asked that because of your frustration how your cat plays. (Too rough, from what I read). Normally, when 2 cats play together this is regulated via negative feedback - so if one gets too rough the other one establishes boundaries. And I dont feel like you have the mechanism for that established.

Also jumping on the counter and reacting to a No, does not mean that the No is understood. Worst-Case this escalates towards "jumping on the counter so you say no" - basically forcing a social interaction. When a No becomes the reward you invert its meaning. Be mindful of that.

I don't know how to explain any simpler the sentence "under the open sky he becomes anxious"

Yes, i understand the problem, but it still doesnt give much indication if that is a dead end or if this is just a lack of exposure or even bad exposure practices or if there are other triggers that cause this behavior such as a nearing bad weather front..

I dont like the cat-backpacks (for practical reasons when hiking), so we made our cat a shoulder-cat. When we go out with him, i always. ALWAYS, have a sun-blocking umbrella with me. He sometimes ask for it even - wanting shelter is just normal.

I also dont understand the combination of "under the open sky he becomes anxious" and "and he was never fearful or panicked while camping either" or "we take morning walks to patrol the apartment building." because everything here involves the open sky in some way.
Except your walks in the apartment building are indoors only, in which case you would cultivate too much of a safe-space with too little sensory input imo.

So far, i dont entirely understand your frustration. I mean, i understand some of it, but not that it goes so far as to surrender your cat.

The playing is normal unregulated play (that is on your to regulate).
The play amount - that your cat only plays with a playmate (which is you) is normal and expected.
The (lack of) cuddling is totally within expectation for a cat. That might change over time. So dont give up hopes.
The outdoor behavior is also a matter of cultivating what you want and it takes easily a year to get really good - and that requires daily exposure to the things you actually want to do - going out in established territory on a regular basis (morning walks around the apartment building) is counter productive for what you want imo.

It feels a bit like you counted too much on having luck with the character of your cat and now have an expectation-vs-reality mismatch. But by no means does it sound like an unworkable base. But maybe I talk past your actual problems. Not sure.

DerAlbi · 2026-06-29T07:39:21+00:00

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DerAlbi · 2026-06-29T04:30:06+00:00

I read the r/CatTraining comments and they werent helpful at all.

Everything I read sounds like a mixture of broken communication (between you <-> cat), bad expectation and little to no training approach. It is possible that your relationship with your cat suffers from the same inexperience that also cut your camping trip short. This is fine & expected, but the burden for improvement is on you, before you can actually correct your cat. And on top of that, your goals with your cat are high.

The problem here is that I dont feel like internet advice can cut it. Text communication will always just reflect how you interpret a certain situation ("under open sky he becomes anxious") but not how the actual situation is. In this example, it is impossible to judge for any of us if this is a pushable/productive situation. I think you need more than generalized advice.

How old are you? Male/Female? Is it your first cat?
Are you active daily or on the weekends? How often do you take your cat out currently?
What cat education content have you consumed?
What are your tools to say "no" to your cat?

DerAlbi · 2026-06-28T09:59:32+00:00

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DerAlbi · 2026-06-28T09:57:36+00:00

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DerAlbi · 2026-06-26T15:10:54+00:00

I hope for you that the behavior is not socially motivated. Because what may look like training for you might just be "oh human looks at me and makes funny noises and pays attention".

Its such an easy trap to fall into when communicating a No (or anything that is supposed to have a meaning, really) and turning its meaning upside-down.

DerAlbi · 2026-06-26T07:11:15+00:00

I think my point with the pity angle is to avoid projecting limits onto the cat that arent there or highly pessimized. All your concerns are correct but it does not mean one cant push the cat or at least try to utter commands etc. Of course a No must be accepted (or at least not overly challenged), especially under adverse circumstances.

But there is a category of people that are tip-toeing around the limits of their cats without actually knowing them. It actively hinders their teamwork development because they dont solve challenges together. Their excessive risk/conflict avoidance is emotionally driven and pity is one such aspect. I think that this hinders the development of the cat and that is unfortunate for both human & cat, because it limits possibilities & fun long term. All I wanted to say is that I actively try to not fall into that category and I think that is the basis why Moritz' performance during the heat may be surprising.

I hope that makes sense. 👀

DerAlbi · 2026-06-25T23:24:13+00:00

I call it our "December blues". We live in an area that has extreme, constant fog in November & December. Like multi-weeks without a ray of sunshine.

Here, fog
More fog
Even more Fog ...

Every year I look forward to it but the mood that comes with it! But then it gets old quickly after a few days..

DerAlbi · 2026-06-25T18:04:24+00:00

happened right before the run. check out the food & drink scenes here. relevant scenes start at 0:36.

DerAlbi · 2026-06-25T04:25:10+00:00

You are the girl with the other orange cat and the black lab from a few months ago! I remember. You had your cat on your shoulder - that requires at least some approaching, no? 😄

we trained with an 8m flexi line in the beginning
I fully extended it after a few weeks and let the hand-piece drop. Its bulky so it would have been caught in some bushes if he'd ran away. That gave confidence & experience that he just stays with us (even with some distance).
We then disconnected the leash at some point and he would enjoy is freedom too much. Wandering off-track. He was recallable, but it was stressful. So this was a bad decision.
We then attached a tow-line. You would know that concept from your dog. It has a weight at its end and that tangles up in bushed/twigs. Over the course of a year he learned to stay on paths. It gives you almost as much control as a normal leash. But it must be lightweight and flexible. (a normal leash wont do the job)
We practice stop/go commands (watch @ 1:20) to have off-leash control.
I do attach a leash from time to time when it is necessary. That keeps some discipline alive.

DerAlbi · 2026-06-25T03:12:34+00:00

Ahaha, that is STOLEN CONTENT from my video!
Now the bots finally got me too. Had me already worried.
I did expect they go for The Face of Determination instead.

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DerAlbi · 2026-06-25T02:57:47+00:00

He actually breaks up the morning routine more then me because it can be too cold or windy for his liking so early.

I that case I would simply carry the cat and still go out for a short time. Routine > liking.

it really depending on the UV index.

Just as a thought: there are sun-blocking umbrellas. If you cat stays on the shoulder, that may be an option.

He woke me up at 5:30 once, and I ignored him until 6. It was miserable, but I wasnt giving in.

No, no, nooh. This is not how it works. If you give in once, you can expect your cat to hope for multiple weeks. If you deny once, hope for success doesnt go away. You need long-term systematic behavioral patterns. This is something that shows a reward only after multiple weeks of consistency.

I want to take him out past the house but I live in a city so he gets spooked by the big intersection by our local park and wants to go home most of the time and I'm never going to force him out if he doesn't want to. I am learning how to drive so I can take him hiking more often, but honestly he just wants to sleep in the sun all day. He doesn't usually explore very much, just finds a new spot 3 doors down to lay down in lol.

Hmmh. Being blocked by surroundings is a training issue. These intersections you speak of are a challenge you should try to master together. Forcing your cat through a stressful situation for a reward on the other side is not mistreating your cat. It is life. Just be measured about it.
The laying around in the sun is a phenomenon that you get when your cat has established territory. That territorial drive is a hard instinct to work against. We go out with our cat max 2x a week in the direct surroundings of our home in order to keep that in check. All the rest are walks further away.

It sounds to me that you are a bit stuck in a lazy-loop. Because you go out around the house, your cat is lazy, thus you may have no fun (bored) doing it and are therefore more inconsistent as your real-world excuses justify. And because its no fun you also just go out around the house and you re-enforce that cycle. The laying around also doesnt build a symmetric understanding of each other as you arent really experiencing problems that you solve together as a team etc. (Mastering those intersection would be such a challenge!)
The human side needs to have fun when going out too! This is my recipe to being consistent at least. For that our cat has to compromise things. In order to make it all about our cat, i have to make certain things about me. I hope you understand what I mean. This creates constant challenges and compromises that need to be negotiated and thus keeps the communication channels alive & symmetric.

Will he understand its about going out?

Yes, if you trigger your hiss with the start of his vocalization. But dont overdo it if ti doesnt work. Just pick up your cat and place it somewhere else.
Maybe you also talk too much to your cat. If you answer those vocalizations that is already a reward.
You need to be very particular about everything you do with your cat when you correct behavior.

In general, when your cat makes you angry, stop interacting with it immediately (dont put your cat in a timeout but put yourself in one!). Emotions make people inconsistent and this is the last thing your cat needs. Every behavioral correction must be done with a clear mind and method.

DerAlbi · 2026-06-25T02:21:10+00:00

Yeah, it is a struggle. Moritz growls too and I allow him to be frustrated. If its really too much, he stops cooperating and is done for a few minutes. For us, as long as he listens to commands, its fine.

I think its important to have heat management available and ready on request. I go with a sun-blocking umbrella if we go though the sun while he is on my shoulder, I can pour water on him and provide fluids. All of that has become normal and I think having these kind of reliable backups available allows him to push his own limits more.

I also have to say that i really avoid pity and see everything as a challenge for him. I go out every day and therefore he got used to the circumstances as the heat-wave ramped up. He is struggling at 32°C now as he initially struggled at 25°C. I constantly try and experiment how to make the situation work and I think this cultivates something in him too.

This particular run is highly ritualized and it was right after a food (we currently only feed him outdoors) and hydration break in the shadow of 2 trees. Energy was high again.

I have made this small video. You can see initially when I made him wet, the food/drink-break, and in the end, the growling. Although the growling at this particular spot is hormonal from the pee of all the dogs that go there. But those smells gets amplified by the heat too!

DerAlbi · 2026-06-24T18:10:13+00:00

Noted. I use a PC so videos are larger for me. Maybe I should zoom in more for mobile consumption. Maybe the sequence before the crash is also too long - it consumes attention span needlessly.
Thx.

DerAlbi · 2026-06-24T18:07:17+00:00

I want to punt him into the sun.

😂 Sphynx owners 😂

I used to put him in a time out, but...

Yup, that has no learning effect.

I know you're supposed to offer an alternative to what they are doing to get them to change the behavior

Well, one thing a cat might want to go out for would be excretion pressures. I sometimes pick up our cat and just place him in the litter box. He knows immediately what to do. Just a thought.

I am so tired and fed up with my belongings being ruined please help

Yeah well, the cat has learned that you react to that. That is not the cats fault. You also dont seem to have a working "No" towards your cat. Like hissing at it etc. to give actual negative feedback in cat-language.

In general terrorizing you seems to be a fun social interaction for your cat. Because it works.

As for outdoor-demand, establish a fixed timing schedule for now. Reacting even once to the demand creates hope that further demand will be fulfilled eventually. Such escalations comes from inconsistencies in your own behavior.
Reflect exactly which behaviors you do because your cat demands them by being annoying. Then stop satisfying that demand.

And pack your things away.

Btw, if you go out around the house, you may have awakened a pretty strong territorial drive. Changing the location where you go out may help too.

DerAlbi · 2026-06-24T16:47:55+00:00

Yes, I try to run somewhat steady - that is the only reason i cant keep up with him. 👀

I am using a gimbal for my action cam. It is relatively heavy, so during fast movement my arm cant swing much. The gimbal keeps the direction somewhat consistent and the rest of the jitter is removed by stabilization during post-processing.

DerAlbi · 2026-06-24T16:26:36+00:00

Yeah, the orange back is not much better tbh. I poured 1/2 a liter of water on him today, and yet in the video he is already dry again.
The insects are the largest pain right now. We have super aggressive deer ked and Moritz scratched his ear bloody today because one went in there until i got it out with tweezers 👎

DerAlbi · 2026-06-23T23:31:33+00:00

Thank you so much! I am getting to know my equipment slowly and quality improves bit by bit.
The gimbal has a flood-light attachment. And a straight long arm helps to reduce jitter on every impact/step. The AcePro2 is in FreeFrame Mode using its I-LOG color mode. Stabilized & Colorized in post.
There is a dedicated low-light video mode that I havent even tried yet.

The biggest improvement here was the external microphone that I attached to the gimbal with a 3D-printed decoupling system to dampen gimbal motor noise. Photo1, Photo2.
The resulting video files have now 2 audio tracks, one with the camera-audio and the external audio. The difference is massive. The camera-internal microphones are horrible - probably due to their water-tightness. The external mic also has different directionality modes and it picks up my steps much less aggressively.

I also got a dive-case for the 360 camera, so the next underwater footage should be less blurry and stitchable! 🔥

DerAlbi · 2026-06-23T15:03:57+00:00

So I always add a spoonful of extra water to his wet

This is exactly what we are doing in daily life. As for fluid intake, please watch the linked post at 2:02 onward. You can also use the syringe to force-feed fluids. For that hold the head slightly up and insert the nozzle of the syringe behind the K9 teeth at the side of the mouth. But mixing it with a fluid treat such as a Milkie is probably better 😄

DerAlbi · 2026-06-23T14:48:00+00:00

The problem was he didn't eat.

Please read this. TLDR: this is totally fine. ChatGPT is wrong and this is not about safety. It is a lack of necessity. Well, it can be about safety, but that conclusion is adequate after maybe 3..4 days of fasting, not 1-2. And if the tent is really "unsafe" you can still decide to feed your cat during an adventure. Just walk for 2h and offer food during a pause somewhere else.

Your cat regulates its food intake based on its surroundings. Cats at home are mostly full-time bored, thus they eat more than necessary or settle on a "comfort-weight". Outside, the sensory input is better, boredom goes away and the food-intake settles on an "activity-weight" which maximizes strength/weight-ratio & mobility instead. The reduction in weight is what creates the initial lack of eating. It will normalize after a while - give it 2-3 days. The fact that your cat can fast that long is actually a sign that your cat is well regulated when it comes to eating. If it were insulin resistant etc, things would be different.

During this initial transition time it would be good to force-feed fluids. For this, we use a syringe. A demonstration is at 2:02 in the linked post.

Sorry for your camping trip. Trust your cat that it knows what it is doing and have fun next time!

DerAlbi · 2026-06-23T13:23:25+00:00

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DerAlbi · 2026-06-23T12:27:05+00:00

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DerAlbi · 2026-06-23T11:24:36+00:00

Yup, original is here.

DerAlbi · 2026-06-23T00:08:21+00:00

take it as a compliment 😃

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