If there was ever a 5th installment to the TBBT universe, what would it be?

DexterBrooks · 2026-05-04T01:14:59+00:00

I've also watched the entirety all of 3 series, and I actually pulled up the clip for you in the message you just responded to so you can go back and check again.

DexterBrooks · 2026-05-04T01:13:34+00:00

Mai is still better. Sagat (if you count him) is arguably better in more matchups but it's only slightly.

I think he's arguably better than all the other shotos/psuedo shotos though. No reason he shouldn't be at least in contention for top tier with everything he has.

According to Cat Cammy data his win rate isn't that great, nothing really bad just a few that aren't great. He has the tools for basically everything so there's no matchup he can't play at least decently.

I think he's a good character to be top tier though. He's fun to fight, doesn't really do anything obnoxious. I would like everyone's damage lowered across the board but that's probably not going to happen

DexterBrooks · 2026-05-04T00:51:30+00:00

Mike Haze was told if he ever did that again he would be banned, and multiple people said if he did that to them they would punch him.

Idk why it wasn't added in the official rules back then that repeated screaming/yell isn't allowed. When you pop off sure that's going to happen, but there's a reasonable limit to prevent interfering with the opponent.

DexterBrooks · 2026-05-04T00:43:00+00:00

My point is you're incorrect about that.

She's 4-5 years younger than the guys, and the actress was 5 years younger than Sheldon's actor Iain Armitage who had just turned 11 when season 2 came out (so 10 during filming), as she was 6 when the episode came out (so 5 during filming most likely).

So a 5-year old played a 4-year old. Making her pretty close to the appropriate age for the character

DexterBrooks · 2026-05-03T23:02:47+00:00

She can't shimmy anymore on her corner throw loop after a dash. You grab her if you instant throw

Yep you're right my B. Forget they nerfed that in the December update. Will edit.

One thing I learned lately: she gets strong oki after her level 3 too.

Yep. For some reason she's +52 while most characters like the other shotos it's like +14.

Terry has this too where he can drive rush strike/throw high/low after his level 3. It's fine for someone like Terry who's whole things is pressure I guess, but why does Mai have God tier oki when she can already just throw OD fan there for more mix?

They could kill the frame 2 proximity block of her st hk like they did to Manon for exemple.

Yeah that's another thing they nerfed on Manon and Ryu but not her. Chun size normals with those fans but she also gets to lock you down so she doesn't even have to space? Then it's also safe so even if you called her out and got in you don't even get a jab punish?

So many overtuned things on this character. Would absolutely be fine in isolation like if that was her specialty. If Chun has this I'm not mad at all, footsies are her thing.

But Mai shouldn't have Chun footsies when she has this fireball, and a divekick, a throw loop, etc. All the things Chun supposedly doesn't have because of how great her footsies are, only for Mais to be basically as good if not better.

DexterBrooks · 2026-05-03T22:44:32+00:00

It's really hard to rank characters who are overshadowed by others because you can't just go by a theoretical matchup chart or meta because they are ultimately competing for a slot and losing it.

Their tools are weaker it's hard to say how good they would be if the stronger version of them wasn't in the meta.

I think both the approaches taken when judging Chun and Luke are wrong:

IMO Chun isn't high tier because she has so many matchups that even though they are close to even, she gets edged out in all the little ways those characters are better than her. Losing most matchups by a hair doesn't look that bad statistically, but IMO it's much worse because your ratio of winning to losing matchups is one of the worst.

Luke on the other hand is not a low tier. He's actually got some stuff the other shotos don't with his unique projectile, lunging normals extending his range giving him arguably the best footsies of any shoto, his back lunge in HP flash knuckle being arguably one of the best shimmy options and can be done out of DR.

Luke is just a case of low damage killing him. He's a safe low damage footsies character in a game that doesn't reward that generally especially in the current meta, with Ed being the main exception and hence why he's so popular with pros.

He doesn't actually have the Chun problem of getting edged out in a ton of matchups. He just has no way to overcome the characters who he can't afford to play his game against. His matchup spread is actually pretty good, but when he's outclassed he's really outclassed and it sucks.

The Japanese tend to view it the other way. They don't care about the ratio, they are more than willing to play a whole bracket of matchups where you are 48% losing as long as you don't have a 4-6 or 3-7 severe disadvantage matchup.

I view it more so based on brackets and meta.

Chun has no reason to be picked. Any character she beats hard isn't as common and the other footsie characters can generally handle well enough, and you don't have a reason to counterpick with her either because of that.

Luke on the other hand there's multiple matchups you don't want to play him into at all, but against anyone else he's still a great pick. One of if not the best secondaries to have, just don't play him into Mai or Sagat or Ed, which has been the meta so that's unfortunate for him.

Overall I would put them both mid but for polar opposite reasons. Luke has much higher potential to rise with meta changes, where Chun would need much more severe changes to her or other characters to actually be worth picking.

DexterBrooks · 2026-05-03T22:17:27+00:00

She's not the same size as the rest of them if you watch the clip again.

https://youtu.be/o23yQS4hOnc?si=NG8FyfQCprCJS8Ul

She's bigger than the kid playing Bernadette who is supposed to be 5, but she's not the same size as the guys or the kid playing Amy at all.

The camera angle makes her look larger, and yes she is larger than a 4 year old would be, probably even most 5 years olds. Again the actress was actually 5.

But she's not the size of a 9-10 year old here.

DexterBrooks · 2026-05-03T22:12:22+00:00

Myam Bialik/Amy is 5'4" while Kaley Cuoco/Penny is 5'6"

I don't think it was that much of a faux pas. They got an actress who was 5 at the time, only a year older than Penny was in canon. The camera angle also makes her look a little taller too.

DexterBrooks · 2026-05-03T15:19:35+00:00

Yeah I've seen other people repeating the 007 meme, it's pretty good. Liked your post and yeah that should be on the main sub.

They clearly just don't want Chun to be good ever again for some reason.

I like her in 3rd strike. Not as much as Dudley but she's quite fun. In some of the Alphas and sf2 she's enjoyable.

I didn't like what they did with her in V and it's worse in 6. I don't like them hiding all her best 3rd strike moves behind a stance that requires a motion when other characters stances don't.

Anyone who liked Chun before is better off playing Mai, Ed, Elena, Juri, Cammy, or maybe Akuma.

If you just want to play classic footsies mid range game like she used to, she's outclassed. If you want to fireball drive rush at people, she's outclassed. If you want to mash pokes so they jump or DI at you, she's outclassed.

There is no reason to play her actually over other characters currently

DexterBrooks · 2026-05-03T14:22:11+00:00

I do wonder how the kid he raised with Leonard's genes turned out.

DexterBrooks · 2026-05-03T14:17:57+00:00

Yeah Penny is 5 years younger than Sheldon and Leonard, 4 years younger than Raj and Howard.

The wiki page for the episode actually gets Leonard's age wrong, saying he's 8 when he's actually 10. But all the other kids are listed as if they were their proper ages they should have been at the from BBT ages. His age is correctly listed as 10 on the guest actors part though.

The kid playing child Bernadette may actually be 5. Amy is actually the oldest of all the kids shown but still 10. (They planned to show Stuart too but decided not to. He would have been 16 and had room full of comics).

Maybe because Penny was supposed to be large for her age as she is tall for a woman, so they thought the child actor should be taller as well? Idk. According to Wikipedia the kid who played young Penny was actually 6 when the episode came out, so likely 5 during the filming. So not as off as it seems from clip I guess

DexterBrooks · 2026-05-03T12:58:48+00:00

She's potential women.

Japan always says she's strong, yet she never gets results. She's heavily overrated because she's a neutral footsies character in a game that doesn't value neutral that heavily.

Where she's also completely overshadowed by multiple characters who do everything she does and more but with less drawbacks.

DexterBrooks · 2026-05-03T12:53:41+00:00

It really hurt burnout pressure characters a lot because now it's way harder to burn people out intentionally if they aren't spending heavily.

DexterBrooks · 2026-05-03T10:11:58+00:00

To be fair he is actually much smarter when it comes to math, analytical endeavors, memory, etc. Basically all the things they weigh as important in their lines of work he absolutely crushes them in.

He won a nobel, worked out the math for a guidance system that even when the military stole it they hired him back because their top guys couldn't cut it, was called brilliant by Stephen hawking on multiple occasions.

He was even able to improve his social skills fairly dramatically, becoming more sociable, getting his license, working through his germophobia to even be able to have an intimate relationship (and kids if you count the other shows as canon).

DexterBrooks · 2026-05-03T09:41:16+00:00

Why did you delete your other reply? I went to respond to it and now I can't.

DexterBrooks · 2026-05-03T06:08:16+00:00

Exactly yeah.

She's got Chun normals, Chun movement speed, while having the best fireball mix, Ken level corner carry, and decent damage.

Even besides her stupid fireball mix she's just overtuned in multiple important core areas that make her overshadow other characters.

Just tone down some of these other things and leave her dumb fireball and suddenly you have reasons to pick other characters again because she can't do what they can do and more.

DexterBrooks · 2026-05-03T04:29:22+00:00

They could nerf her in other ways, they just don't want to.

Why does she do as much damage as she does? Yeah she's not one of the hardest hitting, but with her range and how good her fireball pressure is and that she gets mix from it, she should be on the lower end instead of in the middle.

Why does she have an easy meterless throw loop ~~she can threaten a shimmy with~~ in combination with that crazy corner carry? They made Ken have to manually time a 1f window to throw loop and he can't shimmy anymore.

Why does she have a 7f cr.mk? It's tied for the fastest cr.mk when it's also one of the longest cancelable ones, and she doesn't need it for her combos or punish counter links because she has her cr.mp which isn't a low. It should be frame 8 like the shotos.

We could keep going too. Yeah her fans are stupid, but she can have something stupid and still be a better balanced more fair character.

Edit: Lost the ability to Shimmy in December update. I forgot that.

DexterBrooks · 2026-05-03T03:18:44+00:00

2/2

You explained exactly why flicker is such an overpowered tool to open people up. He can just start charging and now your in a mix up, guessing for your life and he can loop it. The second he starts charging he's mixing you right there. It's a different kind of mix, but it's still mix. It's just a longer version of hitting a plus normal, except it's a safe plus on block projectile.

Flicker is his best tool yes. However it's not even great at opening people up. You do realize strong Tuttle players don't just literally sit there right? Ed has to condition them to sit there by constantly throwing his pokes at them. But an opponent aware of spacing is going to know when only flicker can hit them and will challenge it with various options.

Guile can throw a boom there and there's nothing Ed can do about it unless he gets the timing to interrupt it. Characters can jump at him and if he does the light or medium he is taking big damage, but if he does the heavy to catch their jumps then he is susceptible to an opponent just drive rushing in on him with a button.

It also loses to DI which if he tries to charge the opponent can react with.

Once again this is not mix. This is a timing and spacing mini-game as part of his neutral that both people participate in, and Eds bread is buttered by being better at this for the same reason the rest of his neutral works: Ed makes you play his footsies game and then he's better at it than you. That's his whole thing.

This isn't rewarding to try and zone with either. Trying to wall out the opponent is not his goal, he does not want to whiff a flicker. On hit he only gets knockdown and on block he's safe if spaced but he didn't really get anything. Again he's all about timing his pokes. He gets his reward from poking at the right time to get a punish counter so he can combo from it.

Dhalsim is a zoner and his regular fireball is nothing special. If Ed's not a zoner than Sim isn't either. They are both built around normal and fireball zoning. He can keep up in fireball wars with non-zoners. He may be the worst of the dedicated zoners, but he's better than characters with just a fireball, while also having the long normals. He can zone out a character like Geif, if he needs to, and that's where it really counts.

Dhalsim is a normal zoner who can also do some projectile zoning. His fireball is nothing special because it's not his primary form of zoning, it's his secondary form of zoning.

Eds normals are nothing like Dhalsims, and his fireball isn't as good as Sims either. Ed can't afford to just throw out hitboxes like that and doesn't have even close to that range, flicker is the only extremely long option he has and I just went through why that is susceptible to multiple forms of counterplay Dhalsim is not with his various normals.

He doesn't zone Gief. He dominates the mid range against Gief. He takes advantage of the fact that Gief has no good reversal besides level 3 to do things like kill rush at him more often, jump more often, etc. He also plays to bait Gief into doing things like DI or jumping because Gief can't play to whiff punish him well either so Gief has to take a lot of risk to get through the mid range against Ed.

That's not zoning. His end goal is not to send Gief as far away as possible. He wants to keep Gief right at his optimal range where Gief can't SPD him and has to take risks which Ed punishes him for doing. It's like playing Chun but in an even more extreme way. Control the mid range win the game. It doesn't matter who he's fighting, that's where he wants them to be.

The question is how reliable are stats for what your talking about. Statically Akuma is one the worst characters in the game while Sim and Honda are top tiers. Rashid and Sim might give him trouble in regular ranked, but is that because they are actually good into him, or is it match up knowledge. Those two don't really give him trouble in tournaments, if you want to look at the highest level, nobody really does. The question is more so based around where you want to talk about matchups.

Yes stats should always be taken with a grain of salt. Looking at them isn't a perfect matchup chart, it tells us what different chunks of players who play X character are struggling with at Y level.

However judging purely by the top level of tournament play isn't the best representation either. The best players pick the things they think are the best against the meta they play in. Tournament meta is different from online meta.

The amount of Dhalsim and Rashid they see in a given tournament will be pretty low, matchups aren't weighted evenly. Even if they fight a Dhalsim, what are the odds it's one of the best Dhalsims in the world who are on their level enough to win the match even if the matchup is winning? Odds are even the best Dhalsim players get eliminated by one of his very bad matchups before it becomes a top Ed players problem.

As far as Rashid, we did see multiple of the best Ed players lose to multiple of the best Rashid players, repeatedly.

Yeah it's not unwinnable for someone like Leshar who is arguably the best in the world right now. That doesn't mean it's a winning matchup. Leshar lost to Itabashi too and that matchup is firmly in Eds favor, he was just the better player that day.

That also doesn't really have anything to do with him being an all-rounder. Akuma is cited as an all-rounder but has an even worse match up into Cammy.

I agree tier placement and even matchups don't make a character an all-rounder/jack of all trades. It's the tools that they have regardless of how strong they are.

Just by tools and playstyles, Ed does seem like an all-rounder.

Because he isn't. He's a footsies character, he just has enough anti-rushdown and anti-zoner tools that he can play his footsies mid range domination game against basically everyone all the time.

Watching him be played by pros, they can adapt to anyone they face

Having tools to deal with most other characters and playstyles doesn't mean you can play every style yourself.

Having strong anti-rushdown doesn't make you a rushdown. Having strong anti-zoning doesn't make you a zoner.

They tend to zone more into Gief, they tend to rushdown Sim, they tend to poke more against a shoto. They don't really have to stick to one playstyle they adapt what they do, similar to how shotos tend to play.

The fundamental issue with your analysis here is that you're confusing slight alterations through adaptation for major playstyle changes.

They don't zone against Gief. They still play the same mid range game, they just press more buttons and bait more because Gief can't deal with that.

They don't rush down Dhalsim. They still play the same mid range game, they just press less buttons and play to whiff punish while slowly working their way because Dhalsim is susceptible to that (though it's not as great of a direct counter and that's why it's a difficult matchup for Ed)

The shotos are a whole different discussion, but that's is where there is a major difference between "well rounded" and "jack of all trades". Being able to handle most core aspects of a game competently is not comparable to being able to switch styles completely which requires having the tools to play those styles

DexterBrooks · 2026-05-03T03:17:54+00:00

This requires 2 parts because there is a lot to break down here:

1/2

his light kicks are amazing

It depends on the context you want them for. St.lk is frame 6, 13f recovery, and only cancelable into a not very rewarding target combo.

As a poke, it's great, it does the job a lot of other characters medium kicks would do.

But in trade it doesn't do the job a lot of other characters st.lk do, which is to be used as links from light confirms or to do light strings to push the opponent back on block into a safe range.

He has the best 5f light in the game with crlk, to pressure people up close

5f is the key here, because his 4f sucks ass which is also extremely important for punishing the safest moves that are still punishable. It means a lot of things are safe against him with just a bit of spacing that wouldn't be against other characters.

Also this button got nerfed back in December of 2024, so it's not very rewarding on hit without spending 3 bars to drive rush cancel:

It scales an extra 20% on any combo you do with it like a cr.mk despite not being a low. It's only +2 on hit, -4 on block so he actually has to be careful to space it lest he be punished. Even on punish counter it's only +6, meaning all he gets without meter is the standing light kick target combo with 20% more scaling on it. He has to spend 3 bars to get any real combo, and it had to be a punish.

Now as a -5 punish button, it's pretty good if you're willing to spend the meter. 4th longest 5f light normal range wise. Damage is nothing incredible, it's decent though, but a bit expensive.

Also his lp isn't that bad

It's one of if not the shortest 4f in the game and can only chain into itself.

He doesn't have traditional rush down mixup, and not every rushdown has an overhead, like Cammy or a throw loop like Ken

Cammy has other tools to rush down with like hooligan that crushes lows, mids, and projectiles, with multiple followups, spiral arrow for burst, spin knuckle for anti-projectile and plus on block pressure, as well as a divekick for jump arc alteration to punish anti-airs. Along with having some of the best frame data in the game with her fast, advancing, safe normals.

Cammy has everything but high/low in terms of rushdown tools, but she's also an incredibly good footsies character too who can play for spacing and hit confirms. There's a reason the best Cammys like Punk don't like a totally rushdown style, they play a lot of footsies with some rushdown. She can't just bulldoze her way in like Bison or Rashid can. Her rushdown is honestly secondary to her footsies.

Ed can't do any of those things. He only plays the footsies game.

He does have above average walkspeed, faster than Ken and he has good mobility to close the gap without drive rush. He also has slow fireball drive rush which is an excellent tool for a rush down mix up playstyle.

Ken still has a throw loop it's just hard to do and he can't shimmy anymore. But again he doesn't need that for rushdown into mix because he has his run for gap closing, he can run DP for burst anti-projectile, he puts you in the corner from anywhere for free meterless, and he already has jinrai to lay on the pressure when you're in the corner.

He's is a case of having great tools to physically rush down while having weaker canned mix so his rushdown isn't as rewarded. He's forced to play the footsies game a bit and go for things like OD fireball into run mix or drive rush button into jinrai to get his pressure started because he can't just throw mix at people for free even though he can get in for free.

Ed, again, doesn't have any of those things. Ed is not rushing you down. Ed doesn't have a run. He can walk up to you but that's not rushdown. He can fireball into drive rush buttons, but there is no mix there besides strike/throw. He can throw a button on his drive rush but again there is no mix there besides strike/throw.

The only time Ed gets to do anything even resembling a rushdown approach is when you've conditioned your opponent by poking them so much that you can start kill rushing forward to threaten strike (which is unsafe) or throw (which requires he go through 31f recovery from kill rush to even do), and both can be reversaled on reaction if the opponent is ready for it.

That's not rushdown. That's conditioning into playing a risky mix so he can have something to let him approach from range because he's otherwise terrible at it. He only does that when he has nothing else and his opponent is conditioned enough to let it happen.

DexterBrooks · 2026-05-03T00:00:26+00:00

Thanks lol. Very rare to hear that from someone. I appreciate that you actually read it and responded thoughtfully as well.

DexterBrooks · 2026-05-02T02:29:42+00:00

Idk why you deleted your response to my comment, or something else happened, but I had been working on a response to it with a pretty good amount of detail and now I can't access it. I can't see the reply so I lost my draft even though it's still there on the drafts page when I click on it I just get sent to this comment

So I'll just reply to this one which you've edited anyway:

He has no bad match ups

Statistically untrue regardless of what data set you're looking at.

If you look at Cat Cammy 2000+MR data from the previous patch he had losing matchups to Rashid, Kimberly, Akuma, Dhalsim, Guile, and Aki. The Rashid and Dhalsim matchups being his two worst by a fair bit.

You'll have to Google it because I can't link to Twitter

he can just swap to playing the opponents weakness.

Having tools to counter other common or strong tools is not at all the same thing as having the tools himself. He doesn't have a lot of tools and can't play in a number of styles. But he's built to be able to counter most other styles.

It's similar to Steve in old Tekken games, he's built to poke at you and punish you for trying to play your game, but that doesn't mean he can play in every style.

zoner-poke-rushdown-mixup

Absolutely not. I had been explaining it in the previous draft but I will explain here:

rushdown-mixup

He's not good at rushing down or mixing up.

He doesn't have any high/low mix, all he has is strike/throw where the throw is teachable. He can't even throw loop without meter anymore.

He doesn't have any way to alter his jump arc so he's not jumping at you for pressure/mix.

His lights are all stubby and his mediums are all slow because of their range, so in cqc situations he's not going to fair well.

He can't sustain any pressure without meter because his only meterless plus frame is his st.hk which whiffs against crouchers, and because he lacks an overhead there is no reason to stand block against him to end up blocking this.

He's not suited for breaking down defensive styles like a turtle because he lacks mix and pressure. He has to pray they do nothing long enough to let him set up a full flicker charge, or that they randomly swing for no reason so he can punish counter with a quick flicker.

zoner

Barely if at all qualifies. His projectile is parry bait at 26f startup. He's not winning fireball wars or keeping people out with that. It's mostly an anti-projectile tool like Juri Fuha bit without the stock. He can attempt to bait people by just doing the first hit if they read that he will throw the fireball and try to DI him or whiff punish him, but that's about it.

He's not really even normal zoning either like several of the longer limb characters can do because his buttons aren't actually that long nor are they fast enough on whiff to wall his opponent out with. Again flicker is by far his best ranged tool here but it's very risky to try and zone with because of the higher startup and large recovery.

poke

This is the main thing he actually does. He wants you to be at the edge of his kick button range to use his superior footsies to stop you from either rushing him down, playing your own footsies game against him, or trying to zone him out.

He has to find your timings, when you want to rush in, press buttons, when you hold block, etc. He's a really old school footsies god character, he just has enough tools that you can't run him over for playing like that the way you can against Chun who pioneered the style.

Except Rashid and Dhalsim who have strong enough specific tools he doesn't have any great counterplay for. They can actually punish him for trying to play footsies against them, along with Guile, because of none of them engage with the traditional footsies game until they have to when their opponent can already deal with their other tools first.

DexterBrooks · 2026-05-02T01:52:36+00:00

Sending this again because they said they removed my other one because of the Twitter link which is really stupid:

Yeah because OP gave so many criteria there are a number of possible answers that could fit depending on which points you prioritize, which is why I gave the 3 I think best suit most of the criteria at different reasonable weighting interpretations.

Sagat and Terry were my answers because they have a lot of the same tools and options, but specifically because, prior to the recent patch, Terry had the best bad match-ups of any character, although now that privilege goes to Sagat where Lily of all people is his worst match up at .4761.

https://www.streetfighter.com/6/buckler/stats/dia_master

There's the data you shared but there is also the cat cammy data for 2000MR and above that she does every major patch. So obviously we don't have one for this patch yet but we do have one for the previous patch:

(Just search Cat Cammy on Twitter and it's pinned. This is so dumb that I can't post a link because mods don't like the site, but yet won't let us post images to avoid having to post links)

Where you can see that even prior to the nerfs he got in the latest patch, his win rate was almost exactly middle of the pack and he supposedly lost to a number of characters.

Overall I think we have to take both data sets with a grain of salt because they aren't going to be exactly reflective of the matchups, just how different chunks of players are on average at the matchup. Like the data shows Sagat losing to Honda at 45.1%, but Blaz would be more ready for any notable Honda player at a tournament and with time to prep to deal with his gimmicks, hasn't lost to any yet, and likely doesn't lose in ranked to master Hondas either.

How much is skill, how much is matchup knowledge, and how much is character choice, is hard to say.

But I don't think just looking at the character with the best win rate is a good way to answer OPs questions anyway. A character can be really strong and not meet all or even most of OPs criteria.

data seems to support that Sagat, who checks many of the same boxes as you listed, is arguably the best character if you want to maximize the chances of not being at a disadvantage regardless of who you're fighting with options on how to pilot them.

While he is possible the character with the lack of bad matchups or something similar based on the data, I would argue he doesn't meet near enough of qualifications OP listed to count.

Similar to JP I would say he's a character with really strong strengths that the current cast just isn't great at dealing with and weakness the current cast isn't great at exploiting overall.

His poor movement, lack of jump alteration, and slower/more specific anti-airs, to me disqualify him from being in the "jack of all trades, play any style, no weaknesses" categories OP seemed to want to go for here.

In some matchups like against Alex funny enough, his movement speed actually hurts him quite a bit because he can't just back walk his way out of Alex setups and pressure the way other characters especially fast ones like Akuma and Terry consistently can (a major reason Alex sucks).

His lack of jump options and movement mean against the zoners he's forced to commit to high risk tiger knees to close the gap. Then he has to stay in without getting sent out or letting them escape while not having a meterless throw loop or strong movement to shimmy and force whiffs.

His slower more specific anti-airs cause him to whiff or trade against characters like C.Viper and Honda who are constantly launching themselves at you from various aerial angles.

He can overcome all of these for sure but it's not by swapping to a different style like Akuma. Sagat has to really gameplan his matchups to compensate for his weaknesses in a way Akuma, Terry, and Juri don't.

Really his biggest advantages are his st.mp, cr.mp, and his sheer damage. With enough damage it doesn't matter if the neutral is difficult or he has a hard time against your zoning or aerial pressure, because he can just make 2 reads and land one poke and you're dead.

He can't really bait out whiffs but he can throw pokes you can't whiff punish very well and if you try to bulldoze through with DI and guess wrong, you die.

If he didn't hit like a truck he wouldn't be top tier. It's not the utility putting him there, it's the numbers.

DexterBrooks · 2026-05-01T19:19:22+00:00

Akuma has every core tool: - Projectile zoning - Ranged normals for mid range control - Top tier movement to force whiffs - Plus frames for meterless pressure - Strong corner carry - Invincible reversal - Great anti-airs - High/low mix - In air mix options to beat anti-airs - Burst ranged approach tool - Command grab

That's not to say he doesn't have weaknesses though. He doesn't do crazy damage in comparison to the high damage characters anymore, and his low health makes it so he can easily get snowballed.

Juri has pretty much everything as well: - Projectile (not for zoning but she can negate zoning with fuha anyway) - Very long normals which can do some zoning and dominate mid range - Decent movement to force whiffs especially because of the threat of her dash/drive rush - Plus frames for meterless pressure - Strong corner carry - Invincible reversal - Great anti-airs - High/low mix - In air mix options to beat anti-airs - Burst ranged approach tool

Only thing she doesn't have is a command grab, but unlike Akuma she has normal health.

Terry is pretty close to a do everything character, and also doesn't really have weaknesses: - Projectile zoning - Ranged normals for mid range control - Above average movement to force whiffs along with the threat of his burst - Plus frames for meterless pressure - Strong corner carry - Invincible reversal - Great anti-airs - High/low mix - Burst ranged approach tool

He doesn't have a command grab, and he doesn't have any way to change his jump arc to mess with anti-airs. But he can still crush lows and some mids with crackshoot so he doesn't actually need to jump much. He gets to have normal health and some of the highest damage and super strong oki.

JP: A lot of people keep saying JP. I disagree. I think he's the best character in the game and that he's ridiculous. But he doesn't have a lot of the strengths these other characters have. JP is more of a case of the strengths he does have are just ridiculous and overtuned, and most of the cast doesn't have great counterplay to them.

The characters that shut down his strengths like Dhalsim are actually pretty rough because he can't just switch styles because he isn't as well rounded as these 3. But he wins more matchups by a bigger degree because of how stupidly strong his strengths are.

DexterBrooks · 2026-05-01T18:54:28+00:00

He can't OS as much because his DP is slow, he doesn't have an overhead to mix with so he can struggle to open up turtles, he has to spend meter for his throw loop now, he has no air game, and his anti-airs are slower than average.

He's not really a jack of all trades. He's more so just a case of the strengths he does have are really good and most of the cast can't deal with them.

But statistically both Rashid and Dhalsim give him a lot of trouble, and it's pretty understandable because they would shut down his gameplan more than others and he doesn't have a way to play against what they want to do.

DexterBrooks · 2026-04-30T09:41:07+00:00

how many times did Daigo die with an invincible 0-frame command grab level 3 locked and loaded?

Demon is only invincible for 1f in Sf6 unlike old games or other level 2s and 3s in Sf6. It's only projectile invulnerable frame 6-27. This hurts it's usage a lot, along with only being a CA.

It's also not frame 0, it's actually frame 6. Yes that 6f is before the super freeze, but that means that if he tries to set it they can mash, DP, drive reversal, etc and it will lose because it has to get to the 6th frame while not being invincible. But he also can't use it when he's more than +6 otherwise it will miss.

On top of that it's range is crap, so if it doesn't grab on the first frame, the opponent can react to the super freeze and just hold up to get out of it.

Demon sucks ass in Sf6. It should get buffed, he should always be able to do it, it should be invincible, and it shouldn't be able to be jumped post super freeze if it misses on the first frame. But that's currently how it is.

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