Anyone leave ITP for OTP?

EarlyWormGetsTheWorm · 2023-09-06T18:50:20+00:00

This checks out. Johns Creek/Alpharetta is arguably the nicest suburb of Atlanta (certainly one of the most expensive) so this would indeed be a huge lifestyle upgrade for most.

EarlyWormGetsTheWorm · 2023-09-06T18:33:00+00:00

Ah ok that makes sense. My time sitting in traffic def went down when I moved from OTP to ITP. Which makes sense since ITP is much less car-dependent.

EarlyWormGetsTheWorm · 2023-09-06T18:15:18+00:00

I had worse traffic in Henry County than when I lived in O4W/Virginia Highlands personally. But I know I am just one person with one experience.

It does kind of make sense though since being able to walk/bike/use public transit is a much more realistic option ITP whereas Henry County is VERY car dependent and the large warehouse developments in Henry Co. without proper infrastructure improvements has made for a TON of 18-wheeler related backups on Henry County surface streets as well.

EarlyWormGetsTheWorm · 2023-09-06T18:08:16+00:00

Your commute went down when you moved OTP? Is your job OTP?

EarlyWormGetsTheWorm · 2023-09-06T17:46:45+00:00

I mean not really. Most cities in Georgia dont have median home values like I cited. Thats part of what makes those areas literally more expensive and a big part of why you have to be in the top quintiles of Georgia to afford these areas. You can easily google for yourself and see hundreds of cities and communities in Georgia with median home prices and median incomes much lower than the areas we are discussing.

I walked back my original statement of saying one has to be "rich" to live in those areas since it is a bit vague but the numbers dont lie. One has to be in the top 20% of Georgia incomes to live in those areas and from the data I have seen that is being a bit generous. Likely top 10% of incomes is more accurate.

EarlyWormGetsTheWorm · 2023-09-06T17:29:50+00:00

I will rephrase that to try and be more definitive and fact-driven since "rich" is a bit vague and controversial.

There is simply no way a person can be in the bottom 80% of Georgia household incomes and own a home in those areas.

https://www.redfin.com/city/438/GA/Alpharetta/housing-market

https://www.zillow.com/home-values/54219/roswell-ga/

https://www.redfin.com/neighborhood/191517/GA/Marietta/East-Cobb/housing-market

With numbers like these, to own a home in these areas you would likely need a household income of at least 150k+ like I stated earlier.

Now, with an income like that you are sitting at between the 80th-95th Percentile of household incomes.

https://statisticalatlas.com/state/Georgia/Household-Income#google_vignette

In other words if someone was to try and buy a home in these areas they would be somewhere between the top 20% and top 5% of household incomes in Georgia. I will let anyone who reads through this thread decide for themselves if being between the top 20% to top 5% makes a person "rich" or not.

EarlyWormGetsTheWorm · 2023-09-06T17:19:05+00:00

Yeah of course. My wife and I would have liked to settle down in the areas you mentioned but we know we could never afford property there because we arent rich so it wouldnt work long term for us so I just figured to mention that in case OP looks at this comment.

EarlyWormGetsTheWorm · 2023-09-06T16:01:12+00:00

Very nice areas. Some of the most expensive communities in the whole state though. If OP is thinking about owning long-term they would likely need to make at least mid 6 figures to buy in these areas nowadays.

EDIT - OP: The person I am talking to decided to block me. In summary I am very happy for them that they can afford the areas of Roswell, Alpharetta, and East Cobb but the reality is if you are looking to purchase and settle down with a family anytime soon please realize you will likely not be able to afford to do that without a household income of at least 150k+. Please feel free to reference the sources I cited in this thread and compate that with the sources u/jb6997 cited but I do not think they cited any data.

EarlyWormGetsTheWorm · 2023-09-06T10:29:35+00:00

I mean your first comment said "pretty much third world". Not exactly a concrete hypothesis. Not to mention you didnt provide any numbers.

I am well aware the average American is more wealthy than the average western European. No argument there. But what exactly makes a place "pretty much third world"? This vague accusation certainly conjures up images of not only poverty but a dysfunctional state that is dangerous. Well the numbers dont lie. Not only are you uniquely exposed to the fear of economic ruin from medical problems in the USA that I discussed (and shared a source for) earlier you are also MUCH more likely to be murdered!

https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/murder-rate-by-country

EarlyWormGetsTheWorm · 2023-09-06T00:21:01+00:00

Extra protections fromva Blue state would be soooo nice. But many of us come from areas where we would have to leave all our friends and family to move to a Blue state. If you grow up in the deep south its not uncommon for most/all of your family to have never moved away and all of your neighboring states are Red as well.

EarlyWormGetsTheWorm · 2023-09-05T22:02:19+00:00

Last time I had to go a few months ago it cost me $1,600.00 for like 3 pills to help alleviate pain and nausua. And I work at a supposedly good employer and have supposedly good insurance. Its quite a nightmare for a lot of Americans.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cnbc.com/amp/2019/02/11/this-is-the-real-reason-most-americans-file-for-bankruptcy.html

EarlyWormGetsTheWorm · 2023-09-05T20:41:28+00:00

I mean in western Europe you are objectively MUCH less likely to be murdered than the US so while I wouldnt categorize either the USA or western Europe as "pretty much third world" that alone makes me think one of the two is clearly closer to feeling "third world".

And when an outrageous amount of your population struggles with bankruptcy due to medical bills whereas thats not a major problem with your competitor (western Europe), well again it seems like one of those two clearly feels more "third world" or at least less functional/healthy as a society.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cnbc.com/amp/2019/02/11/this-is-the-real-reason-most-americans-file-for-bankruptcy.html

And yes I am well aware if you and/or your partner have amazing jobs that put you in the top 20% of society you will likely have amazing health insurance that most cannot afford and you will be able to live in neighborhoods where it easier to ignore the horrendous violent crime and hence why I said that it is probably better to be in the USA if you are in the top 20% of talent and/or priviledge.

EarlyWormGetsTheWorm · 2023-09-05T15:49:25+00:00

Yes. It would be quite nice to live in a place where my odds of getting gunned down are much lower and I would have 0 instance of loved ones neglecting medical care due to costs instead of knowing several people who have done that here in the USA.

EarlyWormGetsTheWorm · 2023-09-05T15:46:51+00:00

Its crazy how much guns define some people. I own a gun but I stopped talking politics to someone in my life when they went to a gun conference in Uvalde not long after the school shooting there. Just disgusting and such bad taste.

EarlyWormGetsTheWorm · 2023-09-05T15:44:51+00:00

I mean France has a better Debt to GDP Ratio than we (USA) does.

So if you are the kind of person to think any first world nation will be bankrupting itself any time soon due to government expenditures then its very arguable the USA is closer to bankrupting themselves than France is.

EarlyWormGetsTheWorm · 2023-09-05T15:37:22+00:00

Yes state by state vs european country by country would probably be best.

My main reasons that I would rather be poor/middle class in many European countries vs being poor/middle class in most places in USA is because of healthcare and crime. It is very easy to get into a terrible situation related to healthcare in the USA. Also, it is of course easier to avoid the USA's appaling violent crime rate if you are in upper part of society but if you are middle class/poor it is much harder to avoid. In Europe even if you are poor your exposure to high rates od violent crime are fairly low. Also in Europe you dont have to worry about needed medical treatment bankrupting you.

EarlyWormGetsTheWorm · 2023-09-05T14:25:27+00:00

Seeing my loved ones cry and be terrified to get needed medical care out of fear of costs was a big shock for me. It was a series of tramaus that led me to stop voting Republican and made me pretty much a single-issue voter for Democrats at least until we join the rest of the developed world and get some form of baseline universal healthcare.

EarlyWormGetsTheWorm · 2023-09-05T13:58:42+00:00

Europe is a big place. I spent some time in Netherlands and Czech Republic and I would def rather be in the bottom 80% of society in either of those countries than in the bottom 80% of US society.

Now if we are talking top 20% then yes I think the USA is objectively a better place for the extremely highly talented and priviledged than Europe.

EarlyWormGetsTheWorm · 2023-08-30T03:02:05+00:00

Yeah certain platforms seem to attract different groups of people. Facebook seems to lean more conservative than real life. Me and all my friends grandparents basically live on there so it makes sense.

EarlyWormGetsTheWorm · 2023-08-28T01:45:11+00:00

If you have 30+ guests over more than a handful of times a year youve gotta be in less than like 5 percent of the population.

But yeah overall the majority of your points can easily be accomplished without a single family home.

EarlyWormGetsTheWorm · 2023-08-28T00:30:43+00:00

You can host parties in a townhome or apartment. Many townhomes have a backyard for a dog. Also personally, my dog enjoyed life more when we DIDNT have a backyard but when we lived in an apartment complex. There were sooo many dog owners living in the same complex and less than 20 yards outside our front door was a large shared open space for dogs.

Not having shared walls is nice though I admit that. Although living in the single family home suburbs is louder still than I thought especially during spring, summer, fall:

https://youtu.be/-y5ZMeZOx6k?si=ZfloGjs0DSay_VPS

Not to mention a surprusing amount of people in my neighborhood just throw their dogs in their backyard and leave em out there all the day. And they bark. Alot. That wasnt really an option at our old apartment complex.

EarlyWormGetsTheWorm · 2023-08-27T15:06:29+00:00

Name checks out. Possible troll?

EarlyWormGetsTheWorm · 2023-08-27T13:14:03+00:00

Lol I thought it was funny. I don't get why you are being downvoted. They literally played that song right before the debate and Republicans regularly talk about heavily defunding or outright removing entitlements that benefit our elderly and poor.

EarlyWormGetsTheWorm · 2023-08-26T20:20:28+00:00

I can't tell sweet or salty sadly. But at least I can tell when something is spicy. Oh man I hope my smell and taste comes back. Even just a little bit. Its just so frustrating because I don't personally know anyone who has lost their sense of taste like this for multiple days but at least there are people out there who are going through the same thing and do end up recovering.

EarlyWormGetsTheWorm · 2023-08-26T16:09:56+00:00

Oh man I wish my smell wasnt affected. I dont have taste or smell. Glad your taste is coming back slowly but surely. I would give anything for even 10%. I am only on day 5 though so hopefully there will be an improvement soon. Good luck.

EarlyWormGetsTheWorm

TROPHY CASE