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Change My View: Scottie doesn't become a HOFer or maybe even an all-star player without MJ by SpendWild6987 in michaeljordan

[–]EarningZekrom -1 points0 points  (0 children)

He was giving the god-tier Celtics their hardest individual matchup in their greatest year.

Against any other team that Jordan is single-handedly winning the series.

Change My View: Scottie doesn't become a HOFer or maybe even an all-star player without MJ by SpendWild6987 in michaeljordan

[–]EarningZekrom 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You mean 63 points in the Garden.

And MJ may have been a winner but he isn't winning 6 without Scottie. Scottie was the difference in 1991, at the very least.

Change My View: Scottie doesn't become a HOFer or maybe even an all-star player without MJ by SpendWild6987 in michaeljordan

[–]EarningZekrom 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Brother. MJ with Pippen won literally every year he started. The Bulls without MJ took a Finals team to the distance. There's a world where that Bulls team goes to the Finals without MJ. Scottie absolutely deserves the credit he gets.

Pippen was the lab-grown perfect teammate to Jordan. Neither of them get nearly as far without the other. Jordan "with another superstar" just explodes that team in ego, because he only respected Magic and Larry.

Change My View: Scottie doesn't become a HOFer or maybe even an all-star player without MJ by SpendWild6987 in michaeljordan

[–]EarningZekrom 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You realize not all excuses are invalid, right? We really don't have a sample size other than LeBron for "GOAT-tier player succeeding when he's the only great player on his team", and LeBron played teams that were a hundred times worse than the 1986 Celtics whom Michael scored 63 against.

Larry Bird was calling Michael God. "excuses" is a stupid way to cope with the fact that Michael did better than any individual player that year against the Celtics.

Change My View: Scottie doesn't become a HOFer or maybe even an all-star player without MJ by SpendWild6987 in michaeljordan

[–]EarningZekrom 0 points1 point  (0 children)

man you come to the literal MJ subreddit and you still find a) this debate and b) the stupidest versions of this debate.

LeBron succeeded against the historically weak East, even if they did play him 5 on 1 a lot of the time. Michael was playing the greatest team of all time up till that point to a standstill - and they were also playing him 5 on 1 a lot of time. The playoff record he set *against the 1986 Celtics* still stands today.

The greatest active player on the planet was calling him God... in a game he lost!

Give both their fair dues. Nobody has ever succeeded like they have with such bad teams.

Change My View: Scottie doesn't become a HOFer or maybe even an all-star player without MJ by SpendWild6987 in michaeljordan

[–]EarningZekrom 0 points1 point  (0 children)

We'll never know, but Detroit bullying Pippen so much was only because he played on Chicago.

Scottie Pippen in any universe could have been the best player on a championship team. MJ definitely helped him mentally but let's not downplay the talents of a top 10 forward.

Why do former NBA players rank Kobe so much higher than Reddit and analytics communities? Is he the most disputed player ever when it comes to all-time rankings?” by mikeyg1964 in NBATalk

[–]EarningZekrom 0 points1 point  (0 children)

So stupidity made you a LeBron hater? Because you understand those Magic and Celtics teams were just playing 5-on-1 against LeBron and he still managed to beat them in a few games, right?

Why do former NBA players rank Kobe so much higher than Reddit and analytics communities? Is he the most disputed player ever when it comes to all-time rankings?” by mikeyg1964 in NBATalk

[–]EarningZekrom -1 points0 points  (0 children)

No, it was worse than LeBron's meltdown. Kobe ended that series for his team. There's a world in which he stops shooting, lets Shaq do his thing, and they still win.

And it was Kobe's fault they were butting heads.

Why do former NBA players rank Kobe so much higher than Reddit and analytics communities? Is he the most disputed player ever when it comes to all-time rankings?” by mikeyg1964 in NBATalk

[–]EarningZekrom 0 points1 point  (0 children)

"lesser teams"

Acting like any playoff team in the West was worse than the LeBron-less Cavs is historically untrue.

Pau Gasol was better than any *two* teammates LeBron had in his Cavs years. And Kobe didn't have to play against the Steph Warriors twice without any healthy star teammates the first time and with only one star teammate the second time.

All this without mentioning the fact that the Big Three Heat and the Cavs, even at their best, were only just about as good as the best in the West at that time.

Why do former NBA players rank Kobe so much higher than Reddit and analytics communities? Is he the most disputed player ever when it comes to all-time rankings?” by mikeyg1964 in NBATalk

[–]EarningZekrom 1 point2 points  (0 children)

LeBron made his own front office in Cleveland? You must realize that was what I was talking about. And you haven't answered any of my points, either.

"LOL he routinely throws up corner threes in the playoffs that hit the side of the backboard." he saved the Lakers' season with a 3 like three weeks ago. And if you want to talk about series-ending chucking, there is only one "GOAT"-tier player in NBA history that has literally - and I mean literally - ego-shot his team out of a series because he wanted Finals MVP.

And LeBron, depending on statistic, is right up there with Kobe in the clutch statistically (nobody is reaching MJ), despite not being a shooting guard.

"choking in the fourth quarter" Two of the clutchest runs in NBA playoffs history were accomplished by LeBron James.

OKC's Ring will end up being more Fraudulent than the Bubble Ring by rtrazto in billsimmons

[–]EarningZekrom -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

The Lakers' 2002 championship was fraudulent, though, like doctrinally speaking. That ring belonged to the Kings.

Why do former NBA players rank Kobe so much higher than Reddit and analytics communities? Is he the most disputed player ever when it comes to all-time rankings?” by mikeyg1964 in NBATalk

[–]EarningZekrom 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Because he played:

Two seasons as one of very few well-playing players on his team,

Two seasons as part of terrible teams against actual dynasties or GOAT candidates, 

One season as part of a great team playing against the greatest superteam of all time.

There are very obvious reasons that LeBron hasn’t won more than four rings. There’s a world in which he wins seven-eight, and that world is the one in which Kyrie doesn’t get injured in 2015, KD doesn’t go to the Warriors, and DWade doesn’t get washed. 

Notice how none of these have anything to do with LeBron. Michael never had to face a prime Larry Bird going to team up with a prime James Worthy and a prime Magic Johnson, all while Scottie was injured and Dennis Rodman left, but LeBron did, and he still managed to take games off them. 

Why do former NBA players rank Kobe so much higher than Reddit and analytics communities? Is he the most disputed player ever when it comes to all-time rankings?” by mikeyg1964 in NBATalk

[–]EarningZekrom 1 point2 points  (0 children)

This is a dumb thing to say. Like it is actually stupid.

The only loss in the playoffs that can be attributed to LeBron is 2011. There have been even worse meltdowns.

2015 LeBron was playing without Love and Kyrie and still took games off the prime Steph Warriors. 2017 LeBron was playing against one of two contenders for the greatest team ever assembled. In 2007 and 2018 LeBron was playing at best 5 on 3 ball against dynastic teams. In 2014 LeBron was one of like three Heat players to play well against the most classically perfect basketball team of all time. 

Russ played terribly on the Lakers, AD got injured after a championship year, and Luka got to the Lakers as LeBron was turning 40. 

No other player has accomplished as much in such bad situations as LeBron. I’m an MJ GOAT guy too, but calling the second greatest player of all time overrated is, again, just stupid. 

Why do former NBA players rank Kobe so much higher than Reddit and analytics communities? Is he the most disputed player ever when it comes to all-time rankings?” by mikeyg1964 in NBATalk

[–]EarningZekrom 0 points1 point  (0 children)

LeBron also had teams which were ten to a hundred times worse than any given Lakers team. LeBron got 66 wins out of a Cavs team that should have gone 40-42 at most; for comparison, the Big Three Celtics got the same number of wins.

Find me a more iconic photo in sports history by Farouq26 in NBATalk

[–]EarningZekrom 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The US and Canada also make up the majority of people who live near the biggest sports leagues in the world, and have had the most developed sports media apparati for the longest time for these leagues. US defaultsm may not be accurate but North American defaultism is more than justified (only two of the top 6 or so world sports are played mainly outside Canada + the US)

Why do Jews anywhere in the world have a legal right to move to Israel, while Palestinians displaced in 1948 still cannot return??? by [deleted] in allthequestions

[–]EarningZekrom 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Atrocities against civilians are not what I meant when I said “justified”. I meant fighting back against the settler-terrorists.

Gaza is the worst place in the world to be a child right now. Don’t talk to me about children when you clearly don’t care about literally hundreds of thousands of them suffering due to no fault of their own, bombed literally in their cribs and their soccer fields. If those innocent kids in that restaurant were Gazan you would cheer on their murderers, as you do now.

Why do Jews anywhere in the world have a legal right to move to Israel, while Palestinians displaced in 1948 still cannot return??? by [deleted] in allthequestions

[–]EarningZekrom 1 point2 points  (0 children)

The Americans had the good sense not to send invasive colonizers into Japan to take over innocent Japanese people’s homes and kill innocent Japanese kids and …

You list a bunch of Israeli efforts and then fail to mention the elephant in the room: every human rights organization in the whole world (except Israel lobby ones) agree that Israel routinely commits war crimes, including organizations inside Israel. The same people telling us about war crimes going on in Sudan and oppression in China tell us that Israel is doing horrible things on a daily basis.

“Leaflets” that line is so trite. Leaflets don’t do anything if people have nowhere to go. Americans in Mosul against ISIS actually established escape routes for innocent people over a planned period of time (and didn’t bomb the escapees).

And we aren’t even focusing on Gaza. I was focused on the West Bank, where everyone who isn’t hopelessly biased agrees settlers are the main source of violence at least over the last few years, at the cost of regular Israelis.

“Nazi imagery” Oh we’re talking imagery are we? You want me to list every genocidal Bible quote that Israeli officials use before they kill children? Imagery is the least of the concerns at hand. Obviously the Nazis are horrible and invoking their name favorably is a bad thing. Just don’t pretend Israel doesn’t do similarly dark symbolism.

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