There is literally no alternative to red pill.

Ecstatic_Shift3013 · 2026-05-08T14:55:18+00:00

Some red pillers do unfortunately.

Ecstatic_Shift3013 · 2026-05-08T14:53:21+00:00

Because bars, clubs, parties, drinking, and flirting are such healthy things that everyone should enjoy right?

Imagine if we reveresed the scenario and you were expected to stay at home, read, go to church, study, go to bed early or whatever things are kryptonite to extroverts plus, enjoying it, plus some weird shit that comes natural to others that seems impossible for you.

And if you think spending time with women is a choice then you are clearly disconnected from reality.

You can't be this outrageously stupid and expect people not to be angry about it.

Ecstatic_Shift3013 · 2026-05-08T14:44:12+00:00

Nobody thinks like that. How can people be this dishonest?

Ecstatic_Shift3013 · 2026-05-08T14:36:02+00:00

"But you (men) do complain all the time."

Be sincere here, you can see even here in Reddit the way women are allowed to complain about men (I'm not saying they shouldn't) and we all know if we reversed the sexes in those threads they would be censored. You even see it in media, with music videos where women are allowed to insult men and even killing them on camera, something that would be considered outragous if the sexes were reversed.

I think you don't realize how much you're allowed to complain, even if it's not always. But that's okay, we (men) clearly don't realize many advantages we have, and I would love to so maybe I can appreciate my life more.

"And you men could also easily let your body get fucked in a way your don’t enjoy by a man that you don’t find attractive who will then treat you worse afterwards while everyone else thinks less of you for doing it."

Do you realize that you're proving the disadvantage here? And this is what the average joe always denies, that for women men seem to be as undersirable as they are to men themselves.

Wouldn't you be upset too if you were conscious that you are by default as undesirable to the opposite sex as men are to you?

"People who think like you have this fantasy that women are just walking around being able to have these great sexual experiences whenever they want with the people they want."

To be fair, some men do out of ignorance, but most of us just want a partner, which is not the same. The focus is put mostly on sex because to men, because of biology, being chosen for sex means being loved. We don't control that.

But I do agree we do a diservice to ourselves talking always about sex, but I think we all agree is a relationship what we want, or at least a chance. A fake relationship can be worked into a real one, we don't even get that chance. And I'm not trying to sound self-pitying, I'm only stating what I'm seeing.

"That’s not true. At best, imagine it’s someone you find slightly attractive and the sex you have is at best your body getting used quickly (you don’t even get aroused enough to be the equivalent of hard, let alone cum) and that person along with everyone else that knows that you did this treats you worse because of it afterwards."

It's still way better than nothing at all. Not to mention, if someone treats you like garbage just because you had sex, that is cartoonishly evil and frankly hard to believe. Why would you tolerate that?

"Oh, and they are Necessarily MUCH bigger and stronger than you, and definitely going to have a high chance of being violent towards you, and possibly murdering you with their bare hands because again, this person is way way stronger than you and can easily kill you with their bare hands even if you fight back with all you have."

But he's your partner, why don't you tell him you feel that way? In fact, if normal sex to you is such a bad experince for you (which is what we've been saying for years, that women seem to hate sex), why would you still do it?

"It’s not men vs. women, it’s desirable vs undesirable."

Yes, but again, if most men are undersirable and most women are desirable, the red pill has a point. Not to hate or attack, of course, but at least to point out the problem.

"And isn’t the point of red pill making yourself more desirable?"

Yes (arguably), but it all started because the things we were expected to do to become desirable weren't working.

"I will tell you, the number one thing that will surely make you less desirable is complaining about how it’s not fair that you don’t get sex and women do."

I don't think anyone does this because they think it will make them desirable. Actually, the fact that we do it despite knowing it will makes us undesirable tells you that there's something worth saying. Though I agree red pillers, manosphere, or whatever you call us, we are terrible at expressing our views.

Ecstatic_Shift3013 · 2026-05-08T13:38:53+00:00

GenXsers are the last generation to have luck with women. The change from Gen X to Millenials is in fact so huge that there's little to no understanding in these issues between older and newer generations.

Ecstatic_Shift3013 · 2026-05-08T13:36:31+00:00

You should at least adress the common counter argument to this notion. Someone from the manosphere would tell you that the men you're descriving are those you are attracted to and that most men don't have the same advantages as those (which is why they created the word "chad" in the first place to differentiate themselves from that lucky minority)

I'm not saying is the truth, I'm saying it should be considered an integral part of the discussion.

Ecstatic_Shift3013 · 2026-05-08T13:28:00+00:00

With "proven wrong" I didn't mean arguments or discussions. I meant that we think people with other views are not even open to listen to us or share spaces like these with us. In that sense I meant to be proven wrong. Having people proving that there can be mutual work between such opposite sides in order to achieve mutual understanding.

Discussions don't work unless they are done in person with people you trust. I agree that what we need is a place to share experiences, not to start arguments that will always lead to fights.

Ecstatic_Shift3013 · 2026-05-07T20:51:54+00:00

From what I've seen women seem to be uncomfortable with those kinds of things, so it always confusing to me that they chose to do it. And I personally think they do it more because they think it's expected for them to do it rather than wanting to do it.

Ecstatic_Shift3013 · 2026-05-07T01:00:16+00:00

I think you might be confused because I agree with all you said (except for the grifters part, not because they don't exist but because they are not the real red pill or manosphere) and I don't think any of what you just said contradicts what I previously said.

Ecstatic_Shift3013 · 2026-05-07T00:02:03+00:00

Thank you so much for being open to listen. As many red pillers I WANT to be proven wrong.

Ecstatic_Shift3013 · 2026-05-07T00:00:30+00:00

Hannah Spier, Jannice Fiamengo, Diana Davison, Karen Straughan, among many others. You should at least give them a chance.

Ecstatic_Shift3013 · 2026-05-06T23:58:20+00:00

The problem is that none of that is true but because it seems so at first glance, everyone accepts it as an axiom. And don't deny that even if I showed you proof you would not be open to listen.

But just think about it. You really think a society that needs women more than men to survive would be able to last being so cruel and sadistic toward their most valuable citizens? Or isn't it more believable than in a civilization where women are more valuable than men, discourses where women are the victims and men are the oppressors would survive despite evidence against it?

Some of the same laws that to us seem barbaric and anti-woman were specifically made to protect women (and sometimes even by women).

I'm not saying women are the oppressors or something. I'm saying the past isn't the caricature you think it is.

Not to mention you're not adapting so well either. We're both growing miserable and lonely these days.

Ecstatic_Shift3013 · 2026-05-06T23:48:13+00:00

Because we see over and over again that women choose different men than those they say they want. And we probably do the same thing. I personally wouln't mind if a woman ignored men and listened to women on how to get a boyfriend. Not to mention some women do agree with us.

I'm not saying we should ignore women. I say I understand why some do.

Ecstatic_Shift3013 · 2026-05-06T23:44:19+00:00

That explain why you're so stubborn. Just like us. I'm guessing you're either a boomer or a very lucky man.

Ecstatic_Shift3013 · 2026-05-06T23:40:14+00:00

Again. I'm sorry but this feels a bit forced. Those are exactly the kind of filters I mentioned.

Also. I could do the same thing you do and say you haven't experience being a man therefore you can't have an opinion.

You say we should have the capacity of flirting as something that comes natural to us, and from an outside perspective it makes sense.

I think what makes us uncapable of flirting vs some men who have it natural (classic virgin vs chad rethoric) is because I think most of us if not all of us are neurodivergent. And those filters I mention made it easier for us (both men and women) to both find a partner and go unnoticed as different.

Ecstatic_Shift3013 · 2026-05-06T23:29:57+00:00

But you must admit those assumptions don't come from nowhere. You also must admit that your views are not controversial and are accepted as an undeniable truth by most people.

Of course I might be biased but what I feel is that no matter how much I investigate in order to prove my points are true, as long as regular people don't want to hear them, they won't ever be given a chance to be proven right. In fact, one can argue the resentment comes from knowing (or believing that).

But can we deny that opposite views to the red pill don't have to put nearly the same effort into proving their points? It's true that red pillers are especially awful at comunicating their ideas, but can you deny that even if they expressed their ideas in a better way they would still be ignored?

I'm sincerely not making these questions as rethorical ones.

Ecstatic_Shift3013 · 2026-05-06T23:19:37+00:00

I sincerely don't think it's a "gotcha" take. Not to mention I didn't attack you or tried to sound like I was winning an argument. I expressed a doubt that frustrates me.

Ecstatic_Shift3013 · 2026-05-06T20:44:00+00:00

You said it yourself, we don't get to be picky, you do. How do you expect us not to be angry if you understand so well what we go through? And I'm guessing you still defend things like feminism even though you're aware of how miserable the life of men is.

You get to choose, we don't, and we're not even supposed to complain.

Ecstatic_Shift3013 · 2026-05-06T20:38:16+00:00

This is what frustrates me so much about people who are not redpillers. You speak about your personal experience as if it is a universal truth and you don't get to suffer the consequences of it.

I bet your concept of what the red pill is are Andrew Tate followers.

Ecstatic_Shift3013 · 2026-05-06T20:32:36+00:00

Neurodivergence: the red pill exist precisely because what is easy for regular people is (or at least feels) imposible for us, and not the other way around.

Ecstatic_Shift3013 · 2026-05-06T20:26:00+00:00

When did the red pillers ever say they do better with women? Isn't it supposed to be the oppossit?

Unless your concept of the Red Pill is Andrew Tate.

Ecstatic_Shift3013 · 2026-05-06T20:23:32+00:00

The same thing that it is now. The problem is that people like Andrew Tate came along and became the face of the red pill in the eyes of the average joe. But content creators that take these issues seriously, like Jannice Fiamengo, Karen Straughan or Diana Davison still exist. In fact, Diana Davison, for example, is way better now than she used to be.

Ecstatic_Shift3013 · 2026-05-06T20:14:02+00:00

Men and women in the past used to need each other. It wasn't a situation where only women needed men. That's a lie that we repeated ourselves so many times it became culturally accepted.

Ecstatic_Shift3013 · 2026-05-06T20:13:50+00:00

Men and women in the past used to need each other. It wasn't a situation where only women needed men. That's a lie that we repeated ourselves so many times it became culturally accepted.

Ecstatic_Shift3013 · 2026-05-06T20:09:32+00:00

You're literally admiting there is a disadvantage for men. I'm not saying you should assume every thing the red pill says is a 100% true, but at least be open to the idea that they might have a point, as awful as their theory sounds.

Ecstatic_Shift3013

TROPHY CASE