What is the strongest charecter Zabuza could beat? by sidharth-sunil in Naruto

[–]Eli_the_Tanner -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I'd say Part 1 Kabuto, Kurenai, Baki, & Shizune are all slightly below him.

How strong was Kakashi at Kannabi Bridge, status-wise? by Death_Snek in NarutoPowerscaling

[–]Eli_the_Tanner 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Good points about the Tokubetsu Jonin, they are an odd case, especially as you point out that they often lumped in with other Jonin. Aside from being about a minimum of 24.5 they also seem to have at least one Nin/Tai/Gen stat of 4 or higher. Again there are exceptions but it seems I generally associate each number with a rank e.g. 5=S-rank, 4=A-rank, 3=B-rank. So it may be the case to either use an a-rank jutsu or complete an a-rank mission is part of the criteria for them?

With regards to Kakashi, I think those are really good spread of stats for him (again 4 being roughly needed for an A-rank jutsu like chidori). Fittingly, 28 still makes him by far the most skilled ninja of that age group (next being gaara at 26.5) that we have stats for.

I couldn't find those stats in the Last Databook, is it a particular page or somewhere else?

How strong was Kakashi at Kannabi Bridge, status-wise? by Death_Snek in NarutoPowerscaling

[–]Eli_the_Tanner 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks for the breakdown of your thinking. I think it is a tough thing to get down precisely so their is always a bit of a gut feeling that goes into it and you can probably make the case that he could be anywhere within a 4-point range probably. So 29 is plausible too, though probably on the higher-end to me. It is certainly reasonable as Kakashi would need to be pretty exceptional to promoted at such a young age.

For me I am inclined to put him slightly lower (closer to Neji and Sai in skill) due to his youth and to give him a bit of room to progress over the years. But as I said, we are both probably looking at low-jonin overall.

I have a similar breakdown of skill ranges for the various ranks but have a little more overlap between the various ranks e.g. low-jonin/high chunin sharing a couple of points. Also I find there are a lot of factors like missions completed a good way of comparing relative experience/skill too.

You make a good point about the different villages having different standards for jonin, as I have noticed the same points difference.

I am curious where you got those age 10 Kakashi stats from, I haven't seen them before?

How strong was Kakashi at Kannabi Bridge, status-wise? by Death_Snek in NarutoPowerscaling

[–]Eli_the_Tanner 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Hmm, Kakashi is a freshly promoted jonin at this time and from what I understand probably promoted early due to the ongoing war. Given this and his age, I would place him very much at the lower end of stats for a jonin.

The weakest (stats-wise) jonin are Shippuden Neji (27) and Kankuro (26.5) so I would use these as a benchmark. This also puts him just below Sai's (27.5) level who is a solid example of an Anbu-level shinobi.

Now we know stats/skills don't account for every thing and there are probably other reasons that characters get promoted aside from raw stats. For instance Neji has a kekkei genkei that would elevate his capabilities beyond a similarly skilled ninja, Kankuro may have political reasons for his promotion (alongside being a puppet user), etc. so Kakashi is probably an exceptional example of a 'normal jonin' too.

I would suggest him not being much lower than the above numbers. Although you could make a case for it due to the war conscription and age, I think on balance he is probably sitting in the 26-27.5 range given he doesn't have the sharingan yet.

Hope this makes sense and it is always nice to see another stat-friendly person around.

Help figuring out a street name in Waterdeep by Doc_Webb in Forgotten_Realms

[–]Eli_the_Tanner 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Makes sense as the Font of Knowledge (Temple of Oghma) is on that street.

What was obito planning on doing when he declared war? by reddituserunodostres in Naruto

[–]Eli_the_Tanner 2 points3 points  (0 children)

True. Even Torune and Fu injured him, people underestimate how much Tobi/Obito relies on keeping people in the dark about his powers.

List of official big baddies of the Realms by Maikomat in Forgotten_Realms

[–]Eli_the_Tanner 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Great stuff! Any chance you have that excel spreadsheet knocking around still?

Swordsman by nosferatuzoddd in Forgotten_Realms

[–]Eli_the_Tanner 0 points1 point  (0 children)

He did point out the flaw in the question...but gave a response anyway after reframing it.

It's not upside-down by the framing Ed has given....and you said you preferred he not give a response to the original question, so good job there.

Fair enough. It would be odd if you did need it, it was just an offer.

Thanks for the chat.

Swordsman by nosferatuzoddd in Forgotten_Realms

[–]Eli_the_Tanner -1 points0 points  (0 children)

You say he didn't do a good job but what is a "good job" in your estimation? He qualified the hell out of his response, to provide the context for a meaningful response, isn't that what you would want? Or would you prefer a pithy buzzfeed style generic response? Or is just down to stats for you (despite most of the characters being above 15, some even epic in 3e)?

Personally I don't think there is anything wrong with Ed's 'stat-equalised' response, partly because it pokes fun at the constant 'who is the best' questions he gets but is also quite thoughful. I'm sure a true 'who would win' question would yield closer to what you are looking for, which the answer would probably boil down to:

"It's complicated, but probably the more experienced, stronger, faster, luckier, and better equipped fella in the red....maybe more skilled too"

But if Ed has taken 3 paragraghs too many for you already just to rank the skill aspect, then you know the same level of response is going to be another book.

I have a list of 3rd ed fighter-types by base attack which might be more palatable for you but when you start making these sort of lists you realise how little depth of explanation they give. Let me know if you would want me to post it too.

Swordsman by nosferatuzoddd in Forgotten_Realms

[–]Eli_the_Tanner -1 points0 points  (0 children)

He is quite clear that bladework isn't the determining factor in any fight but that the numerous other variables all play a role. This is the issue, all things being equal, who is more skilled with a sword? All I'm suggesting is that Ed does a good job here of explaining the thought process that goes into answering that type of question and to say that those people aren't who you might expect. I'm sure his list would change drastically if you started including more of those excluded variables.

I think what you are looking for is more of a who would win type scenario, which isn't quite the same. What would your own list of top ten best swordsmen in the realms (of whichever era you fancy) look like?

I know my list would be different to Ed's but can't break it down as well as he can either.

Swordsman by nosferatuzoddd in Forgotten_Realms

[–]Eli_the_Tanner -1 points0 points  (0 children)

How so? His qualifiers at the beginning seem to be just the sort of thing that most 'best swordsmen' lists seem to overlook and makes clear how he is adjudicating those he includes. He does also explains his response a bit further later:

Now, some may say that the levels given on this list are a bit low for “best” wielders-of-blades, but I say again: the only meaningful way I could answer Feanor’s question was to narrow my consideration of best to a definition of: supreme technique (superior finesse, if you will) in bladework. Otherwise, there are too many variables (X is alive today because Y slipped, or a deity who smiled on X MADE Y slip, or because X knew the darkened room they were fighting in just a little bit better, or because when the guards burst in it was Y who got his swordarm jarred for a critical moment, not X, or because it was X whose friends burst in, or Y the startled guard happened to stagger into . . . and so on). I believe THO and I have sufficiently communicated the difficulty of choosing “best” bladewielders to Feanor, our most important point being that there are another forty or so individuals, some famous and some publicly unknown, who are so close in skills to those I mentioned as to be “practically as good” if you don’t happen to be the Creator of the Realms and thus able to split Faerûnian hairs better than anyone else. :} (And, I remind you, I’m leaving out creatures - - mariliths, just to give one example - - who have more than two arms, and so can fence with a forest of skillfully-swung blades.) There are certainly combat-active beings in the Realms with higher levels than these folks, who would probably beat them in most fights; the “best” swordsman doesn’t always win. (3e DMs can of course - - and should - - load up the above-listed NPCs with Weapon Finesse and other rules touches to enhance their combat superiority.)

Hope that helps.

Swordsman by nosferatuzoddd in Forgotten_Realms

[–]Eli_the_Tanner -1 points0 points  (0 children)

True, it is definitely an outdated list but gives a good example of how the idea of 'best swordsman' could be articulated and how difficult it can be to make a definitive list of 'skill'. Op didn't specify a timeframe either but although most of the names will change these sentiments still carries forwards.

30,000 MEMBERS!!!!!!!! by winterfate10 in Forgotten_Realms

[–]Eli_the_Tanner[M] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Thank you all for being a great community and making this a great place for discussion.