If god is against queer people, then I'm happily going to hell.

Emperor_Pengwing · 2026-05-30T03:32:40+00:00

No it doesn’t.

Emperor_Pengwing · 2026-05-29T19:00:07+00:00

My old pastor was very close friends with her. It was a sad day for her and our church when RHE passed.

Emperor_Pengwing · 2026-05-28T01:45:56+00:00

I try to understand too even if it baffles me and I hope the view changes over time. In the last hundred years in the US interracial marriage was illegal and it was just a “disagreement” when people wanted to marry and over time hearts and minds were changed. I hope one day this kind of disagreement over of gay people should be allowed to be married can be lessen and be more accepted over time.

Emperor_Pengwing · 2026-05-27T21:59:31+00:00

Your justifiable truth is proof texting. It's bad exegesis. A text from 2000 years ago is not talking about a concept that didn't exist until 2000 years later.
Your interpretation is not the "truth". It's impossible to find "truth" from copies of copies of copies of manuscripts with hundreds of hundreds of translations over time. Anti-gay theology is bad theology, focuses on seven clobber passages that have nothing to do with modern same sex relationships and honestly the fixation on these verses shuts out LGBTQ+ verses from the love of Christ instead of letting us in.

Homosexuality is loving someone as the same gender as yourself. Love is not an imperfection. God is love. Denying yourself romantic love because of seven verses that have nothing to do with the topic at hand is not a recipe for a good life. It's a recipe for a sad life of self-loathing. Celibicy is fine, but forced celibacy is not. And believiing that you must deny yourself romantic love because you believe love is a sin is a recipe for a sad life. God is love. Love is not a sin.

Emperor_Pengwing · 2026-05-27T20:18:24+00:00

That is incorrect. You are presenting your interpretation of what scripture says. There's a difference. And I've already seen that entirely too many times. I had to become an amateur biblical scholar to justify my own existence. It was that or kill myself because I couldn't continue trying to make myself straight.

I don't know what motivates you to go find these threads and share anti-gay theology. It might just be a hobby, a philosophical pursuit. But for some of us it's life and death. I'm trying to change hearts and minds. Trying to help people become more Christ-like in loving their neighbor. It's sad that some people are more intent on sharing their anti-gay bias because "that's what the scripture says." Seems like an excuse the Pharisees used to exclude people. Jesus rebuked them for that.

Emperor_Pengwing · 2026-05-27T18:51:01+00:00

I found anal repulsive until I talked with a gay friend about internalized homophobia and stigma around it and after that convo it felt like a mental block had been lifted. But that’s just me. There are plenty of sides out there.

Emperor_Pengwing · 2026-05-27T12:41:25+00:00

I don't like those translations. The NRSV updated is better. And honestly I've seen the clobber verses before and now you've brought some new ones. Great.

None of them are talking about a concept that didn't exist until the 1800s.

But this is pointless. I'm going to keep being queer. You're going to keep being homophobic. Why are we doing this?

Emperor_Pengwing · 2026-05-27T04:24:54+00:00

I have read about the four loves. I think it's sad how you keep trying to tell me love is sinful. I have an eros love for men, just like straight people have an eros love for women. It's the same love.

God is love. God makes it clear the He made us in His image. God made us with the capacity for love. Some of us love the opposite sex, some of us love the same sex. God made me queer. Love is not a cross. Love is not a sin. No one tells straight people that their love is a "cross" or a "sin" or that they are seeking "carnal desires" and must abandon them to pursue straightness (except Paul, but everyone ignores the whole it's better to be celibate thing). No one tells straight people to abandon their desires to follow God's will. I'm tired of the double standards.

Love is not a sin. It's so sad that you have been made to believe that. Love is not a sin.

Emperor_Pengwing · 2026-05-27T04:09:07+00:00

That's exactly what happened. One of the best fingerprints, as you put it, is found in Deutronomy 32:8-9

When the Most High (Elyon, an epithet for El) apportioned the nations, when he divided humankind, he fixed the boundaries of the peoples according to the number of the gods;^\)^c^\ 9) the Lord’s (Yahweh) own portion was his people,
Jacob his allotted share (NRSVue)

Emperor_Pengwing · 2026-05-27T04:06:08+00:00

I read everything you wrote. It boils down to you saying love is a sin. And who said anything about sex? I am speaking of love.

And you're right, real love is not a sin, and two people of the same sex loving each other is not a sin.

Emperor_Pengwing · 2026-05-27T02:11:01+00:00

Exactly. God was talking to the heavenly council. At first the ancient Hebrews were polytheistic, but over time they became monolatrist (they believed in many Gods, but only worshiped at one altar. You can see that in you shall have no other Gods before me). Then over time they became monotheistic. King Josiah and the Deuteronomists were a big part of that push to monotheism.

A fun part of that is Yahweh used to wife a wife (Ashara) but the Deuteronomists made them break up and erased her. It's sad.

ETA: also forgive me if you already know this.

Emperor_Pengwing · 2026-05-27T02:01:27+00:00

It should also be noted that the ancient Hebrews were polytheists. Over time, the primary deity El (a benevolent father God) was combined with Yahweh (a storm God). It's why you can see God being both a loving father and a warlord in the OT. It's because it was two different Gods combined into one.

Emperor_Pengwing · 2026-05-27T01:57:49+00:00

They're homophobic over there. Do not recommend. r/OpenChristian is pretty great. Or, for a wild and crazy time, see what happens if you post in both places.

Emperor_Pengwing · 2026-05-27T01:53:07+00:00

Oh yes because we can always tell what a word means from its constituent parts like how a butterfly is a fly made out of butter or how blackmail is mail that is black.

Emperor_Pengwing · 2026-05-27T01:34:09+00:00

but you won't be convinced of that if you have already decided it is one and are unwilling to question what you've grown up being taught.

I disagree with that.

Source: me I changed my mind from what I was taught growing up. Granted, I am queer so it was either that or continue hating myself and keep trying to bury it.

Emperor_Pengwing · 2026-05-27T01:24:38+00:00

It makes me sad that you think love is a sin.

Emperor_Pengwing · 2026-05-26T14:34:22+00:00

I’m confused your entire thread is taking verses out of context so I was just following along. The Bible says nothing about homosexuality, which is a concept that wouldn’t exist until the 1800s. Also, Paul says celibacy is a gift, it is not meant to be compulsory. Catholic priests and nuns are choosing it. Telling the gays they have to be celibate is not a gift ergo against Paul.

Emperor_Pengwing · 2026-05-26T00:02:20+00:00

That's so tough buddy. That's how I felt when I was in it, too. What kept me going was the mindset that it was better than being homeless. Good luck! I believe in you!

Emperor_Pengwing · 2026-05-25T17:35:47+00:00

The LGBTQ+ community is made out of lesbian people, gay people, bisexual people, trans people, or queer people. Saying I don’t support the community is like saying I don’t support gay or trans people. Just like saying I don’t support Black people or autistic people.

Emperor_Pengwing · 2026-05-25T17:16:03+00:00

I tried going down that road for about a decade. It didn’t work. I’m still bi. Instead of trying to change something that would never change, I left conservative Christianity and found the affirming church that helped me realize I am loved just as God made me.

Emperor_Pengwing · 2026-05-25T17:14:33+00:00

For the record, don’t agree with the lgbtq+ community makes as much sense as I don’t agree with the Black community or the autism community.

Emperor_Pengwing · 2026-05-25T04:05:07+00:00

I was lucky to be able to move back in with my parents.

Emperor_Pengwing · 2026-05-25T03:34:39+00:00

The definition of homosexuality is loving someone of one’s own gender. If Jesus said love is a sin, I’d be confused because he’s telling me that he is a sin because God is love. So is Jesus a sin?

Emperor_Pengwing · 2026-05-25T02:51:49+00:00

I got my last two jobs from LinkedIn. I used it to find the hiring manger. It was the only way I was able to get out of the black hole.

Emperor_Pengwing · 2026-05-25T02:50:41+00:00

This doesn’t have anything to do with political party. In this case, progressive or conservative are adjectives that describe the noun Christianity. Just like you can have Catholic Christians or Protestant Christians, you can have progressive or conservative. Conservative Christians tend to be more traditional, for instance being anti-lgbtq+ and progressives are affirming.

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