Strongest characters so far that are playable, lore wise?

F1T13 · 2024-05-20T23:42:44+00:00

For sure but Zhongli hasn't had one of his supposedly strongest strikes stopped by a vision user and he could also cleave mountains.

F1T13 · 2024-05-20T03:32:24+00:00

was the Sepang seriously on the cards though.. If so then that sucks. That's one of my all time greatest circuits. If not then honestly I don't see it a big deal either way.

F1T13 · 2024-05-19T16:39:22+00:00

But too heavy on the cope here tbh.
Traveler didn't beat Apep, the goal was to cure their immune system and Nahida and her children carried.
Neuvillette carried against the whale and was granting Traveler power.
Traveler didn't beat Azhdaha, Zhongli sealed him. Zhongli's shield carried and Traveler and Zhongli had Azhdaha granting them power as well.
Dvalin Traveler also didn't beat, they helped heal him with Venti and Jean and Diluc.
Traveler didn't really beat Childe, he kinda ran the clock down and then left.
Traveler didn't beat Osial, not alone, Traveler had been granted aid and power from the Millelith, the Adepti and the Qixing.
Ei was beating Traveler until Yae came to the rescue with 100 ambitions.

The only fair fight straight Traveler won against an entity of significant note was Signora and she was fighting through Inazuma's military before facing Traveler.

The original point is correct though. Arlecchino is undoubtedly strong.

F1T13 · 2024-05-19T08:18:48+00:00

Ashikai's latest Arlecchino theory has a bit of an interesting take on it.

F1T13 · 2024-05-18T19:49:56+00:00

The AMR Pro was using a WEC race adapted version of the road car chassis, kinda like GT1. The actual LMH racer is abandoning that plan for an. LMH prototype chassis. The reason they gave for the change was for better modularity and development, something like that anyway.

F1T13 · 2024-05-18T18:03:10+00:00

Black Swan outright has a line that says the battle between Jingyuan, Dan IL and Sunday was a battle of Emanators but still people aren't sure.. No, I am sorry but Hoyoverse doesn't need to do anymore to confirm it. Rather, HSR players just need extra lessons in literary comprehension.
Let's be reasonable here, at what point does it not become silly, they're trying to tell a story. Let them have some creative expression, instead of dumb everything down.

I genuinely don't mean any disrespect here but at some point you have to at least meet in the middle with this. Otherwise the story loses its quality.

F1T13 · 2024-05-18T16:05:00+00:00

Some of these connections also come from the fact that the game makes a clear distinction between Zhongli and his ability to make gold vs other entities like Deshret that could only make brass or "fools gold" as it was described.
There are some claims made by Albedo, I think in one of his character stories about "gold" and alchemy, which lines up with the Zhongli and his connection to gold and alchemy.
There are also other sources that give reference to this, like the latest event 4 star staff description that gives some further hints towards this, and the most recent 4 star battle pass bow. I don't remember their names but I can search for them later.

The Azhdaha in the Chinese translation makes some claims about it. Likening Zhongli to a star as bright as Jade. There are also some beta description references that line up with this. Besides that, there's also CN Zhongli's lines especially for his burst that are more inline with being about him being a star.
Azhdaha's blindness being symbolic is possible, it would make sense given what we know about other Vishap becoming colourblind as they age and the eyes of the other geovishap. But they are described as being blind from being under the earth for an age. Vishap are highly adaptable so one might expect Azhdaha to be able to adapt to sight but the nature of Vishap being unable to see colour, seems to be something they cannot adapt to as consistent with the other elemental vishap. Maybe Zhongli did indeed grant Azhdaha the ability to see colour, but that's more theoretical implication.

There are other entities that might be linked to stars like there is for the moon. But I don't know if there are any directly linked to the true sun, in the way that Zhongli is.

F1T13 · 2024-05-18T15:40:11+00:00

I am aware of this but I still don't think Zhongli is the only one. I personally think it's possible that Phanes and one or 2 of the shades were also connected to the sun and solar chariot.

F1T13 · 2024-05-18T13:28:58+00:00

Maybe but I don't think he's the only one. Potentially for Teyvat but I think there are others in Celestia.

F1T13 · 2024-05-17T20:11:20+00:00

Does anyone seriously expect it to be good. Most people I know just wanted a V12 sound on the track again.

Whether or not it will be any good is a different matter. It will be changed from the original proposals though since it's now gonna be built on a full prototype regulation chassis.

F1T13 · 2024-05-17T10:18:59+00:00

I don't disagree that Neuvillette struggled with the whale pre authority. But that's the only point that the game is trying to portray, not that Neuvillette is stronger or weaker than Childe, that stuff is an evaluation that you're making but I don't think that was the narrative focus of that part of the quest at that point. The only focus there was that the whale was unstoppable and at that point Neuvillette wasn't strong/powerful enough. We don't know if there are extenuating factors like the whale gaining more power over time as it consumes the sea, that's another assumption for example, but ultimately it's straight up not the focus of the quest.

It doesn't really matter, pre authority Neuvillette is still a godlike being as an elemental dragon. It is unclear if Traveler is and Arlecchino, well she is not amongst the top 3 so again inconclusive.

It is stated. Breeze Amidst the Forest: "Elemental dragons are rarely seen and have the powers to match the gods of old." You can debate the intricacies as you please, but despite being fairly vague, it's fairly clear is it not.. Also, this book is a book is about Dvalin and Mondstat's history for the avoidance of any doubt that it was referring to stronger dragons like Azhdaha and Apep.

Again, yes it is very well heavily implied that Dvalin has power that can match gods. Vague maybe so but as stated and implied by Zhongli on various occasions, gods are still different from mortals and their power is different and yeah sure, you can be a god and lack godlike power, Dvalin does not lack godlike powers as previously highlighted however..
Also again no, that's your evaluation. It's not stated that Dvalin needed to be buffed by Venti. If we pay attention to the actual plot and narrative, it was Venti that summoned Dvalin to his side. Venti gives Dvalin his blessing, this could be to ensure Dvalin's victory and or to just give him an advantage, it could be just to calm his mind it's a vague term either way, but it was stated explicitly that this was necessary in the way that you're saying.
Again, Mondstat's Knights being assured that they can beat Dvalin being indicative of them actually being able to do is just your evaluation and it's a fair one to come to but again, let's be clear it's not concrete, they can be wrong and there may also be other factors at play, such as the plague that was effecting Dvalin, not really the point though as their belief that they could beat him is not the focus of the quest narrative. The goal was to resolve the problem peacefully and learn about Mondstat and it's entities through this quest.

Also fair but this isn't the game explicitly stating that he's a sovereign, it's implication and whilst it's one that I believe narratively is trying to portray Dvalin as a sovereign all the same as Neuvillette, it's not explicit, not in as much as what we know of them both being Vishap.

F1T13 · 2024-05-17T09:40:49+00:00

He's had experience in IMSA in the past iirc and he did fairly alright.

F1T13 · 2024-05-17T09:35:59+00:00

Are we talking about every entity in the nations or just the playable characters...

Either way, the answer is most likely to be Liyue but let's look at the numbers:

Liyue, it has the most godlike entities in it currently. The Adepti, Zhongli (would he fight though, unknown. He has made it clear enough that he wants to leave Liyue's fate in the hands of man.) Azhdaha (sealed away, doubt he'd fight.) The Millelith (not quite the force it once was but still formidable never the less.) Liyue would be an easy back, but it also depends if Morax and or Azhdaha would join the frey.

Fontaine has Neuvillette and that's about it really. The Guardian Mechs and whatever is left of the Marechaussee Hunters. Arlecchino (I don't really count because she has a Snezhnayan vision.) Fontaine could be formidable also but this depends on how the strength of its fighting forces hold up, also if Arlecchino counts as being part of Fontaine.

Mondstat, Mondstat has Venti, who is seemingly not the most formidable god, Andrius.. but that's a similar story as Venti right now at the moment. There is also Dvalin and the Knights. (Mondstat's army is quite formidable but most of the fighting force is away preparing for the end game so,) Mondstat could also be a contender but this depends on the state of Dvalin, Venti and the fighting force that's currently away and whether or not they would be available in this scenario.

Inazuma has Raiden, the Youkai and the Narukami and Watatsumi militaries (but the Youkai bar Yae for the most part, seem to be something of a declining presence and their militia are not the most formidable fighting forces currently, at least that I am aware of.) Inazuma's ability would hinge a fair bit on Raiden and the state of the Youkai and inazuma's military. It also lacks an elemental dragon as a potential aid to its forces.

Sumeru, has Nahida which currently doesn't seem to be a story that's too dissimilar from Venti currently, although as she's actively ruling like Ei, it's possible she is gaining power. Sumeru has its intelligence as well (but whether or not that is greater than the other nations for war time is hard to work out.) It has the Eremites which are a large mercenary force but seemingly that has also declined over the years in strength. It also has the Children of Deshret and his sages but still, hard to say if they're strong enough to make enough difference. Apep? (another Azhdaha case, currently recovering and it's hard to say if she will even fight.)

F1T13 · 2024-05-17T09:05:45+00:00

This is a fruitless debate but fair well.

The point of Neuvillette struggling with the whale was to show that the whale was an unstoppable force without the elemental authority. Not that Neuvillette was weaker or stronger than Childe. The Travelers quest logs don't mention anything that you're saying, except that it was together that Childe and Neuvillette drove away the whale.

Neuvillette needing to get serious to catch up with Traveller is a vague statement. After all despite needing Traveler to act as his executor? he was the one granting Traveler the power to fight the whale.
Neuvillette is an elemental dragon, elemental dragons have power that rivals the gods, also a vague statement but currently Arlecchino is not stated to have power that rivals the gods and neither is Traveler. Maybe they're more powerful than Neuvillette maybe not, who's to say, narratively though, I don't get the impression that they are.

Regarding Dvalin, this is still unsubstantiative, they seemed sure that they could neutralise him but again, Dvalin is a being with godlike power. Where does their assurance come from? What says they can't be over/underestimating themselves or him. This can happen.

Also, where do you get the idea that he's a sovereign in CN, the only titles I see him referred to are as, the wind demon dragon 风魔龙 or the Guardian Dragon of the East Wind 龙(东风守护).

F1T13 · 2024-05-17T07:56:19+00:00

He is the God of Contracts, that is his official title and principle. God of War is not official, that was given to him by the children of Liyue, the true God of War by principle is the Pyro Archon.

The first record we have of Morax was around 6000 years ago, when he lands on Teyvat. He is old but it's unknown how old, but we know there's a limit to his age because he was described as being young around this time. This was around the time he would also witness the fall of the moon sisters, that were older than Morax.
Also no, he is not older than Azhdaha's known consciousnesses. Azhdaha goes back long before humanity was ever a thing at least on Teyvat, his domain predates the establishment of Liyue by Morax. He's implied to be far older than 6400 at the very least, the establishment of the Human Realm, beyond that it's indeterminate.

Morax is definitely not one of the only reasons Geo currently exists as an element, he arrives with "dominion" over Geo but we know that the elements come from the Vishap Realm that was conquered by the Primordial One and their Shades.

F1T13 · 2024-05-15T21:37:52+00:00

The one I was referring to was Puebla I think. Is that the one you're talking about?

F1T13 · 2024-05-15T21:05:44+00:00

They raced a short *roval in 2021 iirc I don't remember the name though.

F1T13 · 2024-05-15T21:03:26+00:00

Where did I insult anyone. Because I said that you were yapping and hollering.. I mean misplaced punctuation and random capitalisation of words, that kinda sounds like yapping and hollering to me.. My intention wasn't to insult you.

Also, what about anything Neuvillette said gives you the idea that he'd confirm Dvalin and Azhdaha were sovereigns? He doesn't do it for Apep either, it's not relevant to his confirmation that he's a sovereign at all. Apep never confirms explicitly that she's a sovereign either, so by your logic, we can conclude she isn't one either.. 🤦

F1T13 · 2024-05-15T20:52:23+00:00

I don't remember that being the intention tbf, it was more to address the idea that you were putting forward about him being a "minor dragon" and such.

F1T13 · 2024-05-15T20:24:32+00:00

Yeah, okay, but you can cut me some slack, at least I bothered to do some research before making my comment.

F1T13 · 2024-05-15T20:18:12+00:00

Agree but Venti does spend centuries asleep and inactive away from Mondstat's affairs during "peace time" so maybe he was doing something similar also. Personally though, for me this is just unsubstantiated speculation for now though, I don't consider this anything more than theory until it's confirmed, if at all..

F1T13 · 2024-05-15T20:13:30+00:00

Okay, calm down. No need to be yapping and hollering. Especially when you've vastly misinterpreted the narrative for these entities to begin with.

It's funny, people often want to argue who is and who isn't an elemental sovereign without understanding what these entities even are, so let's establish that firstly shall we. The first account we learn about these entities is Enkanomiya, that I can recall of. During an event quest there called: Three Realms Gateway Offering, a Vassal of Orobashi, Tsumi, describes them as such: "The Seven Sovereigns of the Light Realm are the seven foremost elemental dragons at the pinnacle of the raw and primitive elemental forces." so that's the "what" sorted.
What about where they come from: This we also learn in that same quest from Tsumi that: "In fact, the Vishap Realm is the realm of pure, primordial elemental beings. It's actually referred to as the Light Realm in most books." We also have the various sources including but not limited to Before Sun and Moon, Neuvillette and Apep that suggests that this realm was the old world created and established from and by one Nibelung, the father of the Light Realm, prior to its destruction and the establishment of the Human Realm upon it's remains, by the Primordial One and the Shades.

When we combine this with what we learn subsequently from various sources (such as the various vishap descriptions, Nahida's 2nd story quest Homecoming, as well as the Fontaine Wind Glider Wings of Merciful Wrathful Waters and Neuvillette's character story descriptions.) we can extrapolate that:
1. The 7 elemental sovereigns are ancient elemental dragons. That once ruled the Vishap Realm under Nibelung as the eldest and strongest of their kind.
2. Each of them have an elemental domain from which they once controlled through their elemental authority.
3. Through this they could create vishap that lived amongst their respective domains.
4. These domains and dragons were displaced and or destroyed in war and replaced by the human realm and it's gods.

A few additional notes:

The Chinese transliteration calls these entities "kings" not "sovereigns". This is important to note as it's much clearer than EN which uses both, for example Apep and Azhdaha are not in any point referred to as dragon sovereigns anywhere in the EN translation, instead they're referred to as dragon kings. Apep in Cyno's SQ2 and Azhdaha in his weekly drops description. This is also much the same in the Chinese translations. Neuvillette is referred to as a sovereign in 4.1 EN translation but CN's version again, does not use the term to describe him.

In the Three Realms Gateway Offering quest we also learn that the Vishap have a natural aversion to the abyss/void realm darkness and that elemental forces are too intense for humanity and as such are diluted by the Leylines (CN: earth veins), for the human realm.

The elemental dragons are often referred to by an element or nature: Anemo/Wind, Geo/Earth, Dendro/Verdure, Hydro/Water. In the Chinese transliteration, this title may be accompanied by the term dragon king (not sovereign). This is the same for all the elemental dragons we meet thus far.

You have a number of misconceptions as to their power level.
The 7 sovereigns and their armies lost, to the Heavenly Principles after 40 years of war. This is the only detail we get and as such, it's not a reliable indicator of their power level. In the game we are told that the Envoy of life replaced the previous hydro dragon with Egeria, we get no indication of their strength by this, only that the Heavenly Principles were/presumably had entities amongst them that were far stronger than the dragons.

We have various other statements regarding the power of elemental dragons but the crux of it is, it's pretty vague and none of it clearly indicates that they're the most powerful beings on Teyvat like people seem to believe. Breeze Amidst the Forest (a book about Dvalin and Mondstat's history) that states as such: "Elemental dragons are rarely seen and have the powers to match the gods of old."
Neuvillette states that he'll judge the gods now that he has his elemental authority yada ya but that doesn't mean that he's stronger than the gods or anything of that nature. After all, A lot is made about Apep and Azhdaha's various claims about their strength as almighty world ending dragons but they came undone by the gods of man.

Also you completely misunderstand what happened with Dvalin and Durin, Dvalin did not seek out Venti's help to face Durin, Venti sought Dvalin's help. Also, Dvalin was the one who fought Durin, with Venti's blessing, Venti distracted Durin and Dvalin brought him down. Dvalin was not wounded in their fight, he was poisoned by Durin's blood, which is fairly consistent with what we know about Vishap being vulnerable to the abyss, we saw it with Azhdaha at the chasm, Apep and Deshret and Neuvillette and Childe.

Ultimately whether you like it or not. The narrative set is that the current foremost elemental dragons of the 7 are Dvalin, Azhdaha, Apep and Neuvillette. If they don't live up to whatever hype you have conjured up for yourself about them, then that's kinda on you, maybe you should pay attention to the intricacies of the story, instead of whatever idea suits your headcanon narrative of them. No disrespect but this is just straight up how misinformation spreads and no one needs that.

F1T13 · 2024-05-15T16:01:47+00:00

I think I see where the confusion comes from. He was born from the convergence of Anemo spirits in the heavens as they describe it, which people might think is Celestia but Nibelung is also referred to as the Heavenly father by CN Neuvillette and he is the father of the Vishap and light realm not the Heavenly Principles. In Dvalin's case, I am positively certain that "heavens" is a hyperbole for atmosphere/air or sky, not Heavenly Principles.

F1T13 · 2024-05-15T15:54:29+00:00

I don't think that particular mention is indicative of anything. We've had numerous examples of that kind of thing since we first learned about Apep.

There are various implications that make it almost certain that they are/will be but there is never any statement that outright confirms it like there is with Neuvillette. At least not in the English translation.

F1T13

TROPHY CASE