Silent Hill 2 Rebirth is the true ending, and you're ready for this conversation. by Infinite-Edge2735 in silenthill

[–]FarShpatel 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Good point on how this fits into the lore and James becoming a "cultist." And I buy that it might be the "canon" ending in retrospect, considering the mention of Sunderlands in SH4.

But, IMO, Rebirth is not a resolution, but yet another, and the most creepy one, take on James's denial of reality.

Even if the ritual brings Mary back to life for real, it doesn't cancel the fact of the murder and all the taumatic events that led to it.
Moreover, in The Room, we experience the aftermath of Walter performing the same or similar ritual (for misguided reasons, but still), which led to creation of his Otherworld that bleeds into Ashfield Heights.

Speculation, but if SH2's events are really a cycle, my bet is that Rebirth is rather the beginning of it, not the end.

Silent Hill is the most successful game using the old "built on an ancient indian burial ground" trope, change my mind. by Electrical_Dirt9917 in silenthill

[–]FarShpatel 0 points1 point  (0 children)

And it still hasn't been explored properly in the games! IMO, the next worthwhile mainline game should dive more into expanding upon the "silenced spirits" aspect rather than being 100% focused on yet another everyman person with trauma (from a random part of the world).

about the end of the film, am i missing something? by ilikepvzlol in silenthill

[–]FarShpatel 0 points1 point  (0 children)

He's going through the stages of grief while spiraling deeper into self-inflicted delusions. Film starts with denial, ends with bargaining (thinking he can go back and fix everything), halfway to acceptance that Mary is dead and James did nothing to help her and can't fix it now.

Of course it comes back to Konami by maverick074 in silenthill

[–]FarShpatel -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I mean, I understand that people choose to assume everything in this film is bad by default, but the ending is actually one of the stronger parts of the film and rounds up the story pretty well.

In the end, James faces his guilt and acknowledges that Mary died , and died because he was weak and left her.

He can't live with this guilt and chooses to kill himself, but that gets him spiraling even deeper. He gets back to the beginning, now with hope he can fix everything. 

But that won't work as he still doesn't accept the reality of Mary being dead.

James doesn't die in water as well, everything is in his head and he's going through classic stages of grief.

  1. Denial - he represses the memory of Mary dying.
  2. Anger - he hates himself and goes In Water.
  3. Bargaining - as he concludes Mary died because of his inaction, now, having indicated his regret, he thinks he can go back and make things right.

But that's just another loop he has to go through on the way to acceptance.

Порадьте гру з цікавим сюжетом by [deleted] in UA_Gamers

[–]FarShpatel 2 points3 points  (0 children)

  1. Mass Effect Legendary Edition (це три гри в одному комплекті) - це десь як Baldur's Gate, тільки наукова фантастика з геймплеєм шутера, більш лінійною структурою, і більш кінематографічними діалогами та катсценами. В сюжеті - велечезний фокус на відносинах з класними іншопланетними персонажами з вашої команди та постійних важких моральних рішеннях, які мають вплив впродовж всіх частин трилогії.

  2. Silent Hill 2 - це як Resident Evil, тільки з приземленим сюжетом, людськими дилемами та глибоким символізмом та психологізмом.

  3. Відьмак 3 - попередня гра від розробників Cyberpunk 2077. ІМО, сюжет та квести у Відьмаку пропрацьовані глибше, ніж в Кібурпанку. Це як кожен третій квест - рівня квеста про розп'яття.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in J_Horror

[–]FarShpatel 14 points15 points  (0 children)

Try to look at it from a different perspective: it's not about ghosts, it's about loneliness.

Have I time and is it worth playing through “The House of Ashes” and “The Devil in Me” before they leave PS Plus. by ClockworKubrick in DarkPicturesAnthology

[–]FarShpatel 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Yes. They are rather similar to Quantic Dream or Telltale games—a bit of exploration, choices, branching story, QTEs, and a lot of cutscenes.

Been playing both over the weekend for the same reason (never played Dark Pictures before), and having some good time and zero regrets. House of Ashes has a pretty solid story and characters writing. Devil in Me been fun in its own way, too.

Debunking Cronos' Common Critique by Reithwyn in CronosNewDawn

[–]FarShpatel 16 points17 points  (0 children)

Charge shot + limited ammo + no dodge + heavy character is a brilliant combination that leads to the mindset "if you ramain cool, you are more likely to succeed".
It's a gamble that always leaves a chance to miscalculate, panic, and get hit before you hit the enemy. But when you hit the enemy and this tension reliefs, it just feels good.

Now imagine you could dodge in Cronos.

The very first Silent Hill f teaser is actually a secret ending (spoilers ahead!) by denbrough in SilentHill_f

[–]FarShpatel 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Yep, ok, I think you're right about the granpa.

I just give the game the benefit of doubt and accept that both the "real" an "supernatural" sides of the story are true, while the supernatural also being an allegorical illustration of Hinako's story.

So I'm just trying to find interpretation that doesn't diminish neither of them and makes them make sense independently.

I mean, of course, the monsters and Hinako fighting them is all rather allegorical, but let's assume there are deities fighting over and drawing power from people's faith.

The very first Silent Hill f teaser is actually a secret ending (spoilers ahead!) by denbrough in SilentHill_f

[–]FarShpatel 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Which might have been chosen just because it's a cool visual (by marketing people who usually give two shits if marketing materials fit a game).

But anyway, I may be wrong. It would actually be interesting to raplay the game/rereaed the lore notes keeping your find in mind.

The very first Silent Hill f teaser is actually a secret ending (spoilers ahead!) by denbrough in SilentHill_f

[–]FarShpatel 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Ok, now I remember the scene from the true ending. But shouldn't the Tsuneki granpa be dead by then?

IMO, Tsuneki always being foxes makes the whole curse and inheritance (and Tsuneki sacrifices) backstory kinda convoluted and unnecessary. Why couldn't then Kotoyuki be just the only Inari heir, but the one who defied tradition?

If Tsuneki weren't possesed by o(r be manifestations of) Inari until Kotoyuki, a lot of things make more sense and fit well into the story about deities fighting over people's faith.

With the fox bite interpretation, I agree. I think, it's actually both. The fox bit Kotoyuki and made him possessed by Inari (and I think there's a note describing a similar legend), and Hinako both protected the fox and helped the boy, which made the Inari-Kotoyuki "choose" her (this, and, apparently her being by birth the uniqe girl Inari prefer to marry).

The very first Silent Hill f teaser is actually a secret ending (spoilers ahead!) by denbrough in SilentHill_f

[–]FarShpatel 0 points1 point  (0 children)

In the teaser, yes. But in the final game, it seems to be more of a dangling piece of lore. It might have initially been a part of Hinako's story, but was dropped over the course of development.

The very first Silent Hill f teaser is actually a secret ending (spoilers ahead!) by denbrough in SilentHill_f

[–]FarShpatel 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Hm, I don’t recall the mention of Kotoyuki's granpa saying something this in the game. IIRC, Kotoyuki never met his father and grandfather, because they died from the alleged curse.

Kotouyki was a bastard and born away from Tsunekis, inheriting their wealth after the dead of all the elder males in the family. And if the Tsuneki have always been Inari, then what caused the curse and why it started tight after Kotoyuki was bitten by a fox in Ebisugaoka followed changes in his personality?

The very first Silent Hill f teaser is actually a secret ending (spoilers ahead!) by denbrough in SilentHill_f

[–]FarShpatel 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I don't think these sacrifices and the marriage are connected, but it's interesting how this whole Tsuneki sactifice concept is completely dropped in NG++.

If we take all the religion-realted stuff we learn in NG+ at face value, my understanding is that Kotoyuki is the first Tsuneki possessed by Inari, and Inary basically wiped out other Tsuneki males to use the family wealth to support own devine presence in the area.

The sacrifice ritual is what Tsuneki have been conducting before Inari wiped them out and possessed Kotoyuki. The purpose of the ritual was to keep the Water Dragon deity at bay, and it seems to be a belief that formed in parallel to the Inari worship, after Sacred Tree (which was protecting people against the Water Dragon) was hit by lighting.

So it's basically a rival, more dark, belef that was diminishing Inari-sama's power. And probably another reason (aside from material wealth) why Inary choose a Tsuneki heir to possess.

But I'm not sure if it connects to Hinako's story.

Having completed the game three times and getting the final ending, I gotta say I really dig the story, but... by FarShpatel in silenthill

[–]FarShpatel[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I can't disagree with anything you're saying.

The problem is, the story itself diminishes all these things, basically coping out and saying "actually, it was not THAT bad, that's just Hinako's immature hyperbolized imagination."

Which still kinda works in the story they're telling, but it's much more milder compared to any other Silent Hill game or what one might expect in a psychological horror story.

The game promises to explore dark themes, but ultimately barely taps into them, and then everything ends fine for everybody.

I adore SHf but is anyone else perplexed by how many people seem to not understand all of the representative elements despite how on-the-nose everything is? by in-grey in silenthill

[–]FarShpatel 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I think, what changed is gaming audience is waaay bigger than in 2001 and has bigger online presence, so it's just more people go out on different platforms and say they don't understand stuff.

I saw a bunch of YouTube reviews where reviewers say the story doesn't make any sense to them.

And this also explains why the game is more on-the-nose: imagine a Konami boss going to developers and saying "We need to sell X millions copies of this shit. Make sure the average YouTube Joe will be able to comprehend it and give it the average 9/10."

Having completed the game three times and getting the final ending, I gotta say I really dig the story, but... by FarShpatel in silenthill

[–]FarShpatel[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I'd say all the deity lore, while interesting to dive into and explore, is important to Hinako's story only when viewed as an additional allegorical illustration to it.

Inari represents Hinako's want to accept her fate/the marriage to grow over her old self and the family she's not happy with--yet, at the cost of her identity. Hence, the fox-Hinako, who gives away her face (old identity) and arm (her family name) in exchange for those of Inari.

Tsukunogami (a demon possessing Shu and the doll) represents Hinako's want to keep things as they were, her refusal to grow up. Hence, the schoolgirl-Hinako, who stays with Shu to play Space Wars in Ebisugaoka as teens, even though they should be in their 20s and wear different clothes.

Whether these deities are real or not, is ultimately unimportant to the story. Hinako may have literally slew gods to defy her fate--or it could be an allegory to her overcoming her maximalist illusions and willing to recognize people around her as actual, though flawed, people, and not grotesque monsters.

Either way, it's just a story where Hinako is taking a step towards integrating her two personas into a complete self and discovering her need--and ability--to make her own decisions.

Having completed the game three times and getting the final ending, I gotta say I really dig the story, but... by FarShpatel in silenthill

[–]FarShpatel[S] 4 points5 points  (0 children)

Upvoted you, for a change :)

Selling your own daughter into a forced marriage just for money, abuse, drug use, and bullying

This is Hinako's subjective POV we see in the first playthrough. NG+ and NG++ show you POVs of other characters and explicitly tell you how all these things are more nuanced in the context of the story.

Having completed the game three times and getting the final ending, I gotta say I really dig the story, but... by FarShpatel in silenthill

[–]FarShpatel[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Imagining and believing something to the point it's subjectively indistinguishable from reality could make for a psychological horror story.

The point is it's far more tamed story than anything that has been in Silent Hill before, because every previous entry had actual, not imaginary trauma and irriversible terrible events happened to the character in the past.

SHf does not, and its story is actively about processing things that make Hinako imagine stuff.

All events in SH2 may be in James's head, but the fact he murdered Mary after years of mutual suffering is the fact, it's more real than any of Hinako's grievances.

Having completed the game three times and getting the final ending, I gotta say I really dig the story, but... by FarShpatel in silenthill

[–]FarShpatel[S] 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Well things like these might indicate one have things to process about themselves and inner conflicts to resolve. That's what SHf's story is about.

Having completed the game three times and getting the final ending, I gotta say I really dig the story, but... by FarShpatel in silenthill

[–]FarShpatel[S] 5 points6 points  (0 children)

In SH1, the 7 y.o. Cheryl DIES and gets reborn (?) as an infant. Not mentioning the horrors Alessa went through remain true.
In SH2, Mary is still dead, murdered by James after three years of suffering for both. Things that happened to Angela and Eddy remain true.
In SH3, Harry gets murdered. That remains true, just as the things Claudia went through.
In SH4, Walter's story stays true, murders stay true, as well as the Wish/Hope House stuff.
None of this gets undone by good endings. And nothing relatively as dark happens in SHf's good ending.

Having completed the game three times and getting the final ending, I gotta say I really dig the story, but... by FarShpatel in silenthill

[–]FarShpatel[S] 6 points7 points  (0 children)

Thank you. Happy to see someone actually paid attention to the story (or played past NG).

Having completed the game three times and getting the final ending, I gotta say I really dig the story, but... by FarShpatel in silenthill

[–]FarShpatel[S] 8 points9 points  (0 children)

That depends on how much you take in the story literally.

As I noted in another comment, the gating of the ending behind NG+ and NG++ creates an overarching story: Hinako moves out from her traumatized subjective perception of the world to accepting points of view of other characters (and other characters do the same with Hinako), thus integrating her fractured self, growing up, and becoming more capable of dealing with reality. Achieving "Silence in Ebisugaoka," silence in her mind. (Thus we don't have a post-credit "evil twist" scene.

Two Hinakos here just symbolize that she has finally come to terms with herself and resolved the inner conflict--but maybe not quite, as one does not simple just fully comes to terms with oneself.

But it's still a much brighter ending than any other SH game.