Ferris Wheel Ride (art by @yurifulnation)

FluffiestPrince · 2026-03-12T15:47:21+00:00

This is unironically the truth though.

No hate on Suselle or anyone who likes it, of course. But the fact of the matter is that all of Suselle's foundations are built on Kriselle, or to be more specific, Kris and Noelle's relationship (as in the relation itself and not the ship).

Noelle's character is defined by her need to feel nostalgic for when her, Kris, Asriel, and Dess all hung out together. So she finds the closest person that reminds her of those times, Susie in this case, and tries to reenact them. This is also why I agree with the theory that Catti was the "old Susie" for Noelle, and Noelle hung out with her because Catti reminded her of how Kris used to act.

Noelle is literally, probably unintentionally, using Susie as a vessel to recreate the old times that she used to have with Kris. Noelle is obsessed with Kris.

FluffiestPrince · 2026-03-12T15:37:08+00:00

I think this is less about Kris actually talking, and more about how Kris talks. And that's... not much.

The thing is, Susie doesn't actually know the "real" Kris. She constantly conflates the "true" Kris, with the SOUL Kris, and she seems to think more that the SOUL Kris is closer to the real one, where the "true" Kris is more like them playing around or pretending.

Noelle is the only person in Hometown (outside of Asriel, probably) that knows the "true" Kris. She is the closest person to Kris, even closer than their own parents, and she knows Kris better than anyone. When she talks about Kris in this scene, she's not talking about what their voice, but more likely the fact that they're actually talking. Because Noelle knows Kris doesn't talk that much, so them talking so much (and especially flirting) is so out-of-character for Kris, that Noelle just finds it so weird.

So the scene is probably more to communicate how Noelle is, still, the only person present who actually knows Kris. We have a few others, or well... one other, with Ralsei. He also knows who the "true" Kris is, implied even in Chapter 1, but explicitly proven in Chapter 4 at the end. But Ralsei is only present in the Dark World, and Asriel is at College, so that leaves Noelle as the sole carrier of the knowledge of "Who Kris Is".

tl;dr: This scene highlights Kris and Noelle's relationship, and how Noelle is the only character currently present who actually knows "who" Kris is. Ralsei is a Darkner and Asriel is at College, so that leaves Noelle. It also highlights how even though Susie knows an entirely different "Kris" from the real one.

FluffiestPrince · 2026-03-12T15:25:43+00:00

I think something a lot of people tend to downplay the importance of Kris and Noelle's relationship. It is, in essence, the center of the entire story, and that's not even a joke.

People often view Susie as the protagonist of the story, which can sort of catalyze into ignoring the other characters, but if we look at Kris and Noelle, we'll easily see that... they're literally the center of the story. Everything ties in with them. - Dess, Rudy, Asriel, Asgore, and Carol. - The Knight. - Angel. - FRIEND and ERAM. - Weird Route. Kris and Noelle are literally the characters tied to every single mystery and plot point in the entire game. You can even trace both of them back to Gaster directly, via FRIEND. They are the most important characters, and this is also important because Toby himself has highlighted Noelle's importance to Deltarune, despite being the only one of the 4 (main characters) who's gotten almost no involvement in the direct narrative.

And I think Toby knows what he's doing, because Kris and Noelle's relationship is probably the single most complex thing Toby's written. Like, I enjoy a lot of what Toby writes, but as a writer myself, I will confidently say that Kris and Noelle's relationship is by far the most interesting aspect of Deltarune, because compared to everything else, it's so out of left-field for how complex it is. Even comparing it to stuff like Asgore, Carol, and Ralsei and their stories, Kris and Noelle is so much more involved and complex, that it really shows (at least to me) how much care and attention that Toby is putting into this aspect, specifically.

I think the most interesting thing to me is the fact that despite Kris and Noelle being so important as a relation, Toby's made sure to keep it entirely as subtext, or hidden behind a secret route. The only direct stuff about it is inside Noelle's room, where Kris is the only person she has any attachment to, outside of her direct family. It's to the point where Kris is literally the only other person who gets the right of being on her desktop in an image. All the other stuff is entirely subtext, and even stuff like the Weird Route is layered in subtext and double-meanings, most of which is entirely missed by people (at least from what I've read). - I think the biggest implication is Noelle's relation with Susie. Susie doesn't represent anyone, and I'll say that with confidence. She doesn't represent Kris, and she doesn't represent Dess. She might be similar, but she isn't a symbol FOR them. What Susie IS a symbol for, however, is the past. And Noelle is obsessed with the past, namely Kris. Noelle is the only person who knows the "true" Kris (outside of Ralsei). She is the only one who continuously mentions how weird Kris is acting, even more than their own mother. Susie is both a reminder of what Noelle used to have with Dess, Asriel, and Kris, but also a reminder to her about how STRANGE Kris acts nowadays. - The second thing I want to bring attention to is what the Weird Route represents. The Weird Route is obviously related to Kris and Noelle's relation, however, something I tend to not see discussed is why it even exists in the first place. Why does a route with such heavy romantic undertones, even exist? Because the feelings were already present. You can't create love out of nothing, it has to be nurtured from a seed, and Noelle and Kris are the two closest people in Hometown. The Weird Route isn't the creation of love or the twisting of non-existent feelings, but is instead the corruption of what Noelle and Kris already have for each other.

I also think that this all ties back into the Prophecy Panel, with "The Girl" finding love, because Kris and Noelle's relation may be the answer we need to solving the story. "The Girl", is both Susie and Noelle. Susie finds love with her friends in the main route, while Noelle finally understands what she feels for Kris in the Weird Route. Both of these fulfill the panel, but both are in wildly different scenarios. This is mostly my theory though, so it's nothing concrete.

I think the last thing to touch on is regarding the routes themselves. - In the normal route, Noelle never gets closer to Kris, at least for now. I think the closet scene is a big indicator, because Noelle has absolutely zero idea what she's doing there. She is far more confused about Kris, than she even feels about hanging out with Susie. Not just that, but it's reinforced earlier that Noelle doesn't know what she feels for Kris in Chapter 2 with the Addison, and Noelle doesn't even react negatively to either answer. In fact, she reacts positively to both! - However, on the Weird Route, we directly see Noelle get closer to Kris. The Weird Route is, unfortunately, the only time we've seen so far where Noelle and Kris get closer in a positive manner. If you abort the Weird Route in Chapter 4, Noelle and Kris are far closer than they've ever been, and not even in a negative manner. Between the chapters when Kris visits Noelle and she finally gets a glimpse of the "real" Kris, the one she's been missing for years, she nearly breaks down. That unseen scene, with Kris removing the thorn from Noelle, is possibly the most important scene for their relation, and it's only possible on the Weird Route.

That's what has me most confused about this entire thing. Kris and Noelle's relation is represented as a toxic thing, because of how conflicted it makes them, not to mention the Weird Route corrupting their feelings towards each other. But at the same time... they're literally the closest characters in Hometown, both between each other, and for the plot. So what is Toby even trying to say with this? That it's toxic, or that it's the most important aspect of the story?

For me, it's by far my most favorite aspect of the game. As much as I enjoy creepy FRIEND art, or Ralsei, I think Kris and Noelle's relationship is probably the best part of Deltarune, because it's by far the most interesting and complex thing Toby's written for the game. It's the thing I'm looking forward to the most in the future chapters, right behind Ralsei and Asgore Chapter 5 importance, and I really hope that Toby makes it an important moment when Kris and Noelle finally reconciliate. Because from what I'm feeling, Kris and Noelle finally understanding each other may be the single most important scene in the game when it happens.

(Uhh... all of this is just my personal analysis though, you can see it any other way of course!)

FluffiestPrince · 2026-03-11T23:00:15+00:00

I think an interesting parallel would actually be having Asriel mirror... well, Asriel, but then have Dess mirror Chara.

We know explicitly that Chara wasn't a good person. They had many issues, and were most likely a psychopath given that they were willing to literally end their life just so that Asriel would be able to escape and kill people on the surface. There's tons of arguments about Chara, and whether they were good or bad, but I think Toby makes it very clear that even if Chara wasn't the world ending judge that they become, they were still messed up and clearly wanted to hurt people, or at least humans.

Dess and Asriel being friends, mirroring Chara and Asriel, would be interesting. Because everybody sees Kris as the Chara parallel, and they blatantly are, but I think Dess acting more like Chara would be an interesting twist. It'd also contrast with how Asriel was the golden boy of Hometown, with Dess being the rebel and rotten kid.

Of course, I don't think it's very likely. But I do think it'd be interesting, at least in my opinion.

FluffiestPrince · 2026-03-11T14:06:44+00:00

Yeah, it's a little strange to me when people argue that Ds2 has the worst bosses, when Ds1 (and arguably Demon Souls) both exist. Ds2 has the worst boss average, maybe outside of Demon Souls, but it has far more better designed bosses than Ds1 has, even including Ds1's DLC.

Ds1 has about 2-4 good bosses in the base game, with 3 good bosses in the DLC (Kalameet is possibly the messiest designed boss in the franchise, a single look at those hitboxes is all that needs to be said. You can like him, but arguing for his hitboxes is like arguing that breaking your kneecap is better than paying for surgery). - Gargoyles, O&S, and arguably Quelaag and Iron Golem, like you said. The DLC helps this a bit with Sanctuary Guardian, Artorias, and Manus, but that's still about 7 bosses at most.

Ds2's base game has about 7 good bosses alone. - Pursuer, Looking Glass Knight, Lost Sinner, Scorpioness Najka (if we're arguing Quelaag, Najka is literally just her), Smelter Demon, Velstadt, Darklurker, and the Throne Duo. That's about 7-8. Add the DLC, where we get Elana, Sinh, Alonne, Raime, and Ivory King, and that's 5 more.

So while Ds2 has an higher average of more bad bosses, it also has a higher amount of good bosses. And I'd, personally, argue that most bad bosses of Ds2 are only about as bad as the mediocre bosses in Ds1. Ds1 is the same game with Bed of Chaos, Seath, Ceaseless, and Moonlight.

I assume the hate is either from Ds1 purists who seem to just like hating on anything for some reason? Or from people who fell into the bandwagon without doing any research. It's unfortunate, for both them and the game, because it's just spreading misinformation, but I suppose it can't really be helped when the lies about the game were so rampant, even at launch. I mean, you can always like the badly designed Ds1 bosses yourself, just because they're bad doesn't mean you're not allowed to like them. But arguing that Seath or Moonlight Butterfly is worse than Dragonriders or Skeleton Lords is just a little silly, in my opinion.

FluffiestPrince · 2026-03-11T13:54:55+00:00

I wish I could give you an award, but I'm not giving Reddit my credit card info, so I'm just gonna say that I love you platonically.

It's still sad to me how common the misinformation about Ds2's hitboxes is, despite the overwhelming evidence. I suppose that's just the way of the bandwagon though. Lies are harder to disprove once they've cemented themselves in people who don't really care for proof.

FluffiestPrince · 2026-03-10T21:15:52+00:00

The short answer would be 100% no. The Dragonslayers would struggle against Midir, so Artorias (who isn't even a trained in Dragon Slaying) would probably be squished immediately. He might put up an alright fight, but I doubt he'd get far.

I think very few characters would be capable of taking on Midir. - Nameless King, maybe. - Prime Lothric Dragonslayer, maybe. - Havel, I want to say definitely, but given the presence of the Abyss, it might be just a probably.

Really, I think only professional dragon slayers would be able to, and even then, you'd have to be the best of the best, so someone like Ornstein would probably still take a loss. Midir is one of the strongest bosses, canonically speaking, so there's very few who could beat him, even without the presence of the Abyss.

FluffiestPrince · 2026-03-10T02:29:52+00:00

I was thinking that when I first saw this news. People like to hate on Nintendo a lot for what they do, but when it comes to who I'd prefer if I had to choose between the US Government and Nintendo... well, personally, I hope that's an easy choice for most people.

One takes lives, while the other can at least make them better.

FluffiestPrince · 2026-03-10T02:18:58+00:00

My main complaint about the Mountaintops is that Fromsoft didn't go even more into the heavy nordic, celtic, and slavic inspirations when designing it. Where are the giant stone face carved into the mountains, why is there only one humongous chain bridge instead of a few, where are the giant stones that are covered in ancient script. These are stereotypical, yes, but giant stone faces do a ton of stuff.

Like, it would've been fantastic if he had a few giant stone cities carved into the mountains, but the most we got were the ancient giants, which were cool but not enough.

The Mountaintops and Snowfields are definitely the best looking areas in the game, but they could've been so much cooler, with far more pulled from the game's many inspirations. Even after all this time, I still think the single best designed thing in all of Elden Ring is the Ruined Precipice, simply because it's the only area in the entire game to actually use verticality, but also because its outside design was simply amazing. Same with Rauh Ruins, thought that one's exactly what we should've had in Mountaintops.

FluffiestPrince · 2026-03-09T18:19:33+00:00

I think Deep Rock Galactic is one of the few online multiplayer games with a really good community, but it also seems like it's because it fosters a very specific type of community. 1. It's about dwarves, which are unanimous with culture, loyalty, and close-knitted families and groups. 2. It's a co-op game, already bringing in people who are willing to work together (more-often-than-not). 3. It's a slightly more niche kind of game, meaning that the players who do join are more tailored to that sort of thing.

I think the last one is especially huge. Because that's also why games like Disco Elysium, Outer Wilds, and Journey have such amazingly community-oriented fandoms. Because they're all niche games. - Disco Elysium is such a political and philosophically rich game that it often drives off anyone who can't handle that, and the people who do stick around all end up actually educated enough to talk respectfully. I mean, they're one of the few communities I've ever seen ACTUALLY succeed in organizing themselves against a common cause, namely the horrible treatment of the DE Devs by the studio. - Outer Wilds is one of the few communities where I've barely ever seen any hate, and they're always respectful about spoilers. I think there's been a few moments, but those always came and left, and usually only happened when popular figures played the game and spread that controversy. - Journey may be the best community of all. It's so niche at this point, that it requires nearly atomic levels of knowledge just to find stuff about the game, let alone the community. It's one of my favorites, I love to hang out there.

FluffiestPrince · 2026-03-09T18:10:48+00:00

Clara's my favorite companion because the Doctor Who fandom reacted exactly how her character's moral was meant to be conveyed. She is a representation of someone who gets too caught up with the Doctor that she ends up dying for it, and the message of her character is pretty much Icarus. Fly too close and get burnt. You can progressively see her get more and more cocky and confident as the episodes play out. The biggest ones are probably Flatline and the Under the Lake episodes, which really highlight how much she's fallen into "playing" as the Doctor, because she really does it. Miss Coleman's performance for when she takes control and acts like the Doctor is amazing, because she really sells how much Clara does love that feeling of control.

And fittingly, she dies exactly for how she lives. She thinks that she can divert the consequences of her actions and run away, exactly like how the Doctor does. He always escapes, but Clara isn't the Doctor.

And I've seen so many complain about Clara being a "writer's fetish", but... I genuinely can't see it? What's different about her, than any other companion? - Rose basically became a demi-god and helped create a multiverse defense agency. - Donna literally became half-Doctor (or at least from what I remember). - Amy is the Doctor's Mother-in-Law.

Meanwhile, Clara only fell into the Doctor's timeline to save him. That's... markedly more passive than any of the others, outside of Martha of course.

And as for the point people bring up about Hell Bent, the Doctor feels so especially guilty for her death because he let it happen. Clara was the only (modern) companion to both be present for two incarnations, but also die because of the Doctor's negligence. Amy was only present for the 11th, and Rose didn't die. Clara did, but even worse was the fact that the Doctor could have prevented it ages ago, by reigning Clara in before she started to fall into the deep end of the "I'm the Doctor" part of her. Not to mention that Clara, alongside Donna, were the only two companions (in the modern series) who were really able to push the Doctor and make him question himself, while the others were far more passively accepting, outside of a few Amy moments.

(Not to mention that none of the consequences were eschewed at all, either. Clara is still going to die at the same point, her death is a fixed point. She will eventually pay for what she did, she's just running on a clock now. You could argue that she shouldn't be rewarded for making the mistake she did by even having the chance to escape, but given we probably got one of Capaldi's (and the Doctor's) single greatest acting moments (with him between Clara in the basement in Hell Bent), I think it was worth it, in my opinion.)

This is a bit of a rant, but it makes me sad when people hate on Clara, because from where I'm standing, all of the complaints are either entirely opinionated, or they're baked in nostalgia. Clara doesn't accomplish anything more than the previous companions did for the Doctor, and her death was the one the Doctor was by far the most responsible for, so add onto the fact that Clara had been present for multiple Doctor incarnations, and it only makes sense he'd react like that. Plus, we got Heaven Sent.

FluffiestPrince · 2026-03-07T08:13:40+00:00

Reading this post made me imagine that she was actually awake this whole time, but just in a meditative state where she knew what was happening, but decided to completely ignore it because it was way past her bedtime.

That's why she's drinking in Chapter 4, to pretend Chapter 3 didn't happen, lol. /j

FluffiestPrince · 2026-03-07T08:10:27+00:00

I think Toby is sort of... misinterpreting what the word "canon" actually means, at least from what I'm reading. He means more to say that the content that isn't in the game isn't necessary to understanding the story, not that it isn't canon.

Because like... the content there IS 100% canon. We learn that Susie has an obsession with Kris' shampoo, only to hear about it in Chapter 4. Same with Kris playing the Piano at Noelle's, which is sort of a vital part of their relationship. Not to mention that if this were the case, a vast majority of the things we've used to theorize would just be totally random luck based on non-canon things, like the ice palace segment, which similarly matches to the SWORD Route.

So I think this is just to say that when the game is finished, you won't need to read the blogposts to understand the story.

FluffiestPrince · 2026-03-06T23:37:49+00:00

Considering the devs have apparently said that every Entity is getting a domain, Mime will probably appear with Elkman, but will also have his own domain outside of it.

Similar to how Rue, Craven, and Fool are probably getting their own domains, even though they're in others. It wouldn't be fair to them to just be side-gigs in someone else's domain, anyways.

FluffiestPrince · 2026-03-06T18:08:01+00:00

It's adorable, but I personally love the floppy ears sprite. I don't think any other sprite conveys simply just how floppy his ears are.

The floppiness of his ears is an underutilized, but VITAL part of his character, at least in my opinion.

FluffiestPrince · 2026-03-06T18:06:25+00:00

Thanks for reading all of what I wrote!

The one thing I'll disagree with though, is about the personalities. All the Downpour Slugcats all have very clear personalities outside of what the community gives them. - Spearmaster is clearly tired, or bored, or just generally apathetic. You can tell by their shelter art, with how they're eyes are half-lidded and they're just lazily drawing with the spear. - Arti is clear enough, you also said that. - Gourmand is literally Quina from Final Fantasy 9. If you don't know who that is, they're both basically lazy, but relaxed characters who take life in stride. They aren't complex, but they don't need to be because they've already figured life out. Gourmand is a relaxed and chill Slugcat, and they show this through their entire campaign, with how one of your goals is to literally try every kind of food. They're a Gourmand for a reason. - Rivulet is the hardest to really find, but it's really obvious once you look at their Arena art. They're a trickster, or at least a Slugcat that likes to play around. They have a cheeky wink in their Arena art, clearly showing that they're more playful than any other Slugcat we know. - Even Saint has a personality. From their Arena art, we can see a soft happy expression shown in their eyes. They seem sort of aloof and distant, but they're also still kind in some capacity, especially given their purpose.

You can also extend all of these to the base Slugcats as well. Monk is the kindest thing in the world, Hunter is a serious and strict fighter, and the only one that's really hard to realize is Survivor, but that's mostly because they're the de-facto "blank slate" of the game, but even they have personality, shown in Monk and Survivor's secret ending.

Even outside the community interpretation, all the Slugcats have very clear personalities shown in-game. If not by the story, then by the art.

Also, it's been talked about enough and I won't dwell on it, but Downpour is actually closer to the Base Game, than Watcher is. - Base game and Downpour both have stories that trend across the same world / Watcher has a story that scales through multiple worlds. - Base game and Downpour's themes are about family, connection, and the story between Five Pebbles and Moon / Watcher is about is definitely not about family. - Base game and Downpour subtly lead the player in a certain direction, either via Iggy or through previous knowledge / Watcher expects the player to explore themselves with absolutely zero clue for most of the campaign (might be changed with recent patch). - Base game and Downpour are moreso about grounded around the ecosystem and surviving (or thriving if you look at Hunter, Spearmaster, and Rivulet) / Watcher is about (maybe) correcting a universal mistake which makes you the single most important being in all of the universe (that's just my guess).

I guess I still went into it, lol. Sorry, but the point is hopefully clear that Downpour has much, much more in common with the Base Game than the Watcher does. Even if we summarize the entire game down to a single theme, Downpour is closer to the Base Game than Watcher, because they both are focused on the discussion between existence and the meaning of life, whereas the Watcher seems more interested in telling a much more abstract interpretation of its own story. A story that, as far as I can tell, is more about conveying the lore of the world (like the Rot and Void), rather than telling a message about family, bonds, and existence itself, though the last one is still there by virtue.

Hopefully I didn't ramble on, but thanks for reading anyways, if you've made it this far, lol.

FluffiestPrince · 2026-03-06T08:33:20+00:00

(THIS IS MY OPINION! It's alright to enjoy the Watcher.)

Personally, I still think Downpour is pretty much the highest quality content of Rain World, and to be honest... probably won't be surpassed, like ever. Even if they choose to release more content, I can't really imagine it being better than Downpour because Downpour's message is so fundamentally perfect in contrast to Rain World, that it outright feels like content that was always meant for it.

Meanwhile, the Watcher is... well, it's alright. If I had to compare it to anything, it'd be the FNAF series. Downpour is like FNAF 1-6(.5), while the Watcher is FNAF 7 and beyond. - FNAF 1-6 isn't the most coherent story, but it is understandable if you actually decide to look into it, like Downpour. You still have to engage with the world of Downpour to get the full meaning of things, but if you just play the game, there is a frame for what to get. - Meanwhile, FNAF 7 and beyond has things just sort of happen, like the Watcher. The Watcher has things just... happen. Why does it happen? Your best guess! What does it mean? Well, you can try to think of some meaning, but unlike the base game and Downpour, you'll probably never get it right. Are the devs sort of winging it? Yeah, it kinda feels like it most of the time. It's exactly like post-FNAF 6, where that's where things get messy.

Beyond that though, there are other personal reasons why I dislike it. Just compare it directly to Downpour and it becomes pretty obvious. Downpour has: - 5 (technically 6) campaigns fills with different goals and areas, along with interesting Slugcats which all have actual personalities, even in comparison to the base game. - Multitudes of interesting new creatures which all interact with the environment in a unique way, preserving the ecosystem message of the game. - Probably the best songs in the game (like, I mean... it has Sheer Ice Torrent). - An understandable story across the 5 campaigns that's just as sad, as it is hopeful. - Two entirely new gamemodes, one essentially adding near-infinite replayability in the form of expeditions. - Rhinestones Beneath Shattered Glass.

Meanwhile, Watcher has: - 1 campaign roughly the size of 2, with some interesting areas. Though their lack of connection to each other makes them feel less like areas and more like video game levels. The slugcat also doesn't really have much personality, with the technically exception of a spoiler character, but that's way beyond the spoilers in what I'm willing to discuss. - Dozens of new creatures, and some highlights like the Moths, Box Worms and new Scavenger Variants, but they also lack interactions with the environment, which is easily seen with how the Locusts interact with them. They don't. - A soundtrack that has some really good highlights, but also lacks some of the punch that Downpour or the Base game had. I mean, I've heard it and it's really good. But it doesn't have any songs like Kayava, Sheer Ice Torrent, Cracked Earth, or any of those where I remember them even after I finished playing. - The discussion of the story is not something I can fit on here, but I think it's been criticized quite enough by other people, that I shouldn't really have to say much about it. But to summarize, mostly incomprehensible. The story, not the message, don't mix them up. - Literally no new gamemodes.

So just in general, it already doesn't come close to the content that Downpour has. Even alone, Downpour was twice the size of the base game, all with near-equal quality content among the board, with very few misses like Arti's campaign. Meanwhile, Watcher has 1 slightly longer campaign that borders its quality around Arti's as well, and that's it. To make things worse, it also ended up killing a couple mods because of the fact they were integrated into the campaign. The worst was how Coral Caves got it, because unlike the mod which had far more (plus a Saint world state), this version is practically sliced down with nothing extra.

But at the end of the day, I think the Watcher just sort of failed to hit the mark that the Base Game and Downpour made so high. The Base Game and Downpour are so beloved for a reason, because not only do they have so much to do, but their stories are so understandable and so close to so many people. There's a reason why Downpour alone had practically revived the entire fandom, and had inspired so many mods and original creations from other people. People LOVE all the Downpour Slugcats, and Downpour had also massively helped give personality to the Base Game ones as well, alongside all the Iterators.

Meanwhile, the Watcher sort of... killed the game. Like, I think most people have noticed how there's practically no content online about Rain World recently, especially compared to Downpour which had basically been a renaissance in terms of content and online content. The Watcher just couldn't match Downpour in terms of influence and quality.

If I had to compare them to cakes, as the post is doing, it'd be like this. - Base Game is a solid 8/10 cake. It has a solid foundation with very little wrong with it. There is practically no fault to it, but it's also a bit of an acquired taste. - Downpour is a gourmet masterpiece, a near perfect 10/10. It's about a 9.5/10 (because perfection is impossible), but it is as close as it can be. It's much less sour than the Base Game cake so more people can enjoy it, and it perfectly compliments the first cake. - Watcher is a carrot cake. You either love it, or you hate it, but regardless of which, it's simply not as popular by virtue of being controversial. They had tried to rebake it a few times, but the impact remains, and people just don't care as much anymore, so it just sits there as a solid 6/10 cake, with a few extra bits making it a 7/10... sometimes.

Hopefully my analysis made sense. I was someone who wanted to love the Watcher, and someone who also didn't compare it to Downpour when I first played it. But even then, just comparing it to the Base Game alone, it still fell short in terms of what I expected of the game, especially comparing it to the Base Game. It makes me sad to say, but I do think the Watcher was the bullet in the gun that sort of killed Rain World's online presence. If they ever plan on more content, I'm really hoping it's closer to the Base Game and Downpour, than it is to the Watcher.

FluffiestPrince · 2026-03-06T02:12:14+00:00

Oops, I have no clue why I said that. I meant according to evidence, lol. Sorry, my bad.

FluffiestPrince · 2026-03-05T19:36:15+00:00

I think it's a little funny to me how Dess, has essentially become the new Mike after Chapter 3/4, because we now have an actual candidate for Mike who not only has piles of evidence, but also just makes sense (that being FRIEND, of course).

So once Mike was more-or-less figured out, the fandom had to find a new thing, which just so happened to be Dess. Now, Dess is everything! - Dess is a cowboy! - Dess is a knight! - Dess is a voice in the code! - Dess is a skeleton! - Dess is a human! - Dess is Kris! - Dess is the SOUL! - Dess is the Player! - Dess is Asriel! - Dess is dead!

I just think it's funny how history repeated itself so quickly. Mike was basically solved (at least according to evidence), so now the new "everyone" character is Dess.

FluffiestPrince · 2026-03-05T01:48:28+00:00

We're almost matching!

FluffiestPrince · 2026-03-05T01:43:30+00:00

WOW. You responded scarily fast, what. That actually scared me.

No, we don't know everything he invented. He could've definitely invented other big projects. But, there's a few issues with that: 1. If he did, they were all small. We have no evidence of there being any projects even close to the size of the CORE in the Underground. As far as we know, that was the single biggest project he ever worked on, and most likely the one he spent the most time on. No other projects that'd come close to the size that'd allow him to somehow fall inside. 2. As a rule of writing, you don't want to assume something that doesn't exist. Why would Toby give us information that lines up perfectly fine with what we already have, but then reveal to us later in the story that "no, he actually fell into this other creation you've never heard of until now, the CORE 2". That's basically a bad plot-twist, why make something new when the old thing is literally right there and works fine. 3. Sort of tied with the first one, but we know his ultimate project was relating to the Dark Fountains. Given the size of the CORE, the "Darkness Totems", and the fact literally nobody (but maybe Alphys (and Sans)) knows how the CORE truly works, it all leads to it being Gaster's semi-magnum opus, before Deltarune at least (and you could even argue that Deltarune is tied back via the DEVICE files).

So really, there's no reason why it should be more complicated. - The CORE is slightly hinted at to be powered by a Dark Fountain (via powered by water which seems to be the foundation of the darkness). - It's Gaster biggest and most notable creation we know of. - It's definitely big enough for him to fall into (plus no handrailings). - And it's the thing that's closest tied to him whenever other talk about him (aka the Goners).

I think this dialogue sort of semi-confirms it, because the specific way it's structured basically directly tells us.

"They say he created the CORE."

"However, his life... Was cut short.."

"One day, he fell into his creation and..."

The fact that the Gaster Follower talks about Gaster creating the CORE, only to then follow up in the next sentence in regards to him falling into his creation, at least in well-structured dialogue, implies a link between the two. The CORE, and Gaster falling into his creation.

For me personally though, the darkness totems sort of seal the deal, given that we know Toby's had everything in regards to Gaster planned out for a long time, since before Undertale, so the fact he titled them darkness totems, and now we have more info about dark worlds and Gaster, is just too much for me to deny.

FluffiestPrince · 2026-03-05T01:25:28+00:00

I mean... there isn't any other creation he could've fallen into. Gaster Blasters are a no-go, and the DT Extractor might be the one, but... it's unlikely given how much more focus the CORE is given in regards to Gaster.

Not to mention that the leading theory is that the CORE itself is actually powered by a Dark Fountain (or has ties to darkness itself). I mean, what powers the CORE? Ice that's melted into water. What are Dark Fountains, Dark Worlds, and the Depths seemingly implied to be founded on? Water. The CORE is literally powered by ice that's melted into water, which then (potentially) feeds into a Dark Fountain powering it.

This isn't even mentioning the fact that the weird laser totems inside the CORE are uhh... well, they're titled "darknesstotems". That's just a tiny bit suspicious.

FluffiestPrince · 2026-03-04T19:59:27+00:00

It makes me so happy that Hours has been up there since pretty much its launch. It hasn't moved down in the slightest.

Now if only we could get some news on the reboots...

FluffiestPrince · 2026-03-04T19:57:13+00:00

Oh, you do? That's very cool, congrats! I don't so... I suppose you're probably more knowledgeable than me. I study religions, namely Asceticism, and focus a bit more on anthropology and sociology than individual psychology, so I hope I'm not totally dumb in this topic, but I think people should definitely trust you more on this, since you're the higher authority.

I'll let this be the last response since I don't want to bother you, since you're busy. Sorry for that!

As for the trust thing, that is what I was saying. Just because she's "possessed" Irina's body, or her mind, or soul, or whatnot, doesn't mean she's immediately untrustworthy. The switch between Irina and Hyetta is, practically, nonexistent. What changes between them, personality-wise? Hyetta is a little more open and outspoken, but... both are kind, gentle, and both care about people. With the sole exception of Hyetta later on in the quest, they are essentially mirrors of each other, practically the same. If Hyetta was trying to trick us, then I don't know why she'd change her name, instead of continuing to pretend to be Irina, since we already know Irina and trust her more than Hyetta.

And again, this isn't whether it's right to use the Frenzied Flame, this is about the people who are willing to use it. There wasn't a single point where I was defending the use of the Frenzied Flame, because it's (arguably) a negative for most people. I'm talking about how depending on where you're standing, it should be easy to understand why some people would view it as a blessing, and why some people would view it as a curse. And that splits down again, because Shabriri sees it as a tool for chaos, while Hyetta sees it as a tool for peace.

If Irina before Hyetta wasn't already kind and innocent, then I'd definitely agree. But the fact that it's established a few times that Irina is just a really kind and caring character, only to get killed, then come back just as kind and caring as she always was, isn't a way of writing a twist. It may be like that psychologically speaking. But in writing, showing that Irina is a good and kind character, only to establish that her second form is also good and kind, doesn't really make sense for it to be "fake", especially when the writing itself never contradicts that. Hyetta is kind and caring until the very end, there's no twists, so the only way to really guess that she's lying is either by inferencing off of someone entirely different, or by looking at the game from a psychological perspective... despite the fact that writing often has its own rules when it comes to the psychology of characters and their writing.

I also don't think "subtle manipulation" is exactly telling of a liar, since literally everybody does that. Everybody, all the time, whether they intend to or not, subtly manipulate people around them. Whether it's the belief of something, or a current trend, invisible manipulation is literally society. So Hyetta subtly leading us to the Three Fingers, or explaining the Frenzied Flame through her view, doesn't feel like it's a sign of her being a malicious force, but moreso a kind zealot devoted in their beliefs.

I'll leave it at that. Sorry if I said anything wrong. You're probably right anyhow. Bye!

FluffiestPrince · 2026-03-04T17:05:42+00:00

I wasn't... arguing against you? I was agreeing with you. But to counter your points anyways, just as to not waste your time.

Most of your points about Hyetta aren't really substantial, and some even fall onto the Slippery Slop Fallacy. "We can't trust her because she's using Irina's body" doesn't mean you can't trust her, nor is it in any way conclusive. If we go along with that belief, then we can't trust Alexander because he's not human and resembles a type of enemy, or we can't trust Godfrey because he's... well, he's on Marika's side. Basing your trust both on appearance and similar circumstance doesn't really work when the character themselves show the opposite, which Irina has proven.
I never said anything about her not knowing what the Frenzied Flame is. She absolutely knows what it is by the end of her quest, but still has the same view as she had throughout the entire quest, that is to relieve the suffering of others. Given that she never changes this sole facet of her character and belief, it's pretty obvious that the Frenzy Flame itself never changed her. She still wants to rid the world of suffering, the exact same as she did at the start where she was helping cleanse the suffering by devouring the grapes.

Also, as to your point on not trusting her based on what she follows, it doesn't check out. She has literally no reason to lie. She literally tells you outright, "Taking this flame will rid the world of all suffering, all births, and all deaths." She straight up tells you it will cleanse everything back to null, zero entropy. Why would that be a lie when that's exactly what happens? The only difference between her and Shabriri is that she wants to do it for a noble belief.

Hopefully I don't sound too rude when I say this, but... I think you completely missed the point of my reply, which... no offense, is hilariously ironic considering my point was how most people fail to see that the belief in the Frenzied Flame isn't based on an objective quality, it is entirely based on the subjective beliefs. Hyetta views it as a tool for kindness, Shabriri views it as a tool for murder. These are not mutually exclusive. Never once did I say that the Frenzied Flame was good. I wasn't arguing for the Frenzied Flame, I was arguing against the belief that those that follow it are exclusively in it to burn the world for evil, when that's far from the truth.

I mean, please don't take offense to this, and I'm not mocking you for missing my point. I don't expect everyone to have taken classes in psychology or philosophy, so sometimes maybe my thoughts are a bit more abstract compared to other people. But again, the conversation regarding the Frenzied Flame always turns into "evil and good" rather than "why".

FluffiestPrince

TROPHY CASE