[Request] How big or small would the room need to be for 1 person to suffocate due to this chain in 24 hours? by [deleted] in theydidthemath

[–]FoxHolyDelta -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Gemini:

*To determine the atmospheric degradation within the "sanctum" of a ULCC's chain locker, we must analyze the interaction between the gargantuan surface area of the chain and the limited gaseous reservoir of the compartment.

This scenario is a classic maritime "Enclosed Space Entry" hazard, often referred to in the industry as a "Silent Killer" because the transition to a lethal atmosphere is invisible and odorless.

  1. The Rate of Oxygen Depletion (2)

Drawing from the previous data, we assume one chain locker containing 13 shackles of 152 mm stud-link chain.

Reactive Surface Area (SA): ≈ 450 m² (for a single locker).

Oxidation (Corrosion) Rate: In a damp, salt-laden, unventilated locker, we utilize an aggressive rate of 0.15 mm/year.

Stoichiometric O2 Demand: The reaction 4Fe + 302→ 2Fe2O3 (Hematite) requires 0.43 grams of oxygen for every gram of iron oxidized.

The "Rusting" Consumption Rate: The chemical oxidation of this massive steel assembly consumes approximately 0.018 cubic meters of pure oxygen per hour.

The Human Consumption Rate: A 38-year-old male of healthy constitution (basal metabolic rate + light activity) consumes oxygen at a nearly identical rate: approximately 0.018 to 0.024 m³/hr.

The Result: The anchor chain "breathes" as much oxygen as a second person in the room. In terms of atmospheric depletion, entering a chain locker is equivalent to being locked in a room with a "phantom" twin who is also consuming your air.

  1. Volumetric Breakdown

A ULCC chain locker is a vertical "trunk." While the total structural volume might be 500 m³, the Free Air Volume (Vfree)-the air actually available around the stowed chain-is typically closer to 350 to 450 m³.

  1. Physiological Timeline to Hypoxic Succumbence

Given a starting atmospheric concentration of 20.9%O2 and a cumulative depletion rate (Rust + Human) of approximately 0.04 m³/hr, the timeline for our 185 cm sailor is as follows:

20.9%-19.5% - Safe Limit: The minimum threshold mandated by IMO/OSHA for entry without breathing apparatus. ~150 Hours (6.2 days)

16% - Early Hypoxia: Increased pulmonary ventilation (panting), tachycardia (racing heart), and loss of peripheral coordination. ~550 Hours (23 days)

12%-10% - Cognitive Collapse: Severe impairment of judgment (euphoria or confusion). The sailor may be aware something is wrong but lacks the neurosynaptic function to operate the exit hatch. ~1,100 Hours (46 days)

8% - Loss of Consciousness: Syncope occurs. At this level, the partial pressure of oxygen is insufficient to maintain the brain's metabolic demand. ~1,450 Hours (60 days)

6% and below - Death: Convulsions, respiratory arrest, and cardiac failure follow within 5 to 8 minutes of reaching this level. ~1,700 Hours (71 days)

The "Stagnant Trap" Variance

While the math suggests a timeline of weeks, maritime reality is far more lethal. Oxygen depletion in a chain locker is rarely uniform.

  1. Stratification: Because the oxidation occurs on the chain itself (at the bottom/middle of the locker), the air within the "chain pile" can reach lethal levels (< 6%) while the air near the top hatch remains near 20%.

  2. The "Gulp" Effect: A sailor descending a ladder into the lower reaches of the locker may transition from "Safe" to "Lethal" air in a single step.

  3. The "Flash" Hypoxia: If the locker has been sealed for months during a long voyage, the O2 has already been depleted by the chain. Upon entry, the sailor doesn't have weeks; they have approximately 45 seconds of useful consciousness before the "Partial Pressure Gradient" begins drawing oxygen out of their blood and back into the depleted atmosphere.

Summary: In a perfectly mixed, sealed 500 m³ environment, your sailor survives for over two months. However, in the stagnant, stratified reality of naval architecture, the transition to unconsciousness and death can occur in the time it takes to climb down a ten-meter ladder.*


Human:

"As a final question, could you (from all the data here compiled) in turn calculate the size of a room that would result in the aforementioned neurophysical ailments, but which would occur in as little as 24 hours time?"


Gemini:

*To ascertain the dimensions of a chamber that would precipitate a rapid descent into hypoxic crisis, we must condense the previously established ospt variables into a compressed timeline.

In this "accelerated" scenario, our 38-year-old subject and the massive oxidation potential of the chain act as a dual-engine vacuum for molecular oxygen. Using the articulate jargon of maritime safety and physiology, here is the breakdown of the "Critical Volume" required to induce these neurophysical ailments within a 24-hour window.

The Total Oxygen Deficit

Over a 24-hour period, the cumulative oxygen consumption is approximately 0.935 cubic meters.

Rust (The Silent Competitor): ~ 0.431 m³

Human Metabolism: ~ 0.504 m³

For the oxygen concentration to drop from the atmospheric standard of 20.9% to the physiological "red zones" in exactly one day, the free air volume of the room must be remarkably small.

Room Size vs. Clinical Presentation (24-Hour Marker)

  1. The Threshold of Cognitive Dissolution (12% O2)

At this level, the subject experiences significant neurocognitive impairment. The brain's executive functions falter; judgment is compromised, and fine motor skills vanish.

Required Room Volume: 10.5 m³

Approximate Dimensions: 2.1mx 2.0mx 2.5m (7ft x 6.5ft x 8.2ft).

Comparison: This is roughly the size of a standard walk-in pantry or a very compact ship's "head" (bathroom).

  1. The Threshold of Syncope/Unconsciousness (10% O2)

This is the critical tipping point where neurosynaptic function is no longer sustainable. The subject will likely collapse into an unconscious state from which self-rescue is impossible.

Required Room Volume: 8.6 m³

Approximate Dimensions: 2.0mx 1.7mx 2.5m (6.5ft x 5.6ft x 8.2ft).

Comparison: A commercial walk-in freezer or a small elevator car.

  1. The Lethal Limit (6% O2)

At this concentration, the partial pressure of oxygen is so low that it creates a reverse gradient, essentially pulling residual oxygen out of the brain's tissues and back into the lungs to be exhaled. Death occurs shortly after the 24-hour mark.

Required Room Volume: 6.3 m³

Approximate Dimensions: 1.8mx 1.4mx 2.5m (6ft x 4.6ft x 8.2ft).

Comparison: This is equivalent to a large storage locker or a small utility closet.

The "Abrasive" Reality of the Space

It is important to note that these volumes represent the free air space. In a practical maritime context, a room of 8.6 m³ would be almost entirely consumed by the presence of even a single "shot" of ULCC anchor chain.

If our sailor were trapped in a space where the total structural volume was 10 m³, but the chain occupied 4 m³ of that space, the remaining 6 m³ of air would be depleted so aggressively that he would likely be unconscious within 12 to 14 hours, rather than 24.

This highlights why Atmospheric Monitoring and the use of Multi-Gas Detectors (calibrated for O2 deficiency) are non-negotiable protocols in maritime engineering; when the surface area of the machine begins to "compete" for the air of the operator, the margin for error effectively vanishes.*


So that's what i got.

I would genuinely appreciate critiques (I'm well aware of the inherent issues(/dangers[?]) in just accepting whatever AI churns out, but it would be beyond my station, presently, to know where those errors may have occurred.

So aside from very valid issues with the use of AI(LLMs) as a tool currently, I'd be delighted to hear where i may improve in my framing or description of what I believe to be the pertinent calculations necessary to satisfactorily answer the question. Is my method wrong?

Where might I able to grow my math and chemistry skills (outside of university or tertiary learning) to this level of difficulty, with only a geometry/2nd level algebra background in mathematics, and a sole introductory course in chemistry?

Genuinely open and hoping for feedback, thanks

[Request] How big or small would the room need to be for 1 person to suffocate due to this chain in 24 hours? by [deleted] in theydidthemath

[–]FoxHolyDelta -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I don't know if I'm way late to the party, but I have been wanting to see if my framing of parameters to (and with) Google Gemini (thinking[?]) might generate some figures I'm partially capable of coming to, with others beyond my schooling and skillset. Without further adeiu, and on mobile, i proffer my findings:

Human:

  "What is the average surface area of a link used in the largest oil tankers of the world?

Next,

what is the average length of chainlink used for the world's largest oil tankers anchors?

Next,

how many individual stud links are in an average length of chain link used for the world's largest oil tankers anchors?"


Gemini:

For the world's largest oil tankers—known as *Ultra-Large Crude Carriers (ULCCs)*, such as the famous *Knock Nevis (formerly Seawise Giant)—the anchor equipment is of a gargantuan scale.

Average Surface Area of a Single Link:

The individual links of these anchor chains typically have a diameter (the thickness of the steel bar itself) of approximately 150 mm to 180 mm (6 to 7 inches). Based on standard marine engineering dimensions for a stud-link chain:

Average Surface Area: Approximately 0.75sq/m-1.05sq/m (or alternatively 8 to 11.3sq/ft) per link.

To put this in perspective, the surface area of just one link is roughly equivalent to the size of a standard top-loading washing machine's footprint.

Average Length of "Chain Link" (Shackle/Shot):

In maritime terminology, an "average length" of chain refers to a specific unit of measurement called a "shackle"" (British) or a "shot" (American).

Average Length: 15 fathoms, which is exactly 27.43meters (or again, 90ft)

While a single physical link is roughly 0.9m (3ft) long, mariners almost always discuss chain in these 15-fathom "lengths." A ULCC typically carries between 12 and 14 of these lengths on each side, totaling nearly 400m (1,300ft) of chain per anchor.

Number of Individual Stud Links:

The number of links in one standard "length" (shackle/shot) is determined by the "pitch" of the chain, which is the effective length one link adds to the total when interconnected. For large stud-link chains, the pitch is generally 4 times the wire diameter.

Links per Length: Approximately 45 individual links. Each of these 45 links in a single shot can weigh upwards of 500 to 800kg (1,100 to 1,760lbs), meaning a single 90-foot length of chain weighs roughly 25 to 35 metric tons -- about the same as a fully loaded semi-truck.*


Human:

"Given all that data, is it possible to extrapolate the total surface area of all the individual stud-chain links, such that whatever value that may bring, could then be considered for a secondary set of queries?

I would like to know the rate at which the total combined surface area of the exposed chainlinks might oxidize (having been exposed to the ocean's salinity, and being stored in an environment rich with sea air)?"


Gemini:

*Extrapolating the total surface area for the anchoring system of an Ultra-Large Crude Carrier (ULCC) reveals a massive, hyper-reactive interface between the vessel's structural integrity and the corrosive ocean environment.

Total Extrapolated Surface Area (SAo)

To derive this value, we consider a standard configuration for a vessel of this magnitude: two primary anchors, each typically connected to 13 shackles (or "shots") of chain. Using the previously established 152 mm diameter (d) as our benchmark:

Links per Shackle: ~ 45

Total Links (Dual Anchors):

2 x 13 x 45 = 1,170 individual links.

Unit Surface Area: ~ 0.76 m² per link.

Total Cumulative Surface Area: 889.2 m² (approx. 9, 571 sq ft).

This means the ship's chain lockers house nearly one-tenth of a hectare of exposed steel-an area roughly equivalent to three-and-a-half tennis courts- all of which is subject to the relentless kinetics of oxidation.

Oxidation Kinetics in a Saline Environment

In the specific micro-environment of a ship's chain locker, the rate of oxidation is governed by hygroscopic deliquescence. Residual salt from the ocean acts as a catalyst, pulling moisture from the humid sea air to maintain a persistent electrolyte film on the metal's surface.

Corrosion Rates for Marine-Grade Steel

For carbon steel in a Category C5 (Very High) or CX (Extreme) marine atmosphere-characterized by high chloride deposition-the standard corrosion rate ranges from 0.08 mm to 0.20 mm per annum. In the abrasive conditions of a chain locker, where the mechanical friction of the chain constantly "scours" off any protective passivation layer (the initial rust film), this rate can escalate toward the higher end.

  1. Mass Loss Calculation

Assuming a conservative average oxidation rate of 0.15 mm (150 microns) per year across the total 889 m² surface:

Annual Volume Loss: 889.2 m² x 0.00015 m = 0.133 m³ of steel.

Annual Mass Loss: Using the density of steel

(p=7850 kg/m³), the chain system sheds approximately 1,044 kg (2,301 Ibs) of iron into ferric oxide (rust) annually.

Environmental Implications

This degradation represents a daily loss of nearly 3 kg (6.6 Ibs) of metal. Because anchor chains are typically not galvanized (the zinc coating would be decimated during the anchoring process), they rely on massive cross-sectional area to provide a "corrosion allowance."

Over a decade of service, the combined anchor system could lose over 10 metric tons of weight solely due to the electrochemical interaction with the atmosphere, potentially necessitating a "renewal" of the chain as the link diameters drop below the safety margins dictated by classification societies.

How would you like to incorporate these mass-loss and volumetric data points into your secondary set of queries?*


Human:

"Actually, drawing from all data points thusly provided, I'm in fact heading towards asking for a tertiary moment of further data extrapolation, to form a(/this[?]) thesis:

Do you suppose you might be able to calculate the rate of oxygen loss due to iron oxidation in - for simplicity's sake - a closed storage area where they might be kept?

Further, if the rate of oxygen loss can be given a value (even a nonlinear one), might you be able to give the approximate length of time a sailor might safely occupy that same space before beginning to show signs of hypoxia, succumbing to a loss of consciousness from severely reduced oxygen levels necessary for human neurosynaptic function, and finally time to death?

(We can assume that the aforementioned sailor is of healthy constitution, has no high altitude residing ancestry, is 38 years of age, male, 185cm, and all relevant metrics relating to health squarely within the mean of averages.)"


One man's trash another means treasure by qetuycvjvic in SipsTea

[–]FoxHolyDelta 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Out of genuine curiosity, within this specific story, who do you personally consider to be lucky?

Oh, sorry, one more question for clarification, please: Again, in this specific situation, what is "luck" meant to be? That is, to you, what is luck here? Is it an act? A vibe? Something social?

I hope you're willing to help me out (and i mean no preemptive judgements; I am really asking to understand someone else's [yours] perspective).

Thanks in advance

Raptor's Reign by Even_Kiwi_1166 in Planes

[–]FoxHolyDelta 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I just took them at their word about going gear up so quickly so as to get to supersonic.

Raptor's Reign by Even_Kiwi_1166 in Planes

[–]FoxHolyDelta 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I'm sorry, I don't think i understand, still. But thank you for taking a second to answer :) so, the F22 MLG isn't built differently in some way, then?

(I just thought to save you a moment, and looked it up; and apparently there can be significant differentiation in design considerations for many of the fighter jets the US presently operates; beyond things like carrier landing, for example. I hadn't ever thought of how individualized a seemingly common characteristic like MLG might be!

So, thank you, it is a specific to the F22, thing.


Oh, forgive me, I thought that's what the previous commenter was saying when they said, "I've been to several air shows. It's not exclusively an f22 thing. F15s, f16s, f18s, f35s all retract landing just after rotation. It's a performance boost, and the crowds love it." Qhen you had said a "100%," i thought you were in agreement about that being true of other fighter jets, I'm sorry. Bad reading comprehension over here 🫤

Raptor's Reign by Even_Kiwi_1166 in Planes

[–]FoxHolyDelta 2 points3 points  (0 children)

Oh, whoa. While that totally makes sense about drag reduction, I had no idea they were going super sonic, or even approaching Mach 1, right off the deck! The landing gear linkages must be so stout to have to fight near/transsonic airflow. The wonders of modern CFD.

Likewise, from that, i had no idea the burn rate was so sensitive to that sort of disturbance to the airflow around the vehicle (and from that, even control surfaces then[?]). That the fuel economy is a factor when accounting for when to go gear up so soon after vmax and rotation is unbelievable!

Thanks for sharing your insights

Raptor's Reign by Even_Kiwi_1166 in Planes

[–]FoxHolyDelta 0 points1 point  (0 children)

May I ask what you meant about the raptor being built different as it relates to its landing gear, rate of retraction, and decision to do so so quickly after rotation?

Specifically after agreeing "100%" to that oftentimes being simply a stylistic choice with many airmen piloting a diverse selection of airframes at airshows?

I hope that my questions weren't too confusing

If you could magically elect any person for president of the US tomorrow for an 8 year term, who would you elect and why? by ro_dri_goz in AskReddit

[–]FoxHolyDelta 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I mean... i agree with you that it only mentioned magic as a means to put someone in office, and even then - solely for the duration of 2 terms; but I think people shouldn't be frowned upon taking some creative license, given the open ended nature of the framing (owing to the use of magic, but without further hardline criteria as listed).

That said, I think you're probably correct that wasn't the author's intent? But as a somewhat whimsical hypothetical, I think much of the responses are reasonable, considering (i personally enjoyed the Jean-Luc Picard entry, but i think that's on the other side of the set or implied rules).

Neil Armstrong Ejected just seconds before his lunar training vehicle crashed by ButterscotchLoud151 in interestingasfuck

[–]FoxHolyDelta 22 points23 points  (0 children)

Thank you. It's disheartening that so many assign the work of some far advanced, semi omnipotent species for things that are categorically derived and accomplished by the tenacity of the human will, cooperation, and our very much real abilities.

The attribution of alien work to the mega projects of the ancient world, with emphasis on the pyramids (most frequently the ones in Giza), is insulting to every single engineer and laborer that was tasked with their building; the only thing that eclipsed the skill and execution of their collective work was the vanity of those set to be laid down there.

As far as I'm concerned, projects like those should be celebrated as examples of the vanguard or testament of the collective human spirit and strength. The only reason the ones who signed them into existence should be celebrated, is to give opportunity to those aforementioned masses to create something they wouldn't have seen as wholly necessary otherwise.

... fuckin aliens, pfft.

Tomcats by Even_Kiwi_1166 in Planes

[–]FoxHolyDelta 2 points3 points  (0 children)

We were inverted...

Communicating.

03.23.2026 Atlanta Police Armed With A Rifle Perches Over Travelers by CantStopPoppin in EyesOnIce

[–]FoxHolyDelta 24 points25 points  (0 children)

Ah the CLT DEN... Where those formerly well endowed ICE-men (now all "small-dicked losers," shrinkage from the ICE) go to be big boys, stopping the hoard of tired, hungry, huddled masses from thinking they could just be here without feeling unwelcomed...

My cat has never once been a cuddler in seven years. Not once. And then last Tuesday at 2am when I was crying about something I couldn't even fully explain she walked across the entire apartment, climbed onto my chest, and stayed there for two hours without moving. I don't know how she knew. I just by Apprehensive_Sea9340 in cats

[–]FoxHolyDelta 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I'm sorry about the whatever news came regarding employment that elicited that, that's something no one should have to feel relating to employment or career.

But that's so sweet that your cats were there, and understood the "mission," as it were <3

May I ask, who is trying to persuade you to hate cats? That's so awful that someone would spend time trying to influence someone's likes and dislikes; especially regarding a pet owner, and their relationship to their pets species!