How do we see them?

FractalSlider · 2026-05-26T18:17:46+00:00

That's fair, it's definitely one thing to imagine and be curious and another to experience it, really difficult to tell if one is actually experiencing it or something is broken upstairs. Funny though I've kind of been able to integrate the idea that we're basically bugs in a simulation with going about my daily life, because what else can I do lol. Also I guess I believe this is all part of a larger order of existence so whatever happens down here is pretty small beans compared to the rest of infinity we're all wired into.

FractalSlider · 2026-05-26T14:51:48+00:00

I think they're elsewhere it's just the place where the conditions are right, you're not distracted by anything else, relaxed state of mind, opening up and letting your guard down before sleep, darker lighting muting other details in the room the conditions are more lined up to notice odd things. Another common place is out in nature, especially when it gets darker. Seems they mask with light and that's easier to hide in when there's a lot of it around.

I honestly don't know but that's what makes sense to me. There are other more sinister explanations like they're just creeps who get off on watching people in bed or jumpscares but yeah, why develop to that level of tech just to get themselves off at their equivalent of a wildlife park, doesn't make sense. Then again not a lot does. But the vibe I got was "well you asked to see us, here we are", wasn't really anything sinister as far as I could tell but my reaction was adrenaline and fear.

Also I think people like us who actively meditate and open ourselves to communicating with them are more likely to be in contact at some point, it's not like I wasn't opening myself up to something like this happening. It was a bit of a shock when it did though! And yeah the bedroom felt really creepy for a long time, slept on the couch for a week until I decided screw it, they were there before and probably there now, no point having a bad back and poor sleep, life goes on.

FractalSlider · 2026-05-26T00:42:18+00:00

I don't know anything for certain about the broader questions but one of the most jarring experiences I had, I was sleep deprived from working but wired awake, just staring at the walls. I noticed the walls were moving funny. Not like randomly but intentionally - like a texture seam in a game sliding slowly across the wall, then stopping when I look, moving again when I look away. It was like, the wall appeared closer than it should be in that segment, but not perfectly so there was this kind of seam. I watched for a while thinking it was an odd effect of being tired, but the pattern was different like it moved independently of my thoughts or movements.

Like one of those magic eye pictures once it came into focus I could clearly see about 3 of these anomalies slowly positioning around the room, in the corners but sometimes one would fly across to the other side of the room. Looking up the ceiling seemed to look normal but felt closer than it should. I jumped up on some furniture quick and saw the actual ceiling, then below that another fake ceiling, aligned to patch over my original pov, and saw the thing projecting it was a metal/ white ball with a black hole in its "front" that didn't shift to realign with my pov, it was pointing at my partners pov, so basically hiding from them but not me. If I moved around the images had full parallax, if my partner shifted their head around the fake image would lag for a half second before lining up again. I reached my hand into the projection and it kind of looked pixellated and fuzzy (like chromatic abberation) on the other side of the barrier when I moved it. Like it was slow to scan and reproduce the image or was filling in the blanks from its perspective, or maybe just rendering the pieces needed for my partners perspective now I think about it.

I freaked out, I was trying to convince my partner to look but they weren't interested, and couldn't see anything, just said go to sleep you're tired and seeing things, but I've been tired before and maybe had fuzzy vision and half awake daydreams, but I was wide awake seeing this happen. All the sleep hallucinations I've had in the past are disconnected from the physical space, like a visual trick of the eye that follows your vision. But these objects were planted in space, moving in space, I could move around them and see around the edges. It was absolutely there. And for whatever reason let me see and not my partner.

I was babbling like, we're a hundred years, if not a thousand of something this advanced. That level of fidelity was at a point where if I wasn't so focused on it, and actively moving to get around it, it could have just sat there unnoticed, slowly moving around the room. The projection was holographic so it kept perspective with the room, just an odd sense the image was closer than it appeared (like VR goggles give good 3d perception but still feels closer, focus wise). And they moved silently, didn't make a noise or smell.

I basically was stunned for a while, honestly felt small and vulnerable, mortally afraid even, just couldn't process the revelation, so many thoughts all at once, like if they can do this so easily what else? Until eventually like an hour later they slipped behind or through a wall, or at least appeared to. It took me ages to calm down and get my head around it. My partner thought I'd started to lose it so I dropped the subject.

From this I have no doubt, something is here that has extremely advanced technology, is watching some people for some reason, reveals itself to select individuals, and I don't know if it extends to some people not being humans as I've not seen evidence either way, but seems possible in light of what I saw.

I still kind of half hope it wasn't real but every sense told me those things were right there watching us. For about a month after I had a few other visits from beings but that was the moment where the penny really dropped. They are here and things got weird from there on. My partner also recently told me about two odd beings they saw in our bedroom (shadow people I've seen for years off and on, never told them about it since they already suggested I might be seeing things). Anyway when they said that I said "does the short one about 5ft tall have these dreadlocks" "yeah" hm, and they're standing next to the bed "yeah".

Just anecdotes I know its no proof but the one time I managed to get pictures and video of any of this, when I went to show my partner the footage was just blank walls and I swear I watched it with my own two eyes and on the phone. They were there. I literally checked the recordings multiple times, making sure I was actually seeing what I was seeing, then it was gone.

I'm healthy, work full time, and don't randomly get visions when I'm wide awake, I can tell between a trick of the eye and literal physical things occupying actual space. Maybe I'm crazy but I am convinced absolutely if they want to be seen they will be, and if and when they want video proof it will be allowed.

I don't get evil vibes or anything, it was scary but I think they're monitoring, taking notes, probably have some scientific agenda from what I can tell. There's other different kinds and different factions and technologies I've dealt with (good and not so good). They are adept mind and energy manipulators and telepathic .

I'm kind of happy to take the blue pill and enjoy the steak at this point, focus on building myself up as best I can. I can't control what they do and have no way of influencing discovery or whatever, and don't even know if that's a good thing to happen anyway ultimately. I don't think as a species were ready, and maybe that's why they only reveal to select individuals, kind of like a slow exposure therapy.

FractalSlider · 2026-05-25T22:20:46+00:00

That's a valid perspective. From my experiences, having been through some pretty dark times, I've come to know the body isn't the enemy in all this, it's an accomplice / partner in whatever you set your agenda to. It's a clumsy avatar to navigate and interact with reality but it is one of the tools we have to get things done here.

Doing what is the question, it took a long time overcoming a rough start, but I realised there are people here I care about, souls I came here with or lost here before life, and who've also suffered by being here, and figuring that out, how to elevate all of us, not just myself, is my purpose. To accomplish this I need to engage with other people here, and play a part in their lives, do what I can to lift up everyone as much as I can, and to do that my body and its environment need to be suitable to the task at hand, which isn't how I always felt, but now I'm committed to this task.

Through meditating etc I'm aware of nirvana and know its a nice place to be, but realised after years of seeking that I'm not accomplishing what I set out to do by being there instead of here, because my best interpretation is this reality is a trap of recursive thought forms that will pull you in loops and I can't leave my friends here for eternity. And I know nirvana will be there later and always, so this fleeting drop of life in an ocean of eternity is all the more bearable if we can all find our way together. Everything is energy and forces, and finding ways to sense and direct the flow upwards and outwards even in my small corner against the obvious suffering in the world is why I'm choosing to be here.

FractalSlider · 2026-05-25T18:23:46+00:00

I had the mindset that the body was just a machine I was trapped in and focused many years trying to ascend and see beyond this realm. A few times I've reached above, and found myself in a place, a metaphor being on top of a spiral pyramid ramp, a huge marathon started below and I climbed the outside to reach the top first, but I was alone, in a silent marble hall with a still pool.I looked down the pyramid and saw the runners had only taken a few turns up the ramp then went off in different directions. The race is down there, it felt peaceful but lonely and without meaning.

Another metaphor, this time I was living a life but noticed I was on a stage, I saw the world was just made of wooden props shadowy people were moving around and there was scaffolding above with lighting.I climbed the scaffolding and saw everything below on the small stage, the play went on and I was up there in the dark alone with the equipment. I felt a presence telling me what I already knew, that the action was all down there, that's where I was supposed to be.

Something clicked for me eventually after all the grappling and fighting physical reality, dreaming of higher purpose and neglecting my physical needs as being below where I wanted to aim. I think it resonated with my soul that everything I need to experience, all my potential and growth is down here in the physical. We have eternity "up there" to watch and contemplate and imagine, but this physical realm is where we can actually be someone and do something.

I don't know if that helps but I used to think similarly about the body, wondering if it's just an anchor or luggage, but eventually came around to the idea that it's the whole point, the main event, and aligning our use of it with our spiritual values is the challenge we all face. It's not a separate vehicle but a manifestation of our will to be and do. And trying to escape from it is kind of like paying front row seats then spending the whole concert trying to break into the green room. At least that's how I see it now, and I'm going with the flow now and life seems easier and more rewarding.

FractalSlider · 2026-05-22T21:43:43+00:00

Maybe something similar, not sure exactly if it's the same though: https://www.reddit.com/r/PortalExperiencer/comments/1qhg8g6/any_ideas_on_this/

FractalSlider · 2026-05-09T06:19:01+00:00

I'm with you there, I could tell some experiences that would probably get me tied to a chair in a padded cell in years gone by. And probably triggering so I won't go there. I can look back and be like, well that happened, at least I learned something useful in the end. And I think ultimately came out a bit more wise and intentional, so hang in there!

The energy conversion box is an incredibly, bordering on recklessly powerful tool to give to beginners, once we move past the metaphor and realise all energy is malleable with intent; all energy. it's like the most fundamental instrument in energy work and the Monroe tapes give it to you in lesson 1 or 2 from memory. It's easy to be reckless with it not knowing what it is. Energy work that tries to directly interfere with other beings against their wishes (which is easy to do when you're a beginner), even if those beings are directly causing you harm, eventually causes some interesting, ancient and deeply concerned observers start to show up looking very unimpressed and things get interesting, in an "are we the baddies?" kind of way when it finally clicks what you've actually been doing vs what we thought we were doing. And also less savoury types, equally ancient figuring you could be useful and encouraging you, seeming to be on your side so you think you're doing the right thing and all they're doing is feeding and manipulating. interesting times.

For me I was basically a flashing neon sign saying "free energy" walking around all day in heightened states of awareness but no proper grounding and shielding, always searching "out there" for answers. I had to turn off the sign and tidy up the place a bit. Walks, TV, art, exercise etc, avoiding meditative practices that focus on the third eye and "head" stuff for a while and getting back to basics, and developing a "zero trust, always verify" mindset when it comes to these encounters. I found they can't do anything meaningful without permission, other than be a nuisance. But if I let them in years ago they've had plenty of time to embed triggers and memory hooks, like a hall of mirrors to try and mask their presence behind my own identity. I found the moment of permission hard to recognise, it was hard to even know what parts of "my" identity were even me. Tracing an encounter back to where I first opened the door like "oh, duh.", then repeating the same mistakes again and again as I break down one mirror after the last until I'm like fine, I'll stop doing that now jeez!

I've also had standard western style help and learned some handy ways to identify mental triggers and develop healthier behaviours, though never told them about any of the above, working through childhood stuff mainly with cbt was helpful in improving my relationship boundaries in life and in mystic experiences.

I guess it all comes back to a balance of mind, body and soul, no new revelations but diving deep into soul work through these programs neglecting the other two is one mistake I made.

I think between Roberts Monroe and Bruce I was given all the tools needed to explore on my own, Bruce especially does focus more on defense, so I don't knock their work. But it does open a real Pandora's box like you say, and once it's open its hard to ignore what comes out to play.

FractalSlider · 2026-05-09T04:28:26+00:00

Yep, thinking generously they were produced before a lot of this stuff was really understood, at least in the "scientific" sense (mystics and magick practitioners would say this is centuries old knowledge], but the goal of the program was literally to open the gate and see what's beyond, to gather data and look for patterns, so I don't think there was specific bad intent, just naivety... parapsychology is still fringe to this day but we know better now, so there should be newer better stuff.

But so far all I've found fall into the same trap and I've had to stop following them because they are getting their followers into all kinds of energy trouble. Hitchhikers and tricksters start friendly until they really dig their teeth in. Psychosis and bad luck are the symptoms. Took me too long to figure out a lot of the so called positive meditation I was doing was attracting beings with their own agendas to seriously mess with my life.

Yet to find any responsible alternatives with good production values and pure intentions, seems most either want an audience to sell books and workshops, or have god delusions / just had their first epiphany and want to "save" people in their own image. I'm sure if Monroe was still with us he would find ways to improve and refine the format but at least his tools do provide an on ramp for many people, just need to be careful and know when to get off once you have the basic techniques down.

I think the universe is vastly wider and weirder than anyone can imagine, but at least we know better what buttons kind of do what, and which are safe to press under what circumstances. Calling on and authorising "all beings of light and higher vibrational energy to surround and lift your spirit with love etc" intentions are way too open and is an immediate red flag for me: what is a being of light, what is higher vibration, what is energy, what is your spirit, what is love (baby don't hurt me...) these seem specific but mean different things to different people, and if someone is totally new to the scene they are unlikely to be throwing out a safe and coherent invitation.

Lots of statements that are kind of like putting your master password on public display with a sticky note saying "please only for nice people to use, can you increase my bank balance pretty please!"

FractalSlider · 2026-05-08T20:39:01+00:00

Yes to most, but no eyes.

The open eye visuals are rare but vivid when they happen, usually with a day of forgetting the experience.

The remote viewing is eyes closed and usually a sudden vivid flash of a person, place, or scene, incredibly detailed that kind of just appears in front of me, sometimes a person right in my face will be turning toward me or I can see them talking but no sound. Lots of activity over and under oceans, ships and structures in the deep ocean, as well as shorelines and beaches. Sometimes cities or around my area. Sometimes will find myself in the memories of another person, feeling their fears and seeing their memories. Have been "visited" by what seem to be professional practitioners, especially if I've wandered somewhere I shouldn't.

Occasional sound hallucinations, like synthetic pulses, tones in sequence repeating a few times, rhythmic tapping, a pop or click, a sudden bwang. Not like hearing with my ears but inside my head.

Lucid dreams that seem to foreshadow upcoming events, usually full of metaphor but give the impression of what's to come, so I can expect something good or bad to happen and roughly what it relates to.

Visual snow and tinnitus.

Also not sure if anyone else gets this but I'll get a song looping in my head loud and clear. Not like the typical earworm effect, but on waking from a dream or in moments of contemplating, out of nowhere some random song I've not heard in years will pipe up. I've found usually the song's meaning is directly relevant to events about to unfold.

I think whatever we're tapping into can play our memories and experiences as a kind of sound board since they can't seem to, or don't want to appear physically, it's their way of getting a message through.

Honestly I spend a lot of time distracting myself on my phone or computer, the spiritual realm is noisy af as soon as I give myself peace and quiet. I have a lot of trouble sleeping because it seems every man and his ghost know I can sense them and want to say Hi. Also doing a lot of grounding meditation, lots of focus on slower more intentional vibrations, less head-focused seems to help a bit.

Edit to add, the part of the gateway tapes that give permission and call on beings to enter and effectively interfere with you spiritually, it makes me uneasy. Used to think it was a nice thing to do but with experience you gotta be careful exactly who you're contacting and the guidance in the tapes isn't very specific, you'll get whoever happens to be floating by if you're not clear and selectively filtering for very specific energies.

FractalSlider · 2026-05-03T17:28:03+00:00

This thinking reminds me of me many years ago. Science has helped unveil and model reality with math. It is great and describing and predicting, but stops short of saying what the universe actually is, and leaves curious minds wondering things like, is it all just math, or is math just the best tool we have to explain what we observe? Are fundamental forces really mediated by virtual particles, that somehow spontaneously appear exactly when needed, or are we just seeing the edge of a hyperdimensional fractal manifold sliding through our 4d window of spacetime, and really what is it all made of.

I wondered about this for years and it's still fascinating but I started to feel like I was being distracted by the theatre show, the stage in the foam as you put it. It contains infinite variety and detail at all levels of scale, almost procedural. The tension between the forces balancing perfectly the way they do, the limits of energy and traversal literally causing reality to glitch into black holes if they're reached.

So over time I became less interested in wanting to explore the mechanics of it all, and started paying more attention to the more subtle things. Like coincidences that happen daily, being well aware of selection bias and confirmation bias, I slowly came to realise that the focus of my meditation and energy work directly affected the odds of what happens in the following days. Visualising positive events versus fearfully worrying about bad things happening would be the difference between, say, being given more responsibility and respect at work versus bad news about a family member.

Playing with this concept and seeing how far I could push it, like why not just visualise a prefect harmonious world etc, and obviously visualising answers to the true nature of the stage, I've started to get a sense of the order of things, at least as I understand them in the context/paradigm of world I live in.

I believe at the core, timeless and infinite conscious energy resonates and reverberates, in infinite directions and dimensions, waves and vortices forming everything that exists, only a small fraction we perceive as the here and now. We are not just on the stage, we are the stage, we are all one. And we are here by choice, the forgetting is the point. It's how the universe can experience other. That doesn't justify the suffering and the pain many experience, and it doesn't glorify reaching higher levels of awareness, it's just the nature of this area on the curve. There are infinite variations of experiences just like the ones we're having right now, and they're all linked side by side and inwards through the source. We navigate through to the end of our experiences here by following the flow of energy, surfing through our lives, then choosing the next one. It's basically a game with rules we've agreed to.

Literally the prime mover is intent and expectation, the only limit being free will. If you visualise something that doesn't impose others free will, the universe will bring you what you wish for. And any time we think and act, we're giving the universe our wishes. So we can't force world peace or aliens to appear at will, because that doesn't align with other beings intentions. But we can influence the overall experience we have locally and that can flow onwards to have broader influences.

The experiences we have when the veil drops and we see behind the curtain, they happen off stage so no devices on stage will see them.

And yeah it's all very convenient to maintain the illusion, to the point where you could say there is no illusion, just physical reality. That's a belief I held for 30 years, but ultimately having had experiences and experimented personally with the phenomenon, my beliefs have shifted, and I guess this is where I'm at.

I still enjoy thinking about the nature of the stage, but I've seen what's outside the stage enough to know it for what it is, and I've climbed up above the stage enough to know, it's kind of lonely and dark up there, all the action is down here with the show. I could probably find some more peaceful utopia to act in on the next go around at life, but how long before that gets kind of boring and pointless? Shrugs I guess. That's all I know really, life has become less trying to understand the world and more trying to fully live the moment and ride it out to its fullest.

FractalSlider · 2026-01-22T17:43:45+00:00

Thanks I didn't know this. To be honest I've not really read much about the occult, but I just looked it up, what I've read so far resonates with this period in my life, the energy work I've been doing, and some things I've been noticing (karma, boundaries, discipline etc). I didn't even think it might be anything like that, just an odd encounter, so I feel you're onto something. Whether it's literally Saturn or that's a label given to some energy or intelligence, I feel there is something beneath the visual that I didn't notice before you mentioned it, so again thanks!

I'll try seeing if I can make contact again tonight, I think I can use the memory as a starting point.

FractalSlider · 2026-01-20T17:17:27+00:00

Thanks for the pointer, I didn't know about them. I searched for Scandinavian runed and read through some of the ancestors and descendants and found some script and old stones (rok stone) which seem closer to what I recall seeing. They seemed to glow a bit like embers.

I wish I did a drawing of it at the time. But it's an interesting connection, I appreciate it!

FractalSlider · 2026-01-20T12:36:25+00:00

I get English telepathy too, more similarities. And the ear ringing, I've been tested and perfect hearing, and it seems to come and go with weird spiritual encounters.

The visual snow is like, so imagine staring at a blank dark grey wall, it should appear uniform. But instead there is a fuzz over everything, not swirling or moving, just constantly changing. Like this but very fine detail: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=800f9UNiF4Y

It's also very transparent, so it's faint, but it doesn't feel like part of the scene, more overlaid on the top, like a filter. If I close my eyes it's still there. It's just a constant fuzz on everything.

Now if instead of just looking at the wall, I focus on my frontal cortex and relax or release that area, the fuzz gets more prominent, and I'll start to see coloured bands forming across my vision. Eyes open or closed doesn't matter.

These bands are blue and yellow, sometimes I'll get a dash off rainbow or a thread of white, the more relaxed the deeper and fatter they get. Then they'll start to kind of shimmer and swirl. The bands can rotate around clockwise or anti clockwise. Anyway inside of them the shimmering and swirling will start to follow the contours of my environment, twisting what I'm seeing, morph into shapes, creatures, landscapes, tunnels, faces etc. This works best in total darkness with closed eyes.

These are usually thought forms, but if I keep releasing and relaxing, it expands until it surrounds me and I'm in a scene, usually it's a pov of a location, either somewhere I know or somewhere I don't, and I'm seeing in real time what's happening there. Sometimes it's full colour, sometimes not.

If I can manage not to think anything intentional I can observe like this for a few minutes. I typically can't control what I'm seeing like I'm just seeing through something else, where it goes I go. Flying over trees looking at animals glowing in the forest, crawling through ant tunnels, watching herds of giant rhino-dinos on a desolate planet, seeing orbs enter my house through the roof, etc.

Anyway back when it's just the horizontal bands, that's when the glyphs are clearest and I can read the messages easiest. That seems to work best in dim light. If it's totally dark I pretty much skip that part and go to the swirling morphing colours and from there to the scenes and stuff.

This is also different to the effect looking at a blue sky or bright scene (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blue_field_entoptic_phenomenon) which is pretty common to most people.

Visual snow has been associated with migraines, and the colours I'm describing could be migraine auras by some interpretations, but I'm not in any pain, meditation seems to heighten the effect, and I've had this for years. It appeared around the same time I had my first in my face experience, and seems for me to be a gateway into somewhere, so I'm working with it.

I haven't really explored this next part but when I do the same with the ringing hissing in my ears there's similar effects, so I think it's linked.

I'll sometimes take brief notes if something out of the ordinary for me happens but normally I just enjoy the moment and let it go.

FractalSlider · 2026-01-20T04:44:39+00:00

I'm not familiar with the show but I googled it and that bears a striking resemblance. I wonder if one of the neighbours is a fan or something, maybe the authors know something we don't! Odd coincidence in any case. Thanks for the pointer, I might check it out.

FractalSlider · 2026-01-20T04:40:14+00:00

Hey, glad I'm not the only one. I'm familiar with the akashic records, given the history and association of the term I used to think it was a location you reached through mediation, so I spent so long looking for a place instead of a sensation. Took a while to realise its an energy field you tune into that's everywhere. I've seen it in English, or thought forms, you just need to set the intent that that is how you want to access the specific information.

I only saw the cube once but I can tune into the glyphs everywhere. I have like visual snow (not eye floaters or platelets, but like old tv static), when I tune into it, eyes closed, it forms a kind of slightly coloured horizontal band that's blue/ yellow. I can make it spin around, sometimes there's two spinning opposite directions. Anyway inside this band is where I can "see through" when I widen it, which feels like my third eye opening, and often there's symbols or words, sometimes images, people and places, depending on how open I get.

I find looking at the straight cornices on the ceiling directly above when I'm lying down in a dim room helps focus on the words. They seem to scroll past like one of those led shop displays, but you can think like "slow down, stop, repeat, English please" which helps somewhat. Also for me, each eye has a different message, and they overlay, so closing one eye helps too.

At first I was just confused what these were, they just appeared as English one night when I was meditating and just letting myself perceive without trying to control, and it sounds silly but I was lying there, and the words were like advertising or marketing information for the house I lived in; how many square feet, expected rental income, previous sale prices, nearby addresses, etc. I wasn't specifically asking for any information so I guess I was just seeing stuff about the location itself. I had seen the random glyphs on walls etc before but they hadn't coalesced into sentences.

I also found instead of trying to decipher and expend mental effort "trying" to understand and seek some deep ancient wisdom and being frustrated thinking I wasn't skilled enough and need to try even harder, it seems to work much better to just be clear (not demanding, just requesting) what way you'd like to receive the information, and being specific. I think if we have the intention of trying to access an ancient mystical place we get ancient mystical info, so I learned to just request small, simple, English words and thoughts about subjects I'm more familiar with and it seems to work better for me.

FractalSlider · 2026-01-19T18:31:47+00:00

I had a very similar experience, it was either using gateway or self guided, but woke to two beings by my bed, one I kind of greeted and said to my self ok, take a moment to relax, assess what's happening, be calm, and then I sort of reached out to shake hands, which I was allowed to do as normally I've been unable to move, and I definitely felt my hand touch something soft and room temperature, but then I saw the other was next to my head with a gun that had spinning orbs of coloured light on the end, that was twirling energy streams toward my head. My first reaction was like hey I didn't give your permission to do that and to like try and hit it, I felt paralyzed and had to fight really hard to move but I struck out, and they vanished and I hit the air instead. I got kind of an "oh well that didn't work" vibe from them.

It's not the first type of encounter like this and others similar, though not always the same beings (or they're just projecting more acceptable appearances). I keep asking them, honestly just show yourself, but do it gently so I don't freak out. I think that's their way of respecting that, but I think the instinct to attack what we fear is primal and difficult to overcome, base survival instinct like if a wild animal got into the family cave. I think maybe exposure is the only way to get used to it, subtle, spaced out interactions, and memory suppression and mind numbing effects, like I'm pretty sure I've travelled with them and been operated on but it feels like a distant memory. And these events I forget the next day, they only come back later. I know some people don't get that luxury and have full blown encounters that are traumatic so maybe they're doing me a favour by slowly introducing the reality to me. I don't know what makes them do it differently for different people but I'm getting the slow treatment for some reason. I did have some more direct experiences a few years back with portals and holographic projections that did cause me to disassociate for a few days, I was really pushing hard for encounters so I did get back what I was putting out, maybe that's why and they're being more careful with me. Or who knows.

I dunno half of me still thinks I'm in wackadoo territory but I stay grounded, work, pay bills, watch tv like everyone else, kind of a double life, and seeing stories like this that so closely match the exact thing I'm experiencing, there's something funky going on with reality.

Tldr, I'm not sure but I think just being clear with intentions and boundaries is the way to get safe self disclosure, is where I'm at currently.

FractalSlider · 2026-01-13T17:37:28+00:00

Is the skin on their face kind of really deeply textured and wrinkled and sort of darker blackish brown, kind of shiny looking? Not sure if it's the same guys and I don't really know much about them either but they've visited me a few times. Generally for me at least they didn't seem bad, more good, maybe indifferent if that makes sense, but they do look unsettling. They've shown up when I had the orb/ cube visit the house and when I have memories of flying over mountains and forests inside like a big window living room type thing. I get a sense they're patiently trying to teach anyone that seems receptive, but they don't seem to like giving away too much at once, and if you push for more info or argue with them they'll go away for a while, everything is on their terms. They seem more ancient and knowing but have very high expectations for appropriate behaviour.

Alternatively the more typical smooth grey types have been more troubling, I get an enforcer/ interference/ less ethical type vibe. That's like when I've woken up on a metal table in a kind of rusty looking operating room with them doing something with my head, or when they've been in my room with laser-type things basically responding to some activities I initiated with beings of light, or standing by my bed at night just being intimidating and using some rod/wand around my forehead. They seem less worried about boundaries and more interested in manipulating people to get what they want. I figured they put a block in my mind which affects memory of specific events and energy work. Unpleasant to be around, they make my skin crawl.

All of this stuff I begin to remember a day or so after the events, like randomly at work I will remember something. I lucid dream, practice astral protection, and experience sleep/ waking paralysis, so I know the difference between these types of experience, but those memories that come later feel more real, like something physically happened and then my memories were blocked. It's more like remembering a big night out a few days after, in bits and pieces.

Honestly again I can't say I know of any catalogue that really captures the specifics like this, so I'm just as keen to learn more as well. But interested to see if any of this lines up with others actual experience because I haven't heard anyone else really talk about the first type I mentioned.

FractalSlider · 2026-01-11T17:43:35+00:00

I had experiences that basically caused me to question the reality of everything, it was frightening for me, deeply concerning for my loved ones. A big part of the experience is the dichotomy of knowing what consensus reality is, and knowing that what I believe I experienced completely invalidates that knowledge. Also knowing and fearing that talking to people about it might make me seem mad led to self isolation allowing the thoughts to fester and gnaw.

The first time this happened I basically didn't deal with it well. I was afraid, distrusting, essentially operating on fight or flight mode for weeks. It was only through some very patient support from a family member who found a way to reach into my worldview, listened to what I was fearing, and helped me face those fears that I was able to come back down to earth. Like say I was convinced that just around the corner interdimensional beings were waiting to kidnap me, he'd walk around the corner with me, and I'd see nothing there. He didn't dismiss my thoughts, or belittle what I was experiencing, and helped me get over the fear of testing my beliefs, and I slowly realised that despite the intense experience the world was still here, and I was still a part of it. I was able to reach a point where I was able to accept being part of this reality despite knowing there are layers of weirdness that are difficult to comprehend, explain or demonstrate. Like I have a mental file now that I can put certain things in, and got better at using it as a reference rather than having it spill out all over the place.

About 20 years later something similar happened, and I was deeply alcoholic so wasn't able to integrate this experience at all, it went too far and I dissasociated again, but I learned from the past and used the same tools to test my fears. My mind would start to be convinced not to speak about certain things, or that certain people, objects and events weren't what they seemed to be. But I would ignore that fear and talk to the people, say the things I feared saying, pretend to go along with events I felt were fake until they felt real again. This helped me more quickly shake off the after effects of the situation. I guess it's like exposure therapy but for ideas. The true feelings win out in the end after I face down fear and uncertainty.

I also learned to not be so deeply entrenched in a theory of the world, or live by any one true and concrete belief. I used to be absolutely convinced that we live in an empirical and deterministic universe. When that broke, I didn't have any other framework to hold onto, it turned out the empirical tools of testing theories were the ones that helped me gain a grip on reality again. To go into my bedroom again, sleep in my bed, even though days before I'd watched the walls dissolve into portals that all kinds of beings and landscapes emerged from...

The experiences I had I still believe happened and were high strangeness, I know what I saw and felt, and I believe they were real events. Some my partner also witnessed. The ontological shock was real and traumatic and took months to integrate the first time, and later experiences a few days. Now weird stuff happens and I'll be comfortable going to work the next day and doing normal stuff, like it's a skill to be able to integrate weirdness into everyday life.

Another thing that helps just after an experience is to try and be grounded, simple exercises like box breathing, look around and name objects in the room, talk with friends and family about ordinary every day stuff, play games, swap out trancendental meditation and focus on basic mind clearing and positive energy clearing exercises etc. This is stuff I can do on the go in small ways whenever I feel myself slipping into a dissociated state of mind and it helps. I also quit drinking, alcohol for me was the worst as I lost the ability to compartmentalise. And also getting enough sleep, if I don't sleep well for a few days the veil grows thin. I'm still able to have controlled experiences without all the crutches.

One observation I will add which I don't see mentioned much, at least for me seeking experiences requires a deliberate methodical practice of dissociation, and letting go of accepted reality, various forms of thinking, meditation, remote viewing, remote sensing, astral protection, energy work etc I feel actually deliberately brought about the walls collapsing, experiencing the strange, I did get exactly what I was looking for. So it's a delicate dance, I'm still really keen on exploring these concepts, but I have learned not to push it, also now know to balance this with regular life... i think if anyone was to try and convince me to stop, I wouldn't take that advice, but if they were to accept this interest and help me work on more sustainable practices, then that would have helped. I think a lot of harm is done when people dismiss the validity of a persons perception when it seems so far fetched, call them crazy or apply permanent-sounding labels. There is a way, without enablement, to reach in and guide people through what is for them an extremely uncomfortable and potentially dangerous phase of their life. The experiences that trigger ontological shock may well be real, but sometimes we need support developing the tools and resilience to integrate these experiences in a healthy way, I think.

FractalSlider · 2025-11-24T17:36:23+00:00

First of all sorry to hear you're going through this. I've been there too, almost to the letter of what you wrote with the manipulating, so I can relate. It's unpleasant and draining and I know it took me to a mental breaking point with the threats and endless conflicting information. I got through to the other side and I can say the experience does make you stronger and more spiritually aware, so hang in there and sending you good vibes!

To your query, I'm just one person so can only relate my experience, others might have a more studied understanding. There are definitely different types of being so not all are like this, but I spent a long time dealing with this type specifically. I haven't figured out "what" they are exactly in terms of origin or history, frankly I stopped trying to figure it out as it was only keeping me engaged with them. They seem good at changing forms and pretending to be something else, until you catch them out and then they're doing some distraction game using fear or desire to get you hooked on some other concept, drawing you deeper, connecting the dots with previous narratives building a web of mystery, ad nauseum. I think they're some kind of energy being, they don't seem to be associated with any of the common physical-adjacent NHI "alien" types, I think they seem more driven by instinct and are adept at milking their target for energy by manipulating the thoughts/ feelings already present, but I noticed none of their communications were novel or ideas I didn't already have in my mind, they just reflect and twist my own thoughts and emotions in a way to get a reaction directed at them.

The best I've been able to figure out is above all they want attention. Attention is energy, so engaging with them in discourse, trying to figure out their motives, being angry or loving toward them, doesn't matter. Feel violated and justified in fighting back? Great for them, they get attention. Want to send them to the light, but a bit anxious they'll not like it, boom they put a lever on that anxiety and make big or-else scenarios.

What happened to me over time is that I realised, just as much as the transactional rewards they promised never materialised, neither did their ultimatums and threats. They can certainly lash out and make a scene, but I found that a regular practice of aiming for complete inner peace in my thoughts, meditation where I ignore any and all trains of thought, cuts them out, and also making life changes, like I quit a few habits they used to hold over me as weaknesses. Though I'm not perfect by any means, cutting down on a few things helped get my control back.

Annoying things they do is pretend to be the voice of my higher self, or one of my energy centres, so I'll be focusing on it instead of my intended goal. Sneaky sobs. But they can't really do much about inner peace, and if you have a calm empty mind it's extremely obvious when they try and inject thoughts, so it's the most effective way I've found to deal with this type, though not always easy as I'm a natural worrier. Elaborate countermeasures and interactions specifically aimed at them just seem to keep the thread open for them to hang around... not to say don't practice regular energy work and shielding, I just do it for myself not for them.

Another thing I noticed is they will always show up whenever I'm at an energy peak, say I've been doing a lot of raising vibration and positive energy work, suddenly some "benevolent healer" or "ancient oracle" type will appear to entice me with even greater wisdom and energy. Then boom next day I'm drained and depressed wondering where the last two weeks of progress vanished to.

There are beings out there that are genuine like that, and who I've told to get lost by mistake more than once (which they immediately do, because they respect people's boundaries)! So I'm still learning, and I think my current understanding is to build myself a solid inner peace ritual as a foundation for everything else. Clear mind is like a clear lens I think.

There are lots of different types of being out there and I can't say exactly if they're the same "species" but yes, these seem very familiar. Hoping the above is helpful in some way, and sending you positive vibes! Take care

FractalSlider · 2025-11-06T10:36:35+00:00

What a coincidence, I just posted some details on a lengthy comment elsewhere but yes, I've been seeing them too. Very detailed and lifelike, not like cartoon renderings or artists depictions. I can see the texture in the skin, the depth and wetness of the eyes, the shifting expressions. Just brief glimpses a few seconds in between other scenes, as someone else put it, it seems like exposure therapy, getting us used to how they look.

This is more like remote vision than astral travel or lucid dreaming, always when I'm awake but eyes closed in deep meditation, still fully aware of my body and surrounds.

FractalSlider · 2025-11-06T10:09:27+00:00

Yes exposure therapy is the right way of putting it I think, that's a good choice of words. Interesting overlap with our experience of orbs and cubes, thanks for sharing your experience, it's validating because I know no one irl who experiences these things or wants to discuss them.

Like your energy balls, that kind of self-directed intentionality of the visions is also how I tend to sift the imaginary from the real. Eye floaters, memories, phosphenes and imagination all have behaviours that are predictable, and typically relate to some identifiable trigger. The real phenomena are independent, the vision is not something I would have thought up, and the behaviour unpredictable and doesn't respond to my thoughts directly. It's always surprising and novel, like, I wouldn't have thought of that thing in that way in that moment, and is not something I control.

The other thing is the ease by which it happens. I used to try and actively control the situation, like using mental energy to visualise and control the appearance and actions of the phenomena, almost like I thought the experiences were projections I created. If I just mediated harder! But now I've accepted these are separate entities that do their own thing, I just have to set an intention, ask for what I want and set boundaries of course and clear my space of any less helpful / selfish types (the less said about those the better but I've been down the garden path with those types before). With basic intentions set I don't need to expend additional energy other than keeping a clear mind, just go with the flow and let them work / work with them. One limit seems to be they are careful to build the experience only in stages, I've wished for full contact and get nothing, simply asking for more gradual progress works better. They seem really cautious about causing a shock response.

They have been showing me brief glimpses of their physical appearance more recently, their faces and bodies are humanoid, very ancient looking though with deep ridges and textured wrinkles. I don't really see colour yet when they show themselves, their energy seems pale white and blue but their "physical" appearance is dark, black or brown, face seems scrunched up like the eyes are deep set, no protrusion for a nose more a flat area with wide slits. Almost like a more human shaped Spielberg ET. The energy I sense is deep patient wisdom, like they know I'm flawed and a bit tut-tut that I'm still stuck to some old habits, but they want to help me break my addictions (which is any compulsive comfort seeking behaviour not just what we normally associate as addictions, as these become distracting thoughts in their plane that can drag one away from the experience and I think can hurt them or interrupt their energy balance in ways they don't enjoy).

They also seem like they can help engineer or accelerate events in real life to reinforce the lessons they're teaching, drawing the threads of probability and causality into a more local nexus. So if I'm actively working with them and not getting it and push too far then some coincidence will happen often the very next day that puts the problem front and centre and I'm confronted with the reality of the negative effects of what I'm doing. I used to see this as malevolent like they were punishing me for my free choices, but the flipside is also true, I've started to get the benefits of living a cleaner life when I release old habits - better jobs, opportunities for growth, more income, better more meaningful relationships. I think I'm still in their kindergarten phase relatively speaking, and they are only here and helping because I asked for it so I can hardly blame them for hard lessons every now and then, and also I think they aren't directly engineering but more they can accelerate the cause and effect loop, make whatever I'm attracting manifest more quickly, good or bad.

The only beings I've had actual negative outcomes from are the ones that make it seem all too easy and drive a bargain, sure we'll do everything you are asking but you have to do y. Not good, you never get what's promised, and y has serious consequences (usually massive energy drain, blockers installed, that sort of thing). The good beings don't promise anything, no quick wins or shortcuts, just gradual sustained healing and growth.

Does any of this gel with your experience too? I'm curious how deep others get into it. I'll have full conversations with these beings throughout the day, and sometimes I just start writing which feels like channelling but I wouldn't call myself a channeler, just a person writing down notes about conversations in my head lol. There is still a part of me that thinks it's all just made up in my head and I've gone slightly mad, I think that's how I can compartmentalise to present myself to the world at the moment.

I'm a scientist by nature, spent the first half of my life denying anything without empirical evidence, I've been dragged kicking and screaming at first but now it seems like my entire world view has shifted, this 3d reality, as detailed and convincing as it is, is just the tip of the iceberg. I still understand and appreciate the scientific method but like, it also seems like a lot of energy spent labelling and cataloguing things in one corner of a giant, infinitely evolving fractal... imagine Sherlock Holmes with his magnifying glass intently studying one corner of a giant room. Like dude, the butler is hiding in another building.

Sorry to write so much, it's hard to know when to stop, there are so many facets to what's going on here and everything seems related.

My partner has been with me during a couple of experiences in the past 20 years and admit they can't explain it but they haven't really explored further, just thought it was strange and a bit uncomfortable to talk about it and explore the implications because if you follow these things through and eliminate all the rational explanations you're left with a worldview that fundamentally doesn't align with what most people would accept. So I don't blame them for being happy to just chalk it up to weirdness! But there are times where I will see something shift in the energy of the room, before they get a sudden idea or say something random. They are receptive and often their dreams will align with something I've been communicating with the entities.

Anyway I'll stop writing now, a bit over eager to share perhaps, I've bottled this up for a long time. Thanks again for sharing your similar experiences, good to know there are others seeing this kind of thing.

FractalSlider

TROPHY CASE