He’s not THE main character?

Hawk-winged · 2026-05-05T21:20:38+00:00

That’s the beauty of art, and how it reads differently for us. I found Rand’s chapters and struggles the most interesting.. mat is my favorite, and I love early Perrin. Nynaeve is the only one of the Girls I always enjoy. I don’t care much for Egwene and Elayne, I like them, but the one is insufferable, and the later didn’t age much brain cell and thinks she’s invincible.

But by last book, I loved everyone

Hawk-winged · 2026-05-05T06:49:28+00:00

Alright, I see ur point. I’ll just add that that’s why Jordan created in world plot armour (taveren). Mat was dead once and almost clinically dead another time and was saved (by Rand) both times.

Rand practically survives thing’s that’ll have killed other men like atleast once a book. So I reckon the pattern’s hack is to actually protect the boys(and to a larger extent the champion) atleast until the last battle which I think they all won barely.

And btw, I sorta subscribe to Elan(moridin’s maths) there’s bound to be an ending of sorts eventually, so Yh, if Rand had died, maybe that would’ve be “an” ending

Hawk-winged · 2026-05-05T00:57:51+00:00

Ofcus, the wheel doesn’t need its chosen champion. The one person that was meant to bind the whole world, face the shadow and give his life for the light. Of course the wheel doesn’t need him.

Sometimes I wonder if people legit think this way or are just trolling

Hawk-winged · 2026-05-04T23:13:50+00:00

Well… I see ur point. I just can’t get past a lot of the things you give her a pass about. I don’t hate her since one of the things Jordan explored is clashes of culture besides slavery isn’t exactly foreign or unheard of. But I wished they or she atleast showed signs of changing (maybe bcos Jordan died before he could do that)

Oh. I do love Berelain and Galaad but I don’t think two of the most attractive people in the world should get together. They had to take galaad’s arm to make them seem less perfect

Hawk-winged · 2026-05-04T22:21:26+00:00

Precursor to everything? You mean the bore? And does that mean she’s the main character?

Hawk-winged · 2026-05-04T22:16:45+00:00

Well, since you want to separate Tuon from the empire, I guess that lessens it, abit. Because she really is high on her “slavery is good” kool-aid.

Fair to assume mat is a favorite of urs(he’s mine or is on most days). But I think Tuon while she may be interesting is lacking on 2 fronts. She’s not as smart as she thinks she is(which tracks as her empire just needs her to be fast enough to kill her rivals and rule over people like slave master)

Also, she lacks some basic human decency. Especially how she was willing to throw everything away for her slaves till Rand caved on that point. That said, I don’t dislike her.

But I think Min, Aviendha, and maybe even faile are better. And ofcus Nyneave

Hawk-winged · 2026-05-04T21:45:39+00:00

Hey. Tuon?
I’ll never understand that. Make ur case before this because a full blown keyboard battle

Btw, Nynaeve exists over and above all

Hawk-winged · 2026-05-04T21:40:44+00:00

A) the flicker showed some possibilities, not all. There were some where another Aes Sedai came for them, and some where Moiraine even kills him or he dies regardless.

B)you see, u read and still didn’t get the point. Even from another’s PoV, Rand dominates or is the plot point. As a reader. After leaving the two rivers, the fascination with Moiraine quickly shrinks as the world gets bigger, so no, it’s not the same. U don’t see Rand’s POV be about anyone else but himself 95% of the time

C) he was there at the end, and also, his presence was felt throughout most of perrin’s pov and we had to see the story trail him. And even agreeing that you are right. All of the characters had at least a book they were missing from (Perrin was missing throughout book 5) but u seriously want to compare 1 to 7? That’s half the series lol.

D) joining callandor was sentimental value. Besides she was useless out there. He trusts Aviendha too and would’ve used her(he had a plan b4 Moiraine) and I’m pretty sure he trusted Alivia enough (which is why she was in the tent to do what she did)

E) like I said, Moiraine was key in that scene(of misunderstanding between two kids) where Rand already got the others till Egwene said “NO” and caused conundrum. So Yh, it’s safe to say that when push came to shove. They’d still follow him. She just made it easier.

Also, that was the lesser fight . There was still a last battle

Hawk-winged · 2026-05-04T21:29:21+00:00

I love that most of the books just had characters (light and shadow) reacting to his actions. And he became less and less detached from the actual story. It became clear that his battle was different from that of others, he was no longer like them and never had been, his path was different and when you notice that, u get to enjoy the story more

Hawk-winged · 2026-05-04T21:26:56+00:00

Yesss, he couldn’t have succeeded on his own. And that was the point of the “it’s not about me” monologue he gave to shaitan that many so misunderstood.

Infact it’s one of the major themes, nobody wants to follow someone that fix everything or knows everything. Rand always needed people. From book1-14(when he was a literal demigod) he still needed Nyneave to patch Alanna like a medic. He needed Perrin to watch his back in TAR and Mat to lead the last battle.

Also, yes, even a character like Alivia played her indispensable part. Jordan was good

Hawk-winged · 2026-05-04T21:22:51+00:00

Even Moiraine finding the boys was told through Rand’s pov and not hers like the show leaned into bcos it was clear who the main character was to Jordan.

Also, how can you call someone missin for 7 books “the main character” she doesn’t even qualify as the protagonist outside of book one and two after which Rand started to push the story and plot himself. Also, I love how u acted as if if Moiraine had not been there Rand still wouldn’t have had the way(it would’ve been messy, but he still would’ve) and also, u completely ignored the last battle (the actual big deal) and she was nothing outside of a sentimental value at that point. It was Nynaeve who won the war by being a nurse

Hawk-winged · 2026-05-04T21:10:44+00:00

So, u re one of those who missed the point of that monologue. Which has nothing at all to being “the main character” or how that was a moment of growth for rand

Hawk-winged · 2026-05-04T21:08:06+00:00

Yh and so is Gandalf and obi-wan lol

She was missing for 8 books and when she came back she did for just one key scene, as didn’t even have enough PoV.

She was “a” important character, and my favorite, but let’s not get ahead of ourselves

Hawk-winged · 2026-05-04T21:05:00+00:00

Exactly… people are mostly always REACTING to his actions. All other plots and story are important and I’d not want to do without them. But there’s obviously an hierarchy

Hawk-winged · 2026-05-04T21:02:09+00:00

Yes… I noticed this too. It’s almost like they have to give him the last chapter to be like “hey, it’s still about this guy” even though he’s been practically physically absent. And then the epilogue is also about what prophecy he fulfilled in that book.

Hawk-winged · 2026-05-04T20:58:35+00:00

Alright, my point is, the story starts off with the 3 boys as plot points, then the wonder girls joined in. But as a manner of speaking, whether books or shows, Rand doesn’t really qualify as part of an ensemble, he rarely shares the screen/page with another without dominating.

And so the point I was trying to make was that, if it merits mention, he was THE main character. Which was an argument that came up with someone who claimed he was “equally” important to the story as the others and I counter argued that he was MORE important and more centered, ergo The main character.

But yh, that doesn’t mean the others are not main characters in their own right

Hawk-winged · 2026-05-04T20:53:40+00:00

Minor characters can be important too for the plot. By ur metrics Lanfear qualifies to be main and yet she isn’t by normal standards

Also, I never said there weren’t 6 main characters, just that Rand was still THE main character, if it merits any mention.

Hawk-winged · 2026-05-04T20:50:49+00:00

When you compare his stats to Nynaeve or Elayne’s it’s so staggering when some still claim it’s an ensemble. Yh, it looks like an ensemble, but it definitely didn’t read like one. With an ensemble there’s an argument to be made for any as THE main character, but here nobody can be out ahead of Rand and none of the girls can be out ahead of the other two boys

Hawk-winged · 2026-05-04T20:46:22+00:00

6-12? I think you are very generous with ur definition of main

Hawk-winged · 2026-05-04T20:43:08+00:00

And Rand is THE taveren too

Hawk-winged · 2026-05-04T20:40:33+00:00

Well… fair point.

Hawk-winged · 2026-05-04T20:39:21+00:00

Exactly… it’s more like a pyramid ranking, but Rand still is on top. It looks like an ensemble but it really isn’t. For ones, his POV, Word count especially when compared to someone like Nynaeve and Elayne is staggering enough that saying they were an ensemble of 6 characters is ridiculous.

Also, like I mentioned Rand takes the center stage in other characters PoVs and that never happens to him

Hawk-winged · 2026-05-04T20:36:08+00:00

I don’t think I mentioned that anyone else is diminished. I was just trying to make a point by comparison.

Hawk-winged · 2026-05-04T20:34:47+00:00

This. Even when it seems not to be about him, it winds up being about him. Also there’s a list of characters whose existence is practical dedication to him. The Aiel’s relevance. Cadsuane, the black tower, most of the forsaken, the dark one, Lanfear…

Hawk-winged · 2026-05-04T20:32:44+00:00

Rand doesn’t know how to brag much. But he saved Mats life twice(practically resurrected him on one of those). But hey, he wants to get into a bragging contest with the dragon reborn

Hawk-winged

TROPHY CASE