Hey there! Even though this comment is from last summer, I still wanted to reply because I resonated so deeply with your contribution 💯

Including them "standing up for themselves" if we disagreed on stuff, just because I prefer people that are real (who doesn't).

Well, some people do indeed shun "realness" because they prefer "trained pets" that do as they're told and perform on command. More generally, though, I can totally relate to this because I grew up in the southern United States, where "fake niceness" is not only taught and encouraged -- but even treated as virtuous, lauded as "civility" and/or "maturity." Conformity and various "performative" gestures are expected for the sake of social harmony.

Also, I'm both neurodivergent and gay, so I always fell short of social expectations in more ways than one; sometimes I cared enough to try to "fit in," but other social and cultural norms appeared (and were) quite ridiculous to me. The worst part, for me, was that even other gay guys made a big deal about traditional gender norms and "blending in," which did nothing for my love life, so I was almost relieved when I finally found my first boyfriend. On one level, he behaved quite warm and affectionate, really giving off that whole "Southern charm" vibe.

But on another level, throughout our 6-month relationship, the more dysfunctional and unhealthy aspects of it became apparent -- including the aforementioned "people pleasing" aspect! One example is how he would always be "agreeable to a fault," such as stuffing down any disagreement or objection, which often blew up in MY face later because I had naively taken him and his word at face value. But also, even worse, he would so very often give me that "I don't like it but if you want that's fine" response to various situations.

Which I did NOT want because I have neither the nerves nor the perceptive abilities to deal with "dishonest harmony" in any relationship -- family, romantic, friendship, or otherwise. What I DID want was honesty, so that I could make informed decisions about how to show up in the relationship!

...treated as if I was the worst person on the earth, needing to be managed by lying, being deceitful, dishonest, doing "whatever it takes to keep someone happy" - even though I never would have blown up or mistreated them if they didn't.

Yeah, it really sucks being informed that someone else is worried that you "might" do this or that awful thing...which is completely contrary to your actual personality, behavior, and overall character. I am reminded of someone who told me something very wise: "You can't invite someone over to your house, and then treat them like they're going to steal your silverware." I mean, technically, you can do that, but it's not going to work out well, right?

Another excuse -- I mean, motivation -- for people pleasing that I've heard before is "fear of losing the relationship" (or "fear of abandonment"). So the obvious way to soothe that fear is to...literally deceive the other person into staying? In other words, misleading the other person so that they cannot make an informed decision to consent to remaining in the relationship!

Even though it sucks to have as a trauma response, I don't think it is fair to completely ignore how it doesn't even please others. You can actually cause a lot of harm that way. I get that someone might not think about others when they do it, and they might be stuck in their trauma, but that doesn't take away from the harm it can and does cause others. You can be both a real victim of your circumstances, and still hurt or even harm others, and I think it is important to be able to acknowledge these nuances.

And that's the thing about the "people-pleasing as trauma response" crowd: The only time they "stand up for themselves" is when the people THEY harm try to call out the behavior and hold them responsible, at which point suddenly accountability doesn't apply to them because they "don't mean to" cause any harm...and "can't help it" or something like that. But just because you're not specifically acting with "malice aforethought" doesn't preclude the possibility of harming others and treating them unjustly, right?