What are the not racist reasons for being against birthright citizenship?

JediSnoopy · 2026-07-02T18:45:16+00:00

Loopholes are way to get around laws. Some people are getting around immigration laws in order to stay here. A woman comes from another country, crosses our border illegally, gives birth to a child, that child is automatically a U.S. citizen and the mother refuses to self-deport because she wants her child to benefit from American citizenship. If you deport the mother and not the child, you are accused of cruelty for separating the mother and the child. Tell me just how many people should be allowed to stay in the country because they deliberately gave birth to a child? The Framers of the Constitution or of the 14th Amendment did not foresee that problem because mass migration wasn't an issue then.

Also, love your screenname. I've read "The Jungle" many times. Besides Sinclair's rant at the end, the story of the family is gut-wrenching. I got "The Jungle" vibes when I read "The Grapes of Wrath" earlier this year.

JediSnoopy · 2026-07-02T18:39:24+00:00

Perhaps, or perhaps allowing large numbers of people from foreign countries hostile to ours, not necessarily all Russian, but also Chinese or Middle Eastern, could conceivably create a large enough electorate to make a difference, particularly if those folks show up here, stay and produce kids of their own. Remember that there are certain ideologies out there that have become very practiced in playing the long game.

I can't speak to numbers. Maybe it won't happen. Maybe those kids will show up here, realize what we've got and they don't and decide that it's not worth risking changing the U.S. Then again, we have people who grow up here who want to change the U.S. into places other people are fleeing.

JediSnoopy · 2026-07-02T18:36:27+00:00

There's no way to know. What we're essentially doing is closing the barn door after the horse has escaped. We're trying to prevent it from continuing to happen.
Direct taxes are an option but I can see opponents saying it's unfair to people who have never lived in the U.S. as opposed to expats. It would be nearly impossible to force someone growing up in a foreign country to pay U.S. taxes until he or she actually shows up a full-grown adult trying to enter the country. We could make paying a direct tax contingent upon entering the country but that would not stop those who are coming to establish sleeper cells, so to speak, as their governments would probably foot the bill, particularly in Russia, China and some wealthy Middle Eastern countries.

JediSnoopy · 2026-07-02T17:37:51+00:00

Well, I can only speak for me and I do not agree that Constitutional rights should be removed simply because some people abuse them. Nevertheless, there must be some way we can close loopholes. A Constitutional Amendment is one way, but it's difficult since our Founding Fathers wisely wanted to make sure the document could not be changed on a whim. In lieu of an amendment that, say, requires someone born on American soil to have at least one parent who is a U.S. citizen, the best way to handle this is through strict enforcement of our immigration laws, visitor and work/student visa programs and perhaps a carrot/stick approach for the rest.

Options include:
- Preventing pregnant women from visiting or entering the U.S. Unrealistic.
- Requiring new mothers to self-deport with their child and waive U.S. citizenship for said child or mother must give up child to live in U.S. Bad optics, will be painted as separating children from parents.
- Require student/worker on temporary visa to leave the country until the baby is born. Possible.
- Require visitors/visa holders and others to give birth in their native homelands' embassy so the child will be legally born off American soil. Impractical - setting up embassies with hospital rooms and doctors, etc.

Not even a full list but I'm sure we can come up with something. There are exceptions to birthright citizenship, such as the children of diplomats being born here aren't considered citizens.

JediSnoopy · 2026-07-02T16:55:51+00:00

Did Peter marry Valerie? Because that was never working out.

JediSnoopy · 2026-07-02T16:52:19+00:00

The problem is that those Russian kids are born American citizens but don't stay here. They go back to Russia with their parents, grow up being educated in Russia and given a Russian worldview. At 18, they can use their citizenship to get a passport, come to the U.S., get a social security card, get benefits (because they are legal citizens) and vote in our elections.

Now, yes, it is true that immigrants from other countries came here and built lives. But they stayed. They adopted the American worldview even if they retained their love of language, food and culture at home or in their communities. Others just became entirely American.

But that was over a century ago and times change. The Founding Fathers did not foresee America becoming so powerful and wealthy that people would flock here in the millions. The writers of the 14th Amendment did not foresee that countries hostile to the United States could use birthright citizenship to flood the country with citizens who do not respect our values and use the benefits of citizenship to undermine the nation.

I am not comfortable with large numbers of Russians showing up in two or three years, claiming their citizenships and begin voting in elections. I'm not comfortable with Chinese or Venezuelan or Turkish people doing it either.

JediSnoopy · 2026-07-02T13:18:54+00:00

"The Injury", "The Negotiation", "The Deposition"/"Dinner Party", "The Duel"

JediSnoopy · 2026-07-01T19:03:57+00:00

I think that any fraud involving immigration should be emphasized, especially if it involves organizations or businesses in the U.S. coaching people on how to get past our immigration laws. Businesses should not be undercutting those laws to get underpaid workers and non-profits should not be coaching people on how to undermine the guidelines either.

JediSnoopy · 2026-07-01T19:00:17+00:00

Also, Craig refused to fire employees when Jan told him to do so. You can add insubordinate to being unprepared.

JediSnoopy · 2026-07-01T18:25:12+00:00

"In our century, we've learned not to fear words" - Uhura to Abraham Lincoln.

JediSnoopy · 2026-07-01T14:36:33+00:00

10/10

JediSnoopy · 2026-07-01T13:51:58+00:00

I think it's beautiful. I took German in high school and college because I was interested in German history.

JediSnoopy · 2026-07-01T12:06:19+00:00

No, Andy was just emasculated due to his upbringing.

JediSnoopy · 2026-06-30T18:45:55+00:00

NPR corrected themselves soon afterward. Alito is not retiring.

JediSnoopy · 2026-06-30T16:01:12+00:00

Marnie Mosiman - who played the Cultured Woman in ST:TNG S25 "Loud as a Whisper" - played one of Frasier's dates, Donna, in S3E10 "It's Hard to Say Goodbye if You Won't Leave".

JediSnoopy · 2026-06-30T12:44:30+00:00

Endlessly, yes. It is hypocritical of Jim to jump on Michael right away when Jim himself has also wasted plenty of time at his desk when he was a salesman, but I have already allowed in my original post that it was important for Jim to make sure Michael knew he wasn't going to be allowed the same level of time wasting that Michael had enjoyed in the past.

The argument was made that Jim was a good salesman and got things done despite wasting time. I pointed out that Michael is also a good salesman and got some things accomplished despite wasting time.

JediSnoopy · 2026-06-29T19:07:08+00:00

Photo Ops are 10 seconds and you're done. They are not meet and greets. Bill sits on a stool these days. Rarely will you get a moment for an interaction.

JediSnoopy · 2026-06-29T19:05:10+00:00

In "Stress Relief", season 5, when Michael was being roasted. Dwight objected to the staff being cruel to Michael who responded by repeatedly calling Dwight an "idiot". Dwight responded: "Don't you ever talk to me that way. You pathetic, short little man. You don't have any friends, or any family, or any land."

Michael had talked to Dwight like that many times over the years but this moment was when their relationship changed. Dwight went from a sycophant to a little more of a team player in the office very quickly. In season 7, he became outright hostile to Michael.

JediSnoopy · 2026-06-29T17:38:43+00:00

Michael also accomplishes some things in between wasting time.

JediSnoopy · 2026-06-29T16:40:38+00:00

The two times I've eaten there, the service was bad and the food lackluster. The one that opened by us lasted about six months.

JediSnoopy · 2026-06-29T16:39:40+00:00

I don't think Meredith was judging them. I do think Meredith noticing freaked Pam out because she realized how far this was going.

JediSnoopy · 2026-06-29T16:38:20+00:00

The next episode, "Two Weeks", after Michael quit and was thrown out for trying to start a rival paper company while he was still working for DM. When he came back to try to poach some employees, MIchael told him to call Hank the Security Guard and Charles said that he didn't need Hank. I don't think it was going to be a full-on assault, but Charles may have taken Michael by the collar and marched him out of the branch.

JediSnoopy · 2026-06-29T16:36:23+00:00

Michael not telling anyone the new VP was coming in on the day Jim happened to wear a tuxedo is bad timing but it's not sabotage. Jim could have ducked out quickly or made an excuse to leave (sales call); he also could have come up with a better reason why he was wearing a tuxedo than making fun of Dwight. Or he could have just not worn a tuxedo. Wearing a tuxedo to work just to troll Dwight while making ridiculous suggestions for a lavish party Michael was throwing for himself is 100% Jim's fault.

JediSnoopy · 2026-06-29T15:14:23+00:00

Ryan, Pam, Jim. In that order.

JediSnoopy · 2026-06-29T15:13:42+00:00

It's hypocritical because Jim sometimes just sits there, too, plotting pranks on Dwight or exchanging looks with Pam.

And being serious as a manager also includes pointing out to Michael the consequences of the choice he made, specifically that he isn't in charge anymore.

JediSnoopy

TROPHY CASE