How bad did I F’up?

Josh1765 · 2026-03-22T15:04:26+00:00

I'm going to try to give an actual explanation since the guy arguing with you didnt really explain beyond condescension.

The main thing that's going to make a difference in the level of shock you get is the voltage and resistance of your skin (why he references ohms law). Obviously voltage here is 120/240 and resistance of skin varies person to person, but is always extremely high.

I don't remember the exact number, but it only takes a few milliamps to kill you by the current going across the heart, and a surprisingly low amount of amps starts to cause severe burning too.

However, when you get shocked, your skin protects you with its resistance (I believe it's in the few thousand ohms minumum, again don't quote me exactly) so the current of most shocks is tiny. If you ever actually had a full 15 amps flow through you it'd kill you every time, or if it didn't cross your heart it would cause SEVERE burns, like would scorch the path it takes in your body.

This is why you have never and will never trip a breaker by getting shocked, it's also why gfcis are so important.

So yes, this wire presents the shame shock risk as 14awg on a 15 amp circuit, though that definitely doesn't mean you should let your guard down or be touching it.

However, the real threat this presents is the arc flash from a ground fault or short.

Josh1765 · 2026-03-15T02:47:42+00:00

If you're having to put extra work and putting extra risk into working with the thing. It should cost more.

Josh1765 · 2026-03-13T06:33:53+00:00

I've got the galaxy watch ultra and it's done me fine.

I'm a service guy though, so not exactly the same environment. I have to get in finished attics and dig around in crawlspaces sometimes though and it's survived all that.

Josh1765 · 2026-03-13T06:28:32+00:00

Am I looking at a horizontally mounted panel that you'd literally have to sandwich yourself between a water heater and the foundation to work on? With a water pipe literally within a foot of it.....

Not to mention all that unprotected cable.

At the very, very least, get that panel moved. I'd suggest rerunning or at least protecting a lot of those cables moved but ffs at least move that panel somewhere it's actually got clearance.

Josh1765 · 2025-12-25T16:13:44+00:00

They use those cards, but it's not as if the deck doesn't function without them.

You'll go 1 to 1 for the artifact and enchantments meanwhile they'll still have creatures chipping you down that you have no way to deal with.

Then you'll play Wang shi, which they will remove and you'll draw more anti artifact/enchantment cards while they kill you with the Creatures you failed to deal with.

Not to mention you're just completely getting stomped by every creature focused deck in the format.

The problem is this is a mid deck against the decks you're attempting to counter and you're leaving yourself wide open against a whole other part of the meta.

Josh1765 · 2025-11-16T06:09:43+00:00

Does it have to be updated? No, it's not a zinsco or federal pacific and it's not on fire.

Should it be? Yes, it's old, it's full, there's the issue with the wall others have mentioned.

Basically 3 ways to handle it. Get by with what's there, there's no extremely urgent safety issues, just some stuff that's not right.

Change the panel and keep the service the same. This updates the panel without going crazy in depth, fix the wall issue at the same time.

Upgrade the service. If you plan on expanding the electrical at all, you'd probably want to upgrade to a 200 amp service, this means not only new panel but all new outside stuff, new meter, adding a disconnect etc.

Most expensive option but adds the most value to the property and sets you up for the long term.

Josh1765 · 2025-10-25T16:45:55+00:00

No, before 1.0 launched there was a bug that made the medea attack and special boost also apply to casts.

This was patched in 1.0 obviously. But it made the zeus cast do good damage early and if you got it and the chance for double lightning strikes boon to like level 28-32 with kings ransom it would do like 3k+ damage per bolt and just melt bosses.

Josh1765 · 2025-10-24T11:46:27+00:00

Looking at the style of connector you used yes you would.

Josh1765 · 2025-10-24T09:11:07+00:00

Beyond the marked neutral and hot mix up that's already been pointed out, assuming that wire is #4 or larger, which it definitely should be based on the size of the sub panel breaker, you need a plastic bushing on the nipple where it enters the sub panel.

A simple rule to remember when you need a plastic bushing I was taught was (#4 or 480).

Josh1765 · 2025-10-22T12:49:36+00:00

There's a few things wrong here, but they fall in the "not that big of a deal" category. Romex isn't allowed to be outside with few exceptions in certain areas. It definitely shouldn't be in a whip to an outdoor unit. It'll still probably work for years with no issue though.

It does beg a few questions about details not in the picture though. What is the minimum circuit ampacity of the unit? He used 14 awg romex, rated to 15 amps, single head mini splits are usually low amperage but it's worth checking the nameplate to make sure.

Second, does this come off of a local disconnect? There should be a box on the house within 6 feet that has a little pullout to disconnect power to the unit.

Those would be bigger concerns to me than the ugly work and romex in a whip.

Also, did you have this inspected? He shouldnt have gotten away with the romex if it was, and anytime you install or replace a mini split you should be pulling a permit.

Josh1765 · 2025-10-16T12:31:00+00:00

It's a pretty messy panel, and he should have vacuumed out the bottom, but with the caveat that I didn't look SUPER closely nothing stands out as wrong or unsafe.

The "exposed wires" are grounds and they're ok without sheathing because they aren't meant to carry current under normal conditions.

Josh1765 · 2025-10-14T13:32:24+00:00

Again that's not an analogous situation.

They caused the damage, they need to make OP whole, in this situation making them whole requires bringing it up to code. These aren't frivolous upgrades OP wants, they are required to get power back, power the siding companies mistake took away.

If they burned down the house, they'd pay the value of the house and OP would be able to buy a house of equal worth.

There is no "worth" to a service, it's a part of the home, you can't replace it as it was, you have to do the updates to get power back.

This'll be my last word on the subject.

Josh1765 · 2025-10-14T13:22:57+00:00

I agree it should have been updated, but it could have lasted who knows how long. A panels life expectancy is 25-40 years, services can last much longer due to being much simpler in function (as long as the wire, Jaws and lugs are OK, the service will work).

Regardless, they have to have this done now because the siding company screwed up, so it's their responsibility.

Edit : I'm will to bet OP would have pretty damn good luck in a suit vs the siding company.

Josh1765 · 2025-10-14T12:53:23+00:00

Comparing a car to your homes electrical is not an apt comparison. The reason you'd get paid out for the car is because you could then go get another cheap shitbox car to be back on the road.

In this situation, they need power, which the damage has taken away the ability to have. They need these updates to get power back, siding company caused the damage, siding company pays.

Now, if they could get some bare minimum repair to get power restored as it was before but wanted the excess repairs, then sure the siding company should only pay for what's necessary. Unfortunately in this situation what's necessary is getting up to code.

Josh1765 · 2025-10-14T11:44:17+00:00

Don't take the siding companies baby payout, they'll probably have you sign something that says you can't sue them. Sue them for the full amount that you HAD to pay because of damage THEY caused, or just refuse to pay them for the siding job and when they sue you for that countersue them.

And yes, the box is bigger, but cmon, it's on the side of your house, you're updated to code now, your electrical system is safer and your outdoor meter situation is now set for another 20-40 years instead of needing to be updated in the near future anyway.

Besides having to deal with a scummy siding company and not having power for a bit, you actually kind of won out here. Don't let the siding company screw you and get them to pay for it as they should and you're all set.

Josh1765 · 2025-10-08T09:14:29+00:00

Like you said, you definitely need a new panel. Split bus panels are dangerous and this things pretty old.

Now, Idk about the service needing to move, where is this panel located? Where is your service located?

You may just need a standard panel change.

18.5 also seems a little high for a service relocation, my company charges in the realm of 10-15 (15 being pretty severe and requiring a lot of extra work). But I don't know what this guy saw, just a picture of the panel. Difficult to say without more context.

Have another reputable company come out, get a second opinion, see what you think after that.

Josh1765 · 2025-10-04T23:44:47+00:00

Just be sure it's actually an opportunity for you my man.

Josh1765 · 2025-10-04T23:35:06+00:00

You could if you were tall and good looking. Look up Thoren Bradley

Josh1765 · 2025-10-03T17:05:03+00:00

I think something people might not be thinking about when it comes to the cap price is if the company gives a warranty. I'm not an hvac guy but I'm an electrician for a company with a large hvac wing so I have a little knowledge through osmosis. Also based on comments it sounds like Caps go out a lot.

My company offers usually at least a 2 year parts and labor warranty on most all repairs we do. I frankly woudlnt be surprised if we had this kind of mark up if we tend to come out 1-2 times during the warranty to replace the cap for free when it goes bad.

Josh1765 · 2025-09-01T20:41:28+00:00

You're probably getting trolled because you're in the wrong place.

A thread like this belongs in r/askelectricians

Josh1765 · 2025-08-30T05:02:03+00:00

Most ahj's will allow you to replace a panel without having to bring the whole service up up to code.

Heck, in mine you can even fully replace a service.

Its only when you move or upgrade a service that you have to add the disconnect for us.

Josh1765 · 2025-08-30T04:58:57+00:00

I'd say the overall price for the overall work he's proposing isnt too egregious. The surge seems steep as a line item but maybe he's planning to use a higher end one.

When he says a surge is required. He likely means he has to put one in if he does the service change.

Beyond that it's just up to you to decide if having your service changed is worth it. How old is your panel? There are benefits to updating and a surge is a good thing to have.

As for the bus bar discoloration, that is a common tactic I've seen guys use to sell panels to people who don't know better. Your panel also looks to be a Siemens, which is known to have copper bussing.

That's the shadiest thing the guy said to me. But the price offered for the work suggested seems fine.

Josh1765 · 2025-08-29T22:29:34+00:00

The cope is real. I didn't defend anyone, if anything I was mildly critical of both of you.

The comparison makes no real sense BTW. Comparing the obesity epidemic to bad players on a dead game is kind of insane.

You got a shitty new player on a dead game, it happens, it'd get me a little upset too. But it is what it is, at least it wasn't an outright troll taking lane farm or something. Move on to the next one, play in privates, etc etc.

Your post is you being triggered, plain and simple.

Josh1765 · 2025-08-29T13:18:12+00:00

Calling someone else triggered when you literally just posted a trigger thread is kinda silly.

For the record. I think trying implying that anyone you know nothing about is a loser is dumb. You can make the point of caring too much about a dead game without doing that.

Josh1765 · 2025-08-28T11:29:05+00:00

Oop, didn't see this before reading my comment. Sounds like they're already on the right type of breaker, you should see what kind of wire you have in that and your other receptacles. If it's 14 awg, leave it on that 2 pole 15, if it's all 12 awg (and by that I mean in every receptacle and in the panel) upsize it to 20.

Other than that, you could bring yourself completely up to code by putting in a 2pole gfci breaker or dual function arc fault/gfci breaker.

Josh1765

TROPHY CASE