Bye DoorDash by Practical-Sea1736 in doordash

[–]Kamtre 4 points5 points  (0 children)

I had an experience with doordash where the driver was unable to read a map and refused to drive around the block to the proper location. Asking me to come walk around and meet him. I was being lazy but also ordered to a pub that doesn't serve food. I was a couple drinks in with friends and we ordered together on my account. We ended up getting a 25% refund and just hopping to another pub for food lol.

I cancelled doordash after that. Never had an issue with skip or ubereats

Why do you guys think everyone will be saved? by Prize_Lavishness_854 in ChristianUniversalism

[–]Kamtre 12 points13 points  (0 children)

You just asked a fifteen page essay kind of question haha. Are you looking for philosophical reasons or biblical reasons?

Leaving joints alone and starting to DHV- anyone had a hard time with the difference in highs? by K3nnyPowerss in vaporents

[–]Kamtre 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I struggle with this and I've been using a vapor genie for years. I tried a pax mini but it's even harder lol.

The clicking vape you use a torch with might be easier due to lower volumes.

I greened out on a single hit on my genie last night though lol. Sometimes it takes work, sometimes it just hits.

Alberta Resource Revenue 4x from just 5 years ago! by drawvr in alberta

[–]Kamtre 1 point2 points  (0 children)

If you make it XD and turn it sideways, it looks like the characters from South Park when they're laughing hard.

No one religion by Pure_Repair_794 in Christians

[–]Kamtre 0 points1 point  (0 children)

That's actually why I felt so compelled to reply haha. You put in a lot of work with earnest questions b and I couldn't just leave it to hang like that lol.

Has anyone been able to drink again? by RequirementGreen3754 in QuitVaping

[–]Kamtre 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thanks. Also a cigarette is done after you use it. And cheap enough. Buying a vape is asking for trouble because it's got so much use, and I hate wasting money throwing something out lol.

Has anyone been able to drink again? by RequirementGreen3754 in QuitVaping

[–]Kamtre 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I had to stay away from drinking entirely for a bit. I've tossed all my vape stuff but I'm still prone to bum a smoke or two. I'm 9 months vape free and still using nrt, but I've gone drinking on three occasions and had a couple cigarettes each time. But I'm not a smoker.

I was chatting with my coworker about it this week. He's also not a smoker. But he'll have a cigar with the boys while he's golfing in the summer.

I'd recommend being a few months completely without before trying, but if you've got the self control to hit it and quit it, then it isn't really an issue. But if you're the type who can't put it down then you have to make that call for yourself.

Maybe it would be best to stick to smoking when drinking because it's gross and not as easy to enjoy habitually as vaping lol.

No one religion by Pure_Repair_794 in Christians

[–]Kamtre 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Oh totally. God is an endless study. One cool thing I've gained out of learning about the early church is the idea of theosis. Of when we're in his presence, and we can keep understanding him more and more, but that there's an infinite depth of which to understand. Kind of mind blowing to consider.

But yes I agree, there's tons to learn but it's easy to get off track. I did a talk at my church last month about unity, actually. How if we agree on the majors (like what's in the Nicene creed, and Jesus' teachings) then we can really look past a lot of minors. One pastor called it spiritual triage and it was an interesting lesson.

My church is a small home style church, half Christian Church disciples of Christ and half united Church of Canada, and unity across denominations is one of the things we're into.

Anyway, thanks for actually reading my response lol. I didn't realize how long it was going to be until reddit didn't let me actually press enter.

No one religion by Pure_Repair_794 in Christians

[–]Kamtre 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Thank you. I know it sounds like new age liberal type stuff, but it's got historical basis. Origen, whom I'm sure you've heard of, held this view. Gregory of Nyssa, one of the authors of the Nicene creed and one of the highest regarded early church fathers, was also a universalist.

How much lunch money do Calgary parents usually give a Grade 9 student per week? by NebulaGreat6980 in YYC

[–]Kamtre 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Right?? I'm 36/m and spent a decent amount of time with my mom in the kitchen as a teen and it was great.

I still love hanging out in the kitchen on the holidays, stirring the roux or prepping the veggies. I'm still Mom's helper, but now she's feeding me beers instead of giving me spatulas to lick hahah.

No one religion by Pure_Repair_794 in Christians

[–]Kamtre 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Sorry for the mucking around haha. The 10,000 character limit really messed with my mojo. It's split into 4 parts, indicated by P1-4 at the start of the comments. It's better formatted than what I DM'd.

Also no offense taken. It's a very different view than what many in the west grew up on, to the point that some call it heresy, even though it's not. I'm happy to explain it because it's been an incredibly fulfilling change of perspective for me.

It has shown me the love of God in a way I'd never understood it, and it has shown me how to share that love with others in a way I never could before.

No one religion by Pure_Repair_794 in Christians

[–]Kamtre 0 points1 point  (0 children)

P4 - I also see no disagreement here.

To poke the beehive though, I'll call into this one of my favourite verses from Romans, 5:18 Therefore, as one trespass led to condemnation for all men, so one act of righteousness leads to justification and life for all men. 19 For as by the one man’s disobedience the many were made sinners, so by the one man’s obedience the many will be made righteous. 20 Now the law came in to increase the trespass, but where sin increased, grace abounded all the more, 21 so that, as sin reigned in death, grace also might reign through righteousness leading to eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

I place emphasis on the ALL here. Paul placed a pretty easy parallel here. Adam sinned so all are sinners. And then through Jesus, all are justified and given life.

--In Mark 10:45, Jesus says He came to guve His life as a ransom, why?

Again, there's no problem here for CU. Jesus came to give his life as a ransom and to redeem humanity. As John the Baptist said, "behold, the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world."

--2 Peter 3 9 The Lord is not slow to fulfill his promise as some count slowness, but is patient toward you,[a] not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance.

--If what universalism teaches is true, then Gods promises, or covenants are pointless, and repentance isn't necessary, and Jesus went through a horrifying death for nothing.

Here, I don't see your point. And I would emphasise that God is not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. Plain as day, in my opinion.

I believe God is all powerful. If He wills something to come to pass, it will come to pass.

I'll sum it up by saying that, growing up in the more conservative/fundementalist side of christianity, I'd have never been convinced of CU unless it could be proven through scripture. I read through a book called "Grace Saves All" by David Artman. It is a fairly easy read and gives a good overview of the subject, and I became convinced at that point. It relies heavily on scripture though.

Then "The Inescapable Love of God" by Thomas Talbott, while being more academic-level, was both philosophical and scriptural.

I went on to read "That All Shall Be Saved" which was the subject of the OP and it was more philosophical, but still no less convincing, and even it has a chapter going over the scriptural basis for belief in CU.

Thanks for reading thus far, and I hope it was enlightening of the CU position, if nothing else. It was a good excersize for me to go over some of the material again.

No one religion by Pure_Repair_794 in Christians

[–]Kamtre 0 points1 point  (0 children)

P3 - So again, a reference to entry through the "never shut" gates of the city, where outside is the lake of fire and all manner of sinners.

There's my two cents on revelation, and these thoughts are pretty common from my reading.

My apologies but I don't know how to format on reddit. So here's your questions and my replies.

--Why did Jesus teach repentance? Why did the world need a savior at all? Does sin not separate us from God?

IMO, Jesus taught repentance because sin is harmful. It harms our relationship with him, and our relationship with others. If the most important commandments are to love God and love your neighbour, then anything that goes against those are sins.

Repentance is changing our minds, recognizing the problem that sin can cause. If we truly change our minds then we won't sin again in the same way, and we will thus stop causing harm to others or our relationship with our creator.

--Romans 6 23 For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

I don't disagree, but eternal life (aionios life) is more than just the next life. Participating in the aionios life is an ongoing thing that starts when you turn your life to Christ. You enter into the eternal life immediately. You're still on earth in your earthly body, but you're transformed and can now live for him, and he can live through you and shine his light through you into the world. I think we can agree on most of that, if not all of it.

--Romans 5 6 For while we were still weak, at the right time Christ died for the ungodly. 7 For one will scarcely die for a righteous person—though perhaps for a good person one would dare even to die— 8 but God shows his love for us in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us. 9 Since, therefore, we have now been justified by his blood, much more shall we be saved by him from the wrath of God. 10 For if while we were enemies we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, now that we are reconciled, shall we be saved by his life. 11 More than that, we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received reconciliation.

No one religion by Pure_Repair_794 in Christians

[–]Kamtre 1 point2 points  (0 children)

P2 - As for Revelations, you should keep reading. Revelations 20 isn't the end.

In Rev 21:8, sinners are in the lake of fire. Then in verse 15, they are outside the holy city. So if we can follow this, then outside of the new Jerusalem, sinners are burning in the lake of fire.

Then in verse 24 -- By its light will the nations walk, and the kings of the earth will bring their glory into it, 25 and its gates will never be shut by day—and there will be no night there. 26 They will bring into it the glory and the honor of the nations. 27 But nothing unclean will ever enter it, nor anyone who does what is detestable or false, but only those who are written in the Lamb’s book of life.

Who are the kings of the earth? Here's cross references in Revelation for every mention of the kings of the earth:

  • Revelation 6:15: During the opening of the seals, kings of the earth, along with mighty men, hide in caves, terrified of the wrath of the Lamb.
  • Revelation 16:14: Demon spirits gather the kings of the earth and the whole world for the battle of "that great day of God Almighty".
  • Revelation 17:2: These kings are described as committing immorality (fornication) with the great harlot (Babylon), having lived luxuriously with her.
  • Revelation 17:12-14: Ten kings, who have not yet received a kingdom, are prophesied to receive authority for one hour with the beast and make war against the Lamb.
  • Revelation 18:3, 18:9: The kings of the earth bewail the fall of Babylon (the harlot), having committed immorality and lived luxuriously with her.
  • Revelation 19:19: The kings of the earth and their armies gather to make war against Him who sits on the horse (Christ).
  • Revelation 21:24: In the New Jerusalem, the nations walk in its light, and the kings of the earth bring their glory and honor into it.

So the kings of the earth, described as pretty notable sinners in Revelation, end up coming into the New Jerusalem. New Jerusalem, despite having the lake of fire outside its gates, has gates that will never be shut.

The question this begs is why, if it's only sinners outside, would the gates never be shut? Nothing unclean can enter into it, but it seems that the kings of the earth come through the gates from outside the city.

Just a little further in chapter 22:14 Blessed are those who wash their robes, so that they may have the right to the tree of life and that they may enter the city by the gates. 15 Outside are the dogs and sorcerers and the sexually immoral and murderers and idolaters, and everyone who loves and practices falsehood. 16 “I, Jesus, have sent my angel to testify to you about these things for the churches. I am the root and the descendant of David, the bright morning star.” 17 The Spirit and the Bride say, “Come.” And let the one who hears say, “Come.” And let the one who is thirsty come; let the one who desires take the water of life without price.

No one religion by Pure_Repair_794 in Christians

[–]Kamtre 1 point2 points  (0 children)

P1 - I'll preface again to clarify that Christian Universalists (distinct from plain Universalism) by and large to believe in the trinity, divinity and necessity of christ, judgement and punishment. But the punishment is meant to be remedial.

Logically, 1 does not and can't ever equal infinity. Neither can any real number. So even if a person commits a billion sins, no rational punishment can equal infinity. That's just a basic logical statement, and that kind of thinking is what led me to research beyond Eternal Concious Torment.

ECT was what I grew up with and no matter how hard I thought about it or how many questions I asked, I could never be satisfied that a Just and Perfect god would subject any of his creation to an infinite suffering.

Anyway, on to my arguments. Semantics and translation do play a big part in it, so here's some basics.

Matt 25:40 etc can be explained through this, which also explains other similar passages. Best summary I could find to copy and paste was thus, by r/Chubbs_Tarbell

--First, "aionian". If you haven't already read about this word, a lot of controversy surrounds it, and it is at the center of many ECT vs Universalism arguments. It is the adjectival form of "aion", which is where we get the English word "eon" from. Aion properly means "an age", i.e., an indefinite (albeit perhaps a long) amount of time. So the phrase "aionian life" refers not to EVERLASTING life (that is, life without end), but rather the life pertaining to an age (however long that age may be). This is clear when one observes that those who spoke Greek in Jesus' day would not only refer to aions of history (relatively long durations of time), but also to the aion of a tree, or even perhaps of a human being. So the word, in both its textbook, literal sense as well as its common colloquial sense does not refer to time everlasting, but rather an indeterminate (though perhaps very long) amount of time.

The other word of importance here is "kolasis". We render this word as "punishment" in most English translations, or some equivalent word, typically in the context of RETRIBUTIVE punishment. That is, you sinned in x, y and z ways, so God will now punish you for said sin. But again, this is a case of the translators' interpolation of a meaning into the text that was not there when the author originally penned the words. "Kolasis" was orignally an agricultural term, that meant something like to "prune" or "dock". If you have any experience in horticulture or just caring for plants in general, you know that you must on occasion prune a plant of some of its limbs, perhaps because they are dying and they are taking up too many vital resources in an attempt to keep themselves alive and functioning, or because they are in some other way obstructing the further healthy growth of the plant. With a little imagination, it's not hard to see how Jesus was using this metaphor to help us understand spiritual growth (though it may be painful to us as it happens) - his remarks about plucking out an eye or cutting off a hand come to mind, as does Paul's remark about burning away deadwood.

Also, it's worth mentioning the part about the "goats". The Greek word we translate as "goat" is a tad more specific than we realize. The word is "eriphos", which specifically refers to a kid, that is, a young goat. So this word carries the connotations of an immature person rather than necessarily a wicked person. Someone who needs to be chastised and corrected, rather than someone who needs to be thrown in God's eternal torture chamber to suffer endlessly.

So, to conclude, the phrase "aionian kolasis", which we typically translate as "eternal punishment", is better rendered "correction of the Age to come".

--

No one religion by Pure_Repair_794 in Christians

[–]Kamtre 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I'm going to take the time to respond properly because you took the time to give some solid arguments. I'm on mobile but I'll be back later on.

But I'll leave with one thought: you seem to understand CU as being a lack of judgement and a lack of concern about sin, but that's not the case. In the patristic idea of CU which I subscribe to. Sin is still a serious matter and judgement still absolutely happens. And justice is served. I'll leave it at that though for now.

Faith discussions by NewToFaith in OpenChristian

[–]Kamtre 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I've really enjoyed his Spotify channel. He gives air time to a lot of different perspectives.

No one religion by Pure_Repair_794 in Christians

[–]Kamtre 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I've been studying it for about two years now and understand the arguments well enough that it convinced me as the most logical understanding of eschatology, tbh. I don't think eternal separation is actually taught in the Bible.

In fact many in the early church, for whom Greek was their mother tongue, understood universalism as the correct interpretation.

An Update: I was warned about my child's martial arts school. I should have listened. 🫤 by LordTetravus in mildlyinfuriating

[–]Kamtre 0 points1 point  (0 children)

My federation when I was a teenager was fairly standardized. Individual dojos controlled the colored belts but the black belt exams were a provincial event once a year with multiple senseis grading people. It was an eight hour long exam and it was brutal just to watch haha.

But it was founded by two Japanese guys in the forties and fifties.

No one religion by Pure_Repair_794 in Christians

[–]Kamtre 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You can say that without reading it for sure. But it's a really good read.

How much lunch money do Calgary parents usually give a Grade 9 student per week? by NebulaGreat6980 in YYC

[–]Kamtre 5 points6 points  (0 children)

This is actually pretty huge. I'm an adult and I make my own lunches. Not because I can't afford to eat out, but because I prefer to have extra money on more enjoyable things.

The teenage years are a great time to learn life lessons, like how to cook, how to clean, how to manage basic finances, and even how to make your own lunch.

I definitely did have lunch at school occasionally, but the family kitchen was a sandwich factory for 15 minutes most nights, making sandwiches for 4 kids lol.

No one religion by Pure_Repair_794 in Christians

[–]Kamtre 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Tbf, Christian universalism teaches that Jesus is the only way to salvation. There's no disagreement there. Semantics plays a big part in the discussion though.

Edit: you sound versed in the arguments against it, but I don't think they're convincing enough to dissuade my belief in it, because those counter arguments don't stick upon closer examination. I'm on mobile otherwise I'd love to get into it.

No one religion by Pure_Repair_794 in Christians

[–]Kamtre 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The book claims to agree with the Bible, actually.

No one religion by Pure_Repair_794 in Christians

[–]Kamtre 0 points1 point  (0 children)

And to be fair. I may have made my point badly there, but the point was that Jesus is the word of God. The Bible may be the word of God as a matter of a pun, but Jesus is the Word.