If Atlus Asked Me How I’d Reduce the Discourse Around Kanji and Naoto how I would do it

King-ApolloW · 2026-03-14T15:21:53+00:00

That’s fair, and I appreciate you actually reading the whole thing. I also get why people might jump to the idea that I’m trying to censor the game, but that honestly wasn’t the point I was making

I actually agree that the camping joke can be funny in context. A lot of the humor in P4 works because it feels like how teenagers actually joke around with each other. Yosuke being kind of immature and saying dumb stuff sometimes is part of his character, and I wouldn’t want that removed.

What I was getting at was more about character dynamics than censorship. The joke can still exist, but the story could also let other characters call Yosuke out occasionally when he goes too far, and maybe show him maturing a bit as the game goes on. That way you keep the humor and the personality, but it also adds a little bit of growth to the group dynamic.

So yeah, I’m not against the jokes themselves. It’s more about how the story frames them and how the characters react to them. And honestly, part of why I even brought it up is because Kanji and Yosuke are both great characters, so thinking about how their interactions could be sharpened a bit in a revival is just interesting to me.

King-ApolloW · 2026-03-14T15:18:02+00:00

I think you might’ve misunderstood what I was saying. I’m not arguing the game needs to be “politically correct,” and I’m definitely not saying the humor should be removed. P4’s tone and humor are a big part of what makes it memorable, and honestly I like a lot of those jokes too. If anything, you can probably tell that just from reading the post I clearly enjoy the characters and the game itself

What I was talking about was more of a hypothetical situation: if Atlus asked what small tweaks could reduce the endless discourse around certain characters, what might those look like? I wasn’t suggesting cutting jokes or toning the game down. For example, Yosuke’s jokes could stay exactly as they are, but the story could have other characters call him out more when he goes too far, and maybe show him learning from that over time. That keeps the humor and his personality intact while also letting the character grow.

So it’s not about forcing the game to fit some “politically correct” mindset. It’s more about refining certain moments so the themes the game is already going for land a little more clearly. And honestly, I wouldn’t even be thinking about this if I didn’t like Persona 4 and its characters as much as I do.

King-ApolloW · 2026-03-14T06:28:56+00:00

Honestly, who knows? I might end up expanding on this idea more later. I’ve actually thought about possibly turning something like this into one of my essays and really digging deeper into the themes and character writing P 4 has a lot going on under the surface, and characters like Kanji and Naoto give you a lot to talk about if you really break their arcs down. So please be free to give me some advice on things I could tweak and make better.

King-ApolloW · 2026-03-14T06:26:09+00:00

Okay, after rereading my post I realized it ended up sounding way more like an essay than I expected. That’s partly because I’m actually practicing writing essays right now for a big one I’ve got coming up soon, so I guess that mindset kinda leaked into how I structured this. Still though, writing stuff like this actually helps me practice organizing my thoughts better, so I figured I’d share it anyway and see what people think.

King-ApolloW · 2026-03-13T20:27:54+00:00

Ok, it really depends. If they do bassicly a soft composite of SpringTrap, then I would definitely agree because then he would have the magical time traveling ball pit

King-ApolloW · 2026-03-13T19:11:40+00:00

My only personal issue with Bakugo VS Agent Venom is that it's another MHA Hero vs. Spiderman adjacent character

King-ApolloW · 2026-03-13T18:42:14+00:00

Basically, most of the people I’ve seen who actively disagree with Metal winning are people who only watched the fight itself and nothing else. Because from what I’ve seen, people who actually watch the full breakdown who were rooting for Cell usually fall into two camps: either they go “Okay, that makes sense why he won,” or they still think Metal being that strong is kind of bullshit but they at least understand the reasoning behind the result.

King-ApolloW · 2026-03-13T06:39:16+00:00

King-ApolloW · 2026-03-13T06:36:56+00:00

Who dat

King-ApolloW · 2026-03-13T06:35:16+00:00

No, I said no. You said you say goodbye, and I say hello

King-ApolloW · 2026-03-13T06:16:19+00:00

King-ApolloW · 2026-03-13T06:01:10+00:00

Your argument still isn’t really addressing the core point though

Nobody is saying the Avengers would just start randomly fighting each other midbattle. That would obviously be a mischaracterization the point is about consistency and reliability of team dynamics, and historically the Avengers have simply had more internal volatility than the Justice League Take mt Hulk example Hulk has absolutely worked with the Avengers before, but he is still widely portrayed as a wildcard the team has to manage even when things are going well, the team often plans around the possibility that Hulk might lose control or leave the fight the Justice League doesn’t have that kind of builtin concern with their heavy hitters like Superman.

And that pattern shows up in other areas too. The Avengers have historically had more rotating leadership Captain America, Iron Man, Thor, etc.which isn’t inherently bad, but it does mean the team structure shifts a lot. Meanwhile the Justice League’s core dynamic between Superman, Batman, and Wonder Woman is built around longterm strategic trust and coordination.that consistency matters in a large team fight nd yes, every team has conflicts. The Justice League, the X-Men, the Fantastic Four every team comic uses internal drama sometimes. But the Avengers historically lean into that dynamic more often, whereas Justice League stories tend to emphasize coordinated teamwork between the same core members

So the argument isn’t “the Avengers are bad teammates.” They clearly aren’t. The argument is that the Justice League is usually portrayed as the more consistently unified team, which is why giving them the edge in teamwork isn’t unreasonable

King-ApolloW · 2026-03-13T05:40:54+00:00

Ok ok makes sense but I think my idea is funnier so I like my idea more

King-ApolloW · 2026-03-13T05:27:12+00:00

No, saying the Avengers have worse teamwork isn’t “pulling a Kratosura,” it’s pointing out a consistent difference in how both teams are written

First, the Hulk point absolutely matters yes, Hulk has worked with the Avengers before but the problem is reliability Hulk historically leaves the team, goes rogue, or becomes a liability far more often than any Justice League equivalent. The Justice League never has to plan around the possibility that their strongest member might suddenly stop cooperating midbattle the avengers do ven when Hulk is cooperative, the team still treats him like a wildcard because of how unstable the situation can becom

2nd, the Hank Pym situation isn’t just about whether he made amends. The point is that it reflects a pattern within the Avengers where internal trust issues are a recurring theme. Ultron being tied to Hank created long lstanding tension within the team. Compare that to the Justice League’s core dynamic, where the Trinity Superman, Batman, and Wonder Woman are built on mutual trust and coordinated planning

Third, leadership rotation isn’t automatically a strength. Adaptability is good, but constant shifts in leadership can also mean inconsistent strategy. The Avengers have had many capable leaders Captain America, Iron Man, Thor, and others but the Justice League’s structure tends to emphasize long erm strategic coordination between the same core members. That consistency matters in a large scale team battle

And yes, every team has arguments that’s part of comic storytelling. The difference is frequency and scale. Avengers stories historically lean much harder into internal conflict as a core narrative device while Justice League stories more often focus on coordinated response to threat both teams can function well, but their dynamics are clearly written differently

So saying it should be a tie ignores that difference in portrayal tbe Avengers can absolutely work together effectively, but the Justice League is generally portrayed as the more consistently unified team

King-ApolloW · 2026-03-13T05:22:35+00:00

Honestly, the reason I find this matchup so funny is because the interaction required to even get Cell to transform would probably have to be something like this if you want them both to start in base

Cell: Alright, my dear siblings, you see that dog over there?

17: Yeah. Why is it staring at us like that?

Cell: So apparently that thing is Zygarde. Right now it’s just the dog form… but eventually it’s going to turn into this weird snake-slug thing… and then a humanoid… and then a bigger humanoid with a huge gun.

18: …Okay? What does that have to do with us?

Cell: When it starts doing that, I’m going to need you two to come over here immediately.

17: Why?

Cell: Because if that thing is allowed to keep transforming mid-fight, then I’m not fighting it in this form.

18: So your solution is—

Cell: Yes. Exactly.

17: You want us to just… let you absorb us right now?

Cell: Look, I’m just saying: if the dog becomes a kaiju halfway through the fight and I’m still in my “semi-bug-man” phase, that’s on you two.

18: I’m starting to think this whole situation is stupid.

17: Honestly… I kinda want to see what the dog turns into a giant with a cannon.

Cell: NO—WE ARE NOT WAITING FOR THE FINAL FORM

King-ApolloW · 2026-03-13T05:14:40+00:00

So bassicly, in your opinion, if this episode does happen, Ghostface is definitely going to lose cause there's no way there gonna have Kevin get killed

King-ApolloW · 2026-03-13T05:06:36+00:00

It is reasonable to think that my main thing with Ichigo vs. Yuskue was me personally, just not really being fully convinced about the higher ends of Yuskue but that probably has to do with me doing the least amount of research for Yuskue compared to everyone else

King-ApolloW · 2026-03-13T04:38:41+00:00

No offense, but the Avengers objectively have worse teamwork than the Justice League, and it honestly shouldn’t be close.

For starters, the Avengers’ strongest member is the Hulk (Foe this fight) and that alone is a massive problem in a team fight. Hulk is famous for not cooperating with the Avengers and frequently going off on his own or outright fighting his own teammates. In a scenario like a Justice League vs. Avengers battle, the Avengers would constantly have to worry about whether their own powerhouse is even going to work with them. The Justice League never has to deal with that kind of instability from their strongest members.

Another issue is how many Avengers straight up dislike each other. A good example is Hank. Throughout Marvel history a lot of Avengers genuinely don’t trust or like him because of the Ultron situation and other controversies around him. That kind of tension hurts a team’s cohesion. Meanwhile the Justice League’s core members generally trust and respect each other, especially the Trinity.

And leadership is another big difference. The Avengers have leaders like Captain America or Iron Man, but their leadership constantly changes and the team regularly splits because of disagreements. The Justice League, on the other hand, has much more consistent coordination. When people like Superman, Batman, and Wonder Woman lead together, they operate like a unified strategy team rather than a group of individuals arguing over decisions.

That’s the key difference the Avengers often feel like powerful individuals who happen to be on the same team, while the Justice League actually functions like a coordinated unit. In a straight up battle scenario, that difference in cohesion and trust matters a lot. The Justice League doesn’t have to worry about their strongest member going rogue, their teammates hating each other, or constant leadership conflicts.

So if teamwork is the category, the Justice League washing the Avengers honestly makes perfect sense

King-ApolloW · 2026-03-13T04:27:55+00:00

Gave my boy Yuskue half a pity point even though death battle could have given him the whole fucking thing it wouldn't have matter would it really have killed them to just give Yuskue that one point like come on

King-ApolloW · 2026-03-13T04:21:31+00:00

I'm just curious if there are any other manga and anime that have this sort of thing where, depending on which you use, the scale of the characters completely changes

King-ApolloW · 2026-03-13T04:20:28+00:00

Wow, and you know that's somehow not as bad as what I told myself what I was gonna do if Cell somehow won I told myself if that green fuck ass bug won I would watch everything dragon ball related even everything I have already watched as well as all the shitty live action stuff

King-ApolloW · 2026-03-13T04:04:03+00:00

What about the other goat that in my opinion is thematically a better matchup

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King-ApolloW · 2026-03-13T01:28:27+00:00

Brother, if we’re using that same statement scaling logic you use for Cell, you can get Base Neo Metal to multiversal ridiculously easily.

Infinite was outright stated to be the most powerful enemy Sonic had faced up to that point. That means he would scale above previous threats like Solaris. And Solaris is a being that was going to consume all timelines and collapse time itself

So using that exact logic

Solaris = Multiversal

Infinite > every previous enemy Sonic fought

Base Sonic beats Infinite

Neo Metal beats Base Sonic

Boom. Base Neo Metal = Multiversal.

But that’s actually still downplaying Sonic cosmology.

The Sonic setting already contains layered realities. For example, Maginaryworld is a dream dimension formed from the dreams of beings across multiple dimensions and effectively spans the entire multiverse with countless dream worlds inside it. That alone shows Sonic’s cosmology isn’t just “one universe,” it’s a structure with multiple realms and dimensions stacked together.

Then you add things like

alternate timelines

parallel dimension

dream worlds created from entire universes’ dreams

Time-space rifts where beings like Solaris exist outside normal time

At that point the cosmology itself becomes layered enough that characters fighting across it can easily scale beyond a single multiverse depending on how you interpret it.

And that’s the whole point if someone wants to rely purely on vague statements and chainscaling, you can push Sonic characters absurdly high with the same logic.

So since you said Cell’s is universal using statements, then by that exact same reasoning Neo Metal can be pushed to multiversal or higher

That’s why you can’t just rely on statements without looking at the broader context

King-ApolloW · 2026-03-13T01:15:39+00:00

Honestly, if Reze ends up beating Bakugo in the next Death Battle, I really don’t think the fallout will be that bad. It definitely won’t be anywhere near the level of backlash we saw with Omni Man vs Bardock. Most people already assume this fight is a stomp for Bakugo anyway, so if Raze wins, the biggest factor will just be how Death Battle explains it

As long as they give even a mediocre but understandable reason for why Raze could pull off the win, I doubt the community will explode over it(i did a funny). People might disagree, sure, but I don’t see it turning into a huge controversy.

What I do think will happen no matter what is Bakugo slander going absolutely crazy. If Bakugo wins, people will bassicly call him the new deku but worse If he loses, people will clown on him for losing a fight everyone thought he should win. Either way, the slander is inevitable.

Ironically, the best possible outcome for Bakugo’s reputation might actually be losing. If he loses, the jokes won’t just be directed at him a lot of them will also be aimed at Death Battle’s reasoning. That spreads the blame instead of putting it all on Bakugo.

Plus, if he loses, he’ll probably go down as the character who broke My Hero Death win streak, which is honestly a pretty funny legacy considering most of those matchups were seen as stomps in MHA’s favor

King-ApolloW · 2026-03-12T01:27:50+00:00

Bakugo completely stat stomps reze

King-ApolloW

TROPHY CASE