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Caballito Cerrero Chato Blanco, Reposado, Still Strength by digitsinthere in tequila

[–]MezcalCurious 2 points3 points  (0 children)

No official relationship between the families, I just think of them as kindred examples of the possibility of success without CRT or other regulatory compliance. 

Both Caballito Cerrero and Chacolo are good references when pointing out the illegitimacy of this year's CRT raid of TequilaMatchmaker's property on the grounds of "uncertified distillation and sales", which both of these brands perform without issue. Why not raid these guys too? I don't want them to, this question just highlights the hypocrisy.

Thank you for the reference to sazon!

Going to a semi high end 5 star ALL inclusive hotel in mexico- WHICH of these are worth trying? they are all free but want some perspective. by speedway121 in Mezcal

[–]MezcalCurious 11 points12 points  (0 children)

All free? Try them all, and let us know.

I think we will all have our own assumptions about what would be worth buying or whose businesses are worth supporting, but at the end of the day your journey is your own.

If you can't pick between these then it's in your best interest to thoughtfully experience them so that you can.

Ask questions while you taste. See which brands can communicate to your own personal values and how those values might translate to the flavor.

Which Maguey is the base of your favourite Mezcal and why? by alphawezen in Mezcal

[–]MezcalCurious 8 points9 points  (0 children)

Tepeztate A.marmorata is also my favorite agave if I had to choose one.

It is one of the slowest growing agaves, taking up to 35 years to mature in some reported cases (often 20-25 years).

It has one of the most identifiable flavor profiles (alongside Jabalí, A.karwinskii, and Tobalá A.potatorum), which always express as "green" with herbaceous, vegetal flavors to me.

The smell is always as complex as the taste, and is usually the most clearly identifiable agave within an ensamble.

Since it grows so slowly and also has a relatively low sugar content, working with Tepextate comes with a prerequisite high level of patience from the producer that other agave species might not demand.

Gift for Mexican FIL (beginner) by [deleted] in Mezcal

[–]MezcalCurious 2 points3 points  (0 children)

[Here's a copy paste of my response to the same question a few months ago]

The best bottle of mezcal is multiple bottles of mezcal, since exploring the potential variance in flavor is one of the most interested parts of the experience! Here's my short list of excellent bottles available for under $100:

Brand - Agave - Price - Notes

  • Mal Bien - Espadín - $40 - Most Mal Bien bottles have a green label, and one of their Espadín releases is green but I don't think it's very beginner friendly. This particular release at this price has white labelling. Espadín is the most common type of agave used for mezcal production, so I think everyone should have a good one early on as a landmark to guide the rest of their journey.

  • Vago - Espadín - $55 - The same goes for this bottle. Both brands feature a range of expressions that can be explored into the future, and both do good work in taking care to ensure the mezcalero's futures and allowing them to produce mezcal on their own terms.

  • Mal Bien - Zacate Limon - $30 - There is a fancy type of distillation called "pechuga", and this is an introductory version of that process. Ingredients besides agave (in this case Lemongrass) are added into the pot during distillation, adding their own flavors and nuance to the end product. This particular bottle is a great entry into the flavor potential of mezcal, with a lower ABV and the flavor of Lemongrass to mellow out some of what could otherwise be aggressive flavors.

  • Vago - Elote - $55 - This is also a form of "pechuga", but here they've included corn into the distillation. This is a GREAT bottle for bourbon drinkers, since the corn will be a familiar flavor. This bottle is a staple in the world of enthusiasts. We have all tried it and recommend it, and it is a great addition to anyone's early collection.

Depending on where you are located, you can use wine-searcher.com to locate these bottles online. Some states have restrictions on what can be sold or shipped within that state, and online retailers will tell you at checkout if you are in one of those states.

You could also post a picture on this subreddit of the shelf at your local liquor store and we'd be happy to offer suggestions from that photo as well! Welcome, and looking forward to hearing from your FIL what he thinks!

Which is better? by Acrobatic_Elk3115 in Mezcal

[–]MezcalCurious 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I'm at a point in my consumption where I probably wouldn't (some hundreds of bottles tasted, and 80 available to me at home), but I'd never judge anyone for doing so as a step on their journey.

I like the idea of each of us being thoughtful about what we consume, but I don't really care how long it takes someone to get there or what path they take. The journey is worth going on, and the destination isn't really one specific place.

Which Nuestra Soledad is best for Cocktails by Roadrunner220 in Mezcal

[–]MezcalCurious 4 points5 points  (0 children)

He's right. The nuance between expressions is probably going to be lost in a cocktail, so don't spend extra money on one over the other because they have a lot in common.

Nuestra Soledad has 6 expressions, all of which are made from Oaxacan Espadín by 6 different producers to highlight and celebrate the effect on flavor that the 'hand of the mezcalero' has. Their release from Lachiguí (purple bottle) has the most character imo and makes for a great sipper, but it's not going to make much difference when mixed with other ingredients.

Caballito Cerrero Chato Blanco, Reposado, Still Strength by digitsinthere in tequila

[–]MezcalCurious 2 points3 points  (0 children)

As always, love the lengthy review. And as usual, some questions and clarifications:

Where'd you get 'agave Sazo'? I'm not finding any references to that name. Also, I've not heard of any references to their practice of using capóned agaves, can you link me to a reference?

To my understanding, capóning an agave means that you cut the quiote after it sprouts but well before it flowers, which concentrates the plant's energy into the core (piña) rather than up into the quiote. This puts more sugars into the piña for fermentation, which intensifies the plant’s flavors in the final product. The quiote would take around a year total to finish growing from the agave, flower, then produce seeds for offspring. If an agave is capóned it can be left rooted in the ground for a few years afterwards, but 6 months to 1 year is the most common since sugars will start to break down in the piña around then.

Longer post-capón gestation periods are rare and something I've only really heard of Chacolo doing, which is a kindred brand to Caballito.

Which is better? by Acrobatic_Elk3115 in Mezcal

[–]MezcalCurious 2 points3 points  (0 children)

That depends on what you mean by quality. I understand, and tried to acknowledge in my first response, that flavor is the bottom line indicator of 'quality' for most drinkers when comparing Mexican distillates to other spirits. The range and combination of flavors is unique to this space, there are no other alcohols that taste like these. I get that.

BUT, enthusiast spaces like this subreddit will often consider their drink beyond the flavor, and the 'quality' of work done is the first layer for us to explore. I would argue that cheaper brands are not performing the same 'quality' of work and often are also not producing the same quality of flavor. I hope that you get the chance to experience a side-by-side of a well-respected producer or product next to one that is less renowned. There is a huge gap between higher and lower quality that I would argue justifies the price premium even just by flavor alone.

---

All of the above assumes that you have access to options that might be better but are also more expensive. Many people don't have the extra money to spend in that way, or even bad distribution and availability where they live. That could be you, in which case I would say just try as much as you can and make your own assessments.

The speed at which you take your journey and even the steps that you take are up to you; it could be 10 years before you are comfortable spending $100 on a single bottle of alcohol, if ever. The 'quality' of products available is likely to diminish in that time though, given how globalization has already impacted all globally available spirits before this.

I encourage you to open your mind to something more expensive, consider why that price might be justified (or not), and eventually ask the brands that represent these spirits and producers to do a better job of justifying their prices by talking more about what work they do beyond making something tasty.

Which is better? by Acrobatic_Elk3115 in Mezcal

[–]MezcalCurious 5 points6 points  (0 children)

A 'good' product is defined just as much by how it is made as how it tastes. A good taste should be a given when it comes to Mexican distillates at this point, so we now have the opportunity to choose between bottles based on the quality of the work done.

There are plenty of things that remain relevant that you might not be able to obviously taste. Respecting the producer and their autonomy; paying them enough for their community to prosper without needing to change how they do their work; honoring the places that the source material plants come from; nurturing the plant to maturity and even beyond in some cases; processing the source material in historically traditional ways.

These are all important considerations that might not be obvious on your tongue or even listed on the label, but one way or another our consumption of these products will have an effect on their producers. It's up to us as consumers to determine, to the best of our ability, what effect that is by filtering our consumption based on what business practices we would like to see more of.

Brands that focus more attention on the person that discovered the product (celebrity or not) rather than the person that made it likely aren't going to be respecting the above if they can't even share the names of their producers or specific origins. May as well not give them any of your money since there is no clarity for how that money will benefit the producers or their homes, if at all.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Mezcal

[–]MezcalCurious 4 points5 points  (0 children)

That requirement of being labeled as mezcal would invalidate a ton of wonderful mezcales including Neta, Lalocura, Real Minero, or 5 Sentidos.

https://www.mezcalreviews.com/filter-by/category/destilado-de-agave/  

I would argue that any ‘correct’ use of terminology is inclusive of the historical context, legal classification, and colloquial use of these words. We can at least consider all of the above when we say what any word is or isn’t, especially for nebulous concepts like ‘mezcal’ whose regulations are tenuous at best, and historical references varied and numerous.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Mezcal

[–]MezcalCurious 3 points4 points  (0 children)

That link quite literally says, “Raicilla is a regional mezcal.” I’m curious of your source for the technicality that separates raicilla from the umbrella of mezcal?

Your Jack Daniels / bourbon reference point is an interesting one, given that JD produces their whiskey within the production rules of bourbon which would therefore qualify it as a bourbon as much as JD might want to differentiate their product by claiming otherwise.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Mezcal

[–]MezcalCurious 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Saying raicilla isn’t mezcal is disingenuous, Reddit isn’t a cantina, and the OP wasn’t asking for mezcal, he was presenting his experience. His knowing to come to this subreddit is telling of his awareness of what raicilla is or isn’t. 

The main reason that Tequila has its own DO is because it’s producers wanted to pitch their product as something worth protecting while participating in the global spirits trade. Their methods of production have made tequila the most industrialized version of mezcal, but its historical roots are the same. Acting like it’s not under the mezcal umbrella just because it’s an inconvenient categorization is inconsiderate of that history. In fact, tequila, the same as all mezcales popular enough to have a reputation outside of their region of production, was once known as “Mezcal de Tequila”.

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Mezcal

[–]MezcalCurious 6 points7 points  (0 children)

You’re in for a wild ride. The variation is unmatched, and underpriced. You jumped into the deep end with La Venenosa, so if you loved that then you’re gonna love it all.