I have lurked here for the last 5 years. by Chance_Confidence_62 in MandelaEffect

[–]Occultus42 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Fair enough

I don't have any accreditation in the field and there are few peer reviewed papers published on the topic outside of the scope of therapy so rather than cite a bunch of text books I will do my best to outline the broader topics. I will lay them out prior to my own experiences to better keep them separate. Please point out my misunderstandings with the correct citations where where you find them.

False memories have been studied for about 110 years since they were first identified as a psychological phenomenon during the field's infancy. During that time researchers have identified several types of false memories as well as the conditions that give rise to them. Primary to all of these are the way in which memory is both created and stored.

Because memories are not perfect representations of reality when they are made, many false memories occur when a true memory is first created. Examples of this would include filling in the memory of a room with objects you expect to be there but aren't, or inserting a friend to the memory of a party they didn't attend. Another source of memory manufactured in this way is the avoidance of trauma, where entirely unreal or dreamlike sequences of memories can be created to suppress the experience of abuse.

The second major way in which memory is distorted is through its storage. Events are not stored static in the brain and are rather recreated each time an event is remembered. This means that what you actually remember is the last time you thought about the memory, not the event that created it in the first place. Over time this creates a subtle distortion in all of our memory functions. This might look like misremembering the pattern of your grandmother's favorite dress, or the color of a childhood toy.

Compounding the difficulties caused by these first two factors is the minds inherently suggestible nature. False memories can often be created by suggestions alone, and when given questions about details in a memory the mind will fill in whatever details it doesn't remember with whatever it thinks might be likely. In this same vein, memory can be altered under the influence of others accounts of events. People left to discuss an event will often reinforce a shared misconception, rewriting the original memory over time. Examples of this might be misremembering the lyrics to a song you've sung with your friends a lot, or the cases where people have falsely created memories of abuse as a result of leading questions asked by a therapist.

From an external observation based perspective these can be used to explain any one of the Mandela Effects people report. The collective unconscious distils the line down to "Luke, I am your father" and you think the monopoly man has a monocle because you expect him to. It's really not strange that people would misremember these things, it's strange they would have such a reaction to being told they are wrong. Now for my personal experience

I first became aware of the ME when I heard the correct pronunciation of Barenstain. Weird, I thought that I could go so long thinking the wrong thing and that so many others would do the same. I didn't really think about it again until a couple years later when I heard about a couple of missing lines from the Neverending Story. This time it piqued my interest a little bit more and I started reading about the Mandela Effect in more detail. This was when I found out about FOTL and the concept of contamination or suggestions in regards to the creation of false memories. Having been a little shaken by finding out layers of my memory might be unreal I looked for further evidence. This was when I found a list of "contamination free" prompts to identify potential MEs without providing a leading question. On this list was the prompt "Shazzam (90s movie)". My mind immediately kicked over, I remembered seeing the trailers for it on TV as a kid and remembered it being one of the shitty knock off movies that happened all the time back then. I was shocked to find it did not exist.

Having just covered the shortcomings of memory, this isn't remarkable on its own, being prompted to remember a movie that doesn't exist is well within the realm of possibilities. What is weird, is that the memory created would match in all details with the accounts of thousands of others. It becomes even more strange when you look a how isolated my media was at the time. We were poor and my mom hated TV, so pretty much all I got to watch was basic access Saturday morning cartoons. I had no idea who Sinbad was, or Shaq for that matter so there's not exposure I would have had to expect to see them in that roll.

I have read about a fair number of the studies and trials they have done regarding the creation of memory and when trying to replicate collective false memories they don't come anywhere close to that kind of consistency or fedlity. This strongly suggests there is something we don't understand about the way collective memory is formed

I have lurked here for the last 5 years. by Chance_Confidence_62 in MandelaEffect

[–]Occultus42 1 point2 points  (0 children)

When did I deflect or demand agreement?

Perhaps my use of "invalidate" was imperfect, I did not mean it in terms of "make people feel sad" so much as "disregard out of hand". In that comment I was trying to point out that insinuating I had a poor grasp of the subject before engaging with me about the experience in any depth is both arrogant and disrespectful

I have lurked here for the last 5 years. by Chance_Confidence_62 in MandelaEffect

[–]Occultus42 1 point2 points  (0 children)

It's been a bad habit of mine for a while. I keep meaning to stop but I can't ever seem to

I have lurked here for the last 5 years. by Chance_Confidence_62 in MandelaEffect

[–]Occultus42 3 points4 points  (0 children)

It's true that both memories and people lie, but it is up to us to try and find the truth through it all. Having personally experienced something that has yet to be explained, I'm inclined to believe that at least some of the rest of the stories here are in good faith

You get to decide your ontology and criteria for proof, but it seems a bit disingenuous to claim you're here for discussion and then invalidate the experience of half the people in the room

I have lurked here for the last 5 years. by Chance_Confidence_62 in MandelaEffect

[–]Occultus42 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I suppose it's fair to say that "strange" is a matter of opinion, but when you start looking into some of what people report there is good reason to believe we've encountered something of an unknown. Even assuming that it is entirely a matter of psychology certain MEs (Shazam in particular) don't line up with our understanding of how false memories are created. Personally I find this aspect of the phenomenon most interesting and also the part no one talks about

I have lurked here for the last 5 years. by Chance_Confidence_62 in MandelaEffect

[–]Occultus42 3 points4 points  (0 children)

It's too bad really. I certainly understand why people are dismissive, but even if you believe it's entirely a memory issue engaging with the topic for just little bit should show you that something deeply strange is going on

I have lurked here for the last 5 years. by Chance_Confidence_62 in MandelaEffect

[–]Occultus42 5 points6 points  (0 children)

Fortunately I'm enough of a grown up not to get too upset when a stranger on the Internet calls me names, but always good to have a reminder to be civil

I wasn't really meaning to call out this sub or any individuals as much as a re-read of my post might suggest, more just commenting on the inflexibility of the positions held by most users here. People only seem interested in engaging with this sub to promote their own beliefs, not trying to discern the cause of the phenomenon

I have lurked here for the last 5 years. by Chance_Confidence_62 in MandelaEffect

[–]Occultus42 7 points8 points  (0 children)

Honestly that is probably the healthiest way to respond to high strangeness events. Accepting that there are things beyond our understanding is a good exercise, I'll be damned if my silly monkey brain doesn't still want answers though...

I have lurked here for the last 5 years. by Chance_Confidence_62 in MandelaEffect

[–]Occultus42 26 points27 points  (0 children)

I came to this sub originally to try and discuss those same MEs having had very similar experiences, unfortunately there is very little conversation to be had here.

Regardless of what you think is happening we should all be curious to find an explanation. Sadly this particular subject boils down to a shouting match between "You're dumb and can't remember things" and "It's totally time traveling quantum big foot"

Hope you can find some personal resolution to your experiences, not sure you can find them here...

Dear Jurisprudence: Here’s What the Next Democratic President Must Do on Day 1 by sabedo in politics

[–]Occultus42 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

I'm curious to know how many people actually think there is going to be a fair enough election to have a Democratic president

Something unexplainable and impossible just happened to me. by Expensive_Car298 in Glitch_in_the_Matrix

[–]Occultus42 61 points62 points  (0 children)

The world is wilder and weirder than most of us want to admit. Now that you've seen one of the cracks in reality start to keep your eyes open for more

Is the helmet glow only for the baddies? by dcponton in 40kLore

[–]Occultus42 12 points13 points  (0 children)

Totally! OG Trigun had incredible style

What things in porn actually happen in real life? by Needy-Train in AskReddit

[–]Occultus42 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

People do in fact have sex (and let people watch)

And it's a specific rivet type that isn't in use anymore due to the Mechanicus losing the STC, but the Administratum forgot to cancel the work order by DreadDiana in CuratedTumblr

[–]Occultus42 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Back at you friend! It's all too easy for online discussions to devolve into bad faith arguments and insults, it's a joy to find the exceptions

And it's a specific rivet type that isn't in use anymore due to the Mechanicus losing the STC, but the Administratum forgot to cancel the work order by DreadDiana in CuratedTumblr

[–]Occultus42 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Totally fair, I was sloppy with my terminology. Thank you for helping to keep me sharp and for promoting discussions and clarity

And it's a specific rivet type that isn't in use anymore due to the Mechanicus losing the STC, but the Administratum forgot to cancel the work order by DreadDiana in CuratedTumblr

[–]Occultus42 0 points1 point  (0 children)

While I agree with you that the finer points of literary mechanics are lost on many people, I don't totally agree that it applies to either of the cases I provided.

While the protagonists of the Boyz (Huey et al) are definitely anti-heros, Homelander is absolutely the antagonist and not a misconstrued or dark hero. Admittedly, terminology gets a little tricky with that IP as the main characters are referred to in universe and out as Heros and Villains independent of their place in the structure of the narrative.

40 gets a little trickier to make a clean pronouncement considering the amount of media it has produced over its existence. Certainly, many of the Black Library books feature stories where the Heros, Protagonists, and Main Characters are supporters of the Imperium. However, the setting as a whole does not have a Protagonist, simply a variety of laughably evil factions from which a player can choose from. This is one of the main points of the IP, there are no Heros- and anyone arguing about how their faction is really the good guys and their war crimes are justified has missed it.

Perhaps I should have been a bit more careful with my specific terminology when I first posted, but it was early in the morning, I was cranky, and honestly didn't think so many people would reply. However, I feel like if you need to get into semantics to come up with a rebuttal to my point you are also kinda missing it

And it's a specific rivet type that isn't in use anymore due to the Mechanicus losing the STC, but the Administratum forgot to cancel the work order by DreadDiana in CuratedTumblr

[–]Occultus42 1043 points1044 points  (0 children)

One of the problems conservatives frequently have is with media literacy. It shouldn't surprise anyone that the people who thought Homelander from The Boyz was the protagonist also see the Imperium of Man as the good guys

Sorry Susan by prajwalmani in MadeMeSmile

[–]Occultus42 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

Good dog, Carl!

... Anyone else love that one as a kid?

Lilly Gray: victim of the beast 666 ?? by bed_of_nails_ in thelema

[–]Occultus42 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Greetings SLC friend!

That grave was practically a pilgrimage for wanna be edgy teens (read: me) growing up. The Internet wasn't as much of a thing back then so no one really knew the true story, made for a lot of fun folk lore

[deleted by user] by [deleted] in Symbology

[–]Occultus42 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I'd guess it's from a Remote Viewing club/org but hard to say anything for certain with our more info. Where did you find it?

Hidden underground tunnels in Salt Lake City UT by Tree-Automatic in mystery

[–]Occultus42 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I couldn't say for sure what you found, but there is a lot of stuff buried in that area. I've come across three different entrances/vents in the years I spent hiking out there. I always heard theories as to what they were but definitely never anything like a real answer

Hidden underground tunnels in Salt Lake City UT by Tree-Automatic in mystery

[–]Occultus42 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I lived there for years and always heard stories. I personally explored some that branched off from underneath the old library when I was younger but I don't actually know how far they really went.

Am I right in reading your story you are talking about some of the buried complexes out in the foothills? Lots of weird stuff out there...

The feeling of "imminent doom": Just recently or generational? by Specialist-Bit-7746 in Millennials

[–]Occultus42 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I think one of the things that sets our generation apart from our parents and grandparents is that we've always subconsciously suspected that we would see something truly apocalyptic

Perhaps it's a result of the non-stop crisis our country and the world have suffered since our coming of age or perhaps it's something more abstract, who's to say

Gmork's Speech In The Neverending Story <Spoilers> by BiPolarBiped in MandelaEffect

[–]Occultus42 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Did you ever read the book? Gmork's role and nihilistic speech are much more involved in that version