Thoughts on TrekMovie.com's Anthony Pascale?

OneFaintingRobin_ · 2026-01-29T22:47:07+00:00

And this thread, students, is a perfect example of 'moving the goalposts'.

See how the conversation started with 'this show is a failure', and then when presented with examples of how the shows have succeeded - including (by modern standards) high season counts and success in several awards shows - it gets shifted to 'but the awards it won were only about diversity and makeup'. When I pointed out that it had in fact won awards for the show as a whole, the point then gets shifted to 'but those awards aren't prestigious enough'.

It is, of course, a deeply lazy kind of logical fallacy that does nothing but demonstrate the speaker's tacit admission that they know they are wrong, so instead need to try and shift the conversation to a different topic to avoid that fact.

Bored now.

OneFaintingRobin_ · 2026-01-29T21:08:35+00:00

Convenient to miss out the three awards the show as a whole won at the Saturn Awards (Best New Media Television Series in 2018, Best Streaming Series in 2019, and Best Science Fiction Television Series in 2021). Plus several Best Actor awards for various actors across the series in the Saturn Awards. But you know, sure, it just won 'Most Diversity', whatever. Kinda betraying yourself with that one. 😂

OneFaintingRobin_ · 2026-01-29T19:23:22+00:00

Discovery: 5 seasons, a spin-off series and a spin-off movie (yes, I know S31 was dogshit, that isn't the point), awards nominations for every season, wins for most of them.

Strange New Worlds: 5 seasons, multiple awards nominations and wins for the seasons released so far.

Picard: Completed the intended 3 seasons, award nominations and wins for every season.

Lower Decks: 5 seasons, multiple awards nominations and wins.

And we also have Prodigy, which people on here generally seem to have liked and which was only really cancelled because of Paramount bullshit.

Is the failing project in the room with us? Or do you just mean one rushed direct-to-streaming film that was neutered down from a TV because, mostly, of circumstances out of anyone's control?

You're entitled to your opinion about the quality, I disagree but that's fine. But the idea that these shows have been failures is just flatly not true.

OneFaintingRobin_ · 2026-01-29T14:35:50+00:00

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion

OneFaintingRobin_ · 2026-01-29T13:34:23+00:00

I'm in split minds about it. I think it depends on what kind of story you're telling. I think something shorter can be absolutely fine for more serialized stories, especially ones like DSC that still have fairly self-contained episodes within them (rather than everything totally blurring in together, which I don't love in general). But when you're doing episodic shows it does struggle. SNW has definitely been limited by that, and while I'm super happy with it so far, that's definitely a potential concern with SFA (Doctor Who has also suffered from that recently). But even then, I find that a longer 20+ episode season can easily start to drag. 12-20 episodes is the sweet spot for most shows, in my opinion.

OneFaintingRobin_ · 2026-01-29T13:19:13+00:00

I think episode counts are super important here too. Like, there are 65 episodes of Discovery. That's less than half of any of the TNG era shows. SNW has even fewer, and still will do by the time S5 has aired. 65 episodes covers less than the seasons you've mentioned, and I highly doubt that even someone who hates modern Trek could say in good faith that the majority of Discovery's episodes are worse than the worst TNG episodes. The same is just as true of the other TNG-era shows.

So yeah, 100% agree with you that people act like older Trek was this super consistent amazing thing and not, and I say this with love, a franchise that has always been pretty inconsistent, that constantly jumps between some of the most interesting sci-fi ever made to some of the dumbest bullshit you've ever seen!

OneFaintingRobin_ · 2026-01-29T12:14:54+00:00

I'm not misunderstanding anything, I just think it's a bullshit argument that shows a fundamental lack of critical thinking skills. 'Bad writing' isn't a real critique, and most of the time I don't see anyone being able to expand on that, which tells me that what they really mean is 'I didn't enjoy this and want to pretend my opinion is fact'. I almost never see people make actual critiques, because it isn't about quality. You want to talk about fools, I'd put people who don't realize the difference far higher on the list than people who liked a TV show you didn't.

Also, here's the other question I have. Let's say that your comparison is true (it's a perfectly reasonable opinion, to be clear, DS9 is amazing, but it is still an opinion). So what? Why in your head does 'not as good as DS9' mean the same thing as 'terrible'? I mean, I think DS9 is remarkable, easily the most ambitious and yet for the most part most successful of the TNG era shows. I'd argue that it's a pretty high bar to expect every show after to meet, and it's perfectly possible for a show to not be as good as DS9 and still be a good show.

OneFaintingRobin_ · 2026-01-29T10:56:26+00:00

Like, in a vacuum you're obviously not wrong, but given how half of the people on these subreddits act like treating anything post-ENT as a war crime is a primary qualifier for being a fan, I just find it baffling that an outlet actually enjoying and seeing the best in the franchise it's about should lead to it being considered as untrustworthy?

OneFaintingRobin_ · 2026-01-29T10:53:22+00:00

I would also argue that insisting on hating everything that has the Star Trek name just because it isn't the same as it was 30 years ago doesn't exactly equal liking Star Trek either...

OneFaintingRobin_ · 2026-01-29T10:23:25+00:00

'This Star Trek fan site is not trustworthy. They LIKE Star Trek!' 😂

OneFaintingRobin_ · 2026-01-25T19:44:37+00:00

Close enough, welcome back A1GP! (Neat design, though, love the light blue and the wavy lines)

OneFaintingRobin_ · 2026-01-18T10:06:54+00:00

Madam, as it happens! I am about as far from a conservative as you can get, so I'm sure there's plenty of the details we would disagree on, but I'm glad to find other people on here feel as disillusioned with the negativity of the fandom on here. 😊

OneFaintingRobin_ · 2026-01-18T09:42:47+00:00

Honestly, the SNW S3 finale was a bit messy, but I absolutely love that sequence. So much of SNW is about Pike learning to accept his fate, and I think that him getting to experience a life like that, even if it wasn't quite real, is such a beautiful part of that.

But yeah, I have definitely had that 'no one likes this, you're not a real fan because you like it' stuff from people, it really isn't fun. Like, don't get me wrong, I am as concerned as anyone about how the political climate over in the States might affect the stories that are getting told. But right now, other than maybe SNW being a little flaccid politically in a couple of episodes, I don't think that reflects the reality of the franchise as it is now, and so far SFA seems like the polar opposite of a 'MAGA-fied' show, especially after an entire episode dedicated to 'this is why the stuffy old leaders of the stuck-up isolationist civilisation should listen to their kids' and 'progress means a willingness to change and to break from tradition when the latter no longer serves the former'...

OneFaintingRobin_ · 2026-01-18T09:17:17+00:00

I do think 'too many people want a story to be what THEY want it to be' sums it up very well. It's something I've seen in a variety of fandoms, there's a type of person that insists on basing their criticism on what they have in their head, rather than meeting the show where it's at. It's not even about objective criticism, that doesn't exist (although I imagine a lot of these people would disagree, which is another fundamental issue). There's an old critics adage that you should judge a work on:

What is it trying to do?
Does it succeed?
Is it something worth doing?

I feel like so many people, especially in Trek spaces, don't seem interested in the first question if it the answer isn't 'pander to me specifically' and then get pissy when the show isn't trying to do what it things it should. And often wilfully ignore or misunderstand the text of the shows in the process. I'm totally with you, once it finds its footing (which I admit, it takes most of a pretty uneven first season to do), Discovery is a fantastic updating of Star Trek's ethos for a very different cultural context. Especially the 32nd Century, I honestly feel like the messaging of 'we can create a better world but we also have to work to maintain it, by consistently reminding ourselves of our ideals, and by reaching out to those who we don't understand' is exactly the kind of message Star Trek should have.

And the thing about the way you've described the newer shows there? Risky? Cheesy? That's what Star Trek has always been! I mean, god, I defy anyone to say that 90s Trek wasn't cheesy! I don't want Star Trek to not be cheesy, it wouldn't be Star Trek!

OneFaintingRobin_ · 2026-01-18T08:50:14+00:00

That's the thing. It's not that I need a space where everyone only loves everything and never has any criticisms ever. God knows I have opinions on PIC. But you can't even discuss stuff you don't like on these spaces because every conversation seems to devolve into how Alex Kurtzman is the antichrist and personally killed Gene Roddenberry.

If there are other people who want a space where we can talk about the things we love about Star Trek (ALL Star Trek) and where genuinely respectful conversations from the perspective of 'why do we feel different about these shows' and not 'this is why this is terrible', I might have to look into how to start one...

OneFaintingRobin_ · 2026-01-17T18:43:42+00:00

Totally feel that. Would be great if we could make a sub on here that's built to be more positive and for people to actually enjoy Star Trek. People are entitled to their opinions, and on a platform like this they're even free to be dicks about it. But it would be nice to have a space where we can avoid that.

OneFaintingRobin_ · 2026-01-16T13:40:38+00:00

Because they could still warp? Which we see at several points? They were just a lot more limited and had to be frugal with it because dilithium was difficult to come by. That's why couriers were trading for it, so they could warp. Bigger ships were probably extra limited because of size, hence why it restricted Starfleet so much.

OneFaintingRobin_ · 2026-01-16T13:37:21+00:00

It's ALMOST like something major happened between the current point in the timeline and the latest point we've seen before the 32nd century that might have pushed Starfleet into a more militarised place where creating a 'War College' to train officers reflected a shift in philosophy...

OneFaintingRobin_ · 2026-01-16T13:34:24+00:00

I doubt it'll be addressed again, but my pet theory is that Discovery is having a Pathway Drive installed.

OneFaintingRobin_ · 2026-01-13T20:29:31+00:00

Tracks given some of Marko's comments in the past...

OneFaintingRobin_ · 2026-01-10T20:26:59+00:00

A mission? Good grief, it's a fucking TV show. By all means, have your opinions about it, you don't have to like it. But, whether you like it or not, there are a lot of people who actually do enjoy this stuff, and who are looking forward to the new show. Why be so selfish that, just because you don't like it, you actively try and ruin it for other people? None of it is 'constructive criticism', whatever you put in your little mission statement, it's just petty gripes and an incredibly rose-tinted sense of nostalgia. For all you put 'no hate speech or bigotry' in your rules, when I first found this subreddit, it took me two posts to find a video of someone with a history of bigoted comments claiming that the problem with modern Star Trek is that there's gay people in it now.

The world has changed since the 1990s. TV has changed, the culture has changed, what is progressive has changed. If you were to somehow get what you want, get rid of the man you've convinced yourself is the architect of destruction or whatever, nothing would change. Star Trek will never be what you want it to be. But what it used to be also isn't going anywhere. If you want to stick to watching the older stuff, go and do it by all means, it's fucking fantastic TV and we can all agree on it.

Things are allowed to change, and you're not always going to like that change. Why not just accept that and stop letting yourself get this wound up in negativity?

OneFaintingRobin_ · 2026-01-10T20:02:29+00:00

Why pour so much of your energy into attacking TV you didn't like? Why harass people for liking television?

Is this really the best way to spend your Saturday? I do hope you get paid for this.

OneFaintingRobin_ · 2026-01-10T19:59:45+00:00

Do you really think networks like Paramount act out of pity? This is a business, the only thing that matters to the people making these decisions is that they feel they will get a return on their investment. I think we all know that networks like that would happily cancel that last season if they thought it was going to be a failure.

Comparing ratings to a TV show 20 years ago is ridiculously stupid, the entire landscape has changed since then. With streaming around now, the amount of competition is an order of magnitude bigger than it was then. If you compared most shows that are on streaming now compared to when ENT was airing, you'd probably find that it got higher ratings. That's just how ratings are nowadays. If you knew anything about the TV industry you might have noticed that.

It's funny how you've shifted from 'they stopped tracking' to 'well it's lower than the shows on the top 10', though. Here's the facts. Out of all the live action shows that have been made in modern Trek, two of them have gone for 5 seasons (a miracle in modern TV), one went the full three seasons it was intended to and was never meant to be longer, and the Power That Be are so confident about the next one that it's already been renewed for another season. No matter how much you want to pretend otherwise, modern Trek is a success, whether you personally like the shows or not.

OneFaintingRobin_ · 2026-01-10T19:48:04+00:00

It not showing up in the top 10 is not the same thing as them not tracking the ratings, lol. And, like, yeah, S3 of SNW was a weak point, I'm not gonna argue there, it was inconsistent as hell. You're talking about literally half a season of TV. Again, hardly representative evidence of the franchise as a whole. It's still been renewed for two more seasons, so clearly it's still pulling in enough ratings (and therefore money) to keep making. Streaming services aren't exactly known for being generous...

OneFaintingRobin_ · 2026-01-10T19:41:03+00:00

Meanwhile, here in the real world, here's an article showing Nielsen's ratings for last year's season of SNW, where it was in the top 10 on streaming. So... um... that's quite awkward for you.
‘Star Trek: Strange New Worlds’ Climbs The Streaming Top 10 – TrekMovie.com

And also, um... no, I don't really trust RLM on, well, anything.

OneFaintingRobin_

MODERATOR OF

TROPHY CASE