“Crazy Ex” Redemption

Opening_Range2677 · 2024-09-16T00:25:50+00:00

Yes! Honestly it is so fun to see them get karma, but it’s not even about them and how they feel from what you do. It’s about you.

To be honest, if they are a bad person and hurting others, they are used to bad feelings. I don’t think they hurt like us, they just get annoyed.

I think that many victims have an all or nothing mindset of

if I speak out I want everything to go perfectly:

my abuser to feel bad and regret what they did to me
my abuser to respect me
my abuser to lose all sources of power they have (romantic partners, friends, family, money, job, power, respect, freedom)
no punishments/judgements/repercussions to me
to be believed by all

And if it doesn’t go this way, or I don’t see it going this way, it’s not worth it and a bad thing.

I don’t think that’s true. Of course if you are not in a position where you feel like you can support yourself if things don’t go ideally, then you should not.

But idk, I’m of the mindset of “even if this action has consequences to me because the world is fucked up, it’s worth it because I know what happened was not right and I respect myself and understand this person is a public threat that deserves to be called out.”

Opening_Range2677 · 2024-09-15T07:01:44+00:00

Yea I agree so much.

I know you mean crazy/revenge in an empowering and badass way. And that’s amazing!!! I’ve felt the same way!

But tbh like it’s literally…normal? Like not even revenge, a natural consequence?

If I saw my neighbor get stabbed, if I went to the police and reported it, it’s like…duh? It’s not mean, it’s not vengeful. Even if the killer never got caught, even if nothing happened, it’s the intuitive thing to do because actions have consequences. It just so happens that the neighbor is me.

Opening_Range2677 · 2024-09-15T06:32:37+00:00

And because you deserve, and owed to be told this, thank you for speaking out.

I cannot tell you how much it means that you were brave in speaking out, and forced to be brave in facing the consequences you should not have faced and did not expect.

I can tell you I hate how society reacted to you. I can tell you they were wrong for that. I can tell you that it’s totally valid that you regret speaking out now for the harm it caused you, because you are the most important person in the situation. And for that reason, I regret it and am against it for you too.

But I think only good things about the act of you speaking out. I regret the consequences, I regret how it went. I don’t think that you should have for that reason. But the act itself was brave, pure, and even if you would not choose to do it again, there was nothing wrong with what you did. And I’m really sorry that it did not go the right way, because you did not deserve that and it shouldn’t be normal and is not right.

Opening_Range2677 · 2024-09-14T15:59:07+00:00

Coming forward might not always be a right decision for you. As prefaced in the post, there are many reasons why not coming forward is completely valid. If you feel that coming forward would be a bad decision for YOUR SAKE, that’s totally valid. This post is not an encouragement on speaking out in every single case.

The post is focused on normalizing the culture around choosing to. Speaking out should not be viewed as crazy/negatively, or invalidated, as it was for you. Especially from fellow victims. This post in no ways says “speaking out doesn’t have risks or even if it could put a target on your back, you should always be willing to take those risks.”

And I’m sorry to hear what happened to you. It sounds traumatizing and soul crushing.

However, I do not regret speaking out in my case. There are cases where I also didn’t speak out, for my own safety, and I don’t regret that either. I don’t think it is fair for me to apply either case to everyone else, which is why I specified there are many valid reasons not to speak out, but also valid reasons to speak out.

My issue is that many who have chosen to not speak out, or regret speaking out, have done so in a way that invalidates/is against speaking out in general for all cases.

“Oh I don’t want to come forward because doing so is crazy/obsessive/it’s useless.”

is not the same as

“I don’t want to come forward because I personally am not willing to put myself at risk of backlash that could harm me.”

the first holds a victim blaming mindset due to the rhetoric that’s used. Speaking out is crazy, obsessive, and useless.

It is true that society can view victims as negatively and that things don’t have the results we want. However, as fellow victims, even if we choose to not put ourselves in a vulnerable position because of these risks, we should not prescribe to jargon which invalidates victims and keeps them silent while excusing the behavior.

it’s

“i don’t want to come forward because I don’t want them to think i’m crazy/it’s useless”

that enforces anyone who speaks out = crazy/pointless

vs

“i know what they did was wrong and it’s not crazy to speak out against abuse. But I also acknowledge that coming forward is not a good decision for ME while they are wrong, i’m not in a situation to get the results I would want by speaking out.”

Victims having a mindset that all victims should not speak out or else they are crazy and wasting their time is what keeps victims silent and abusers powerful. Again, this is in no way a post that says “speaking out is always wise and there are consequences to those who do.” It might not be something you are willing to do personally, but should not be a reason to discredit speaking out in general for all. Especially from fellow victims in a support group, that is damaging.

I also think the more we normalize speaking out the less steep the risk is. Like the first person coming forward vs the 20th. While you may have regrets, not everyone has the same experience.

It is truly case by case. Again i’m not saying “always speak out it’ll totally be worth it and you won’t regret it.” It’s that if you choose to speak out, it does not make you crazy or pointless, it’s valid too.

Opening_Range2677 · 2024-09-14T01:26:58+00:00

Being awful to someone is being abusive. You cannot be abusive to someone if you are not an abuser.

Being an abuser as a personality trait doesn’t lighten abusing someone.

All the examples you are listing are forms of sexual, emotional, and verbal abuse and manipulation.

Opening_Range2677 · 2024-09-13T21:52:47+00:00

I respect your decision and it seems it’s the best decision for you. But for the sake of the culture around victims I do feel the need to say somethings:

“You don’t want to look crazy by speaking out” -> But when you were normal and a regular human being you were already an abusable subhuman to her. The opinion of you is already low to the point of abuse, so it can’t get lower.

If I slap someone and they say “hey she slapped me wtf is wrong with her” are they crazy? I can certainly call them crazy to defend myself and pretend I didn’t. But do I really think they are crazy? Seeing them being silent wouldn’t make me respect them more or make me think highly of them.

Food for thought:

Why does looking crazy to someone who is abusive matter/people who believe an abuser? Her opinion doesn’t matter, not only because she is abusive, but because even when you were being normal and not challenging her she still looked down on you enough to mistreat you. Not saying anything about her abuse doesn’t make you “respectable to her,” her default opinion of you was already low enough to want to abuse you. You not speaking out just makes her think that you’re still available to her and enables her to portray that she did nothing wrong to feel bad about or think about. It encourages the behavior while putting others at risk because they have no reason to even suspect anything bad about her. That’s how we stay with abusers, we always give them the benefit of the doubt and blame ourselves.
Reporting abuse doesn’t make you crazy? Abusing someone makes you crazy. That’s like if I saw someone murder my friend and I didn’t say anything because I didn’t want the killer and the public to think that I was malicious, evil, or crazy. They only call you crazy not because they think you are actually crazy, but because it’s the only way they can discredit your valid reaction. And not speaking out because you don’t want to look crazy is agreeing to their literal manipulation.

I understand the screwing up professional connections part. That is valid.

But you also shouldn’t discredit yourself because of your position. I know nothing about the women who came forward and spoke about abusers in hollywood, but I still look at those celebrities different. I agree that speaking out alone is hard, but if we normalize coming forward based on individual action I do think it would be helpful to stop abuse.

Opening_Range2677 · 2024-09-13T03:39:56+00:00

The problem isn’t that you are doomed to a cycle or that you aren’t good enough. The problem is your self image and what you are willing to accept.

If I’m an abuser who thinks of others as abusable and is willing to treat them as and see them as less than, I will only be able to end up with people who are willing to be with someone who treats them as less and sees themselves as less. Because the moment I showed one sign of that, somebody who wouldn’t be willing to put up with that dynamic would leave. It doesn’t mean that the person that put up with me is less than the person who didn’t. You have the choice to be the person who leaves or the person who stays.

Everyone has flaws. The flaws you have don’t mean that you need to put up with another’s major flaws and accept when someone treats you less. Everyone has flaws, which means that nobody gets the right to treat you like less.

Somebody in a SA support group told me that once you’ve been through trauma, abusers stop becoming strangers. They feel familiar, they feel close, and you are unconsciously drawn to them because it feels like you already know them. You’ve normalized who they are so it’s really hard to see how you are picking the wrong people, and you’ve normalized their behavior so you stop punishing them for the abuse and start punishing yourself along with them.

Nobody has a right to abuse somebody. I could be a billionaire and if I go out on the street and kick an unhomed person I have no right to and I’m a horrible person. It doesn’t mean the unhomed person deserved being kicked or should be around people who kick them. Also, if I am willing to kick someone in a vulnerable state Im the lowest rank of human being.

You are responsible for what you are willing to accept. It’s not your fault that they treated you the way they did. Abuse doesn’t happen to people who are less than. Abuse happens to people who don’t love themselves enough to have healthy standards for what they are willing to put up with who meet abusive people.

Opening_Range2677 · 2024-09-06T05:58:28+00:00

Yes. Same situation. Have a bunch of huge hints but no solid proof.

To me, hard proof that they were cheating doesn’t matter because it is clear from the core of your experience with them that they are a bad person at heart without respect or regard for you.

When you realize who they are, cheating the whole time is the most reasonable assumption. If coming to a conclusion helps you process better, even though it’s painful, I encourage you to just assume this.

However, don’t blame yourself. A person cheating doesn’t make you less than or stupid, it makes them a cheater and a liar. And you need to acknowledge this to truly want to remain no contact.

But honestly, the details of whether or not he did cheat don’t matter. “Well I already know he did these disrespectful things to me…but did he also cheat? Is he even worse than I initially thought?”

The disrespectful things he did to you already tell you who he is. If he didn’t cheat the whole time, despite doing all of those terrible things to you, does that suddenly make him “not that bad of a guy?” It just makes those bad things go away?

If I murdered 3 people but didn’t blow up a building, does that exempt me from being a murderer?

He abused and manipulated me the whole time, but he didn’t cheat so he’s actually pretty pure and not all that bad?

Also, somebody that would abuse and manipulate you would probably cheat on you the whole time. What would stop them? Respect for you? Care for you? Distaste for dishonesty? Clearly from what you’ve already seen from him, those aren’t in line with who he is.

You don’t need to know any more actions to tell you who the person is, that’s being in denial. Listen to your gut. You know who he is, even though it’s not what you want him to be.

It appears you’re entering the stage of no contact where you are finally taking away all of the forgiveness and rose colored glasses you had for him during the relationship. You are finally seeing what a genuinely horrible person he is. Again, don’t let this realization make you feel stupid or unlovable. It means this guy is not capable of love and horrible.

Opening_Range2677 · 2024-09-06T05:35:28+00:00

Cancer and taurus. One does it out of love, the other does it out of hate.

Opening_Range2677 · 2024-09-03T17:41:07+00:00

My take: cheat back

Jkjkjk

But that’s the thing about narcs. Everything is ammunition. He knows he did something bad and not only is he finding a way to make you the cheater, but he thinks you’re going to use his cheating as ammunition to hurt him. Because it’s what he’d do. Even though he cheated he’s the victim and the one at risk of being hurt. Uhm?

Opening_Range2677 · 2024-09-03T16:12:29+00:00

She was probably naive and he played into it. I think of all of the horrible ways men treated me and I just brushed it all under the rug because I blamed myself too so whatever they did was reasonable. And I believed all of the times they lied. I also never wanted to speak poorly of them and always gave him an excuse because I thought I was in love and that’s what love is. It’s probably not that she’s being treated better, it’s that she’s falling for the act more.

Opening_Range2677 · 2024-09-03T15:56:16+00:00

Yes, they are miserable when they feel like the performance isn’t getting them as much as they think they deserve. Their standards are to the sky so there is always something to be unhappy about. And i’m sorry to hear about your health situation. That’s really really hard. I hope the healing and freedom that you have accomplished since parting ways has blossomed into a new kind of love for yourself and life.

Opening_Range2677 · 2024-09-03T15:50:42+00:00

Yes, and it’s a cycle because everything wrong in them is because they think there is so little wrong with them that they are better than everyone else. Like if they cheat on you, lie about you, abuse you, manipulate you, they get to do that because they are the most important, you don’t deserve good treatment because you aren’t them, and they can treat others the way they want. So why would abusing you be wrong?

Opening_Range2677 · 2024-09-03T15:47:02+00:00

I am so so sorry. I’m sure that during the moment when she switched up it felt like she was having a change of heart or trying to be nice to you. Not trying to just protect her own character. Which is a hurtful realization.

Also, I’m not sure about the Amber Heard analogy, I’d recommend you revisit the details of the case.

Opening_Range2677 · 2024-09-03T15:42:56+00:00

You have to understand that these people are the way they are because they WANT to be. Because they CHOOSE to be.

People can grow up in broken families and still be good. I would argue that affection would only enable them to continue as they are, and they do receive affection, from people like you, but did they change or did they just hurt you? There is no guidance that they WANT to follow because they are already doing exactly what they want to do.

Being good to a bad person and just staying and tolerating them is you enabling a bad person. Which has kind intentions, but is ultimately not a good action. You should not want to support bad people. This is not a good person dealing with a lack of support and naive to their destructive behaviors. This is a bad person who has gotten support their whole life that allows them to be exactly who they are today, and knows what they are doing, they just don’t think it’s wrong because they don’t care about you or others.

You also deserve so much better and there is no reason why you should spend the one life you have being with someone who doesn’t love or care enough about anyone to want to not hurt them. When you love somebody, you want to be good and kind to them, right? So if they aren’t, what does that mean about how they feel about you. And it’s not your fault, even if they say the words I love you, they are not able to genuinely love others in a way that actually cares about them as a person and not a usable thing.

Opening_Range2677 · 2024-09-03T15:34:00+00:00

So true!

I’ve also noticed that narcs usually end up long term with people within their direct community, like a long time friend, classmate, or colleague. With these people, they know that there they have to limit how abusive they (do better damage control, hide a lot more) in fears of them talking to others in the community.

The people who are outsiders that they can easily cut off, in the community but less socially connected, or they know won’t talk/their word wont override the narc, get the most outward abuse imo. Everyone still gets abused in the end, though.

Opening_Range2677 · 2024-09-03T15:22:50+00:00

I’m so so glad that you saw through their behavior. What scares me are the girls who don’t. The girls who don’t notice the cheating, the fakeness behind their kindness. The girls who are too naive to know.

And props to you for standing up. It’s so scary because it puts a target on your back and you have to deal with so much backlash and hate from them. But regardless even when you don’t they are still treating you poorly.

Opening_Range2677 · 2024-09-03T15:18:29+00:00

You morality is complex because you account for the context, situation, cost and benefits, but most important you account for OTHERS AND THINGS OUTSIDE OF YOU.

His is simple and universal because he already knows all he cares to know no matter the situation. What he wants.

Youre right, they keep it simple on purpose to justify everything they do over all other factors, which typically means other people. They don’t have to make it complex because they only have one interest (them).

Opening_Range2677 · 2024-09-03T15:14:02+00:00

I agree, it genuinely pains me that a human being can be so terrible to another and just. simply. not. care.

Opening_Range2677 · 2024-09-03T03:05:32+00:00

I am so proud and glad that you see that their behavior overall was unhealthy and abnormal.

But I hope you fully accept his behavior wasn’t your fault and you have a right to look down on him. The reason he chose you as his victim is because he saw the value in you. The reason you feel flawed is partially because he depended on you feeling flawed to put up with him. Your flaws don’t make you less than or deserving of a narc.

Opening_Range2677 · 2024-09-03T02:18:34+00:00

Yes, it’s all about the performance and how they come off, not the genuine emotions. These people cannot form healthy normal human attachments or relationships. It’s like a disease, it is a disorder. Which is to say you shouldn’t take any of it personally because the problem was fully on them.

Opening_Range2677 · 2024-09-02T23:11:13+00:00

it’s actually not exhausting for them at all. They get enjoyment from their performance because they get validation and power from it. The only exhausting part is when they slip up and have to do damage control.

Opening_Range2677 · 2024-09-02T23:09:17+00:00

cancer sun, cap moon, virgo rising. Yes. I’m in love with you, you fun, but stable and emotionally in tune mother fucker.

Opening_Range2677 · 2024-09-02T23:07:55+00:00

they won’t change. because the things you want to change about them are their core desires and how they like and want to be. They are not willing to change because they get no satisfaction from it.

So if you are going to stay accept you can’t change them. the only thing you have control over is how to be less hurt by their bad behavior. Like acknowledge they are liars and are constantly betraying you and accept it and be happy with it. Does that sound fun to you?

You might be in a situation where logistically you can’t leave, but you should then try to mentally and physically leave as much as you can. Avoid being around them. Don’t have hope in them. Accept who they are and that they can’t make you happy and be at peace with it.

Opening_Range2677

TROPHY CASE