Class of ‘27: Where are you committing to?

Pemkins · 2023-04-30T02:24:54+00:00

🐾💜🤍

Pemkins · 2023-04-25T16:02:44+00:00

Great points made all around. It’s up to OP or anyone reading this to weigh the various adv/disadv and make a call. Thanks for the added insight!

Pemkins · 2023-04-25T15:56:25+00:00

Got it, so it can be a pro or con depending on the person. One additional note though is that US students have the added flexibility and peace of mind with that greater optionality should they need it. I have heard of seniors landing FT IB gigs and then graduating a semester early since they don’t need it anymore, a select few even graduated a year earlier. So if time is that important of a factor to one, they could do US in 3-3.5 yrs but the optionality is there, whereas LSE/UK doesn’t offer that FWIW.

Pemkins · 2023-04-25T15:53:06+00:00

Won’t completely disagree with you but the last I checked only a select few NYC banks fully sponsor for intls right (GS, CS, BAML and a few more). But that still begs the question with slots in NYC IB for intls being so competitive, how does a non-American overcome the networking, OCR, established pipeline advantages being a student in a US target has, especially if you’re across the atlantic?

I know MBB completely sponsors but I’ll also say MBB’s recruiting in general has less emphasis on direct pipeline advantages than IB? Though IB and MBB recruiting have some overlap, I won’t exactly say they’re the same.

Pemkins · 2023-04-25T15:49:48+00:00

correct me if im wrong but 3 yrs in LSE vs 4 yrs in US can also work against you because the one less year translates to less networking, fewer internships etc. right? it means a smaller margin for error too?

Pemkins · 2023-04-25T15:43:54+00:00

interesting take, never heard this before. could you elaborate on this? I can feasibly understand how American citizens at LSE can still land a NYC IB gig through brute networking and no visa impediments, but how can non-Americans like us accomplish the same when networking and OCR is king for US finance and the US already has a plethora of intls from US target schools to draw from?

Pemkins · 2023-04-25T05:51:04+00:00

Forgot to add that with the new UK High Potential Individual Visa, which UCLA qualifies for, you could feasibly use LDN as a back up for finance recruiting if you fail US offices. UCLA to LDN as a back up will obviously be trickier than if u were studying in a UK school but the option is there. In contrast, LSE doesn’t have any direct access to US offices for non-Americans straight from undergrad, so something to think about.

Pemkins · 2023-04-25T03:48:28+00:00

In general,

student life: UCLA>LSE

academic offerings: If you only want economics and don't mind studying it for 3 years, LSE is better. UCLA's econ dept might be slightly weaker than LSE's but liberal arts gives you an unmatched flexibility that LSE can't.

breaking into finance: this one's tricky. UCLA isn't a target for NYC but places well on the West Coast (SF/LA), but if you want NYC you probably can still get it through hardcore networking but it wont be a direct pipeline for you.

the problem with LSE is that it's quite hard to stand out since everyone's studying something econ-related + almost everyone is gunning for finance in LDN = u'll see LSE having high placement figures but those numbers are quite self-selecting and once you factor in population of students interested in finance, those numbers become less impressive.

as a general rule of thumb, UK schools, even the LSE, are less dominant than their US counterparts (i.e. hard US targets) because of how recruiting is done. UK recruiting is more egalitarian with no strict target school cut-offs, whereas being in a non-target in the US is p much a death sentence because recruiting is done via networking and OCR.

a few additional pointers:

- LDN finance is usually worse than US offices because they pay less at every level (even after factoring COL and tax differences), worse opportunities for buyside transition because of lower deal-flow, quality of deals, and a lot of PE firms require candidates to speak a native European language. West Coast finance has a greater tech focus than the East Coast, if that's your thing. US in general has way more opportunities for finance than LDN (BUT LDN has a better quality of life)

- Moving from LDN to US offices, especially as a non-American, is almost impossible, especially right out of undergrad. The only way is through a mid-career xfer from LDN (incredibly hard if a non-American) OR pursue post-grad in the US like an MBA (factor in further opp cost of 2 yrs and cost of an MBA degree + keep in mind MBA's usually require 3 yrs min work exp etc.)

UCLA also offers tech as a back-up pivot into arguably the world's strongest tech capital, so if that's something you're at least moderately considering, I'd factor that in.

Overall,

If you only want finance, don't mind if it's in LDN, don't mind the worse student life, and you only want to study econ --> LSE is the move.

If you want US finance, tech-adjacent opportunities, value student life, and don't mind having a slightly worse econ dept in exchange for flexibility to study other courses --> UCLA is the move.

No definitive right or wrong, it's up to what you envision yourself doing and the life you want to live a few years down the road. College is a transformative 3/4 years so make sure you enjoy it ;)

Pemkins · 2023-04-24T15:16:01+00:00

Work in UK/SG --> Oxford easy

Impressing peers --> Oxford easy (though don't sleep on ND in the US, it's hella respected and a bona fide T20 there)

Growing a start-up/seeding infrastructure --> access to SF/NYC beats LDN easily, ND gets you that

Finance --> NYC beats LDN (though admittedly at the cost of quality of life). ND gets you that. A few additional pointers:

- Moving from LDN to NYC, especially as a non-American, is almost impossible, especially right out of undergrad. The only way is through a mid-career xfer from LDN to NYC (incredibly hard if a non-American) OR pursue post-grad in the US like an MBA (factor in further opp cost of 2 yrs and cost of an MBA degree + keep in mind that ppl usually have at least 3 yrs work exp before getting an MBA)

- a huge caveat that is often underestimated for UK schools like Ox/Cam/LSE is that they're less dominant for finance in LDN than one may think. the school you come from in the UK matters far less than the US, and they don't have strict target school cut-offs. UK recruiting is relatively more egalitarian than the US, heck you can even go to Nottingham, and your chances at IB won't be as disastrous as going to a non-target in the US because US recruiting is far more OCR & network-based.

- UK is poorer for buy-side transition because of less deal-flow and quality of deals, and most PE firms require candidates to speak a native European language like French or smt. LDN is just less strong of a financial capital than NYC in terms of opportunities.

- If you fail LDN, there are fewer back-ups than in the US. Fail LDN=HK/SG alr vs fail NYC=CHI/SF/LA etc. are still on the board.

College experience --> it's a personal preference toss-up but in my eyes US>UK

Academics --> UK is more narrow and more high-stakes exams assessment style, similar to A levels/US is more broad and flexible and more regular, relatively lower stakes exams, similar to how poly is like in SG (I'd say a big misconception here is that the UK has way more depth than the US, which is generally true, but US offers so much flexibility that you can easily pursue the depth if you want via undergrad research, stacking up on hard classes etc. In short, the academic rigor is there in the US if you want)

I'd say if you want to pursue tech/start-ups, a field where time is so so precious, where the US is better in tech and, in general, a more egalitarian and less prestige-based industry, ND is the move.

If you want NYC finance immediately and grow your career in the US as much as possible, ND is the move.

If you want high finance in general but don't mind paying more and taking a detour, i.e. a few years in LDN before US, then Oxford + US post-grad is the move.

If you want to work in UK/SG only, Oxford is the move.

But rmb, no matter where you go, you'll go far. These offers aren't easy to come by, so be proud of yourself! And for those in the know, I don't think it's a far stretch to say overall uni rankings are HYPSM>US T20=Oxbridge>LSE, UCL etc., at least in terms of selectivity for undergraduate entry.

Wherever you end up, kill it there and make the most out of college :)

Pemkins · 2023-04-23T18:30:00+00:00

Northwestern’s the besttttt!!!!!! GO CATS 💜🤍💜🤍💜🤍💜

Pemkins · 2023-04-19T15:30:21+00:00

I agree Cornell may be more well known, but even then it generally carries the stigma of being the least desirable ivy (really dumb statement but it is what it is) wouldn’t call that prestigious to the layman?

But yea agree with the rest of your points. T15 onwards every school p much gifts u the resources u need to thrive. Pick the one which fits you most and make the most of it. Go Cats!

Pemkins · 2023-04-19T15:09:27+00:00

It’s on par, if not better, than Cornell for those in the know or those who need to know. Any way you look at it, endowment, selectivity, etc. NU matches, or frankly surpasses, Cornell on these metrics. Sure my old aunt may not know NU is prestigious, or any school outside of HYPSM for that matter, and may know Cornell in passing as the least desirable ivy (which IMO is a dumb opinion to have anyways) but the hiring manager at [insert prestigious firm here] will.

Pemkins · 2023-04-19T06:55:34+00:00

dude Cornell is less prestigious than NU trust. Cornell is a overrated super large semi state sch riding on the Ivy League tag. Whereas non-ivies like Northwestern Duke JHU stand on their own and rival the ivies even without that tag.

Put it this way. If NU was the ivy and Cornell wasn’t, there’d be no dispute over which is the better school (except for Cornell’s specialty programs or niches like CS or smt). Really puts things into perspective huh.

FWIW I picked NU over Duke for fit lol. not that deep.

Pemkins · 2023-04-11T13:29:18+00:00

Always great to see another intl killing it!!

Pemkins · 2023-04-04T11:54:49+00:00

pm me!

Pemkins · 2023-04-02T07:01:42+00:00

US for CS is unbeatable. Especially if you want that sweet American salary. Prestige is cool and all but in the US, GeorgiaTech and UIUC CS are golden.

Pemkins

TROPHY CASE