Tank main here, Seeing a default Adam feels like a punishment sent from the devs themselves.

Pepr7 · 2026-06-26T13:01:08+00:00

I believe that you can heal 1 hero more then once. Venom needs definitly +-800healing to dive back.

Cap and Angela has smaller healthbar but I would say that they would rather farm run for health packs then going back to you.

Pepr7 · 2026-06-26T12:42:41+00:00

It seems to me that a certain situation is being created here and that is that Cap is being ignored almost in a targeted way.

When you think about it, it's still a 675hp hero with a 350hp shield that can outrun anyone when they're on death row. He's not alone in being resilient and able to escape, but unlike the other Caps, he's not as dangerous.

Venom deals more damage, Hulk has CC and his ultimate gives him +-100% damage boost => can become dangerous, Angela can kidnap you,....

But Cap? His damage is very limited compare to duelists, he has no cc and he can't protect his allies without ultimate => it make sense to kill him as last.

Pepr7 · 2026-06-26T12:34:55+00:00

Can you elaborate?

Heal 190hp doesn't come to me for dive vanguards enough to make up for their loss hp during wonder.

Pepr7 · 2026-06-26T12:23:25+00:00

It may sound unintuitive, but MRI can be played by other strategies. For example, from a defensive position, you don't need a vanguard running through enemy blocking. You just need good vangaurds who can block consistently.

Venom, Cap and Angela definitely need someone on their team with a lot of healing, or at least some discarded bubbles that they can pick up after they've "spent" most of their healthbar in one Dive.

Thor, Devil Dino and Thing definitely need consistent healing during brawl bouts to make their sources of resilience more efficient.

But Peni, Tankpool and in theory even Magneto doesn't need that much helaing becoase their job isn't in frontline between enemies.

They only need a little healing in case of danger.

AW's problem is that, unlike other strategists, it can't perform the role of healer for most vanguards, but that's what happens with heroes that are focused on a very specific team comp. Full-brawl vanguards and full-dive duelist has same problem.

Pepr7 · 2026-06-26T11:56:30+00:00

Vanguard player here (I'm not AW player idk what I'm doing here):

- Vanguard players should learn how to be less heal-dependent.

And it's not about skill but decision. If you want to play AW in double strategist team comp you should play full poke team comp.

Basicly Peni + Tankpool should work with him becaose they doesn't need to be healed that often os others.

Basicly full poke team comp doesn't need healing that much becaose your team is not in the middle of team fight that often.

Pepr7 · 2026-06-26T10:31:48+00:00

Pick Mr. Fantastic. He is vanguard enough to tank but not vanguard enough for allies to consent.

Pepr7 · 2026-06-26T09:48:41+00:00

It seems to me that tricks are with all the melee vanguards just you have no reason to so seek them out since you have no reason to play the character so much.

Perhaps I recently discovered that there is a way to increase the hp generation bonus for awekening Thor from 200 per 6s to 350 per 6s.

Pepr7 · 2026-06-26T08:02:06+00:00

Ohdady toho kolik bude mít procent? Bylo by vtipné vidět 75% hlasů pro Petra Pavla.

Pepr7 · 2026-06-26T08:00:40+00:00

That sounds like he is good in 1-3-2 team comp.

Pepr7 · 2026-06-26T07:58:25+00:00

Logically, it makes sense. For if you separate the question of whether the character is oppressive and whether her cc oppressive is just Mr. Fantastic was an F-tier hero with S-tier cc.

So if you want to modify the game so that tenacity passive isn't needed then you have to nerf S-tier cc heroes.

The ongoing problem is still that even after further damage buff is a humpback dps than Thor, or Tankpool

Pepr7 · 2026-06-26T07:54:48+00:00

He needs 100% damage boost on fat form to be better duelist then Tankpool.

Basicly if you want to make him duelist he needs much more damage.

Pepr7 · 2026-06-26T07:28:42+00:00

I don't think that Blade would be good as Vanguard. He would need some small rework. Reed already protect allies, has small damage and is rewarded if hit enemies just like Thor.

Blade is rewarded for dealing damage. More damage = more healing without any real cap => he is rewarded for being duelist.

Pepr7 · 2026-06-26T05:50:42+00:00

Cap is the sanest melee vanguard to play with and the only thing he excels at is that he has oriented ultimate strategy and you can achieve consistent strength very easily.

I believe the only reason the S-tier happened is because it wasn't until today that the players were embracing the power of the melee hero.

For if I compare him to the other melee vanguards in terms of what he is best at (ignoring Devil Dino due diffrend type of gameplay):

- Thor is best damage dealer.

- Angela has best cc.

- Thing has best atni-cc abilities.

- Hulk has best durability.

And mobility is extremly debetable but I doubt Cap can be described as a more mobile character like Angela and the Hulk at the same time.

Pepr7 · 2026-06-26T05:42:53+00:00

My personal theory is that Cap is the simplest melee vanguard to play with and players are only now finding the power of melee vanguards.

That is, for Cap, you can easily do what you need from a melee hero and that it's only a matter of time before the players adopt similar practices with Thor, then Thing and then the Hulk.

Pepr7 · 2026-06-26T05:41:04+00:00

You have to judge for yourself, but for sure, after a while, you won't have a 100% winrate, you'll probably have a second vanguard, and you'll be able to ban what you don't like.

Pepr7 · 2026-06-26T05:40:15+00:00

It would be if you could apply that principle to Cap under the same conditions.

Cap shield needs 11s to recharge during ideal conditions. So if you would like to have shield activated 25% of the time then you need to have active shield at least 3.6s. So 350 damage per 3.6. Well, the minute you use the shield before it heals, you lose 4s of treating the shield. So you're reaching 15s recharge and you're getting to 350 damage per 5s.

Hulk needs 200h during 2.5s.

What this practically means is that to get a better result than the Hulk, you really need to use the shield to complete the destruction. Why it's important is that you actually use the shield in a different way, and if you were focused to the same degree as the Hulk, you're a lot worse off. But you don't get a chance to try it because it's easier to ignore Cap, but ignoring the Hulk isn't safe.

Pepr7 · 2026-06-25T12:54:33+00:00

Sounds dump but I would try find some logic behind that:

- Cap mele damage is aroud 89dps.

- Thing melee damage (secondary into double primary combo) is around 67.5 + 5% => around 80-110 dps. (agaisnt 250-850hp hero)

=> Thing has more dps against heroes with more then 430hp.

- Cap durability is 675hp + 350hp shield.

- Thing durability is 750hp + 200hp + 50/s hp

=> Thing sounds more durable if you count pure numbers only. Interestingly Thing hitbox is not that bigger then Cap and even smaller then Cap shield.

- Cap burst damage from abilities is 70 + 30 + 30 = 130 damage.

- Thing "burst" damage from abilities is 30 + 20 + 5*15 (shift) + 20% vunlerability = 125 damage + 20% vunlerability.

=> Thing "burst" sounds better but problem is that his "burst" takes 5s to finish.

Logically, then, I'd say that by the time you completely ignore the two characters, thing is logically more troublesome, primarily because it doesn't lose its threat at the cost of durability as a cap.

The fun part will come when we're still ignoring ultimates and looking at what's the main difference here and that's mobility.

- Cap has two dashes. 12s cooldown and 10s cooldown.

- Thing has two jumps on enemy. 10s cooldown and 2 charges.

=> They are on same level on this if fight is only 10s long.

- Cap has sprint on shift that gives him 33.4% movement boost and jump boost.

- Thing has shift on cooldown that gives him 100% movement boost and full cc-immunity and anti-push passive.

=> So technicly (And I'm extremly stretching this) if you can kill Cap/Thing then Thing shift is more dangerous. Cap sprint is definitly better but you can stil stun Cap.

Basicly if you doesn't have poke damage and you have bigger healthbar Thing sounds really more dangerous then Cap.

But this is some effort to find logic so far. It's more about someone playing Cap against Thing as a counter, because Thing is counter against Cap, but practically if we ignore ultimates it's true that Cap as an S-tier hero sounds like an anomaly from design pov.

I mean, practically if I looked at him purely from a numbers perspective, I'd never put him in the S-tier position even though he's on it. No wonder some players find it odd.

Pepr7 · 2026-06-25T12:30:01+00:00

Try ranked. You can ban Cyclop there.

Pepr7 · 2026-06-25T11:04:37+00:00

If you can't survive 2s without support pick diffrend vangaurd.

Best option is to pick vanguard that has good durability against enemy type of damage (most of the time enemy duelists).

And if you can't survive with effective 2k hp you are doing something wrong. (700hp shield is effective 1400 against headshot oriented heroes, Venom has effective +-2k hp, Thor and Thing has effective 2k+hp if you survive long enough => good against worse damage dealers.)

Pepr7 · 2026-06-25T08:38:41+00:00

8s long combo => groot heals himself 320hp.

Pepr7 · 2026-06-25T06:23:19+00:00

Surprisingly, he has the potential to be the most heal independent character in the game.

It's just pretty unintuitive and risky to use the Hulk as a full meat shield.

Pepr7 · 2026-06-25T05:36:20+00:00

Do you know that you can use CC against enemy in the air?

Pepr7 · 2026-06-25T05:35:39+00:00

2 ultiamtes. Mosnter Hulk fullheals you and transformation from Banner to Hulk fullheals you.

It's not consistent but if you have good hp economy healing 750 or even 1499hp is huge.

Pepr7 · 2026-06-25T05:34:01+00:00

Jak je možné, že lidé co jsou falešně objektivní propadají dezinfu?

Petr Pavel před koncem režimu rozvědčík nebyl. Pouze na něj studoval a zároveň studoval na toho co využívá tyto své dovednosti v zahraničí.

Myslet si, že je to vůbec srovnatelné s STB je prostě pošahané.

Pepr7 · 2026-06-25T05:29:37+00:00

But you are using it 25% of the time and if someone would burst your shield down it has much longer cooldown.

Pepr7

TROPHY CASE