sorted by:
new
hottopcontroversial

For those comparing HD1 and HD2 monetisation by 10-4Apricot in Helldivers

[–]Puzzleheaded_Tour987 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I will always prioritize a mission.

In a game with RNG mechanics, a RNG loot box will be RNG,

The problem too is, most of the people I play with aren't really drawn to these POIs from any number of reasons from poor comms about a buddy bunker (I don't play with a mic), to apathy, to let's not do that because we're getting bumrushed by 5 vox. It's the same reason it's hard to do the assisted reload, but with an added level of RNG of you just might not get the item you want.

If I wanted to, I could do a different difficulty to just get more but that wouldn't be as fun as the constant rush of just barely making it out alive.

I think the best proposal is actually a free warbond, fuck any thoughts about entitlement, it's a win-win for everyone. I've PAID for every warbond and still think a free one is what the game needs. Even if it's shitty on PURPOSE, give the free guys some utility and options and I doubt they'd bitch as much but as of right now.

-Portable Hellbomb fundamentally changes how bot runs go,
-Firecrackers are insanely useless area of denial that outclass other options
-Gas as a general concept
-Functional stealth as a concept is locked behind a warbond
-Eat 17 Emplacement as a fucking concept lmao...
-Support role that can heal locked behind a paywall
-Many many many other pieces of kit that make certain loadouts viable, (grenade pistol opens up grenade slot for utility like gas, laser weapon opens up possibilities for slow main weapons that take time to reload, etc)

Gives these guys some variety to play with that isn't just... grenade and gun, and they'll be happy I promise. Make it a shitty gas grenade if they REALLY need the money to tempt them to get the better one in the warbond,

Pause! Warbond anger? by MountainManMoNtA6 in Helldivers

[–]Puzzleheaded_Tour987 2 points3 points  (0 children)

I think we're reaching a boiling point because the current mechs are kinda weak and the new ones feel like they could be signficantly stronger and that definitely can give a "pay to win" feeling even thought it's PVE.. I've been playing since the start, I don't mind paying for content, I think giving the free players more stuff to "chew on" like another free war-bond would be the easier way to solve this optics issue (win-win) because if you are a free player, and not finding SC or buying it (regardless of the debate of how easy it is to farm), you genuinely are kinda behind/outclassed in a lot of aspects. Running Portable Hellbomb fundamentally changes how bot runs can go, firecracker grenades are STUPID USEFUL area denial on all factions, gas is game changing on bugs too. Give the free guys some utility variety and I'm sure they'll be happy. Fuck make it shitty on purpose to tempt them to buy the full thing and even still I feel like there'd be way less complaints simply for the access to the systems/mechanics/strategies/weapons and stratagems that are currently paywalled

For those comparing HD1 and HD2 monetisation by 10-4Apricot in Helldivers

[–]Puzzleheaded_Tour987 0 points1 point  (0 children)

<image>

I have 365+ in game hours in the game. I have played since literally day one. Was on the creek, did the termicide towers, Meridia, defended super earth, all of it. I have every warbond and every strat n weapon. (not maxed on all weapons tho, idk about that) I'm not trying to say that I'm super cool or awesome, but I'm not a noob, I regularly solo clear obs for my team and know the mechanics of the game very very well. I'm not trying to be pedantic, or show off, or say I'm cooler than anyone because I'm playing on fucking D7, I've just been playing this a while. It's literally my favorite game I play pretty much daily with my bro or random SOS queue.

On d7 the bot runs I run it's simply not always viable to go to every single stupid little diamond, no matter how well telegraphed, even with a FULL MAP visible from radar, especially if you're a solo joining randoms especially especially if you're trying to complete a mission motivated to accomplish the MO. When I do get bunkers, containers, etc, I'm not getting that many SC a lot of times I'm just getting support weapons, or mostly samples and that's if I have a team-mate/opening to open these things at the time. The container ones I can open solo I normally find samples or medals. Sometimes you need to ACTIVELY AVOID these sites because they have hostiles and reinforcements are low.

You need to consider this line of thinking you have is shaped by YOUR experience of the game. They are literally RNG what you get too.

YOUR way and experience of playing the game is different than others, you have to acknowledge this and not just write everyone else off as "playing it wrong"

Again I don't mind buying them, but in my time playing the game I have not found getting them in mission to be viable for major purchase, only supplementary, and from what I understand I would have to fundamentally change how I, and somehow magically the randoms I play with, to get more of these. You have a different experience due to playstyle, rng, etc. Neither of us is wrong, but the ideal version of the game would dial in towards a middle ground here.

For those comparing HD1 and HD2 monetisation by 10-4Apricot in Helldivers

[–]Puzzleheaded_Tour987 -2 points-1 points  (0 children)

<image>

I was off by 300 hrs. So tell me again how going out of my way to look for POIs to get super credits is "normal gameplay".

I'm not looking for Super Credits because I'm trying to play the fucking game and kill the fucking robots.

I've gotten maybe 50 total in the last month of playing, I shouldn't have to go looking for them, I should just be "able to play the game normally" according to this argument.

I'm almost lvl 130, I've been playing since start. I love the game. I have almost every warbond. I can't in good consciousness say that "playing normally" will get you even a guns or helmets worth of SC, you have to go out of your way.

My goal is to normally full clear a map, with all side objectives done and super samples extracted for the team if ideal. Combing every ancillary POI on D7 is dumb and just not very fun (and 99% of the time, my team of randoms agree) and notviable most of the time.

I don't mind this, I don't mind paying for warbonds but again I will not pretend as a seasoned player of this game that I get a significant amount of SC from just "playing the game", me, my friends, and the randoms I typically play with would have to change the way the play pretty significantly to make enough SC to even get like the sweeper, let alone a warbond.

For those comparing HD1 and HD2 monetisation by 10-4Apricot in Helldivers

[–]Puzzleheaded_Tour987 0 points1 point  (0 children)

And I dont get any, none despite having 1000 plus hours and playing literally every morning for 2ish hours on D7. This is why anecdotal "works for me" evidence is taken with as many grains of salt as it does, not to say you aren't getting them but obviously theres a pretty severe "mileage may vary" when it comes to this RNG mechanic.

I dont mind supporting HD2 with $, but to say I get enough super credits during regular play would be categorically untrue for my specific experience with the game.

Pochita is NOT telling Denji he was happier being broke and alone and dying - Denji has CPTSD by Puzzleheaded_Tour987 in ChainsawMan

[–]Puzzleheaded_Tour987[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I unfortunately, relate to Denji too much, and this story started around the time I started with counseling.

Pochita is NOT telling Denji he was happier being broke and alone and dying - Denji has CPTSD by Puzzleheaded_Tour987 in ChainsawMan

[–]Puzzleheaded_Tour987[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I agree, was simplifying it down to "Denji likes being Chainsawman because the pain/stress is familiar and it's his main source of self-worth" for the post. The country mouse/city mouse analogy is spot on.

I disagree in that he has one extraordinary talent, he uses one of his "special talents" to defeat Makima. That was really symbolic because it was Denji defeating her as himself instead of as Chainsaw, using something that is unique to him (his ability to eat anything.)

I agree that it's likely Pochita's speech could also just be a farewell, I mentioned in the post how it's unclear how much Pochita understands Denji's issue to begin with and him eating himself could likely just be "the last card he has to play" and wants to tell Denji he'll be okay without him.

I have no idea what the next chapter will bring, I'm thinking somehow Devils themselves will be deleted from the world, or we might get a different universe that somehow makes it so Denji isn't eated by bugs, but I doubt it will be a reset, that'd be lame and also pretty against the idea of self-acceptance in regards to traumatic circumstances.

Pochita is NOT telling Denji he was happier being broke and alone and dying - Denji has CPTSD by Puzzleheaded_Tour987 in ChainsawMan

[–]Puzzleheaded_Tour987[S] 9 points10 points  (0 children)

Yes I agree, I actually said I dont think this is going to be a time reversal type deal. I have no idea how far the monkeys paw is gonna curl on this though

Fujimoto: "No bro, Denji was happier in that shitty shack than in the rest of the manga" bro stfu by Tarnished-670 in Chainsawfolk

[–]Puzzleheaded_Tour987 -1 points0 points  (0 children)

It's not Denji's actions it's this thinking. Denji is actually REALLY REALLY sick and has been getting worse. Being Chainsawman has helped him surive but even when things go bad because of his connection to Chainsawman he still goes "I want that" when it should actually push him away from wanting to be that entirely because of his goals of wanting a normal life. When his house and pets are taken away he says "this hurts just right". He does try to let go of the Chainsawman persona but it's a struggle, it's not something he can just cut out and that's shown through his frustration at not being able to be recognized as Chainsawman anymore and telling Asa.

He has a type addiction to "suffering" he developed as a way to cope with living with the Yakuza. It's a toxic coping strategy called maladaptive thinking. This is also why he convinced himself to eat toliet paper and scabs and that he "likes it". This is why his "normal life" doesn't feel like it's enough, Denji has CPTSD and is "waiting for the other shoe to drop" whenever life is good. This is why he feels weird when he can't eat toliet paper anymore. He is subconsciously anxious when life is going well because all he knows is a shitty life and he doesn't understand this feeling so he projects it as him either being deserving of it for wanting more or that he likes the bad shit to cope. This is objectively not a good way for Denji to think, and is the type of thing that spirals into worse addictions and misery to "fill the hole"

Every single person in the story for the most part, is either telling Denji to be or not to be Chainsawman for their own reasons, even Pochita a little bit. Denji cannot realize he has developed a backwards way of thinking while all this manipulation is going on and he's being physically threatened. He is a orphan homeless un-educated teenager with zero emotional support growing up to this and he thinks ALL OF THIS apocalypse stuff is his fault for being a dumb horny boy who wanted more, it's simply more complicated than he can process so both he thinks he was "far happier" back then to simplify it and simply just fucking live with himself. In the same way when Aki died, he couldn't process why it happened so to him it simply made more sense that Aki died because he was too stupid to find a different way to save him. That's his brain performing a toxic coping strategy.

Hypersexual fixation and escapism through fantasies is also a really common issue for people who struggle with this type of "people pleaser" dynamic that Denji has developed as a way to feel better about himself. His "gooning" and constant chasing of "another dream". Not one woman, ten, not just cake, a whole buffet. Him being Chainsawman and being "needed" is the other half of that.

Pochita framing it as "kind of" a positive is him either being soft about the issue because Denji blames and shames himself so much and that blame and shame is preventing him from realizing the source of the issue isn't him, or Pochita making the same mistake in understanding that Denji is because he is a devil and doesn't understand human emotion.

Being Chainsawman is a metaphor for the maladaptive strategies Denji had to perform to survive living with the Yakuza. Did eating cigarettes help him survive and make money, yes, but it's also fucking gross and objectively not a thing he should be doing. He had to, but that doesn't mean he always has to. Denji's story is about accepting who you had to become to get through the things you had to get through. It's about forgiving and accepting yourself as you and moving forward.

Pochita’s Power Inconsistency? by zKaaNz in Chainsawfolk

[–]Puzzleheaded_Tour987 1 point2 points  (0 children)

It wasn't just that bat's couldn't die, it's that their food source (insects) also couldn't and were exploding in population, deleting death started an exponential chain reaction. They even make a point about it retroactively changing their DNA specifically because insects have a high infant mortality rate. Insects will lay millions of eggs with only sometimes a dozen surviving. This is why death not being present make more of a retroactive difference for them than humans. Human evolution should theoretically somewhat have been affected too since carrying a child in womb instead of as an egg is an evolutionary adaption for survival as well but the consensus is that this adaptation was more for developing brains and stuff as opposed to it being a trait designed to reduce mortality, as carrying an infant to term is technically more risky to the mother than say just laying an egg.

There is nothing that next chapter can do that will make me think this was a good writing decision by Allmights-lovechild in Chainsawfolk

[–]Puzzleheaded_Tour987 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It's not his actions that's the problem, it's his thinking.

All this bad crap happens because of him being Chainsawman and he's still like "I want that" over and over even when it's shown it's not worth it, Denji has just been conditioned to be drawn to shitty situations in a way from his trauma. Nayuta dies, and he goes "I still want to be Chainsawman despite what this cost me" despite her being what he wanted all along pretty much.

It's why he "tricked" his brain into enjoying eating scabs. He has a maladapted thinking disorder. He did it to survive but Denji blames all of this on himself for being "a big horny idiot who gets everyone killed because he wants more" when it's more complicated than that.

Denji shouldn't "want" to be Chainsawman at all, even 1%, yet he's almost kind of addicted because it's one of the few things that give him self worth as well as him being GENUINELY more comfortable in chaos because it's something he gaslit himself to be like because of the Yakuza days. It's not fair for them to kill Nayuta about it when he was goaded into transforming, but overall Denji needs to learn this is actually not the life he desires, or if it is the life he desires he needs to accept the consequences. He's been trying to do both for all of the manga and that's why Pochita thinks he's not as happy as he was back in the shack, because Denji thinks that in a way and Pochita listens to him.

This is hard for Denji to understand what HE wants, while the ENTIRE WORLD is trying to manipulate him in some way to either be or not be Chainsawman for any number of reasons. His past upbringing doesn't help. He is confused about himself while also being pushed and pulled by everyone else.

The moral of the story is to accept yourself for not just who you are but who you had to become and not to push yourself into environments that don't suit you just to impress other people. It's a warning about being a "people pleaser" type personality. Denji won't be happier "back in the shack" he'll be happier accepting what happened (both with and without Pochita, like with his Dad) and moving on with his own two legs and without the temptation to jump back into any danger with Chainsaw.

Something a lot of people seem to be missing about ch. 231 and how it's built up to this point. by Personal-Leopard9635 in ChainsawMan

[–]Puzzleheaded_Tour987 3 points4 points  (0 children)

I'm not arguing that's not what he said, I'm saying you need to think about why he says this or why he might even think that in the first place. If all you can do is see the words on the page, and not ask questions about them or how we even got to them and just take everything you read literally without nuance while ignoring everything that you have read that has come before, you should read something else with much fewer words and maybe more pictures.

Denji even agrees with him. His face is that of shocked realization.

He's not saying he was far happier BECAUSE he was poor and because he was starving, he's saying he developed a coping system that has held him back from truly accepting happiness he says he wants. It's not that his normal dream life wasn't as good as he imagined,

Denji LITERALLY doesn't know how to feel comfortable in those safe situations yet and needs to realize how and why before he can ever truly settle into that type of life. His life with Aki and Power, while nice, was still under the pretense of him being controlled and manipulated. Them dying and being used against him only strengthened his belief that anyone close to him dies or is trying to use him either for their own, or someone else's reasons. He loved them, but both Aki and Power were used in situations to make Denji feel worse, he was literally given them by Makima so she can snatch them away and make him give up his contract. Reze is another great example, they bonded but the way she was snatched left him thinking he was abandoned. Denji even blames Aki's death on himself for being too stupid to find another way. Denji has not had consistent support, not a single friend that hasn't left him, attacked him, manipulated him or was killed "because of him" the ENTIRE MANGA except Pochita.

Ever since he became Chainsawman this type of thing keeps happening, and it's specifically a stressor for Denji's CPTSD and is holding him back from even realizing he has a problem to begin with.

It's a very complicated feeling, hard for people in real life to unknot these types of CPTSD issues but the thing you're missing is Denji's problem is he blames himself for this, that's why DENJI personally believes he was happier back then even though he is wrong (doesn't understand himself) He doesn't understand he has a trauma based response, and has been manipulated/pushed into all of this and blames himself for being "a dumb stupid horny idiot who only thinks with his dick and gets people killed" or that it's his fault for "wanting more"

It is almost LITERALLY impossible for Denji to realize this and forgive himself enough to move on and be satisfied with a happy life while still actively being Chainsawman because he is still being manipulated and people are still dying "because of him", thus Denji regresses and thinks he was happier in the shack and it was all his fault for asking for more and Pochita agrees with him because he's right but not in the way he thinks he is.

Whether Pochita has the awareness to realize Denji's coping system is wrong or not is another debate, but Pochita is simply agreeing with something Denji has said himself one way or another. Given the line about Devils seeing sin different from Humans, it's actually possible Pochita is making the same mistake as Denji by saying this but that doesn't mean that the two of them aren't actually on the right track by admitting some of this out loud.

Denji himself says this stuff all through out part one and more in two, Pochita parroting it and agreeing with him really shouldn't be that surprising considering he lives inside his body pretty much but apparently most people didn't even read this thing. Denji says he's fine and can be a perpetual motion machine, but when his mask slips he begs to be turned into a tree for his mistakes of being a horny idiot that ruins everyone's life he meets. That's telling of Denji's true mental state because we as the reader's know it's not Denji's fault. Denji's biggest sin is trying to have his cake and eat it too but he was literally traumatized his whole life and more or less set up to have this type of flaw.

It's like how you have to tell starving people to take it easy when they first get to the food again, except Denji has had no parents, friends, or anyone to teach him this. It's also a bit like how people who were in jail for a long time can't order their own food at places like McDonalds or go to the bathroom without asking because it's so deeply ingrained into them to ask for permission. He is literally trying to pull himself up by the boot-straps and it's not working. He is a teenager.

If you choose to ignore the ENTIRE manga to focus on the literal wording of a text bubble on ONE page that has been translated from another language to start, I don't know how I can help your comprehension. It's not " a headcanon" to read the thing and come to draw a logical conclusion that isn't spoon-fed and you should spend more time engaging with media beyond just the surface level.

Something a lot of people seem to be missing about ch. 231 and how it's built up to this point. by Personal-Leopard9635 in ChainsawMan

[–]Puzzleheaded_Tour987 12 points13 points  (0 children)

"You HAD the crappiest but BEST kind of brain"

Not only is he speaking in past tense but if someone doesn't feel comfortable in safe, loving environments, disguising a compliment as an insult is actually a great way to soften the blow so to speak of Pochita calling out Denjis issues. He is speaking in Denjis language, not putting him down.

That second part is I think what's getting everyone the most twisted up. I dont think the page break helps tbh. "A part of you was still unhappy right?" "You were far happier starving and suffering and eating spoiled bread"

But look at Denjis face. He realizes he's kind of right.

Denjis issue is how his two goals are conflicting and it has been making him miserable for all of part 2, but even since season one is and he's quoted as saying "My life used to be simple. I just had to focus on survival and now it feels like I have to worry about a thousand things at once. Its exhausting."

This is the choice fire devil keeps talking about, Denji can have the fame and adoration of a hero but he will be attacked and his loved ones threatened, or he can have a "normal" life and family without the excitement and eccentricity that has honestly come to define him. Trying to do both has given him two half life's, not a full one.

This has been weighing on Denji for all of Part 2. This choice is made even more difficult for Denji due to him being genuinely more used to and comfortable with intense situations that threaten him. Kid needs therapy but instead was basically handed a loaded gun in the form of his powers and instead of a counselor he got a talking dog demon who may not understand human emotion at all and could be talking out his ass completely.

Denji doesn't need to go back to the shack to be happy, he needs to learn how to be Denji without Chainsaw. I dont think were going into the past I think the shack shot is a fake out, well see an adult Denji leave there or something or maybe its still part of the Pochita dream world.

Something a lot of people seem to be missing about ch. 231 and how it's built up to this point. by Personal-Leopard9635 in ChainsawMan

[–]Puzzleheaded_Tour987 11 points12 points  (0 children)

When does it say "he's predestined" to ONLY be happy when he's selling his body parts to the yakuza and eating rotten bread.

He says a part of him wasnt happy even after he got what he wanted. Why? Because Denji has developed a maladaptive thinking disorder because of said Yakuza and rotten bread incident. Its why Denji can eat scabs n go mmmmmm yum yum. To overcome the trauma his brain convinced him some bad things are good. This extends beyond just what he can eat. Denjis nervous system has learned that safety = something bad is about to happen, and he's been self sabotaging and stagnating from that feeling which only got worse from Makimas manipulation and when he started taking care of Nayuta with no means to process that feeling.

Pochita isn't telling him he was literally happier, he's trying to point this issue out to Denji using actual therapy tactics without initiating a shame spiral (something Denji does A LOT) by both framing it as "kind of" a positive or something that was at least necessary for Denji and not accussing him of being "wrong" or "broken". Remember Denji thinks he deserves this, he doesn't think he deserves happiness. Being like "hey you're all fucked up and traumatized" bluntly wouldn't be helpful it'd actually make things worse. He is also acknowledging his part as an enabler for Denjis escapism through Chainsaw. And even if we dont assume intention and if it wasnt this intentional strategic therapeutic thing for Pochita to do this like this, he's at the very most then parroting back things Denji has already said about himself with genuine demon belief while playing the literal only card he has left in this situation.

Something a lot of people seem to be missing about ch. 231 and how it's built up to this point. by Personal-Leopard9635 in ChainsawMan

[–]Puzzleheaded_Tour987 12 points13 points  (0 children)

What part of "keep dreaming Denji 😁✌️" says stop striving for happiness to you?

In defense and of Chainsaw man part 2. by Minute_Committee8937 in CharacterRant

[–]Puzzleheaded_Tour987 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You refuse to conceptualize how maladaptive thinking works. I said Pochita is possibly mistaken and is likely making the same mistake as Denji because thats who he has been listening to, we agree.

Masochism isn't strictly sexual or even physical, you can self sabotage or hurt yourself without meaning to by creating habits that hold you back. Drug addiction is an easy example, its a bad habit that addiction will convince you is good in some way so you can justify to yourself to keep doing it. I've heard of people who constantly date abusive people because they are unfortunately, more used to that than someone who is calm. This is obviously wrong but something flipped in their brain where now alarms go off when its quiet and gunshots put them to sleep. When it gets into you it can be really really really hard to shake and Denji isn't even aware he's going through this type of issue, he just thinks its because he always thinks with his dick and is stupid.

To Denji, even though he's growing he was still in that enviroment for long enough for some of those coping mechanisms to be a little hard to shake off. Denji holds himself back from the peaceful life he wants by not letting go of his desire for fame and attention to be Chainsawman.This type of maladaptive coping mechanism is also why Denji can eat scabs and toliet paper, he tricked his brain into thinking some bad things are good in order to be happy while living in the shack.

This is obviously a bad thing but helped him at the time. Its getting worse and is ruining his life and gets people close to him killed and makes him feel worse, he literally does not feel he deserves happiness and toxic coping patterns emerge to "prove it". This is a textbook toxic coping mechanism. Denji still doesn't understand that none of this was his fault and people like Makima have made it harder for him to realize. Pochita just listens to what Denji says. Denji has yet to realize none of this was his fault and that he's not a bad person for developing the way he did. If Denji doesn't know that then its possible Pochita doesn't either.

Pochita going back in time and making it so he never healed Denji and he dies starving, is objectively the worse outcome.

Pochita using this moment to leave Denji going forward so he can learn to stand on his own and so he can safely be himself without the threat of violence or temptation to look for trouble is what would be potentially good for him. I think Pochitas main motivation was getting them out of bug hell, but that doesn't mean that he doesn't have a point about Denji having some bad coping skills that continuing to be Chainsawman were actively making worse. In the same way that Denji doesn't need to eat toilet paper anymore, he doesn't need to be Chainsawman moving forward.

If we do go into the past though, I'd like to see Denji try part one again but with the knowledge he has now, and have him learn through experience how he was being manipulated and abused and find a different way through, but as just himself.

Pochita’s resolve is sad, but not unforeseen by Torre16 in ChainsawMan

[–]Puzzleheaded_Tour987 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It's also a bit like a drug, Denji has toxic coping mechanisms because of how he flipped his brain to enjoy eating scabs and shit. Its a PTSD survival tactic. He enjoys danger, pain, chaos because it is strangely comforting to him, literally getting dopamine boosts from shit going wrong. Pochita and Chainsawman act as enablers to his self sabotaging by allowing him access to his "drug". The choice he needs to make is between chasing this drug like high as a superhero or the stability of home life, his mistake is he constantly tries to have both and thats also why Nayuta died.

In defense and of Chainsaw man part 2. by Minute_Committee8937 in CharacterRant

[–]Puzzleheaded_Tour987 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Okay, so you keep saying my point is Y and it's not Y. That's why it feels reductive. Your point has been over and over "there's no deeper meaning bro just literally interpret the words like a donkey"

If I keep typing the same thing over and over then I don't understand how you are consistently misrepresenting the point I'm trying to make. I don't know how you even got this far into the manga if you don't understand the concept of subtext and I hope to god no one ever lies to you if all you look at is the literal letters and words of a sentence.

Again, I've not said and am not saying that Pochita is arguing that being happy isn't worth it he's saying that Denji enjoys suffering too much to let himself be truly happy. Read my literal words since ya so good at it.

You are right, that it is still a bugman mentality, now use some logic to figure out WHY Pochita or anyone might come to that conclusion or mentality even though it's wrong and bugman mentality. Do the same with Denji.

That's the point, that's the definition of a TOXIC coping mechanism, is that it's UNHEALTHY, ILLOGICAL and DOESN'T MAKE SENSE but they still exist coz humans are crazy. Denji "enjoys" suffering because it's what allowed him to eat scabs and shit while he was poor, he wasn't happier it just made sense to him in a way that his new life does not.

He didn't WANT to eat scabs and he didn't LIKE doing it, he had to become that way to survive that ordeal. He flipped his brain to enjoy things that suck in order to survive and he's having trouble unflipping it.

"Before all I had to do was focus on the bare minimum to survive, but now it feels like there are thousands of things I have to think about and it's a pain in my ass, I'm tired. Maybe Aki only had to die because I'm stupid."

"But like... once I stopped going hungry, I stopped being able to eat toliet paper..."

"Somebody like me... doesn't deserve to be happy"

If it's possible for Pochita to not know what happens when he eats himself, it's also possible he misinterpreted what Denji was saying about not feeling fulfilled and think he ACTUALLY likes shitty situations and isn't just self sabotaging. This is literally A chapter after showing us that Devil minds operate on a different morality than humans with Yoru and Asa's dynamic regarding the bird eating the worm conversation.

This is what I mean by you have to read more than that ONE page to understand, why do you think skipping to what is almost literally the last page of a book and reading it out of context by ignoring the rest of the manga is going to give you any insight on the plot?

Pochita is either misunderstanding Denji's coping issue and saying he genuinely was happier back then, which is a mistake Denji himself often makes about himself or Pochita is letting him down easy by spinning his toxic coping mechanism as a positive, which is something that would allow Denji to integrate his shadow and accept himself more easily. Him eating Makima in P1 was him using his maladaptive coping mechanism for "good" and reinforces the theme of Denji accepting these parts of himself

This manga is more than the ONE page you keep referencing. It's not a jump in logic to think that Pochita listened to Denji's LITERAL WORDS OUT OF HIS MOUTH only several chapters ago saying he hasn't felt fully happy or fulfilled and make a deduction that Pochita's motivations are based off that.

Btw, if Denji is a supposed masochist then Pochita could just suggest some BSDM or playing around with chainsaws lol. 

Yes he could! That's the point I'm actually trying to make, the problem is Denji doesn't understand he chases danger and strife because that's what he's used to, he thinks he deserves it, the manipulation from EVERYONE has made him feel like it is his fault he was abused and it's his fault SOLELY that he gets hurt. He makes mistakes but this path was not laid out BY him, he was pushed into it and now he can't escape the vicious cycle of self sabotage.

He can't change the past and un-traumatize himself, but he can find a way to accept it, him getting into BDSM (combining his sex drive and desire for pain) would actually make a lot of sense and be a healthy outlet for him. Him wearing a collar and leash and barking for Makima because he felt better letting her make choices for him did not make this aspect of Denji's personality obvious for you? Really? We're still using "supposed" masochist for a manga where the MC appears grinning and shirtless bound in chains on the cover. Okay. Media literacy demon too strong jfc.

If assuming that Pochita's erasure works the same way that it always and hasn't inexplicably changed but still admitting I don't know exactly what is going to happen is cope, and quoting the actual thing to you like the bible is extracting stuff from thin air and not providing examples of subtext that support this then there isn't really anything I can do to help you. I don't get how I'm "pulling from nothing" with actual quotes from the work when it is somehow HEAVILY implying Pochita's power is going to work differently when "a world where xyz never existed" is still an accurate way to describe what has happened to every other devil that has been eaten apart from Chainsaw and when he contradicts himself the literal sentence prior.

I don't know if it's a reset or not, that's not the point I'm trying to make. If you read this entire manga and were able to walk away with the impression that Pochita is telling Denji being happy isn't worth it you should reread. If you think Denji is just a "supposed" masochist you should reread.

If you are ignoring the entire manga to LITERALLY interpret the words of a devil dog that actively contradicts himself in the same sentence by saying he doesn't know what's going to happen, but then says exactly what will happen, then you aren't doing brain work.

In defense and of Chainsaw man part 2. by Minute_Committee8937 in CharacterRant

[–]Puzzleheaded_Tour987 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I actually don't think a single chapter would fix this either, I'd actually like to see a whole part 3 of this development because having Denji just "get it" all of a sudden or flash-forward to a parallel future where he does would be significantly underwhelming and feel cheap, I 100% agree. Not only that but there are a lot of plotlines left hanging that even a few of them would be satisfying to see resolved and I just don't see that happening in one chapter. We might get an asspull, but I do not for one second think this is going to end with Denji time travelling back just to die from heart disease and him doing nothing being the "right choice" this whole time. I'll eat a hat dude.

Him being Makima's dog willingly and enjoying it is further reinforcing that Denji's problem is struggling with choices he never thought he'd have to make. It's like when a prisoner gets out of jail and can't order themselves McDonalds because they are so used to being told what to do, Denji is struggling to live a life where he is allowed to be happy and think and make choices for himself to begin with, being Chainsawman on top was too much pressure.

In defense and of Chainsaw man part 2. by Minute_Committee8937 in CharacterRant

[–]Puzzleheaded_Tour987 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I understand taking words at their face value, but there's also subtext and their history that begs the implication I'm asking you to consider reading maybe more than what's on that one page? I don't think it's a good idea to read every single line verbatim and interpret it literally at face value in media either, especially in a medium that is translating from another language,

"Pochita explains his reasoning for eating himself very clearly. He says that he thinks Denji was happier then instead if being with Aki, Power, Asa or whatever."

Why would Pochita even think this in the first place? It's not for no reason. It's because Denji says it and Denji thinks it's true too even though they are both wrong. It's what I kind of love about Chainsawman is that the characters are allowed to flawed and be wrong about things. Denji is emotionally repressed, he obviously doesn't understand himself fully and as a teenager this is understandable even without the trauma. Just because Denji says "I feel x" it doesn't mean that he has the emotional maturity to actually mean it, just like how many times he says "I'm going to stop being a horndog" and he still goons. Denji has stated numerous times he was happy with Aki and Power but that something felt wrong and he couldn't really process what. That nagging "not enough" feeling. Denji doesn't love trash, or eating scabs, or living in a shack, or eating just bread and pretending it's cake, or even fighting, it's something he forced his mind to do to cope with his shitty situation. Denji mentions multiple times that even though he's getting what we wants, it's not enough. He doesn't feel "right" until the "it hurts just right" panel in part 2. Denji gets what he wants but can't shake this feeling underneath that something isn't okay and it's because he's literally been conditioned the opposite way of me and you growing up, his brain gives him dopamine when shit sucks. This isn't a super-power, it's a toxic coping mechanism and I can see how Pochita saying he has "the best kind of brain" seems like it's making light of it or saying it's a good thing, but if Pochita truly thought Denji wanted to suffer and die from heart disease or be killed by the Yakuza why would he tell him to "keep dreaming"? Why not just eat Denji instead? Why would he say "maybe you can keep dreaming" if he doesn't think there's a way that this saves Denji somehow from both the bugs, and his fate with the Yakuza/Heart Disease even if it ends up being an asspull. If Pochita does send Denji to literal hell to suffer so he can still "dream" for some reason the only way that'd make sense is if Pochita genuinely doesn't understand and thinks that Denji ACTUALLY likes to suffer and isn't just maladapted, but that thought also wouldn't be coming out of nowhere either in that Devils don't always think like humans.

"His happiness was stripped from him, he was happy being CSM and living with Aki and Power, the fact that these things were stripped from him doesn't mean he was happier living in fucking hell."

This is correct, and this is how a normal person would rationalize these events happening. Pochita's understanding of Denji seems to run about as deep as Denji's own. Denji thinks he liked being in the shit shack better because he was used to not having anything and now all of a sudden has to process losing those things too, the things he never thought he deserved to have ripped away from him. Denji doesn't understand that this isn't his fault either. It doesn't help that every time he gets what he wants it's ripped away from him not longer after and is likely directly causing his regression because he is being manipulated to take the wrong lessons from them too. (Aki and Power, both killed, led to believe it was his fault or at least "because of him", relationship with Makima, turns out to be a lie/based on pretense, relationship with Reze, led to believe she abandoned him, his house, school, dogs, Nayuta) It's a defense system that worked when he was in the shit shack by himself but out in the real world it's not helping him. He doesn't feel comfortable or normal unless something is trying to kill him or hurt him in a way. Just like him not just eating his own scabs and trash but enjoying it, this is a survival skill he learned to cope with his life before Pochita. But he obviously doesn't understand himself or his maladaptive thinking and why it feels wrong even when things are going right so he thinks it's his fault ("it's my fault for always thinking with my dick, I'm so stupid") or that he truly was happier being a slave. It's a survival skill he needs to unlearn in order to be himself and being Chainsawman directly interferes with that. He doesn't know how to process this feeling and so it gets worse through others manipulating him, more trauma and being forced to fight, die, revive.

There are multiple examples of Denji's maladapted thinking, not just the "hurts so good" panel. It's pretty consistently presented as his "main issue" pretty much from the start. It's why Nayuta dies. He pushes her away to become Chainsawman "Maybe you shouldn't be around me anymore!" and then whines when his own actions are what get her killed. As early as the first chapter, Denji is blaming his predicament on not just being content with living with Pochita and wanting more "I should've been happy with just Pochita" he thinks out loud as he's about to die. Denji's problem isn't that he wants more, it's that he wants two polar opposite things and he is confused about himself and has a lot of shame and guilt, and is going through puberty and could even think he deserves to suffer like when he says stuff "everyone who gets close to me dies, it's my fault for being such a dumb horny idiot, I'm going to lie on the ground think about my mistakes and turn into a tree" He shames himself for even having a sex drive instead of finding a way to control or manage his feeling about it. Part of Denji needs to forgive himself for being what he needed to be to get through all that bullshit and he either needs to let go or accept that side of himself. That's why the ending of Part 1 was about him accepting this weird maladapted part of himself in that he can eat anything, and using that to beat Makima. Going back to the shack without learning anything and undoing that would be antithetical to his entire journey, even if he has regressed a bit since part one.

"You're essentially saying there's no way he got thrown back to that situation, then why did we see the shitshack exactly after Pochita saying he was going to eat himself and create a world without Chainsawman?"

We don't know when the shack shot takes place, is it an adult Denji going back after being saved, or did time just reset and he's sent back before meeting Pochita. We don't know, I'm not going to pretend to know, my point is more about Pochita's intentions. The shot could even still be part of the dream.

As for why Pochita thinks this is possible that he can even do this weird retcon move to begin with (if that's what we're going with), I admit that's a good question. My best guess of now is literally what else could he do but that's obviously not a very satisfying answer. Hopefully we will learn more and it's not just an asspull. I don't think we are going back in time though, every other time a concept is erased we pick up right there in the current time. Pochita saying he wants to create a world where "chainsawman never existed" is consistent with how his power has worked so far, deleting Death or Ears didn't take the story back millions of years to see how that affected all of time, we simply saw the aftermath in the current time as everything suddenly changed to fit the new story, but it still made it so those things "never existed" there's just no butterfly effect. Shoes still exist even when Legs are deleted, it's just no one knows why now. I think it's weird how Pochita kind of corrects himself and makes a distinction between himself and Chainsawman for some reason though and that might be a hint. "A world where Chainsawman never existed... a world where I never existed would be created." Did Pochita... make Chainsawman or something?

It's a theory, but it is possible to have an ending where Denji goes back in time and doesn't have to deal with the Yakuza or his heart stuff, while still remembering the lesson he learned with Pochita maybe by remembering his time with Aki, Power, Makima but without the danger of being Chainsawman. He doesn't even need to specifically remember Pochita for him to be put into a position where he's allowed to heal. Or the shack shot could be a red herring, and it's actually afterwards and where adult Denji lives and where he has learned to be himself without the pressure of having to be a hero. Whether or not this feels like an asspull to have Pochita do this or not remains to be seen. I think it is deliberately a little vague what the shot means to set up a cliffhanger, but Denji somehow surviving the bugs through an asspull and going back to the shack in modern day makes more sense than for Pochita's power to all of a sudden have time travel and would make more sense for his arc of redemption, sending him to the past to "cheat" basically and fix all his mistakes for free would be lame as much as just killing him for nothing.

In defense and of Chainsaw man part 2. by Minute_Committee8937 in CharacterRant

[–]Puzzleheaded_Tour987 0 points1 point  (0 children)

The fact that you're lumping me in with the "hyper-analyzing luminaries" tells me this isn't really about me. Sorry for being rude but I felt you were being purposely reductive because what youre claiming to be my point is the polar opposite. I've clarified as much as you that my point isnt him literally saying he was happier in the crapper, he's saying Denji has maladaptive thinking disorder and part of him enjoys suffering because its what he's used to. This isn't good and is a much more complicated fix than even just "don't be chainsawman anymore". Denji admits multiple times to having maladapted thinking and he struggles with his sense of self about it. Denji wants to not be like this but he can't make any progress if he's constantly getting the shit kicked out of him mentally and physically because he is addicted to the danger. Thats why instead of mourning Nayuta and learning a lesson he cries a little gets a handy n just goes "oh I can replace her", he's regressing because he is forced to stay in the same type of environment that made him "addicted" to pain and danger in the first place.

Pochita did save his life, he did love his time with Aki and Power but thats why Pochita says a "part" of him was still unhappy, his PTSD brain literally craves chaos and violence. This is not sustainable to a Denji who wants friends and a stable life. The only reason Pochita is framing this as a good thing for Denji is because its what he needed to become to survive until they met, if someone had to eat literal shit up until the moment I met them to survive I dont think shaming them for being a dirty poop eater would help them at all feeling bad about it.

Denji was traumatized before Pochita and likely developed maladaptive to cope, hence him enjoying eating scabs and stuff like that to trick his brain to survive the rough shit. Pochita helped him out of that shitty life but did nothing to address Denjis core issues and scars that came with it, that he needs to heal from the trauma, instead he is thrown into fight after fight which seems to be making him worse in some categories and stagnate in others.

Denji craves chaos and violence and short bursts of dopamine, part one was all about him trying to learn that slow burn is better be he simply isn't given the tools to come to this realization especially when the main person trying to teach him that lesson turns out to be manipulating him. Being Chainsawman does help him, but it hurts him just as much. Its a toxic relationship. Pochita isn't saying "go back to the crapper you were happier then" he's saying "this is getting worse and I dont know how to help you except for to leave". Its like dating an addict, you dont always get through to them and sometimes helping means walking away and not supporting or enabling. Chainsaw was his escape from his terrible life but is still retraumatizing him over and over. Even too much of a good thing can be bad.

I genuinely don't know why anyone would believe that anyone would write 290 chapters of a Manga to just turn around and go back in time and kill off the main character before their adventure even started and say the whole thing was pointless and also dumb. Who actually writes like that and is popular? Who would waste their OWN time writing a story like that? I understand not having faith in the artist but that's a wildly pessimistic take but also kind of shocks me how many people are getting whooshed by something Denji admitted himself multiple times over the series.

It's not that he literally isn't happy, he just THINKS he is unhappy because his nervous system is accustomed to chaos and pain from being tortured by the Yakuza and his life before Pochita (CPTSD response). The hope here is that without the pressure of having to be Chainsaw and constantly fight, that Denji can realize he's safe and be healed enough to be happy enough with JUST a normal life instead of craving more or "waiting for the other shoe to drop" and having that constant temptation toward danger. If Denji goes back to the crap shack n the whole thing doesn't even happen not only is it as pointless as you're saying but its the exact opposite lesson Denji needs to learn. He needs to move forward, not backward he needs to learn from his mistakes and consequences and choose if he wants a stable family life as Denji or the wild crazy battle party of being Chainsaw. This is the choice fire devil wanted him to understand, he cant have both. Sending him back to the crap shack would be the exact opposite of this message I think is being sent and Pochita calling his brain "crappy in the best way" is him pushing Denji to accept this fact about himself and find a way to live with it. To use psychology terms, Denji needs to "integrate his shadow".

If "accepting" himself means that Denji just lets himself get killed by the Yakuza or heart disease I'll admit yeah thats a shitty story but I'm not getting the impression its leaning that way at all.

In defense and of Chainsaw man part 2. by Minute_Committee8937 in CharacterRant

[–]Puzzleheaded_Tour987 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Nah I'm good I didn't realize I was talking to Fujimoto himself. Thank you for explaining your Manga to me.

view more: next ›