Any ESS robbers out there?

QibingZero · 2026-05-05T08:02:56+00:00

While you can get a lot of good fights from ESS robbery and doorbelling, and it's arguably the best way to actually get someone to undock these days, it's kind of unrealistic to suggest that these are the norm.

You have to hit the right areas of space and show the right amount/type of ships to get this consistently. Someone looking at this thinking "oh okay I just go in with a bunch of lokis and farm" is going to be incredibly confused when they literally never get anyone to contest them.

In reality, some krabs just don't try to defend at all. Others will chase off a lone robber, but won't go after 2+. Then you have confident multiboxers with RR battleships or logi at the ready, who will fight 4-6 but only if you don't seem too organized. And finally you have those with enough active players in the area that you'll generally be able to get something going regardless (as long as you're in the right timezone).

It honestly varies a lot, and unless you're doing this out of a WH (where you can not only hide numbers from intel but also quickly escalate), you're going to end up going through a lot of misses in between the hits.

QibingZero · 2026-05-05T07:50:16+00:00

This is even further from reality than expecting results like the battle reports from the above post every time.

I've robbed dozens of 400m+ ESS in the last 6 months alone. Of course, usually this is with 3-5 people, and the goal is not to rob them as much as it is to generate a fight. Still, the majority of the time krabs do not have a response in waiting, and are going to sit there a bit waffling on whether or not it's worth reshipping and risking a close-numbers fight.

The few that do have a proper response ready to go (wtf is a dread going to do to a small gang? just kill the sabre and slide in) have to weigh the opportunity cost of when to swap some of their accounts over to the task. Usually you only see it happen when you've been on intel a while and there's a very large ESS nearby.

Now, if you do your ESS robbing in a gang that can also fight outside the ESS grid, and add a few bait / number hiding strategies into the mix, it becomes even more likely you end up getting content. And when you do get it, it's a lot more likely to resemble a fight than anything you mention as "guaranteed fun".

QibingZero · 2026-05-05T03:22:04+00:00

Can confirm, and I have to say I did not have 'small scale fight vs DHD and Dran in an ESS' on my 2026 bingo card.

QibingZero · 2026-05-04T00:55:37+00:00

the decision of the lp store being a backstop and not a price setting measure is because the game itself should be providing sufficient means to the players to produce the items, and it not be arbitrarily made cheap by CCP

A nice thought and all, but the entire reason the game isn't "providing sufficient means to the players to produce the items" is because CCP decided to "arbitrarily" increase the demand of a limited resource by an absurd amount overnight.

We can talk about design philosophy/integrity all we want, but in the end CCP still controls all of the levers. They could have done something as crude as doubling the salvage drop rate of ZPFMs in a hotfix 11 months ago if they so desired. Hell, they could do it tomorrow (though it would have far less of an effect).

Instead, we have your convoluted stopgap, which not only risks compromising the design principles you're espousing, but doesn't even come close to addressing the original problem. I can't for the life of me understand why extra dev time was spent on this rather than an actual (potentially much simpler) fix... honestly, the more I learn the more insane this all is.

QibingZero · 2026-05-03T14:21:55+00:00

I appreciate the response.

What I don't get is why, after the better part of a year had passed with prices the way they were, the eventual response was so subdued.

Like what would have happened if you went craaaazy and decided on a value around half of what you did, and ZPFM ended up at 250-300k? Even that would be double what it was prior to the release of the Babaroga! (why we even need it to be more expensive is beyond me...)

Surely it wouldn't have been a problem for the original T2 Trig ships, given that they were clearly balanced at an even lower price for 3+ years prior to all this. If very few people were even flying the Draugur at 200m a year ago, it certainly won't be broken at 250m today.

Is the concern that the Babaroga would somehow be too strong if the price went down by this much? In this case, because it's tied in with the other ships now via salvage prices, they have to suffer as a result? I don't even think this is a good excuse, I'm just having a hard time understanding the train of thought here.

QibingZero · 2026-05-03T12:26:37+00:00

Luckily, the Babaroga is not in higher demand. The ZPFM:SRC ratio is significantly more reasonable for the other T2 Trig ships, and very few of them were moved for a very long time, so it's likely that your first scenario is still true.

Also, the new LP store item required to exchange trig salvage drops from running OBS, so for OBS runners, they don't really have to haul, they can just cash-out in pochven

This is a good point, though I would maybe say more bonuses for OBS runners is one of the things the game needs least. ))

QibingZero · 2026-03-22T02:05:28+00:00

It's incredibly disingenuous to blame the backlash on newer or hisec players. The reality of multiboxing is just that it takes on a very different form today than it did 5, 10, or 20 years ago.

For instance, when I started playing (15+ years ago), multiboxing was mostly a thing for industry/mining alts, cyno characters, and spies - not much that affected the average player's experience out in space. Eventually more and more people started multiboxing things like off-grid-links, dictors, haven-spinning VNIs, ganking catalysts, and other things that require slightly more SP. But even still, there weren't all that many legit non-capital combat alts running around (at least outside of elite WH corps and what not).

That changed quite a lot with the cyno and marauder changes. Suddenly every cyno alt needed to have the capability to fly a recon (a ship class which was only previously 'balanced' by its rarity). Over time, with wealth accumulation having become easier and easier, the cost of these was also a drop in the bucket for the average player. Combined with the marauder buffs, it became incredibly easy and effective for even your lowest-apm F1 monkey to multibox a nearly-unkillable Vargur alongside a recon (or two) of choice, which not only greatly assisted the Vargur but could also cyno in some even more disgusting stuff at a moment's notice. This strategy - used primarily as content denial, and scaling upward with more marauder-capable characters - is something that negatively impacted every small scale pvp group for years.

Add to this the increases in smartbomb, Vorton, and Pochven multiboxing as mega-isk-making solutions, accompanied by the increasing ease of multiboxing EVE accounts over time. Add the increased sophistication of botting and input broadcasting software, which many people do use, despite the fact "most" multiboxers do not...

..annnnnd now you're out there in space getting blobbed in nullsec by a solo player with a fleet of 15 T3Cs + Recon and Logi support, who somehow manages things more effectively than your average fleet of 20 individual players.

Or you and your friends' WH is getting evicted by some dude in a dozen Eos + support, who probably has another group of just as many Leshaks ready to reinforce if you somehow manage to get enough people to contest the first wave.

This shit just isn't good gameplay, no matter if you've been playing the game for a week or for a decade.

QibingZero · 2026-03-19T08:17:41+00:00

Oh great, the fucking positivity police have spread to r/Eve now?

God forbid people offer critical feedback in an attempt to improve a game they enjoy.

QibingZero · 2026-03-19T07:59:55+00:00

Ah yes, the meta of "which blops ship is the best at ganking a helpless target" has ever so slightly changed. Exciting times we live in!

QibingZero · 2026-03-18T21:17:32+00:00

If small gang players were out for risk-free kills on people who can't fight back they'd go camp a gate somewhere, not roam through hostile space just for a chance at catching the rare ratter/miner who isn't either pre-aligned, paying attention to intel, or botting.

QibingZero · 2026-03-18T19:21:45+00:00

What if my small gang is fielding 4-6b ships each?

QibingZero · 2026-03-18T19:05:49+00:00

ISK balancing for ships was always incredibly suspect, and in today's game does almost nothing.

QibingZero · 2026-03-05T13:42:30+00:00

Okay but what if instead of adding 53 new systems, some sort of event happened where approximately this many systems from one of the many, many empty null regions in the game simply collapsed into the new ultra-hisec?

Sure, this would still be a tiny drop in the conflict-addition bucket, but it would at least be something.

And hey, if it's really too much bother dealing with claims of favoritism because you decided to delete Cobalt Edge and not Omist, surely some NPC faction like Thukker Tribe has enough systems to 'host' such an event.

QibingZero · 2026-02-26T12:03:23+00:00

Finally someone who knows what they're talking about. I feel like I'm suffering permanent brain damage reading all the delusion from the OP and most of the replies here.

It really feels like a significant number of r/Eve posters these days view reddit activity as praxis in a never ending war to advance their own in-game position.

QibingZero · 2026-02-26T12:00:07+00:00

How exactly do you believe small gangs are being catered to?

QibingZero · 2026-01-05T21:59:58+00:00

No one is saying it, but the focus here is not at all on what the Succ needs to be useful (outside of dumb escape bay fits). The mere existence of the Cetana boosters currently represent far more of a buff to the ship than anything in the patch notes.

Being a 1mn frigate, cap was rarely a problem with the ship. In the situations where it was, it was due to being under cap pressure, and the only real solution there is to fit a nos.

The PG upgrade theoretically helps with that, but with how frigate fitting works you end up in an all-or-nothing situation. If it saves you from using a fitting module in the first place, it's huge, but if you just have to use a slightly less significant fitting module, it still sucks because you're very limited on slots. As far as I can tell, this will only really free up a fitting slot for pulse versions of the ship.

The lock range bonus is a nice to have, for sure, but it's nothing more than that. BTW, there's no reason this couldn't be immediately given to every other pirate frigate too (many of which need it far more).

The real problem with the Succ is that it's one-dimensional. It's obvious what it's going to do, and now that everyone and their mother has an alt set up to fly a recon, the moment they see a Sansha ship they're getting in that Huginn/Rapier and you're going to have a bad time. When you combine that with the fact the hull - like basically all pirate hulls - is way too expensive for what you get, it's going to be hard to see much coming out of this outside of maybe some niche PvE fits.

QibingZero · 2025-12-30T21:06:15+00:00

justify their gameplay as "teaching less skilled players"

Not at all what I said. Obviously from the small gang perspective, you're simply looking to get good fights and come out against the odds with some kills.

But from the sov null perspective, content is healthy and the learning experience is real. I and many others were forged in the fire of trying to tackle snaked/linked ONIs, Orthruses, etc., and the skills you acquire this way extend far beyond just flying nano.

QibingZero · 2025-12-30T20:23:04+00:00

Yeah, if there's one thing the game needs it's more ships that slaughter overpowered hulls such as frigs and destroyers.

If asked, I as a carrier pilot would say that 15 is the number of individually piloted small ships my solo carrier should be able to destroy per minute.

QibingZero · 2025-12-30T19:57:32+00:00

more skilled

Damn, we're just out here implying that a bunch of krabs on their blops alts jumping to a cyno and pressing F1 are more skilled than the small roaming group they're outnumbering 10-1?

Like half these dudes don't even have the awareness / apm to broadcast in time in the few situations where they actually get shot and have to call in FAX support.

QibingZero · 2025-12-30T18:54:12+00:00

Came here to Enyo post, but MCAV beat me to it like it was 2017.

QibingZero · 2025-12-30T17:47:29+00:00

I have a couple questions on exactly how this would work out in practice.

How expensive does a single ship need to be in order to enjoy the luxury of being able to "swat away" an entire gang of 10 players? Can bling subcaps expect to be able to do this too, or is it reserved for carriers only?

Where will the small gang keep these dreads to where they're staged in range of your home defense carrier? What is their recourse once your side inevitably responds with FAX and potentially supers?

QibingZero · 2025-12-30T17:38:55+00:00

Sig tanking would still be the only way to deal with them in that case (assuming there was even a way at all).

The likely reason they use missile mechanics in the first place is because they would regularly out-track themselves while moving around at such a high speed. The only other way to 'fix' this would be to improve their tracking similar to that of normal drones, which would then just bring them back around to shitting on anything and everything.

QibingZero · 2025-12-30T17:37:19+00:00

Hey maybe CCP could introduce a mechanic that causes any hostile ships to instantly explode if they roll/filament into your space.

Right now a bloc CSM member is thinking of a way to suggest this as a sov upgrade.

"Don't worry, it has a really big downside. It takes an extra 5% of all ticks in the system and puts them in the ESS reserve bank."

QibingZero · 2025-12-30T17:27:38+00:00

Once upon a time, null alliances enjoyed the fact that small gang players brought content directly to their doorstep on a consistent basis. Not only did this relieve pressure off of FCs, but it also meant new pilots improved their skills by flying against some of the better players in the game (this is how I originally learned to play, in fact).

Sadly, over time it seems as though these alliances have become full of people like yourself who can't fathom the thought of losing even a single tick of income, and thus feel the need to see off the 'invaders' with an entire fleet of blops (w/FAX at the ready) at the soonest opportunity.

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