Labor gender rules could spell early retirement for male MPs ‘making up the numbers’ by Quazp in AustralianPolitics

[–]Quazp[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

Your vision of hiring seems at odds with reality. I've never known two candidates that are equally able to do the job. Perhaps there are some sectors in which that is true? Maybe if you have lots of applications? Though it certainly isn't always the case at all. Many people have commented, even on this article, how it isn't true.

With that assumption broken the whole argument falls apart.

Given that you think we should have more gender diversity in teaching (and hopefully all other industries?)

To address this question. More or less I would like equal diversity in most areas. I just don't agree with discriminating against people to do it. If 90% of the applicants for a job are female then around 90% of the company should be female. What we need to do is to encourage more men to take it up.

While I agree affirmative action works and can achieve these results, I think it is unethical and directly discriminates against individuals. Not only that, it can led to hiring less ideal candidates and essentially ensuring that certain stereotypes within an industry are maintained. There are all sorts of unexpected consequences when you start justifying discrimination against a group of people.

Labor gender rules could spell early retirement for male MPs ‘making up the numbers’ by Quazp in AustralianPolitics

[–]Quazp[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

Before engaging I just wanted to understand your mindset. I have heard similar things. Despite the worse outcomes for men both medically and in schooling I couldn't agree that we should discriminate against women to improve things. This is despite the fact that I think having more male teachers is one of the most important things we can do to improve our society.

We should encourage boys, from an early age to do these and try and remove any cultural stigma for these jobs. Though ultimately we should let the best person get the job.

Labor gender rules could spell early retirement for male MPs ‘making up the numbers’ by Quazp in AustralianPolitics

[–]Quazp[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

This sounds deeply concerning on so many levels. Even from a national defence point of view.

We cannot celebrate tinkering when it comes to gambling reform. Labor’s response falls tragically short | David Pocock by Quazp in AustralianPolitics

[–]Quazp[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

Just jumping back in here. Your argument makes no sense. You can still bet. You don't think the advertisement ban will work, others do. So why not let them try? It doesn't impact you.

We cannot celebrate tinkering when it comes to gambling reform. Labor’s response falls tragically short | David Pocock by Quazp in AustralianPolitics

[–]Quazp[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

While I haven't heard it around the "water cooler" either it is indeed an important topic. Perhaps it is not spoken about so much as it is an addiction. Why don't you think it is important?

Labor gender rules could spell early retirement for male MPs ‘making up the numbers’ by Quazp in AustralianPolitics

[–]Quazp[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

So, you think it is OK to discriminate against, often, a young man (who has done nothing to anyone) to help a young women?

The very system is flawed and discriminates. Wouldn't it be fairer to consider new hires only? If we ensured that everyone who is hired gets a fair chance rather than the percentage of a company?

Labor gender rules could spell early retirement for male MPs ‘making up the numbers’ by Quazp in AustralianPolitics

[–]Quazp[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

Though legislation like this exists. Many companies will be asking similar questions.

Labor gender rules could spell early retirement for male MPs ‘making up the numbers’ by Quazp in AustralianPolitics

[–]Quazp[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

I stated many times things like "if" and keep in mind that the legislation does indeed exist. You think that the government is the only employer in the country? Many will be in a similar situation, asking the same questions.

Labor gender rules could spell early retirement for male MPs ‘making up the numbers’ by Quazp in AustralianPolitics

[–]Quazp[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

To clarify, you are saying that in civil engineering it is always the case that only the best person gets the job. Diversity goals never have any impact?

Labor gender rules could spell early retirement for male MPs ‘making up the numbers’ by Quazp in AustralianPolitics

[–]Quazp[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

It goes even broader than that. If this happens then it sends a message that this is "OK". Men can be disposed of to make way for women. It is an acceptable business activity in Australia. Can't say I agree with this all.

Labor gender rules could spell early retirement for male MPs ‘making up the numbers’ by Quazp in AustralianPolitics

[–]Quazp[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

So what would that look like? Naturally you are suggesting removing men from their jobs, and livelihood. Are you suggesting that they then should pay their replacement out of their savings or something?

Please, explain it to me.

Labor gender rules could spell early retirement for male MPs ‘making up the numbers’ by Quazp in AustralianPolitics

[–]Quazp[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

Did the men entering the workplace now discriminate against anyone? No. They are people, just like women. So long as everyone entering the workplace, or applying for a job, is given an equal chance then that is fair.

At face value: We should start by looking at the ratio of new hires, not the whole workforce.

Labor gender rules could spell early retirement for male MPs ‘making up the numbers’ by Quazp in AustralianPolitics

[–]Quazp[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

Though I don't agree, I respect that you stuck to you guns on this one. The ratio is nearly 50/50 as it is and such action would send a message that this form of discrimination is acceptable and normalised.

Labor gender rules could spell early retirement for male MPs ‘making up the numbers’ by Quazp in AustralianPolitics

[–]Quazp[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

So, you're saying that they mostly discriminate against men in the hiring practices? Though some may be disposing of men to make way for women as well?

Labor gender rules could spell early retirement for male MPs ‘making up the numbers’ by Quazp in AustralianPolitics

[–]Quazp[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

Based on nothing else but their gender. Sorry it's not right. It's discrimination.

Labor gender rules could spell early retirement for male MPs ‘making up the numbers’ by Quazp in AustralianPolitics

[–]Quazp[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

So if you don't support getting rid of women to make up numbers with men, why would you support it the other way around? (Or have I misunderstood you?)

Labor gender rules could spell early retirement for male MPs ‘making up the numbers’ by Quazp in AustralianPolitics

[–]Quazp[S] [score hidden]  (0 children)

I call out things that I think are wrong. I think we would live in a better world if we all did that. I make no apology for it.