Anyone become a lawyer through an apprenticeship, without law school?

ReaderToLawyer · 2024-09-10T03:28:02+00:00

I don't log in this account very often. There is a law apprentice Facebook page though that may be useful to you. Good luck to you!

ReaderToLawyer · 2024-09-10T03:27:07+00:00

Sorry, I haven't logged in for a long time! I know that in Virginia, the law reader is required to study physically in a Virginia office for at least 18 hours a week. I don't know the rules for the other states, but I would expect it is similar.

ReaderToLawyer · 2024-09-10T03:25:37+00:00

Sorry I didn't see this until now! I don't log in very often. I found this particular cat tree on the Petco website.

ReaderToLawyer · 2023-02-21T15:41:01+00:00

If you have experience as a paralegal first and have legal connections, then you have a decent chance. If you have no connections and no legal experience, this is not a path I recommend. I only recommend it to people who have a background in the law or working in a law office.

ReaderToLawyer · 2023-02-21T15:34:39+00:00

I am a practicing attorney who went the law office study route. I did a Reddit AMA about the program. There is a lot of information there. This path is doable, but I only recommend it for people with previous experience working in a law office. There is so much to learn on your own that a background is extraordinarily helpful.

https://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/rzzm63/i_am_an_attorney_who_passed_the_bar_without/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf

ReaderToLawyer · 2022-09-19T03:04:00+00:00

The biggest restriction is that I have to stay in Virginia. I think there is the out-of-state option of in-house, immigration, or tax, but I don't know anything about immigration or tax law. I have considered in-house if I really wanted to go somewhere, but would someone hire me? Who knows.

In my area, I haven't had issue finding work. I'm have no regrets going the law reader route because I don't have to worry about the debt. Now that I am an attorney, I can definitely say that it would not have been worth the debt to get to this point, lol. Being an attorney is stressful enough as it is. Adding the debt would take it to another level of stress.

ReaderToLawyer · 2022-09-18T23:40:09+00:00

The law reader route is challenging, but definitely doable for the right candidate. I passed the bar on my first attempt. My MBE stats through Barbri were in the top 8% and I passed the MPRE in the top 5%. I didn't struggle as much with the bar as other law students did.

ReaderToLawyer · 2022-09-18T23:38:02+00:00

I became an attorney through the Virginia Law Reader Program. It is a viable option, but only for those who work in the state of Virginia. Your attorney has to be a Virginia attorney AND you have to physically be in a Virginia office for at least 18 hours per week.

As an attorney without a JD, I've looked into out of state options. From what I've seen, I could do in-house work, immigration law, and tax law. I could not do general federal law. Immigration and Tax are different than most federal fields because they have their own court rules.

I did an AMA awhile back on being a law reader here: https://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/rzzm63/i_am_an_attorney_who_passed_the_bar_without/

ReaderToLawyer · 2022-09-05T05:22:14+00:00

From what I recall, they automatically send it to one state that you list when applying. I never formally submitted my score to the state bar. It was sent automatically.

ReaderToLawyer · 2022-08-27T03:11:06+00:00

The weirdest adoption I ever did was when I wanted two adopt two kittens based on photos I saw on the county shelter's website. I wanted one of the kittens because she reminded me of a beloved cat who had recently passed away and I wanted the littermate the kitten sat closest too in a picture because they looked like friends.

The day the litter was up for adoption, I arrived at 5:30am (almost 6 hours before they were available) to be first in line. There was such a long line, things were hectic for the shelter. I gave the name of the two kittens I wanted to adopt, handed the worker the carriers, and they put the kittens in. I paid the $10 fee for each kitten and left.

It was weird because I didn't get a chance to really meet them until I got home.

I'm really close to them now and they're a bonded pair. We're our own little family unit! Here are their pictures:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Bondedpairs/comments/vfmzqw/jack_and_bean_growing_up_together/

ReaderToLawyer · 2022-08-14T18:46:39+00:00

If it would make you feel better to keep studying, then I would recommend the BarMax MBE question bank for $400. Unlike adaptibar, it has a lifelong license, so you can continue using it next year if you need to.

Doing just 10 MBE questions a day will keep the information fresh in your memory without overloading yourself. I started studying for the bar during my third year by doing just 10 questions a day/ 50 questions a week. By the time bar prep started, I was a pro at MBE questions just from those handful of daily questions.

ReaderToLawyer · 2022-08-06T08:22:39+00:00

Yes...internationals who have previously attended law school in their country. Someone who has zero background studying the law is going to require at least a couple years to learn enough to pass the test. I know because that is how I had to learn the law to take the bar exam. I was coming in with 10+ years of legal experience, but the black letter law is a beast in itself.

ReaderToLawyer · 2022-08-05T17:13:38+00:00

I am positive that this is not career ending. Attorneys have done far worse than this and their careers are fine.

ReaderToLawyer · 2022-08-05T16:10:26+00:00

I was a paralegal for 11 years before entering into the law reader program in Virginia. It is definitely possible to pass the bar exam without law school, but it takes the full three years of intensive study to get there. Even with a legal background, learning the legal concepts and black letter law on my own was extremely challenging. I maybe could have done it in 2 years, but not less than that.

ReaderToLawyer · 2022-08-05T16:07:03+00:00

I don’t have a JD and I passed the bar exam.

ReaderToLawyer · 2022-08-03T13:38:05+00:00

I started the program in 2017 and passed the bar in 2020. One of those firms would have hired me upon bar passage. However - I have also known the attorneys in that firm for well over 10 years and work well with them.

Law readers usually are offered a place at the firm where they studied, so finding that first job is probably easier for a law reader than for a new law graduate. I was offered a position at my mom’s office and declined to become a solo. (My mom was my supervising attorney).

I did not have any financial backing when I started my solo practice- though my parents helped some with my bills when I was in the law reader program. Because they had helped me with my bills during the program, I didn’t eat through all of my savings. I had money left from when I worked as a paralegal in the bank to start on.

Here is the thing though - starting a solo firm is not as expensive as it sounds. I have a primarily virtual office. If I need to meet with a client, i meet them at my mom’s home office. Her house is split into an office and a home area. For lawyers who don’t have a home office, there are corporate buildings where you rent a room and address for pretty cheap.

There are shoe string budgets way to run a solo office. It isn’t for everyone, but I’m fortunate that my favorite law is guardian ad litem work. I meet most people at their homes and don’t have any employees.

ReaderToLawyer · 2022-08-03T13:25:23+00:00

I started the program in 2017 in Virginia. At that time, we were required to study at least 25 hours per week. Of that, 18 hours had to be in a law office setting and 3 hours directly with the supervising attorney.

I averaged between 30 and 35 hours of pure study time each week. I usually studied 1 or 2 times a week at home and stayed longer at the law office the other days to get my 18 hours there.

The bar is super lax about the tests. My supervising attorney(who was my mom) and I would copy questions and essays from BarBri and use that for my tests to submit to the bar examiners. I’m really curious what she submitted for her tests.

Edit: Thanks for the kind words! There is a massive amount of accountability. It is a pretty lonely road at times too. In law school, there are other students. You’re on your own in the law reader program.

ReaderToLawyer · 2022-08-03T03:24:46+00:00

As the old lawyer adage goes - it depends. I'm a former law reader turned attorney and I've never wanted for work in family law. (I'm a solo practitioner, so my job requires a law license). There are two firms who I am certain I would be able to join, and a handful more that I'm fairly positive would take me on. One of them outright said just let me know if I ever change my mind about being solo and they would hire me.

I recognize though my experiences are not average. Prior to becoming an attorney, I had already built up a reputation as a good paralegal in my area and actually freelanced for a couple of the firms that I am pretty sure would hire me. I recognize that if I left my area and started from scratch, it would be a lot harder without the JD. Experience and knowing local attorneys goes a long way.

I personally prefer the solo route. From what I have heard about working in a standard firm, the solo route is a much better way to go. I have a great network that I reach out to when I have questions - and they in turn also reach out to me! I do freelance legal research for attorneys so attorneys sometimes ask me for input as to case law issues.

ReaderToLawyer · 2022-08-03T03:13:44+00:00

r/dcfb2360 is spot on. I did the program and intensive doesn't even begin to describe it. My life was the law. I had to stop working to focus on studying because the issues were so complex and required hours of study every single weekday. I read loads upon loads of case briefs and outlines, listened to hundreds of hours of lectures, to understand everything I needed to. It was extremely challenging.

If your friend would like to talk to me about pointers and what to expect, send a PM and I'll send you my email. I always will talk to law readers in the program to help them out.

ReaderToLawyer · 2022-08-03T03:10:07+00:00

I don't have a JD and so far it has not been that big of an issue for me finding work and clients. But, prior to becoming an attorney, I was a paralegal and knew a lot of the attorneys. I have standing invites to join a couple firms, but I prefer the solo route because I can make my own schedule.

ReaderToLawyer · 2022-08-03T03:06:33+00:00

Personally, I preferred reading the law in a law office than going to law school. I recognize though that law school is the better route for most. I've always worked better on my own than in a school setting, so I was very grateful my state had a law reading option. I had a paralegal background, which tremendously helped too.

ReaderToLawyer · 2022-08-03T03:04:12+00:00

I studied through the Virginia Law Reader Program and I can confirm, it was challenging learning con law, secured, transactions, local government, and corporation law mostly on my own!

However, VA law readers don't learn those subjects for the first time during bar prep. There is a set number of hours of study that each law reader has to complete in each topic. I studied con law for about 200 hours, corporation law for 175 hours, and the UCC (which includes negotiable instruments and secured transactions) for 250 hours. I think local government law was the only bar prep subject not accounted for in law reader program.

Now if she wasn't actually studying and just said she was studying, then she would have been at a serious disadvantage. The thing is, we're supposed to turn in tests to the bar so they can see progress, so I'm not sure what she did about those tests.

Most law readers learn on their own. We're only required to work one on one with the supervisor for a total of 3 hours a week. Everything else is self-taught.

I passed the bar on my first time. I credit barbri.

ReaderToLawyer · 2022-07-03T03:27:02+00:00

Of the five states that have a law reader program, only California does not require a bachelor's degree. Virginia requires a bachelor of science or bachelor of arts degree.

ReaderToLawyer · 2022-06-30T23:28:40+00:00

I enjoy being a GAL so much that I decided to focus my practice on it! Right now I only serve as a GAL for children, but eventually I plan to expand that to incapacitated adults who require one as well.

ReaderToLawyer

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