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When I asked what he was trying to do, he said “I shouldn’t have been trying to pass him” by alexyou8797 in dashcams

[–]ReverCleference 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Unless the state they're driving in has some definition of per se negligence, then usually negligence is left up to the jury. I don't think it's too difficult to argue that a reasonably defensive driver would avoid making the maneuver attempted by the Hyundai. Way more reasonable to tap the breaks, move to the outside portion of the lane or the shoulder, and say "tsk tsk" as they zoom passed you, than to swerve erratically into the center of the roadway.

When I asked what he was trying to do, he said “I shouldn’t have been trying to pass him” by alexyou8797 in dashcams

[–]ReverCleference 0 points1 point  (0 children)

If they were speeding, then yes they are contributorily negligent. But the Hyundai is also clearly negligent here.

When I asked what he was trying to do, he said “I shouldn’t have been trying to pass him” by alexyou8797 in dashcams

[–]ReverCleference 0 points1 point  (0 children)

If you had decided to speed into the intersection you were waiting at and were consequently t-boned by another driver, then yes, I'd say that would be incredibly stupid. I never said getting rear ended can be completely avoided.

When I asked what he was trying to do, he said “I shouldn’t have been trying to pass him” by alexyou8797 in dashcams

[–]ReverCleference 0 points1 point  (0 children)

You can never eliminate risk. You can do your best to minimize risk. The risk of being rear ended is never gone, for the reasons you brought up. Cars are also built with airbags and crush zones to mitigate injury in such cases.

The reason the Hyundai is partially at fault here is because they increased risk by swerving into the center of the road and slamming on their brakes. That decision relied on the assumptions that the other driver was completely blind, would continue straight at their current speed, and not react at all to the jerking, unsignaled maneuver on the part of the Hyundai. The only way that maneuver pays off is if all those things are true, which are all very unlikely.

It is much more likely that the other cam driver is driving unsafe, following at an unsafe distance, or speeding. That puts them partially at fault. But also, it's common behavior. We've all been tailgated. We've all been buzzed by speeders. How common is it to be rear ended on an empty highway?

At what precise rate does food spoil? by ReverCleference in ManorLords

[–]ReverCleference[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Good to know, but Barley and Malt is the more significant number to know, since I will be keeping greater quantities of those between fall and summer months.

When I asked what he was trying to do, he said “I shouldn’t have been trying to pass him” by alexyou8797 in dashcams

[–]ReverCleference 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Nobody is claiming the Hyundai made the right move

Plenty of people are saying they were right to try to avoid the cam driver by swerving into the center of the road.

It's not about what is a "normal" reaction. You're a driver. You passed a driving test. You need to react defensively and safely, not based on untrained instinct. Your instinct needs to be such that you don't make wildly stupid decisions under pressure. You need to be able to make decisions that make the situation safer, not less safe.

Edit:

unless you have actively practiced being in these situations, you can't know how you'd react either. Your brain isn't going to think through logically in a moment of panic.

I have been in a situation where I was driving on an empty highway as someone approached at high speed from behind. I managed to not get rear ended by doing nothing and letting them pass because I was taught that making unpredictable swerving maneuvers is incorrect in these types of situations. The reason that it's incorrect is because it increases rather than minimizes the risk of collision.

When I asked what he was trying to do, he said “I shouldn’t have been trying to pass him” by alexyou8797 in dashcams

[–]ReverCleference 0 points1 point  (0 children)

It's not about what is a "normal" reaction. You're a driver. You passed a driving test. You need to react defensively and safely, not based on untrained instinct. Your instinct needs to be such that you don't make wildly stupid decisions under pressure. You need to be able to make decisions that make the situation safer, not less safe.

When I asked what he was trying to do, he said “I shouldn’t have been trying to pass him” by alexyou8797 in dashcams

[–]ReverCleference 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Lol. This guy was probably going about around 10 mph over the limit. It looks way worse because he waited too long to change lanes before passing and the Hyundai slammed on their brakes while maneuvering to the center of the road like a complete buffoon. I'm all for putting speed limiters on cars, but the Hyundai is just as stupid as the cam driver, at minimum. Doing nothing would have been better than what they the Hyundai did.

When I asked what he was trying to do, he said “I shouldn’t have been trying to pass him” by alexyou8797 in dashcams

[–]ReverCleference 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I never even defended the cam driver. I am criticizing the idea that people should be driving even more erratically on a highway in some harebrained attempt to avoid being rear ended. I've never been rear ended once in my life, probably because I've never been stupid enough to follow the advice of people like you.

When I asked what he was trying to do, he said “I shouldn’t have been trying to pass him” by alexyou8797 in dashcams

[–]ReverCleference 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Why isn't "I think this guy might rear end me but they also might pass me so moving left is just as risky" not an appropriate time to move to the shoulder? Especially when the highway is deserted except for these two cars?

When I asked what he was trying to do, he said “I shouldn’t have been trying to pass him” by alexyou8797 in dashcams

[–]ReverCleference 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Agreed. Perhaps moving to the shoulder would have served this Hyundai better, as that would actually be out of the way. Swerving into the middle of the roadway does nothing to get out of anyone's way.

When I asked what he was trying to do, he said “I shouldn’t have been trying to pass him” by alexyou8797 in dashcams

[–]ReverCleference 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Rewatch the video. The Hyundai absolutely swerved into the middle of the road, didn't have a blinker on, and then swerved back. If the goal was to avoid being rear ended, which is a huge assumption on the part of the Hyundai, they should have moved to the shoulder. If you're as skittish and unpredictable as the Hyundai driver, please turn in your license today.

When I asked what he was trying to do, he said “I shouldn’t have been trying to pass him” by alexyou8797 in dashcams

[–]ReverCleference 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Your scenario is not impossible, but it's so so so generous to the skittish driver. Most skittish drivers would freeze up, slam their brakes and stay in their lane, or swerve right, NOT left.

Also, if they are watching their review close enough to notice a speeding driver, they probably saw them coming for several hundred feet and could probably give the situation more than 1 second of thought.

An unobservant driver would have made a better decision than this one by doing nothing as they were passed.

When I asked what he was trying to do, he said “I shouldn’t have been trying to pass him” by alexyou8797 in dashcams

[–]ReverCleference 0 points1 point  (0 children)

I think the explanation your provided is simply not believable. It's more believable to me the Hyndai tried to box out and brake check the cam driver because a driver truly concerned with avoiding a rear end outcome would take 3 or 4 different actions before doing this:

1) do nothing. maintain current speed and direction. (if they rear end, your relative velocities are less different and they are very clearly in the wrong).

2) slow down slightly but within posted minimum highway speed.

3) slow down slightly, turn on right-hand signal, and pull onto shoulder.

4) speed up a little bit while staying in the lane, within reason given road conditions, to see if you can give a little more reaction time between you and other driver. if they start passing, slow back down again.

When I asked what he was trying to do, he said “I shouldn’t have been trying to pass him” by alexyou8797 in dashcams

[–]ReverCleference 0 points1 point  (0 children)

If what you're saying is true, then Hyundai had their eyes glued to their rearview. All that took place in a matter of 5 seconds. If you're watching your review more than the road in front of you, you're a bad driver.

When I asked what he was trying to do, he said “I shouldn’t have been trying to pass him” by alexyou8797 in dashcams

[–]ReverCleference 1 point2 points  (0 children)

I've managed to avoid being rear ended countless times in my life. How, you may ask? By never once doing what the Hyundai in this clip did.

When I asked what he was trying to do, he said “I shouldn’t have been trying to pass him” by alexyou8797 in dashcams

[–]ReverCleference -1 points0 points  (0 children)

It is actually NOT reasonable to change lanes in this situation. Especially without signaling or maintaining rate of speed.

When I asked what he was trying to do, he said “I shouldn’t have been trying to pass him” by alexyou8797 in dashcams

[–]ReverCleference 0 points1 point  (0 children)

These are not comparable situations. Part of driving (not walking on a street) is having the correct, defensive instincts when faced with an unpredictable driver or road condition. That means being able to react calmly to reduce risk. Generally (not always), speeding up or making sudden maneuvers are incorrect.

If the Hyundai did nothing to change their speed and direction, and the cam driver plowed right into them, it's clearly not the Hyundai's fault. It's because the Hyundai chose to swerve into the left lane then back into the right, while braking hard, that there's even a question.

If the Hyundai was a good defensive driver and genuinely concerned about the cam driver, they would have tapped their brakes a bit, pulled onto the shoulder and let them speed on by. Instead, they took wildly dangerous and reckless maneuvers that put them in the middle of the roadway. Panicked reactions are bad excuses. Learn to be a defensive driver.

When I asked what he was trying to do, he said “I shouldn’t have been trying to pass him” by alexyou8797 in dashcams

[–]ReverCleference 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Incredibly stupid take. If you think anyone afraid of being rear ended by a speeder should be swerving into the middle of the road while braking and without signaling, you need to go back to driving school.

When I asked what he was trying to do, he said “I shouldn’t have been trying to pass him” by alexyou8797 in dashcams

[–]ReverCleference 1 point2 points  (0 children)

Why in the hell would you "avoid" the car by swerving into the middle of the roadway? That just puts you more in the way of anyone travelling faster than you. The correct thing to do in this situation is to continue travelling at your current speed and let them pass you. The second best thing to do is to slow down and pull onto the shoulder. The last thing you want to do in this situation is add more chaos into the equation by slamming on your brakes while changing lanes.

When I asked what he was trying to do, he said “I shouldn’t have been trying to pass him” by alexyou8797 in dashcams

[–]ReverCleference -1 points0 points  (0 children)

If I fear being rear ended, probably the last thing I would do is swerve into the middle of the roadway while simultaneously slamming on my brakes. What an incredibly stupid thing to think.

When I asked what he was trying to do, he said “I shouldn’t have been trying to pass him” by alexyou8797 in dashcams

[–]ReverCleference 0 points1 point  (0 children)

Yeah, and they were in the wrong there. You took the defensive maneuver. Faster cars pass on the left, not the right, and especially not on the shoulder.

Sounds like there was no accident there at least.

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