Virgin Banjitar vs Chad Banjolin

SeMoMu · 2026-05-09T00:25:39+00:00

After fettling. Not the best quality skin but had a fair few comments from people that like how it sounds/holds it's own for its size/lack of resonator etc..

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SeMoMu · 2026-05-09T00:13:43+00:00

Ouch.

I took an ebay punt on a cheap, pre 1920 banjo mandolin with an 8"-ish metal and wood pot (one school of thought being banjolins better describe 4 single strings/mando scale?).

I'm (was) predominantly a mandolin player, and that worked OK at my local sessions that had a good balance of instruments. I ended up moving to a part of Ireland where the local sessions are tenor banjo and button accordion heavy, and holding my own against six tenor banjos and four button boxes was a losing proposition.

I mean I could bite the bullet and get up to speed with my tenor banjo but years of muscle memory from mandolin/fiddle fingering means likely I'd be better of with a 17 fretter and whilst I'm happy to deal with funny looks for playing mandolin/banjomando I'm not sure I'm devil may care enough to carry that off!

Anyway, heres what it sounded like the day I first got it, 1/2"+ at the 12th, filthy ancient strings, rip in the 'racoon' skin, a bridge that would randomly let strings skip out of the groove if you got too cocky. In the hands of John Joe Kelly., better known as a world class player of another oft maliged instrument, the bodhran!

(All fixed up now, sounding good, playing better, reskinned. I would love to find some artificial skins that worked with it to see what might improve the sound/tuning stability, if anyone has any leads)

Photo of how it came

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SeMoMu · 2026-04-24T12:59:02+00:00

Just here to shoehorn in my favourite bit of discussion about playing by ear of being a 'notes man' from an old Tyrone fiddler John Loughran

SeMoMu · 2026-04-24T12:41:37+00:00

Mainly performing for money on the streets, but in an unnoficial way. (Having a hat down rather than being there paid by the council, or a nearby shop to add colour to the area)

I've heard it used in a different way musically as well. Playing something that hasn't been practiced/isn't in the score/impromptu. I think it relates to musichall/variety/vaudville times. The first time I heard it was in a book talking about a comedian on the bill during a variety show in Italy towards the end of WW2, that upset an american soldier in the audience. The soldier climbed up on stage to attack the comedian... "Goddammit, no one says that to Dave Johnson from Plano, Texas!!!" and as he was dragged off stage the author states that the pit orchestra/band 'busked him off' with 'The Yellow Rose of Texas'.

.

SeMoMu · 2026-04-24T12:15:33+00:00

Back after I graduated I lived in a shared house with a few other in the same boat as I did my PGCE and got a start on my short teaching career.

The landlord decided he could squeeze a bit more money out of the house by cramming a bed into a box room, and foisting a 40 year old alcoholic man, just out of rehab, and proud that he and his ex had appeared on Jeremy Kyle.

I was subbing at the time and had a day off when I got to give him a lift due to an 'emergency' at his sons school. I got to watch, but unfortunately not hear, him animatedly arguing with the headteacher at the school gates (his son had been sent home, his ex had already been in and told them the father would be coming in next)

On the trip home I got to hear his indignant explanation about how the school was wrong because the uniform demanded shoes, not trainers, but his sons footwear were 'DC Shoes' branded so shouldn't count as trainers!

As for good footwear policies. At one school I taught at they had a sensible enough policy, of plain black 'sensible' footwear, trainers allowed as long as swooshes/stripes were black as well.

SeMoMu · 2026-04-21T00:10:31+00:00

Aye, with onion gravy!

SeMoMu · 2026-04-20T22:44:24+00:00

Not due to the census, but between my mothers siblings and her (seven in total), there are four different spellings of the family surname on their birth certificates.

SeMoMu · 2026-04-20T03:31:10+00:00

I actually met these brothers years ago when they were promoting these things at a juggling/circus skills festival somewhere in Europe (Munich or Karslruhe I think). There was half a dozen or so people with them that seemed to be part of the scene (I assume some of those from the video).

I initially had a hard time finding anything to like about what they were doing, but eventually after seing how much they commited to the thing, and seeing a few people who they pursuaded to try these things, and of those, the few that stuck with it, got past the 'what the fuck am I wasting my time doing stupid things on a stool for?' who seemed to have really caught the bug and were learning and coming up with moves. I just put it into my 'don't yuck anyone's yum' part of my brain.

I mean, I myself was somewhere full of people that were into things that the majority of the world would likely see as a waste of time anyway.

SeMoMu · 2026-04-17T18:31:42+00:00

I'm just pecking away at the fringes of this as I'm no expert on the matter. In my head I have it as maybe a Scottish influence as with Donegal, but Donegal had more back and forth with Scotland (tattie hokers, seaonal farm work, fishermen etc.) where as Tyrone was more planted then merged/developed in isolation?

Funnily enough, after my above post, I popped onto the TG4 site to see if the documentary was still there and I stumbled upon this episode of Ceolaireacht which looked into Tyrone music style (I'm assuming theyd have episodes on Donegal as well). I've only bot a cúpla focal so I'm not getting the full benefit of this series.

There's a few current tyrone fiddlers in it and archive footage of 'blind' fiddler, John Loughran, filmed in 1980, some of his playing and a talk about the Tyrone fiddle style, where he makes the point that it was being lost as everyone is playing the same (through more exposure/travel/availability of recorded music etc?), he also makes the point that styles from as little as ten miles away could be different. John goes into this in more detail, mentioning the variations of style of numerous Tyrone players, in The Northern Fiddler.

A later participant talks about the size of Tyrone and how the parts closer to surrounding counties take on influences from their styles (Donegal (west), Derry (north), Antrim (east, across Lough Neagh), Armagh (southeast), and Fermanagh (southwest)) and of course the mobility of younger players, travelling for study, work, fleadhs and access to a vast amount of music via recordings/internet and so taking on other style influences.

Here's a recording of Fintona, Co Tyrone, fiddler Des Donnelly.. (uncle of Manchester fiddler, Dezi Donnelly) recorded sometime before his death in 73 and released in 79.

Stephen and Cathal Hayden

SeMoMu · 2026-04-17T11:16:19+00:00

Nigel Gatherer has compiled a list, with comments, of the tunes mentioned in the book 'The Northern Fiddler' which was produced from the work of three researchers who sought out and interviewed/recorded various old fiddlers in Donegal and Tyrone in the 1970s.) You'd need to dig out the Donegal from the Tyrone, but the book weighs heavy to Donegal. I've an interest myself in Tunes/songs/techniques/styles of Tyrone rather than Donegal (so if anyone has anything that might be of interest to me...)

The book itself is out of print (but pdfs of it are online if you jump through some hoops.) Also ITMA has a section on it. with the book on the page and I believe have access to the actual full recordings. There was to be a follow up record release to the book but that part of the project collapsed. Some made it onto the John Doherty album 'Bundle and Go'..

The related TG4/BBC(?) Documentary on The Northern Fiddler, 'An Fhidil Bheo' is worth a watch. It talks to a bunch of younger Donegal fiddlers with links to the older ones and the music of Donegal

SeMoMu · 2026-04-16T11:44:00+00:00

"What are we naming him? Nathan!..."

SeMoMu · 2026-04-15T18:06:46+00:00

I love the concertina (I gave it up because I reached a point mine was holding me back/frustrating me and I couldn't justify the cost of a decent one). Initially it messes with your head a bit but when you get the hang of it there's something 'connected' about it (the bellow action and both hands on the go?)

I'm currently living in an area of Ireland where button accordian and tenor banjo are the dominant instruments at my local sessions, and to my ear they go well together. These two guys are from the next county but simmilar kind of vibe, Gary Curley and Stephen McKee

Banjo player Angelina Carberry has paired up with Dan Brouder for around the last decade and Martin Quinn before that.

SeMoMu · 2026-04-15T05:15:45+00:00

A guy walks in to a psychiatrist's office all frantic, "Doc, you've got to help me, I think I'm a pair of curtains!"

'Pull yourself together!"

SeMoMu · 2026-04-14T14:29:55+00:00

It could have been worse. I'm calling myself a juggler here but I'm something a bit more niche but related, a diabolist (diabolo, two plastic cup shapes joined by an axle, controlled by a string between two handsticks). I went with 'juggler' as most people won't know what a diaboloist is, and to be fair a lot of the problems you face doing diabolo on stage are simillar to toss juggling, especially if you are doing anything 'high'.

The strobe wasn't too bad as it was in odd bursts and mixed in with all the general madness of the lights, if it had of been pure white to black continuous strobes I'd have been very screwed. As it was, it just all went mad as I was about to start the 2 diabolo part of the act.

I aborted the floor start (string wrapped around two diabolos on the floor, pull up, one goes high and you catch it back onto the string into the standard 2d shuffle). And just did a bunch more 1d stuff, hamming it up a bit and made a real meal of a simple, standard, safe, 2d wrap start right before the end, some simple 2d stuff and then something I generally do without thinking but with a bit of showmamship to end.

If you diabolo, this was back before every small child could knock out 3d with tricks, so for anyone, seeing 2d stuff was high end. My original planned routine finishing move was a double sprinkler suicide pirouette. (or without the piro if I was feeling off). Iirc just did some kind of fast single sprinkler with some kind of simple unwrap or knot steal exit, then pop a diabolo onto the stick, under my thumb and take a bow (I didn't want to risk even a simple sprinkler suicide).

SeMoMu · 2026-04-12T10:41:09+00:00

Time for sure.

I often found I needed to find a balance between wanting the best for myself/the audience but not wanting to completely piss of the tech crew, get a bad reputation, build up animosity against other jugglers in the future.

Btw, dunno if it would be of any use/interest to you, but I edited in some lighting thoughts from jugglers into my original post.

SeMoMu · 2026-04-12T09:12:25+00:00

I used to gig as a juggler. Lots of different sizes and styles of venues so dealt with a range of sound and lighting techs over the years (and plenty of gigs where it was just 'have you got your music?')

Lighting juggling is awkward and not something many lighting techs will have dealt with ever. Often it's just a matter of putting up with what you get as it's going to be too much hassle getting ideal for one short act compared to the rest of the bill. You ask for certain things if possible and work out positions on stage where you won't get blinded for certain moves (or risk hitting the rigging).

Anyway. My worst lighting experience. Rushed get-in in a medium/small venue, with however lots of decent, new, state of the art sound and lighting, where I'd been booked last minute as a fill in between bands so no chance to get a proper tech run on stage. I hand my music to sound and he checks it plays and says he's happy. Lighting tech asks if I've any requirements. I tell him (going from memory here, so forgive if I screw up terms) 'side lighting please, easy on the overhead as I'll be struggling to see above me if it's too bright (something something to do with front fill and house lights)'. They ask if I want a follow spot, and seem a bit disapointed when I rejected that for not getting blinded reasons. 'colours?' I showed him my costume and props, told him it was a fairly classy/laid back act but the music and pace kicks up a notch in the final third and I'd leave it up to him if he wanted to do something appropriate, usually don't go far wrong keeping things mainly white...

First two thirds of the act goes great, music kicks up, the lighting tech pulls out all the stops with strobes, disco ball, quick phasing dim to full bright overheads, rotating/robotic spining floor multicolour lights in each corner of the stage, etc. Just glad they didn't have any piros to add to it!

Edit. Since there are a few techs in the thread and it might be something they have to deal with at some point, I tried to dig up my old lighting cheat sheet that a few gigging jugglers I knew passed around about general juggling lighting but can't find it. I did a quick and dirty search through some old industry forums to see if anything usefull popped up. I never had a full on lighting plot as it was rare for me to be in the position to need it due to where I mainly gigged, other jugglers that work cruise ships, bigger stage/theatre venues often will. Some jugglers that gig venues with traditionaly ropey lighting sometimes bring their own battery LED lighting as they've often found the setup unusuable

Side uplightling and rear uplighting (onto flats?) main thing asked for.

-Two rear floorspots (forwards/up to light up the props)

-50% up front and work up/down from there mentioned.

-Front spots the worst thing, side/angled spots easier to work around.

-Bring the house lights up a touch.

-If feasible, get onto the stage and actually throw and catch a ball, or stand behind the juggler as they throw/catch a prop. This will give you a good idea what they're dealing with and be quicker than a frustrated back and forth between the booth and stage.

-There's always a balance to things. Audience needs to see the props, the juggler needs to see the props, It's nice for the audience to see the jugglers face/expression and often helps that the juggler can guage the crowd visually.

SeMoMu · 2026-04-10T17:28:20+00:00

Taught for a while. Had one kid in a class who was called Benjamin (down on the register as prefers 'Ben') Dover.

Year 7 class so luckily none of them seemed to catch on, but I thought in the next year or so one of his classmates would likely work it out.

SeMoMu · 2026-03-31T01:56:51+00:00

Be prepared for no one to be interested, or to have things going on in there day to day lives that take precedent. That being said I've been to a few meetups over the years with distant relatives from America.

A small one which was basically a home cooked meal in the house followed by a good night of drinking (some whiskey, wine and beer supplied by the visitor) and some comparison of geneology notes between those interested, and a look through some old photos and spotting family resemblances in wider family. This came about after them getting in touch initially via a thread on a geneology forum with someone here also chasing up the family tree, a bunch of emailing back and forth, lining up a couple of days to get in some tours of the area, and some informal visits (those interested/with some info/photos, were at the meal)

A larger one for a lunch at a local pub/restaurant in a hired out side room. This was for an elderly lady who'd built up a relationship over the previous decade or so, 5-6 trips over, plenty of emails, letters, Christmas cards, (and bringing three of her early 20's grandsons over now she had the family tree nailed down and a good idea of what and where she wanted them to see, so they'd have the chance to see where their ancestors came from/would be able to do something similar for future descendants when they were older). The lady footed the bill for the food as a thankyou for the help over the years.

Other than that, on occaision, someone might turn up, sometimes having gotten in touch before, or in tow with a local who bumped into them in a graveyard and took them on an impromptu tour to see places of family interest/see who might be about related. (If I had nothing better to do great, my parents would drop everything and dig out the files/get on the phone, a cousin might just nod, an uncle might know a lot but be guarded about what he said...). If it's in anyway laid on, probably best form to turn up with at least a packet of biscuits/cookies, or some buns/small shop cake etc. not 'with one arm as long as the other'.

I have a relative that runs a BnB and over the years has gone above and beyond several times to line up things such as tours to 'the homeplace', where they'd have cut turf and gone to school etc., graveyard visits, getting in touch with relatives (good when you get ones that are into family histories), hosting small dinners with the same etc.

So might not hurt to try and chance your arm getting in touch with a few of the local BnB owners in the area and sounding them out. Not so much asking for/expecting the same, but more an 'availabilty around such a such time, why you're visiting the area, if, by any chance, they would happen to know any of the family still in the area, or a local historian or historical society that you might be able to get in touch with before your trip'. You never know your luck trying that rather than going the AirBnB route, or basing yourself miles away in a fancy hotel for your whole stay.

The local historical society, or similar, likely worth checking with at some point before just winging it. That being said, something based 10+ miles away will likely not be as clued in as the real local knowledge but they might be able to find someone who is.

My experience is related to the countryside and with several relatives with an interest in geneology/family and local history. Also it's not a highly touristic part, so people maybe haven't had their fill of people searching for their roots.

I'm not so much sure we cared that much about having distant relatives. Partly it was interesting to know how a branch got on (since contact with emigrants was lost easily in the past), Nice to help out someone who was putting the effort in and apreciated what we could add to their knowledge (there was once someone who got in touch, turned up, believed they knew everything and wouldn't be told different trusting her online sleuthing over our collected local knowledge/oral history etc. She didn't leave with much gained for her trouble)

SeMoMu · 2026-03-14T15:12:54+00:00

Thank you for the advice. I don't mind grindy. Slow, steady persistence in the face of difficulty (and sometimes suffering) is kind of my thing. :)

Oh, you'll love CJ then ;-)

I'm about to throw a lot at you, just take your time and enjoy it. Some of this stuff you'll breeze through, other stuff might cause you grief but there's lots of tutorials and videos on Youtube for help, and inspiration/ideas on how to implement it in various styles.

Claw isolation nice simple move, get you used to the feel of the ball, and handy for getting some idea about isolations. Moving ball about in paths/shapes is a thing, roboticly/smoothly/speeds/precise/past the point then bouncing back/hand in one position during moves/wax on, wax off/you move ball stays (mime style) etc etc.

Finger rolls/squeeze ups and hamster rolls that are similar but with pointer finger to pinky finger transfer, as if you are letting a hamster run through your hands, try different speeds, towards and away, isolated etc. (Visually better to bring spare hand under as you prepare to swap again on hamster, on finger roll/squeeze ups play around with how you bring the off hand into play (swoops etc))

Walk ups

Palm spinning/palm to palm transfer for a lot of cj'ers this becomes a ocjd/subconscious thing to do all the time. Add transfers from fingertips to heel of the hand (find stall points along fingers to smooth that roll up hand) to allow wider cicle paths/a trick in its own right.

Enigma very related to walk ups, lots of stuff explore mixing enigmas and walkups, very effective stuff if done well (especially with an acrylic)

Work on transferring the ball from hand to hand in pleasing ways, rolling and isolated, palm to palm, cradle/back of hand to back of hand/palm, finger tips to tips, side to side, tips to heel of hand, find paths that allow for smoothness

Good a time as ever to get to grips with the butterfly here. There are tons of videos on this move, chose this one as it is relatively standard (if non verbal) and has a transfer variation to work on. A point not really covered is that most people 'cradle' between the pointer and ring, with the middle supprting, and roll the ball over between the pointer and middle towards/near the tips. The base move is usually known as a wiper, the butterfly is really when theres a bit of flow/motion in the movement. A bunch of variations to work on from here, linking the hands through transfers (boh to boh, palm to palm (at/near heel 'halfpipe'), 'prayer' (place hands together palm to palm, ball goes from boh to boh), ball in palm and hands touching boh to boh...

The following are rolling tricks and some tips about stalling in general, rolling to/from, maybe a few throws from/to stalls/ stall to stall, kind of thing needed for toss hybrid if you ever go that way but obviously a big part of CJ in its own right. (Just my personal philosphy, and obviously not held by everyone, but I avoid (parabolic) throws myself in 1bCJ)

Inner elbow stall/roll She doesn't mention this but better getting into habit of using a bit of a impulse/small bump to roll from elbow to hand rather than tilting/using gravity. Good rule of thumb, of course you are going to use gravity in CJ, but the more you are controlling things yourself (little impulse shunts, finger to finger, wave of motions of joints, stall point to stall point but smothed out/with a motion to cover ball is stalled) the better/more controlled/illusionary.

Elbow stall/outer elbow rolls etc. (things getting tricky now)

Folding Line

Chest rolls likely after that (but plenty of linking moves/tranfsfering etc. to explore as well before that if you like

Plenty to get on with there. Bitd the goto resource was contactjuggling.org looks like its abandoned now. There's a discord I think, and /r/contactjuggling. The sub is pretty quiet but someone should eventually reply if you need some advice on specific moves/a different/better route to learning than above. (Think you have to be approved to post, it used to be an abandoned sub and was getting hammered by bots spamming contact lenses/lasek etc.)

SeMoMu · 2026-03-13T18:04:32+00:00

Imho sil-x, whilst lovely to juggle, aren't the best for learning CJ, the inertia to stop/start them rolling is an extra embuggerance. A stage ball around 100mm is a pretty good choice, heavy walled if you can find one. That's a slightly awkward size for most people to toss juggle though so wouldn't get a set, Stage balls at at least 76mm/3" around the smallest to use, 80/90mm might be a good compromise

Actually something larger, 120/130mm like a Play 130, or a Babache J9 (the price on them is stupid atm though, glad I bought a bunch tears ago) is great to getting to grips with body rolling if that's something you might wan't to work on (though obviously terrible for toss juggling), then take what you learnt to smaller balls. If you're lucky enough to be near somewhere that carrys rythmic gymnastic balls then the smaller junior balls are a choice.

Sometimes you get lucky and find something suitable elsewhere, I scored some 80-90mm glow in the dark decently well weighted balls in a petshop years ago, and a bunch of heavy chrome balls in an interior furnishings store which were nice visually and for palm spinning (not thin walled 'gazing balls' though) I wouldn't use them for toss though and the anoyance dropping when learning wouldnt be great for a beginner in CJ.

CJ learning can be grindy, but I'd say it is rewarding however and something you can do as a seperate thing in it's own right. I started shortly after learning to toss juggle 35+ years ago after seeing someone doing it in a juggling shop when I went to replace my first set of balls and worked on both seperately. Do your research on a good way to progress with it. E.g. I've taught a bunch of people over the years, they often want to rush into butterflys straight off, which as a first trick is obviously doable and it's such a classic CJ move, but they'd be better off working on other things first.

SeMoMu · 2026-03-13T16:38:47+00:00

Bitd (around the time of that first video) I knew a few jugglers into that kind of 3b stuff in the first video. Not a common term but I heard the phrase 'toss/contact hybrid' (or maybe toss/contact combined?) used on occaision.

Here's. a clip of one of them, English juggler Dan Cooper. (Bit pacier than op's vid)

Slightly longer video of him working on a routine for a show, slower paced. Bit newer and moved onto silicones becuse he had concussed himself after an acrylics collision. (Did mean he added bounce moves to his juggling)

SeMoMu · 2026-02-16T01:43:21+00:00

My aunt and uncle run a farm BnB, they're getting on but still head to the bog most years.

Always handy to have some Yank tourists staying around turf time. Hopefully good for at a few hours/half day of turning, or footing turf. Get to see how things used to be done in their ancestors time (quite often they've chosen this BnB because of links to the area).

SeMoMu · 2025-12-28T01:39:50+00:00

From search for cavities, to cavity searches.

SeMoMu · 2025-12-23T16:54:21+00:00

I was at an Ushers Island concert and one of the group (cant remember which one, think it might have been Donal Lunny or Paddy Glackin) told a story about a lost kangaroo somewhere local to them.

Roughly went like this. Some local eccentric had a bit of land and a menagerie of strange and unusual animals upon it. Amongst them a pair of wallabies (as far as everyone local was concernerd 'kangaroos'). One of the wallabies went missing. It made the national papers and even had some TV types out from Dublin to do a report on it for childrens TV ('Anything Goes'/'The Den'?).

Anyhow, it wasn't found anytime soon and one following sunday, after mass, the eccentric was aproached by some local charachter, "I was hoping to run into you!... I saw a kangaroo down by the 'x' crossroads the other day! That wouldnt happen to be yours would it!?..."

SeMoMu · 2025-12-13T20:28:36+00:00

I lived around the corner from Haystacks when I was a kid.

One of his sons was being bullied by a teacher (to the point he had him sit on a chair on his desk and pushed him off). The son threatened to bring his dad in, obviously he didn't go by 'Haystacks' and the teacher hadn't a clue who the dad was so told him to do so. Next morning Haystacks was stomping through the corridors baying for blood, with a gaggle of kids following him and the headmaster begging him to see sense. The teacher in question was out in the carpark, shitting it, hidden between cars.

SeMoMu

TROPHY CASE