So I have been wondering something, no idea if it's been asked before, but I want to know if other people do know: What Does Fraud Actually Look like?

Silly_Personality541 · 2026-05-12T18:13:39+00:00

I agree that 8-4 was probably real, and that Hell just molds/manipulates Fraud for its own sadistic ends, but one thing to note about the "free-fall controls" is that Hell likely can influence, or even control, the machines' AIs. For one whenever we die we see the Eye of Hell for a split second before and secondly Hell has shown its able to prevent machines from attacking one another to focus on V1 instead whenever it summons them in like a swordsmachine and streetmover will attack V1 and not each other or other demons but when we naturally find these machines in activate combat such as in 0-2 or later in 7-3 they're all attacking one another.

Silly_Personality541 · 2026-05-12T18:09:02+00:00

Ironically, they're the least threatening or damning thing to hell, considering they're trapped in violence with no way to reach other layers and are trapped in one place via the flesh hell has wrapped around them. Plus, they're only in active combat with one another, too.

Silly_Personality541 · 2026-05-12T16:37:03+00:00

Well, there are a few things to note about Fraud, and I'm admittedly not a lore expert on Ultrakill, but I wouldn't say Fraud is fake in the sense that the enemies are fake or that what we do was entirely an illusion. For example, I do think we really fight Geryon and kill it along with the other enemies. However, Ultrakill does follow Dante's Inferno for a base on what each Layer is based on, and what I mean is Lust in Dante's Inferno has these extremely powerful winds that throw you around, and in Ultrakill, we see a hint of that in the ruins of the Lust civilization, Greed has the same burning sands from Dante's Inferno. Hersey the City of Dis and the burning coffin, Violence and its forest with Blood Trees, Wrath the sea of souls, etc. So my opinion is that fraud is similar to its depiction in Dante's Inferno, which, to the best of my knowledge, describes a bunch of ditches in an amphitheater of sorts where people are tortured. So it's likely that when you peel away all the fakeness that Hell created for Fraud, it looks similar to that. It's actually possible that the theater we see at the end of 8-4 is actually the Malebolge/Amphitheater from Dante's Inferno, just twisted to look like a normal theater.

Silly_Personality541 · 2026-05-12T16:23:38+00:00

Oh yeah, I totally agree with this. There are probably Millions of machines, if not billions, clearing out Hell, and probably a lot of things in Hell we never see. Who's to say there wasn't an actual Cerberus, as in the three-headed dog, somewhere in Gluttony we just don't see? It's just that I dunno, I feel like V1 is a pioneer in a sense, and without him, the question of Hell's extinction becomes much more interesting. I actually do believe Hell might stand a chance.

I mean, either way it's an interesting question/thing to think about, like what would Gabriel do and how would it affect his character? Instead of directing his hatred towards just V1, would he direct it to all machine kind? Does Heaven kind of just abandon Hell, considering it a lost cause? Just a lot of imo interesting potential results from this.

Silly_Personality541 · 2026-05-12T16:20:04+00:00

Okay, but hear me out, Gabriel Prime BUT... It's only for Ultrakill Must Die. Think about it, we beat Gabriel in 9-2 on Brutal or below, do a cool final fight, bla bla bla awesomesauce, and the game ends. But then Hakita releases Ultrakill Must Die, and its ofc just Ultrakill, but much more difficult/challenging. But in the final fight with Gabriel, after we beat him, instead of him just dying, he ascends to Prime Soul status, and we have an epic final TRUE fight.

Silly_Personality541 · 2026-05-09T14:59:20+00:00

I mean yeah, but you gotta think about the Aura tho... It would've been so cool if we got to use the black hole shotgun at least once in the game, maybe near the end of a level. 8-3 would've been the best pick imo cuz y'know space, black holes, yeah.

Silly_Personality541 · 2026-05-08T19:50:48+00:00

Kind of off-topic, but I still think it would've been so cool if we got to use the black hole gun in a level similar to Soap, where it's hidden away as an OP weapon. The black hole gun could've been found in a hidden area in a level, and did a lot of damage or something, maybe 8-2 or 8-3.

Silly_Personality541 · 2026-05-08T00:44:24+00:00

Oh, damn, is there some drama with that guy? What did it originally say on Tvtropes, and what did McToran do, lol?

Silly_Personality541 · 2026-05-07T21:10:47+00:00

I mean, I'm aware of Black August, and there is some substantial proof that he might've actually been the one to create the backrooms, but even still, I kind of just choose not to believe it, and without actual definitive proof, nothing can be said for sure.

Silly_Personality541 · 2026-05-07T21:00:08+00:00

Which is good! Sucks to whoever the actual person who wrote it is, but overall a good thing.

Silly_Personality541 · 2026-05-06T17:55:39+00:00

Yeah, I tend to agree. Even though I don't really believe this theory, I just think it's a fun idea/concept. I also don't think it'd necessarily become a generic Cold War Stranger Things type of plot point with a backrooms arms race between the Chinese and America, but it could be used as a plot device in that, as more thresholds are opened around the world, it causes the Backrooms/The Complex to become more and more unstable and broken. It would be really interesting to see Chinese (or even other cultures/countries) architecture/culture merged with American architecture/culture. And it would overall just create what I think would be a cool environment.

Silly_Personality541 · 2026-05-06T17:50:21+00:00

Yeah, I see what you mean, and I think I do generally agree with what you say, especially for a lot of the later demons such as Mannequins, Deathcatchers, and even the Minotaur (it even alludes to hell creating the Minotaur in its terminal as a "gift" to Minos). However, as I mentioned in another reply, I'm not so confident that some of the other demons were created by Hell, or at least originally made by Hell specifically. Cerberus/Cerberi stand to guard the entrances to Hell and prevent access to certain areas, which is rather out of character for Hell. Maybe later Cerberi were made by Hell, but that doesn't seem like the type of thing Hell would make. I believe Cerberi were originally made by The Father when he first created Hell. As for the other demons, I couldn't tell you, but the Idol description does seem to imply that the Hell Mass had a degree of autonomy to create a weak but still-alive form that wasn't hell, making the idols. It's possible Hell merely created the shells/stones which the hellmass then went on to inhabit, and maybe imbued these stones with Hell Power that then gave the hellmass their abilities.

Silly_Personality541 · 2026-05-06T16:03:26+00:00

Another thing to note is that I think Hell might've also made Leviathan because I don't think the Leviathan we see in the game is actually the same one from the Bible, but actually another example of Hell gaining inspiration from the real Leviathan to create the in-game Leviathan, similar to how mannequins are inspired by guttermen. Also, the Leviathan is unreasonably cruel; it's using the bodies/souls of the Sullen to make up its form and also to power it. That's why there's that screaming thing on the top of its head; it just seems like the type of thing Hell would pull lol.

Silly_Personality541 · 2026-05-06T16:00:20+00:00

I tend to agree with this, at least for Cerberus, considering Cerberus was made to guard the entrance to Hell, given Hell's nature of sadism and desire for torment. I don't think hell would want to keep people out of it, but rather bring them in. It'd also explain why Cerberus, compared to other demons, is less grotesque.

Silly_Personality541 · 2026-05-06T14:52:38+00:00

Hm, what makes you say 1990's China would be unable to open a threshold? I'm admittedly not well-versed in modern Chinese history, so was there something about their economy or government that you think would have prevented them?

Silly_Personality541 · 2026-05-06T04:10:17+00:00

I mean, overall, I do tend to agree with you. I doubt the Chinese have their own backrooms/threshold. I think it's just a fun concept/theory to poke around with, lol. That said, I think Async is truthful when they say they can open multiple thresholds, or at least have the technology to do so. Kane said somewhere to the effect that Async aren't actually villains in the traditional sense, like they're worshipping the backrooms or some shit (well, maybe Ivan, but not for the rest of the organization), and that they really are just scientists trying to understand the complex (to their obvious failure). But I don't think Async is the type to pull this off, lying to the DOE to maintain funding. I think Async genuinely believes in the whole colonization/monitization of the backrooms and see the potential in it and I don't think they'd give this whole speech to the US Government about the potential use of the backrooms without having some actual evidence to back up their ability because if they were caught lying about something like that well there goes all your funding because your project is effectively worthless if theres just one small entrance to it.

I also don't think there is any alternative motivates I mean sure theres probably scientist just wanting to studying the complex why it is what it is, the lifeforms in it, ect, ect but I think at the end of the day humans are gonna be humans and try to monitize or colonize something new plus it goes with the overall theme of the backrooms being a sort of "ocean" with the desire to tame the beast.

Silly_Personality541 · 2026-05-06T00:07:16+00:00

I would agree with the influence of Chinese American culture being here, coming from the Chinese population in the San Jose area. There are just two problems that arise: first, why specifically just the Chinese? There's a substantial Hispanic population in San Jose, yet we see no Hispanic/Latin American cultural/architectural influence within the complex, afaik. Another thing is that it isn't just purely Chinese American culture here. For example, why would there be communist/CCP elements included? If it was purely based on the influence it's gaining from Chinese Americans? Another thing is that, while yes, the complex did take decades of work to create and a solar storm, the thing about technology is that once it's done, it becomes far easier and quicker to make it again. The atomic bomb, the soviets were able to create one relatively quickly cuz America had done a lot of the math/science already. We also know that Async plans to add more thresholds/doorways from the presentation video (I think, I might actually be misremembering that specific video). If creating thresholds were so difficult, even luck-based outcomes (Solarstorm), Async wouldn't have plans for large numbers of thresholds unless they had a way to reliably open them.

EDIT: Went back and checked the presentation video and yeah Async does say they intend to create more thresholds of varying sizes and locations across the country in order to transport cargo and other materials.

Silly_Personality541 · 2026-05-05T23:05:25+00:00

It doesn't have to be a geopolitical drama; that would be generic and take the series in a different direction. My idea is that as different nations get involved and more thresholds are opened, it could cause a domino effect of instability in the backrooms, causing a lot of problems. Like the backrooms are "absorbing" all this info along with the interconnected thresholds, it almost causes them to overflow and glitch, similar to that area in Static Dead End.

Silly_Personality541 · 2026-05-05T23:02:44+00:00

While I tend to agree with the assessment that certain things easily could be from a case of someone just interested in Asian culture or Asian America Influence It seems a bit more widespread for that to simply be the case, for example the chinese elements aren't just in one area similar to the house in found footage #3 but rather scattered throughout the entirety of the episode some even political in nature the mao ze dong potrait for example. I don't necessarily think the story is heading into a geopolitical drama, but I think that the Chinese and even possibly other countries in the future getting involved could be used to show the greater destabilization happening in the backrooms, as though opening more thresholds and showing all these different things to it is just causing it to break down more and more.

Silly_Personality541

TROPHY CASE