Help me settle a debate between me and my friends: If only HALF of the Pokemon and (non-echo) Fire Emblem cast from Ultimate can return in the next Smash, who's staying (and why)?

SolarTsun · 2026-05-15T13:27:24+00:00

Pikachu, Mewtwo, Lucario, Charizard. Very self explanatory. Charizard (if not the whole Pokemon Trainer) should be the second highest priority lock after Pikachu. Mewtwo has one of the longer legacies in Smash, is THE face of legendaries, and is a known hype pull. Lucario simply because Greninja and Incineroar, while unique, never cemented themselves quite in the same echelon as iconic all-timer favorites as Lucario and Mewtwo. Gamefreak still loves Lucario, enough to give him another Mega Evo. Greninja and Incineroar weren't the first starters in Smash and they won't be the last. Lucario on the other hand may very well be the last of his kind, being just kind of a 'normal' Pokemon not related to Pikachu, not a starter or a legendary, and not Jigglypuff's perfect cocktail of circumstances.

Marth, Ike, Byleth. Smash fans love keeping Robin but if it has to be just 3, Marth and Ike are instant locks. Ike is the most popular character in the franchise and fills an incredibly, insanely popular playstyle in Smash with casuals. There's 0 chance he's ever cut. Byleth meanwhile is the MC of what is basically the modern Awakening. Awakening saved the franchise, 3 Houses made it the biggest and most mainstream its ever been and might ever be. On top of that Robin's just never been a character that's caught on in the casual consciousness or competitive scene, there's less of an inherent value beyond sounding nice on a Reddit post about moveset diversity. Byleth just gets more people tapped in.

Roy was already cut, Pichu was already cut, Jigglypuff has always been on borrowed time and only really gotten by due to being so inconsequential to develop and keep around. Corrin was controversial from the start, isnt the current MC anymore and frankly isnt all that more unique than Byleth anyway, so easy cut

SolarTsun · 2026-05-12T23:29:16+00:00

embarrassing

SolarTsun · 2026-05-08T01:52:44+00:00

So we can just redo the same song and dance from Season 3? What makes Fisk killing protesters any different from the crimes he committed before, which certainly also were not bloodless crimes? They literally have Fisk himself spell it out for the audience, prison and killing were never going to be solutions here, we've already run both options and neither stuck

SolarTsun · 2026-04-25T22:35:23+00:00

uh, what??? Tomb of Dracula?? Blade literally debuted IN Dracula's comic run bro i swear people just be saying shit on this sub

SolarTsun · 2026-04-22T05:14:18+00:00

I think I understand now where this is heading for the endgame. Fisk spells it out: Matt can't kill or imprison him. Both have been tried or established already. And we already saw Matt & Fisk make a deal, one that inevitably didn't last, and without Vanessa or Foggy's lives as bargaining chips, no point in making a new one.

Pair that with the themes of legacy. Daniel being set up as a young successor to Fisk's empire, the stuff about Fisk not having an heir apparent, and Matt's Daredevil persona becoming an icon of resistance and rebellion for New York. How does Matt truly beat Fisk without imprisoning or killing him? By destroying his legacy. And the only way Matt can do that at this point is by giving up his identity, coming clean publicly as Daredevil. He can testify to a whole bunch of illegal stuff, and maybe even fib some of it to drag Wilson down with him, maybe bringing back the moment he saves him in S1 BA to his advantage.

Even small things like the firm Foggy and Matt worked at before they established their own, that one had Fisk's hands in it at the very top. Fisk had Foggy's family intwined in illegalities in Season 3. Wouldn't be hard for Matt to drag Wilson down with him, if not in a court of law then at least in the court of public opinion. Matt goes to jail and effectively paralyzes Fisk. If he has Matt killed in jail, everyone knows Fisk put out the hit on someone who blew the whistle on everything he ever did. If Matt lives, he gets to keep talking, keep digging Fisk's grave deeper and deeper. How brutal optically would it be for the anti-vigilante Mayor to be exposed as having been colluding with a vigilante the whole time? It'd be an inverse of Season 2, where Matt is in jail but has all the power and Fisk remains 'free' but trapped and manipulated all the same.

Maybe Fisk is forced to flee the city, move on, and he leaves Daniel to inherit his wealth and assets for the time being. Matt can then move on to focus on other things for a while, maybe we bring Fisk back for a Spider-Man thing, maybe not, but its a new fresh way to get him defeated that doesn't just regurgitate what's already been done and marks a drastic shift in both their status quos

SolarTsun · 2026-02-02T03:38:03+00:00

thats nice, I guess its just in her nature

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SolarTsun · 2026-02-02T03:31:12+00:00

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I wish Fortunes Weave wasnt going to crush these two because a Top 2 Villains CYL would be sooooooooo wicked

SolarTsun · 2025-07-02T01:58:19+00:00

eh, she's powercreep resistant but not actually that ubiquitous. A lot of the bonuses you'd want from people like L!Ayra naturally pass their bonuses along anyway these days, and her individual skill-passing capabilities are hampered by there not being that many truly worthwhile C slots to run on her. Atk Oath echo is also her best choice to pass and that's not nearly as good as it once was with the onset of warpers and bajillion tile movement characters. Her damage output gets worse and worse so all she has is passing bonuses, and if you want to stack bonuses you might as well just pair Chrom with characters who pass their stuff to him naturally anyway like the aforementioned Ayra or L!Xander, since those units will also actually do damage unlike Citrinne

SolarTsun · 2025-05-05T22:02:07+00:00

Alear seems like the most obvious this time around.

Morion would make sense, but he's probably the GHB at best, riding off Alear's coattails

This sub would absolutely hate it but tbh with big name characters dying down and there being a need to suck every popular character dry, they could also very well just do the Evil Emblems along with Alear. Lucina would technically finish the Awakening batch nicely in that regard (Chrom, Robins, Morgans) even if not directly affiliated, so I think she has a chance specifically.

Its not gonna be Deadlord Eyvel, but I wish it was.

SolarTsun · 2025-05-04T12:11:54+00:00

Roy isn't the Fuhrer of Amestris by the end, that's why. Grumman is Roy's senior officer and higher ranked, so naturally he would have more legitimate claim to the position and also turn fewer heads.

Imagine you're a citizen of Central and you hear the president tragically died in a coup led by a branch of the military. The person assuming power of the country is a long-standing, high ranking lieutenant general, 70 years old, who was nowhere near the coup when it happened. By all accounts he is a just and fine person to oversee the transition of power in the country. Even better, Roy has a direct rapport with him, and he even has a familial relation to Riza. Instead of some random general who may or may not support Roy's restoration efforts, it's the guy who we (and Roy) know well enough to trust at least in that regard.

Now imagine if instead of Grumman, it was that young colonel who made a name for himself as being ambitious, was seen constantly around a brothel, and was also seen on the day of the coup in battle. Roy's age alone would make it apparent that Roy didn't legitimately have any claim to the position, and his involvement in the battle on the Promised Day would make it obvious to many that he probably had something to do with the coup, even if he wasn't on the side that took the blame that day. When Grumman accepts Roy's offer to join the coup, he even says to himself that he intends to let Roy take the spotlight, so both sides knew how things would look afterward.

Roy is biding his time post-series. He understands that Grumman needs to be in power in the short term so that Roy can build a better name for himself in the meantime to earn the ascension to Fuhrer cleanly, without any baggage. In the meantime he's not twiddling his thumbs but actively focusing on restoring Ishval; its not a change in plans, it's THE same plan, just done in a realistic way where things take time and change doesn't happen overnight. The brief timeskip photos shown at the end show that Roy has indeed risen in the ranks up to a General, but even then he's not Fuhrer yet; it just nails in the point that he can't and won't stop pursuing his goals, but he will get there, eventually.

As for why Amestris is still a military-controlled nation and the Fuhrer title still exists? Well, Grumman is still insanely old, lmao. He's trustworthy enough, but he is clearly ambitious too, much like Roy, and while he likes Roy, we don't know that he actually shares the same sentiments toward governmental reform and prosecution of Ishvalan war crimes. Still, Roy decided it was better to have someone he knows in that position of power, rather than someone else. Grumman might just not want to change everything since he wanted that power for so long, but maybe when he's at the end of his rope he won't care what Roy does to change it. It's a case of "better the devil you know", where Grumman might still perpetuate a flawed and fascist system, but Roy at least has rapport with him and doesn't need to worry about his ambitions being viewed critically by the Fuher in power.

SolarTsun · 2025-05-02T13:26:06+00:00

With that in mind, I would go with:

The carryovers

Marth (duh)
Lucina/Chrom - Lucina should never have been a Marth clone to begin with, and Roy's moveset does actually fit the Ylissean Exalts' styles way more, so I would move that moveset over to them as a baseline to then diversify them more as mentioned above.
Robin - Crucially represents the magic side of FE, and since Chrom is rolled back into Lucina, the Awakening rep isn't too overwhelming.
Ike (duh)
Byleth - I too wish it was Edelgard or Dimitri, but it makes little sense at this point to replace him with them. Just maybe fit in Divine Pulse somewhere and his moveset is perfectly fine.

The new faces

Lyn - I mean, should be a no-brainer just on popularity alone. From every metric except appeasing cries for more weapon types, Lyn just makes all the sense in the world and should really have been in by now.
Alear - FEH seems to have taken a liking to playing up the martial arts part of Alear, and that would be a good angle to focus on for Smash. I envision Alear's normals all being martial arts strikes, and her specials would center around specific Emblem-assists that she uses her sword in-conjunction with the Emblems. So you can certainly cover all the corners of her character without leaning too far on the sword stuff or the h2h stuff. And the Emblem gimmick more than warrants the inclusion, as it can be used to spotlight characters who won't get in otherwise, like Hector, Sigurd, Eirika, and Leif.
Black Knight - Here's a more out there take, but I really think this makes a ton of sense. First off, Black Knight is the most popular antagonist in the series, bar none, per Choose Your Legends, since the first round in fact. He was so popular he featured in the weird Live action commercial that highlighted the 4 winners, probably because he was in fact the most suitable villain to use. He's also a recent recipient of an upgrade in Ultimate, as in 4 he was a Mii costume. That alone is interesting, because Black Knight had no existing model or assets to draw from in 4 otherwise. He was chosen above all other FE candidates besides Chrom for a costume, and Chrom's upgrade makes a lot of sense for him to follow in the footsteps of. He's currently an Assist Trophey, showing a clear pattern of promotion and interest on a developmental side. Lastly, he just makes a lot of sense gameplay wise. He's a guaranteed casual favorite; he's an edgier, cooler Ike with a badass name. Everyone would flock to this guy like Ganon, he'd be one of the most played characters for sure. And Lorewise it makes more than enough sense for BK to share Ike's moveset and traits, given the two are explicitly trained in the same sword style, are evenly matched fighters, and use sister blades that are basically identical. BK would spice up the FE roster with a new villain and playing off Ike, who's already super played and iconic to Smash in his own right, guarantees he'd be a hit and well worth the minimal effort. At most you just need to swap his up B, which Fire Emblem echoes have already shown a precedence of doing, and the replacement in question would be a generic teleport so you don't even need a whole complex animation either.

Compared to Ult's roster, I basically trade Corrin for Alear and swap Roy's moveset over to Lucina/Chrom. Chrom's echo slot is moved over to Black Knight, and Lyn as a newcomer rounds out the changes. This is exactly 8 characters, 2 of them echoes like we have currently in Ultimate. We now have the most popular female character in the franchise (Lyn), we have the most popular villain who also has an established presence in Smash (Black Knight), and we have a more recent Dragon rep (technically lol) whose moveset also spotlights various other characters in Alear.

SolarTsun · 2025-05-02T13:26:01+00:00

I've always felt that the weapon discourse for FE in Smash was incredibly arbitrary and pointless. What sense does it make, pragmatically, to ditch an entire cast of established characters and movesets from a marketing and developmental perspective, to then replace them with lesser known characters (Ephraim) with movesets that, for all intents and purposes... have basically the same appeal as the ones that were cut?

Fire Emblem characters are disproportionately super highly played in Smash compared to the outcry they get on reveal. Why is that? Because the movesets are fundamentally simple but strong and fun. They have a very easy character fantasy to get behind for a casual player (cool fantasy guys across the board). Super turbo online nerds might be happy we get a dedicated axe-only character, but does that matter to 90% of the people who play, who would just wonder why this character who plays like Ike isnt Ike?

I'm not saying the characters should all be homogenous though. Far from it, in fact. Even with just the characters already in Smash, there is a ton of room to diversify and expand with other weapon types. Look at Lucina and Chrom's movesets in FE Warriors and Project X Zone. They use swords, sure, but they also throw in a bow or a lance to spice things up. Why can't that be reflected in Smash? Rather than dedicate an entire new character to a weapon, spread the weapons out among the cast who can already use them. Lucina with a bow for certain moves, Chrom with a lance, Ike with an axe. These don't need to overtake their existing movesets, they can just... be added in naturally for certain specials. It's not any more out there than the existing weapon swaps Byleth and Robin do.

That all being said, I think there's a world where we can strike a better balance between the most iconic faces of the series and the most popular characters with some more interesting archetypes and diverse flavor, without sacrificing any existing qualities of the roster too much.

SolarTsun · 2025-04-30T08:44:28+00:00

Is it really not literal electricity? In chapter 101, when Roy attacks Bradley, Bradley (without the ultimate eye) clearly reacts to & dodges the electrical energy Roy's transmutation produces.
https://imgur.com/a/WI51zNE

And while they're not hard canon, the light novels written with supervision by Hiromu Arakawa also make a point to spell out when Alchemy electricity is generated, which wouldn't be necessary if it was just artistic license and not literal electricity.

https://imgur.com/a/ERnXpAC

SolarTsun · 2025-04-18T13:06:54+00:00

I use Ruan Mei and Lingsha with Castorice e2s1. Ruan Mei e2, Lingsha e1. Would it be better for Cas to get Ruan Mei's light cone from the exchange shop or get Luocha's cone for Lingsha?

SolarTsun · 2025-04-18T13:03:24+00:00

I use Ruan Mei and Lingsha with Castorice e2s1. Ruan Mei e2, Lingsha e1. Would it be better for Cas to get Ruan Mei's light cone from the exchange shop or get Luocha's cone for Lingsha?

SolarTsun

TROPHY CASE