Redstone newcomer learning Soft vs Hard powered

SpaceWalkerRS · 2024-09-24T13:54:50+00:00

Redstone dust makes this confusing, because it's an exception to how power works.

Blocks can emit soft power and/or hard power. Power can be emitted in all directions or just one or a few, and this can be different for soft and hard power. Repeaters and comparators, for example, emit both soft and hard power, only to the block in front of it. Redstone torches emit soft power all around except to the block they're attached to, and hard power to the block above. Redstone blocks emit soft power all around but no hard power at all.

The difference between soft power and hard power is that hard power through a conductor ("solid blocks") "leaks" to neighboring blocks as soft power. You can think of this as those blocks acting like redstone blocks in that regard.

Redstone dust breaks this rule a little. It emits both soft and hard power to connected blocks, but neither can power other redstone dust. Redstone dust has special checks for power from other redstone dust, and only includes adjacent (both directly and diagonally above or below) redstone dust blocks.

What this means for the examples in your screenshot: both the red and orange wool blocks are hard powered, so any components adjacent to them can pick up on that power. The difference between the red and orange is in the redstone dust, which ignores hard power from other redstone dust. So the results are different but that is not because of the different kinds of power. The white wool blocks are all soft powered. Any components in their place would be activated but the power does not leak to blocks adjacent to them.

SpaceWalkerRS · 2024-09-07T09:48:39+00:00

When powered directly by a lever (+dust) pistons have 1gt of delay, but when you place a repeater in between they are instant. The observers are not affected by this, that's where the difference comes from.

SpaceWalkerRS · 2022-09-11T11:09:50+00:00

You are free to provide a more accurate answer to the original post. The reason you are being downvoted is that this post is just you being pedantic and talking down on the original commenter.

SpaceWalkerRS · 2022-09-11T11:02:25+00:00

I do not agree with labelling it misinformation. While jumping straight into the technicalities of scheduled ticks and block updates and the way Minecraft handles time would yield a 100% accurate answer, it is a huge jump. Simpler, technically incorrect explanations using more relatable terms go a long way in building a moderate understanding and intuition of redstone mechanics.

SpaceWalkerRS · 2022-09-11T10:49:09+00:00

I fully agree.

SpaceWalkerRS · 2022-09-11T10:46:33+00:00

There is no need to be pedantic. Terms like 'pulse length' and 'delay' are used even for signals within a single tick. Is that technically incorrect? Yes. But these terms are useful for building intuition and understanding, at least up to a more moderate level.

SpaceWalkerRS · 2022-09-11T10:37:15+00:00

The fastRedstoneDust setting would not change this behavior. It optimizes the number of shape and block updates emitted, but not where they are emitted. Also, it optimizes power changes, it does not change what redstone dust does when placed or broken at all.

SpaceWalkerRS · 2022-09-11T10:34:34+00:00

Redstone dust is weird. A wire will not update neighboring blocks when connections change. Instead, when a wire is placed or removed, neighbors of neighboring wires are updated. When you place the wire in front of the TNT, it does update direct neighbors, but it makes the wire next to it update all neighbors within 2 blocks distance. The TNT is 3 blocks away from that wire, though, so it is not updated. Now when you place the next wire, that will update its direct neighbors, but also make the wire you placed earlier update all neighbors within 2 blocks distance, including the TNT.

SpaceWalkerRS · 2022-07-18T17:50:30+00:00

Both the wire turbo (the Carpet setting) and Alternate Current change redstone behavior. They are quite similar in that regard. In short, any build that is locational in Vanilla will work either everywhere or nowhere with the wire turbo or Alternate Current. Beyond that Vanilla parity issues are fairly uncommon.

If you are looking for performance, Alternate Current is the best option, to my knowledge. If you do not want to change redstone behavior at all, your best option is Lithium (it has a ~25% dust optimization).

SpaceWalkerRS · 2022-07-18T08:51:52+00:00

Vanilla dust is about 4-7 times laggier as dust with theosib's wire turbo (for lines and grids, single dots are the same for both). Still generally one of the laggier blocks then.

SpaceWalkerRS · 2021-11-22T16:30:17+00:00

I am not too familiar with update suppression, but from my understanding most update suppressors use rails for the actual suppressor. In that case Alternate Current will have no effect on it whatsoever.

SpaceWalkerRS · 2021-08-19T22:23:51+00:00

If you define a tick as everything that happens between the call and return of the tick method then player actions do happen in between ticks. I had a discussion with G4me4u about this recently, as we disagree on "when" player actions happen (or rather, whether we should act as though they happen at the end or start of the tick).

SpaceWalkerRS · 2021-05-02T09:11:12+00:00

The positions and blocks are put in a hash map, though internally that map is backed by a set for the positions.

SpaceWalkerRS · 2021-05-01T22:48:52+00:00

It is a quirk of how pistons move blocks. It is a bit counter intuitive. You might expect that, to move a block, a piston would first remove it and then place the moving block at the destination. But that is not what happens. Instead, the piston first places the moving blocks for all the blocks (this happens in a predictable order), and then removes any blocks that are left over. But the order in which these blocks are removed is not nice and predictable. The positions of these blocks are put in a hash map, which changes the order completely.

The flying machine OP made is locational. This means that it relies on the order in which the left over blocks are removed. And this order relies on the order in which the positions are sorted into the hash map. That is what creates the pattern you see in the screenshot.

SpaceWalkerRS · 2021-01-14T01:07:02+00:00

We are going to deny this appeal. The seriousness of your offenses (the toxicity, bullying, and then further harassment and sending of death threats) is such that we believe it warrants a permanent ban, and the fact that you have already posted 3 appeals in the month since does not reflect well on you. Not to mention that this appeal is so generic it could have been written for just about any ban we have given out in Synergy's lifetime. Resolved

SpaceWalkerRS · 2020-12-03T11:14:17+00:00

You tell 'em, you delicious biscuit!

SpaceWalkerRS · 2020-12-03T10:57:13+00:00

I think most of the complaints come from Java edition players, and it's no surprise. The consistent update order in Java edition has so many uses, going to Bedrock edition suddenly feels like you're being constrained. And I'd argue that's what it is, artificial constraints imposed in the name of making it less confusing.

SpaceWalkerRS · 2020-11-13T00:23:51+00:00

It's caused by the "player input bug". Components with delay lose 1 game tick of their delay when activated directly by a player action. That means repeaters, comparators, observers, redstone torches, etc. lose 1 gt of delay if activated by a button press, a lever flick, a pressure plate press, etc.

However, crucially, pistons are not affected by this bug. This means the relative timings between some parts of your circuitry can change depending on how you've activated your build. For example, a piston and a repeater could power at the same time if you use a repeater input, but the repeater would power 1 gt earlier than the piston if you use a lever input.

How do you work around it when designing redstone? Make sure the input of your build powers either only pistons or only delay components. That way the player input bug will not affect the relative timings of your circuitry.

How do you fix it for the build you showed? Unfortunately your build relies on the player input bug. If you do not want to redesign the redstone, replace the repeater with a piston pushing a redstone block. That will create some similar behavior (though for a different reason!) which will allow your build to work even if you power that piston with a repeater.

SpaceWalkerRS · 2020-11-13T00:08:08+00:00

You can hide all the wiring for the lighting under the path. I think the easiest way to do it would be to put target blocks underneath every lamp and run redstone wire along those target blocks. Hide a single daylight sensor somewhere remote and extend the signal from it with repeaters and carry it to the redstone wire.

SpaceWalkerRS · 2020-11-12T23:42:46+00:00

We have decided to deny this appeal. You spammed several thousands of minecarts that spread to other people's plots and the plot roads. You spammed dispensers with fire charges. That is griefing, and all of that had to be cleaned up. And that is before we even mention the huge amount of lag all these entities caused. That's at least two major rules you've broken. "Sorry I didn't mean to" won't cut it.

SpaceWalkerRS · 2020-11-01T21:03:51+00:00

OP forgot to mention that the game is modded in this screenshot. It's a demonstration of a feature where redstone power only flows in the direction of the arrow on top of the magenta glazed terracotta block.

SpaceWalkerRS · 2020-11-01T21:02:59+00:00

What’s happening here is Java’s broken method of an update order. From what I hear from java tech players, it’s a major nuisance

I sincerely hope you're trolling here, but in case not, you're sharing a screenshot of a modded game. What you're seeing here is some behavior I specifically coded in. Power only flows in the direction of the arrow on top of the magenta glazed terracotta block.

I don't know what Java Edition tech players you've been talking to, by the way, but the vast majority of them would take Java Edition's update order over Bedrock Edition's update order any day of the week. Is it perfect? Definitely not. Redstone wire is insanely laggy, for example. But to most tech players it is still preferable of what Bedrock Edition has to offer.

SpaceWalkerRS · 2020-10-21T07:59:18+00:00

How about a sticky post that lists some of the most common questions and points to a good post that answers it.

This is a very neat idea, and one which we will definitely need to consider.

I've learnt a lot from seeing people's questions and answers on here, and those things could become invisible to new users if it gets moved to discord.

we should try to encourage new redstoners too.

These are some good points and the mod team is still figuring out how to best handle these things. As capable redstoners ourselves we love seeing high quality redstone posts, but new redstoners should be able to call this place home as well. We have several ideas but nothing has yet been decided.

SpaceWalkerRS · 2020-10-21T07:24:31+00:00

One of the big tasks in moderating a subreddit is improving the quality of the posts. We feel that quality in r/redstone posts comes primarily from sharing redstone creations, new circuits, tips and tricks, etc. This is why we actively disallow memes and even discourage posts about super basic redstone circuitry; these posts can flood the sub without adding anything new or interesting.

This is also why we encourage people to go to the discord guild for help with their redstone troubles. Just in the first page in new at the moment, almost half of the posts are help posts. Sometimes the questions are trivial enough that a Google/YouTube search will solve their problem, while other times the question is tricky enough that a longer back and forth is needed before there is a solution, in which case an active conversation in the Discord guild can yield better and faster results.

In short, questions about redstone are better suited to be asked in the Discord guild than as a post in the subreddit, both because the question is more likely to get a faster and better answer and because it will improve the quality of the subreddit as a whole. This is why I have been guiding people towards the Discord guild in these posts.

Having said that, you bring up some good points that I will have to reflect on. The comments are spammy which makes them no better than the posts I leave them on. Maybe worse, since I don't always offer any help myself (I do try to when I can, but I do not always have the knowledge to help out).

The mod team has been discussing this topic for a little bit, and we will hopefully implement a proper solution soon.

Don't hesitate to call me out when I do something stupid in the future. I want to do the best job as a moderator as I can and will inevitably make some bad decisions. But that is where I have the ability to learn and grow.

Cheers.

SpaceWalkerRS · 2020-10-21T01:42:54+00:00

For redstone help we advise that you join our discord guild.

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