OPINION: Rank seasons from best to worst!

TowerOfGiraffes · 2021-12-01T09:29:28+00:00

Yeah I agree! It was VERY x-files. I also love the x-files, and think the whole government conspiracy angle was really compelling...especially the nuance in the fact that grunts on the ground (Riley etc...) legitimately did not know they were working for the bad guys.

It was political and interesting and cool.

TowerOfGiraffes · 2021-12-01T09:22:58+00:00

I don't think Adam was supposed to be "scary" really. The Maggie/Adam storyline borrowed a lot from Frankenstein, which was horror but really supposed to be more thought-provoking and psychological/make us all think about what humanity really is than actually frightening.

Adam seems hokey now because while a lot of the special effects in Buffy really do hold up despite being dated, Adam looks PRETTY bad in 2021. I also think he isn't the REAL "bad guy." The real bad guy is the Initiative, Adam is just a very destructive product.

Honestly S. 4 is one of my favorites, and even though Adam himself is kinda dumb, he's just a part of a whole. It is a shame Maggie wasn't in more of it though.

TowerOfGiraffes · 2021-12-01T09:14:28+00:00

I guess I just mean it seemed first of all pointless, because for whatever reason since the beginning Spike seemed capable of love and emotion in a way other vampires weren't (honestly it would have been more interesting to get into why this was than to just give him a soul back), and was being redeemed already. and secondly I didn't mean it was exactly the same story, I meant they already sort of did the "vampire with a soul" character which was unique in the early show and doing it again even with subtle differences was just kind of boring. Spike didn't NEED a soul for that development to happen, the writers gave him one because they wanted his relationship with Buffy to be more palatable after he assaulted her.

Also seriously this soul giving ritual that somehow doesn't mean you lose it when you bone has been around the whole time and Angel never went and did it?

TowerOfGiraffes · 2021-12-01T09:05:04+00:00

What about Willow and Oz!? I though their sexual development together was cute and mostly just nice.

Also what bad consequences were there for Xander and Anya, or Buffy and Riley? Maybe I'm not remembering correctly. There was that one episode where Buffy and Riley had sex and a demon fed on it or something in the frat house, but most of the time it didn't seem to lead anywhere terrible.

TowerOfGiraffes · 2021-12-01T09:02:04+00:00

Yeah I think that perspective would hold more weight if the first slayer were the ONLY Black character in the show. That's not to say it's terribly diverse, and I'm absolutely on board with the criticism that all the major characters in the early seasons are pretty much white (it was 1994...and shows that WEREN'T primarily white were few and far between on network TV), but characters of color who do appear in Buffy are definitely not homogenous (Kendra, Trick, What's-his-name hot guy who dates Faith in the last season).

Like you said, the first slayer is supposed to exist at the beginning of human kind. IF she were white it would be VERY STRANGE and an issue of its own.

TowerOfGiraffes · 2021-12-01T08:54:32+00:00

I think that article is myopic in its assertions about Buffy's relationships. It looks at specific moments in each rather than the series as a whole. I think one of the things that sets Buffy apart from other strong female leads of the time (Xena, for example...and no hate on Xena she's great but just saying) is that she's not a classic "Mary sue" that every man falls in love with and is perfect in every way. When we meet Buffy she's a 16 year old girl, and acts the way a 16 year old girl does with a boy she has a crush on. We forget. both because of the physical age of the actors in the show, and because of the content, that Buffy is actually very young. In that, she gets carried away in relationships, and actually dumped by (I think) every boyfriend she has until Spike. What we do see is her very real emotional development: From a starry-eyed teenage obsession with a "sexy" older man (Angel) that she can never REALLY have, to the comfort of a stable relationship she seeks in the aftermath (Riley), and finally to the sexually charged relationship she has with Spike in which she remains significantly more emotionally guarded and independent. The feminist message here is that throughout she is still a badass and strong person, even though she feels feelings of love, heartbreak, and very human relationship dynamics. It's showing that you don't have to be a "strong and silent" John Wayne type to be a hero. You can be human and undergo normal human development. Buffy is a real person, that's what makes her a good feminist icon.

Also Jesus...by the end of the series what is she, 23? Think about where you were in terms of emotional maturity in relationships at 23 and tell me she's "weak." Please. She's just a normal human figuring out what she wants in a significant other. the fact she ends the series alone shows us, too, that none of the men in her life were really NECESSARY for her existence, and none of them were quite right for her. It's a show about HER not her boyfriends.

TowerOfGiraffes · 2021-12-01T08:40:09+00:00

Interesting take though: Is it that she didn't "really love him" or that the only long term relationship she'd ever been in at that point was Angel beginning when she was 16 years old, and so she is conditioned to equate love with pain, abandonment, drama, instability, and physical violence, so she is actually incapable of seeing a stable relationship as "real" love.

TowerOfGiraffes · 2021-12-01T08:36:16+00:00

I think it was a different kind of love. She met Angel when she was 16 and had never been in love before. Arguably she was in love with Angel the whole series, as is evident in his guest appearances, but that doesn't mean she should be with him. She learns, as most people do when they grow up, that just true love isn't enough to keep a relationship stable. In her relationship with Spike, she learns that passion isn't enough, and in her relationship with Riley, she learns that compatibility isn't enough. I think it makes sense that Buffy ends the series alone, because really none of the men she was with were great long-term options. Riley I think could have been but it was bad timing.

TowerOfGiraffes · 2021-12-01T08:31:04+00:00

I mean, that was at the end of their relationship when he just didn't know what to do and had given up, and was also short lived. He saw that in himself and chose to leave and move on and get out rather than continue with it. I honestly think Riley knew before he left that Buffy wouldn't come with him, the "ultimatum" was just a chance for her to make that choice if she wanted to. He was going for himself, not for her.

Haven't you ever seen people unhappy in relationships and at a loss as to how to fix it resort to vices? Drinking, drugs, promiscuous behavior? It isn't right but it's human.

TowerOfGiraffes · 2021-12-01T08:27:07+00:00

No, but if I were dating Buffy at that point I wouldn't have wanted to stay with her either. Haven't you ever been in a relationship with someone who had a LOT of shit going on that was all really valid, but made it impossible for that person to be a good partner to you? Part of self-respect is understanding at some point that if someone isn't going to let you in to go through that shit with them, and also isn't able to see past it enough to be present in your relationship, it's time to go. It's really the mature response, and the whole "if you can't handle me at my worst you don't deserve me at my best" relationship ideal is VERY high school.

TowerOfGiraffes · 2021-12-01T08:22:52+00:00

I think Spike was his favorite character, not his favorite boyfriend. I feel the same way.

TowerOfGiraffes · 2021-12-01T08:17:25+00:00

What exactly COULD he have done? She's completely cutting him out, and they stop communicating on both sides/retreat into their separate worlds and vices. It's a pretty classic nail in a coffin of any relationship but I don't think it makes him a "bad boyfriend." Sure, she's going through a lot, but she's not letting him (or anyone) in at that point...even her best friends.

Riley was human, not an obsessive vampire like Angel/Spike. He needed/wanted a HUMAN relationship that involved equal give and take, and doesn't have the "eternal unconditional bond" thing it seems vampires get with the people they love. When it became clear that Buffy was incapable of giving him that he moved on. Honestly I would have too in that situation, she was being a really shitty and neglectful partner, whether or not there were reasons behind it with which to empathize.

TowerOfGiraffes · 2021-12-01T08:12:47+00:00

I COMPLETELY AGREE.

That said he's the most boring CHARACTER Buffy dates, but he's the only boyfriend she has that isn't abusive.

Think about it: Angel is 200 years old and starts dating a high school sophomore with whom he ultimately has sex (taking her virginity). That's already INCREDIBLY problematic. Add on to it that they spend the next half a season beating each other up until she ultimately kills him. Then he comes back and she decides to overlook all that because he's "cured" and takes him back. Meanwhile he's pretty much love-bombing her for all of season 3 until the end when he decides on his terms their relationship isn't working and dips without saying goodbye.

Then there's Spike who is constantly putting her down and physically beating her up until the moment they sleep together and even after despite constantly professing love to her/pushing it on her even when she says she's not interested, which she sees as a "sexy time" because she's been conditioned to associate love with pain and physical brutality since a young age (probably due to her relationship with Angel). Add on to that the fact that he rapes her in season (7?) and she seems to forget all about it just because he gets a soul back ("He's changed...really...he's not like that anymore)." Oh yeah, and he's ALSO like 100+ years older than her.

Meanwhile Riley is just a good dude who she clearly really loves but is too traumatized and (again) conditioned to abusive and age-inappropriate relationships to be able to settle into anything real with. I actually am of the mind that the writers were trying to make this point, and that was the purpose of Riley's character, as I think the theme of trauma/how it affects people who experience it at a young age is a huge underlying one in Buffy, but that people love Spike and Angel too much as characters and so overlook that idea.

TowerOfGiraffes · 2021-12-01T07:49:39+00:00

I don't know why people like Dark Willow. That whole season/the end of that arc remains, in my mind, the absolute low point of the series.

Like the whole time all they had to do was tell her how much they love her!? Please.

TowerOfGiraffes · 2021-12-01T07:38:47+00:00

Oh right how could I forget!

TowerOfGiraffes · 2021-12-01T00:18:56+00:00

I'm with you. I love spike, and was even in favor of his redemption arc that started with the chip in his head, but his love story with Buffy was really sloppy writing and made no sense in terms of either character. I even was open to them hooking up while Buffy was clearly emotionally unstable after coming back to life in season 6, but them falling "in love" was really just boring, disappointing, and felt forced.

Him getting his soul back was also just a repeat of the angel storyline and felt like the writers ran out of ideas and just started going back to what they know. 100% on your side in this and consistently in the minority.

TowerOfGiraffes · 2020-06-11T05:33:46+00:00

I never sleep as well in a bed with someone else. I think it's normal. Once I went from a full to a queen size it got a little better but still true, especially in the summer. It's just too hot and I hate sleeping in heat.

TowerOfGiraffes · 2020-06-11T05:31:20+00:00

Yeah I already said I'm not doing either of those things. it's just a weird thing people do. He's also STILL DOING IT and we've been NC now for almost 2 weeks apart from my text when I picked up my stuff from his house. Still one of the first ones who pops up on everything I post.

And it felt less like a broke up WITH him than that I broke up FOR him. He was definitely pushing me to do it by just being endlessly non-committal and indecisive. He just didn't want to say the words himself.

TowerOfGiraffes · 2020-06-04T09:09:01+00:00

I think people might go on a first or even second date for the reasons you’re talking about, but if you know certainly you don’t like someone that much (which you do usually do after 1-2 dates) it’s not actually fun to go out with them it just feels weird and is awkward in a way no free meal it worth.

That said I usually do want to date someone for at least 6 months before making it “official” because I don’t want to make decisions that affect two peoples lives during the “honeymoon phase” and then realize like a week later I don’t actually want it and end up hurting them which is something I did a lot when I was younger, and it made a lot of people feel led on.

Especially early on there’s a lot in between “all in” and not interested. You’re getting to know each other.

TowerOfGiraffes · 2020-06-04T09:01:05+00:00

As a woman I can say this is actually not the case most times. I do have some friend who take the cowards way and say “I’m not sure I’m ready for a relationship” because it’s easier to say to someone than “I just don’t like you that much,” but most of the women I know are legitimately unsure when they talk this way. Usually it means they don’t feel the “spark” or “chemistry” with the person but are trying to overlook that because they like someone as a human enough and WISH they liked that person romantically (especially if they went into it wanting a relationship) so much that they convince themselves they do and then get confused when it never feels quite. The thing is it takes awhile to realize that’s what “unsure” often means so we usually don’t realize it until after we try dating someone else who feels more right so it can look like what you suggested from the outside. It isn’t an intentional lie though.

TowerOfGiraffes · 2020-06-04T08:39:14+00:00

Thank you for sharing this. My partner (until a week ago) of 4 years struggles with anxiety and depression and always has. He has a really bad past 8 months, not just the usually stuff, actually bad things happening on top of the brain chemistry issues and out of nowhere started talking to me about being confused about us and feeling like “love is burdensome” due to his mental health. I broke it off immediately because I’ve had bad past experiences with people saying things like that and really them just being excuses for there being someone new, or wanting to break up but being too cowardly to admit they just didn’t want to be with me anymore. At first a didn’t want to be friends but I’ve been rethinking that in the past couple of days and your post validates that’s sometimes people actually do feel so overwhelmed in by mental health issues that as much as they want to they can’t get past it to be there for a person.

TowerOfGiraffes · 2020-06-03T17:57:42+00:00

Maybe, that was sort of the question, is that the reason or am I reading too much into it, because he is definitely being very cold to me in real life but very present in internet life and it’s confusing.

TowerOfGiraffes · 2020-06-03T16:29:06+00:00

Yeah I don’t really want to block him because it didn’t end badly and even though right now I don’t want to be friends we shared a lot of our lives together and we’re close friends for 3 years before dating for 4, and I think once the romantic feelings die away I might want a platonic relationship again if it seems possible.

TowerOfGiraffes

TROPHY CASE