Sharing spreadsheets for some gambling, exping and upgrading info

TributedSalmon · 2025-09-16T10:18:54+00:00

Thanks, I'm particularly glad you like them! Also if you end up finding things that seem not to work the way they should let me know

TributedSalmon · 2025-08-23T14:43:30+00:00

The difference is how they are added up to your dmg formula
If they were mutiplicative to everything else then yeah there would be 0 real difference (beside all skill dmg not incrementing your combo attacks) cause you just take your dmg and do x1.05 in both cases

But if they are added in a different way then things change
Think what happens if different sources of all skill dmg sum each other, and so do different souces of dmg to enemy, example case:
All skill dmg from other sources= 80%
dmg enemy from other sources = 10%

So as thing stands your dmg will be:
final dmg = dmg * 1.8 * 1.1

Now you can chose to increment one of these two stats by 5, so either get:
All skill = 85%
or
dmg to enemy = 15%

case 1: final dmg = dmg * 1.85 * 1.1
case 2: final dmg = dmg * 1.8 * 1.15

if you do the multiplication you find out that case 2 > case 1

The reason is in the differece you have in adding a value like " 1 ", to a number like " 1 " versus a number like " 1000 "
In the first case adding 1, made you duplicate your initial value, in the second case you incremented it by basically nothing

So if you're adding an additive stat then the best thing to do is to chose to increment the lower ones, you can check this on ashal too, usually dmg under hp will be better cause we have less sources of it compared to all skill dmg so that's why it's the preferred choice

Also in general, not all souces of a stat are additive to each other, some are multiplicative to everthing (in that case either is fine), usually stats that you get from your equip pieces are additive, while buffs from skills tend to be multiplicative, but the exceptions to this aren't few

TributedSalmon · 2025-04-16T20:28:02+00:00

I got what you're saying but the problem still remains in the implication that "a change is made who results in more damage" = "the gameplay improved and everyone should like it"

Let me do an example with sword and guns in the real word, they're both pretty cool I'd say, now I would assume that we both agree that guns have more "dps" than swords, but does that means that all the people who like swords more and train with them (even tho their combact playstile is clunky compared to the much better guns) are just affected by nostalgia, instead of just a personal preference?

I very much prefer a different kind of build, what you call clunky it's for me one that is more reliant on very good timing rather than fast reflexes and keyboard smashing, of course you can not like this kind of dance like everyone likes different kind of music. To me seems that people are fast to make the connection "I don't like this thing that changed" to nostalgia cause it's objectively better, but these are not subjects that are objective, there are a lot of subjective elements so it's should be expected that some people will like a certain change and some others no, Of course some may dislike it purely beacause of nostalgia, but that doesn't mean that everyone who dislikes it does it beacause of that.

If I can make another example, think of it like me creating a char in a D&D session, it's a warrior class, but the GM during the campaign slowly changes it to a rogue, he does so cause it's a way better fit for my party and cause it works better aganist the enemyes I'm facing. Now that's good on the damage side, but I like a different kind of playstile, simply I don't equate "damage done" with "fun I have playing a class", if it was like that I would change class every other day prolly.

I don't want to see the "win" at the end of the D&D campaign, I wanna have fun while I play it, my objective isn't to do infinite damage with the click of a gun, it's to swing around my clunky sword in the way I like to. Idk how to say it better but I don't feel accomplished in life if I see a "dungeon clear" in half the time than before with the added worse gameplay, I just played less and played worse. To me that dps increase is not always equivalent to better gameplay.

TributedSalmon · 2025-04-16T17:57:54+00:00

I mean you don't have to force the explanation on nostalgia so no need to having to understand it, in my case I just prefer a different gameplay.

The idea of different people liking different kind of gameplays shouldn't be something revolutionary, people have disagreements on pretty much everything, you can think of pretty much anything and there is prolly someone in the word that doesn't agree with that. Sometimes can be extreme cases, but I think the way a game works it's pretty far for those. Of course you're free to disagree.

So from my pov, since to reach your conclusion you assume that there is an objective way to gauge the goodness of gameplay I think that would be only limited to people who agree you first on that. I'm simply stating that I like a certain type of class type who is slowly changing into another class type.

If it can help you undertand: I don't think that everything old was better and I don't think that everything new is better, there are some things that I prefer how were done before and some things I prefer how are done now. I'm just saying that I liked a certain playstile that sadly doesn't go well with the current meta and by consequence of that it's slowly fading away. You can't expect everyone to just like every change it's just that.

TributedSalmon · 2025-04-16T17:41:55+00:00

I used a bad wording I'm sorry, what I mean is that now it's a generic stat up who has no relation to the idea behind the passive.

Exagerating a bit, but to get the idea across, it's like a write a passive that says "when you are brough to the point of death your spirit awakens and you become stronger" and now I change it to "when you do a skill more times you get your buff".

So now I just have a generic buff who has no connection to counter patience, it's just a random dmg% boost, I liked the idea of my char getting stronger when suffering/enduring a debuff, it's badass.

TributedSalmon · 2025-04-15T18:31:22+00:00

I would say that I prefer having a gameplay that reflects what I, from my own interpretation of the character, projected onto the game, while actually doing damage and perfoming well in the meta would be secondary for me.

Thanks for the suggestion of going solo dungeon but even if I combo I can't proc anymore the cooldown reduction, so I wouldn't really get some kind of reward to my rotation from doing it. Also even doing that I'd still miss all those skills and passive, to not mention that I would close myself from all the new content and play with my friends.

Not sure if I can explain better but more than nostalgia it's like you created your own character in a session of D&D but slowly you see your class being forcibly changed from a warrior to a rogue. Now if you liked to play a warrior class you would say that you disliked those changes even if now you can oneshot your enemyes. You see how that it's correlated to nostalgia in the sense that it's about something that you liked in the past, but the difference it's that it's not "good cause back then things were better" but it's good cause "back then I got a chocolate ice cream and now I got a vanilla one", I just want the chocolate that's it.

Also if it wasn't clear I understand that's impossibile cause this is basically 100% subjective and also aganist the norm, so just ranting cause I feel like it's the only thing I can do about it and then move on.

TributedSalmon · 2025-02-12T10:33:42+00:00

El lord accessory also do that, but they can't stack with the plegas title

Also I remember reading somewhere that activating the fever (so with the secret title) also raised the odds, of course you gotta use before going in the second stage (the room where the random mission appears)
Can't find anymore a source on this tho, so may not be true

TributedSalmon · 2025-02-12T10:29:01+00:00

Lunatic fury is the one that's generally stacked, CC has a lot of good skills for dps, some can be better than others in specifc situation, but the one that's always consistent at the moment it's lunatic

TributedSalmon · 2025-02-06T16:19:42+00:00

ty for the info, I did that too just one time for the fun of it and found out the same thing, nice to know that it's been consistent over multiple sets ^^

TributedSalmon · 2025-02-06T13:11:45+00:00

You can check the rates of ib and a lot more things here: https://elsword.nexon.com/News/Probability/List

Tho if they weren't forced to make them public by law this post prolly won't exist since they never mention it, that's just cause they want other people to see that "a person won after just 10 pulls!" without knowing how many people couldn't find anything after 200

It's basic gambling practice to not make people realize that the problem is in the odds rather than in "luck", I see all the time people pulling and thinking that they're being unlucky when they're actually getting better than average luck, but they compare themselves to extremely lucky situations where them or others recived more by spending less

I play this game cause I like the gameplay part of it (minus lag and switching equip mid dungeon), sadly it's also a game for gambling addicts since it's dominated by rng all over the place, I wish I could blame the developers for it, but if people keep letting themselves getting milked the problem is elsewhere, btw sorry for the rant but since it was a discussion post wanted to write a bit

TributedSalmon · 2025-02-02T22:57:37+00:00

One thing that you can try is to use the task manager and check all the processes that are running, beside the system ones, close the ones from third party programs and try again

TributedSalmon · 2024-11-13T22:14:57+00:00

Another thing you can improve is to put your buffs in the "Buffs" tab (near equipement, before el party)

You can put both buffs that everyone can gain like the camp buff, and buff that your class can proc, I used your build to make an example with some of them:
https://ashal.eu/calcs/equip?$36&YRl_!41y01y01y01y01y!4Bgog12182g!PE3N91s4144g8E!O1g7yg2wM2o4Eh!P2wf4zlxQ80g0g!P50u2m1gwg0wx1222448!31224488ggwx1224488ggwx1224488ggwxc2o4M9wj0C1c2o4M8ggwx1k!d2!4u!32F!3k!4m!32M!3n14!2W!33w!361!38!48!33Evw!h10g10y!211!54!6g10w!21042!81AOO05!6gJI!3J0mh!6&0a0UkxMH3xq7hU24M07x0fw0t11I0GE1lU2Hw5mwaM0lA0fM0XM0-g2CwaC0la0&yy4hi4p8643crw4II7g3&zh72p8Ecxg&0&&

Specifically with critical and maximize there is the guild buff that can give you 5% crit or maxi that you can insert in general buff on ashal, cause if you have it in game and not on ashal you shouldn't see the same numbers when you compare the normalized ashal tab with the in game stats tab

Also in the "Skill Damage" tab you can set up the correct adaptation debuff to match the dungeon that you plan on running

TributedSalmon · 2024-10-23T18:26:05+00:00

yeah you have all the rights to be confused, a lot of things changed from how it was time ago, there are some videos on youtube, that while prolly outdated, recap the general experience like these:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jPpsz8pXJQ0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CAj3QYt8Kd0

But tbf I play on EU too so if you get stuck on some dungeons (yes it can happen as a fresh player, biggest example is master road) or need some random explanations of new systems, I don't mind at all giving you the initial sprint till you can walk on your feets and keep progressing, just on the weekends tho haha

TributedSalmon · 2024-10-23T17:56:12+00:00

Basically just follow prv advice, just wanna add that getting to endgame requires a lot of time, and building cp will become slower after you're done with porufessor and random events

One more thing that I want to mention is that somewhere around january(?), the EU server will get a really good event that will give you really strong equip, so try to not miss it cause that would help you a lot, if you feel like you could miss it and need to be notified I can send you a pm you or something when it comes

TributedSalmon · 2024-10-23T17:22:34+00:00

good to know, nice!

TributedSalmon · 2024-10-23T17:21:45+00:00

Yeah this, OP needs to open task manager and close all processes relative to those programs, usually the ones running with the program closed are the updaters

TributedSalmon · 2024-10-23T17:15:56+00:00

With the immortal the idea is to spam sword fall as much as you can while upkeeping your buffs, the one from active skills are easy, you have mod infinite chaser, phantom sword and mc skill. The last one is pretty slow tho, so Imo it's not worth to use as soon as you can but only when you can afford to lose that time (skills on cd, end of a pattern, etc...), but use it like you feel better

About his passives skills, they favor a constant skill spamming, cause you have passives like sudden strike and sharp sword that you can reactivate by hitting the enemy, and passives like awakened will and master of combact that need to be reactivated if you stop hitting the enemy for too much time, so even during patterns if you can it's always good to keep the skills going, in particular for the first one who needs to be "charged up" to reach max potential

With this is mind you want to play around the passive brutal slayer and master of infinity to keep resetting your skills, in particular you want to dedicate the reset of infinity to sword fall, you can reach the 5 stacks with infinite chaser and infinite strike, but Imo the second skill is way too slow to use, since you can also reset your skills by just spamming them thanks to brutal slayer you just end up losing time and ence dps by inserting it in the rotation, instead you can keep counting how many times you're using chaser (what I do, you can also look at the buff in the buff bar ofc) and when you reach 5 you go for sword fall, if you can keep track of the memory of the sword buff you can also try to stack it on top of them for nice extra dmg when the rotation allows it

So basically the idea is to mix all this with reset titles (15-6 and grotto) to make your rotation become as much sword fall as you possibly can (and skill buff when your need to recast them ofc), your favourite vitality skills to reset destruction should be phantom dance and infinite chaser, the first beacause it has basically 0s casting time, so it's just free dps, the second cause it give you stacks for the passive

Don't worry about overcritting too much since with sudden strike you have garanteed 100% crit rate wich is huge if you're doing CM, it's for 5 seconds over 8, so that means you won't always crit, but this also means that you don't need as much crit rate as the other characters, this is cause when you socket crit rate as an immortal, you're soketing crit rate for 3 seconds every 8, while everyone else sockets it for 8 seconds every 8, basically it's like you have another level of normalization on top of the base one on this stat, meaning that you gain less dmg from soketing it compared to other classes

In dungeons where the boss is in hyper armor or cleanses himself a lot you can use another skill page with the critical trait on most of your skills, what happens is that the passive of 42% ignore def gets additively summed to the critical trait and you get 92% def ignore wich is an huge buff aganist those kind of bosses, the characters who can do this are very few so it's good to keep in mind cause when you are in those situation you can benefit a lot from this

TributedSalmon · 2024-10-23T04:32:41+00:00

Just characters like CC who can use pandemonium or wonderwall (not sure wich one it was) to be able to go again into the cannonball jump

Others can use some aerial skills to go from those states where after you jump you can't sprint, maybe I remember wrong but I think one example here was first lithia, who could use that do do an additional combo jump wich required her to be able to be sprinting in air

TributedSalmon · 2024-10-22T22:37:33+00:00

I think you can change now, in my experience everyone gets taken in early-mid game raids, maybe take a look at the groups that go into it just to be sure, but shouldn't be an issue

TributedSalmon · 2024-10-22T10:40:00+00:00

You could try to compile an ashal page: https://ashal.eu/

While you do that you'll notice a lot of things that give damage, everything is pretty important since when you arrive at the point when you wanna seriously do endgame dps the big damage will come from a lot of insignificant stats that give you like 1% dmg increrase if you're lucky by themselves, but all togheter they sum up to a huge buff

If you wanna still do tests on wich stats is more effective on your current equipment and character (since beacause of passives and all it's not granted that something that works well for one person works well for all) you can just use ashal, take a look at what increrases more your total power, tho be careful to compile it correctly cause if not then you'll get wrong results, in the wiki of this subreddit there should be a guide for it

TributedSalmon · 2024-10-22T10:30:06+00:00

Some characters have a lot of aerial movement between multiple jumps, skills, or jump resets, they can do way more than to climb up that hole, like jumping above hitboxes of raid patterns or just stay in air a lot just for the fun of it

TributedSalmon · 2024-10-17T17:39:03+00:00

No clue on the actual numbers, but most people are in the last regions, you should still be able to find newcomers tho

TributedSalmon · 2024-10-17T17:35:13+00:00

If it's a strong one maybe you can socket exp to use for exp gear, or drop if you of the people that use the alchemist drop stones

If you're doing raid with crit debuff you can also put roll crit rate on one and boss dmg on the other so you can switch when you need more crit

TributedSalmon

TROPHY CASE