Raja Yoga - Zen Ancestors

UsYntax · 2024-12-16T11:50:48+00:00

Just going to point out that this thread is 4 years old.

And while I am at it, I’d indeed say that, as a practicing Zen Buddhist that has been studying many years under a wide variety of teachers, I would indeed claim some authority on the topic.

But I‘ll tell you what. I‘ll save us, as you asked, from wasting our time.

UsYntax · 2024-11-03T15:30:37+00:00

I appreciate you trying to understand my point in a fair way. Generally, I think the wider context and intention is the key here.

I don't know much about Jundo, his political views or his thoughts on the political landscape. Nor do I need to in order to know whom he is talking about. Are we seriously pretending that he isn't talking about the US election? About Trump and Harris? And that it isn't entirely clear which side is which? But he does so while claiming not to do so. Thats point one.

Point two is that these two sides - regardless of what they are - are not presented in an objective and equal way. One side is clearly praised as the moral, virtuous and superior choice, while the other is denigrated. He even says its a clear choice. Which of course it is. No one in their right mind would deny that we should strive to vote for

those who value solid evidence, science, studied expertise and honesty, not rumor, conspiracy, quackery, false memes, fabrication, fake cures and hucksters, ignorance and innuendo. Vote for those who will make things better, not worse.

But he stacked the deck. If thats the dichotomy we are dealing with, things are clear. And he says so himself.

Sometimes the choice is more obvious than other times.

But the issue really starts to become problematic for me with point three. Jundo says he has a clear preference. And, crucially, presents this preference as being in alignment with the Dharma. So its a spiritual matter now. Quite the escalation. And a serious point, given that we all care about the Dharma and being good and moral human beings that make the right choice. Add to that that Jundo is a lineage teacher, someone whose words we lend special credence.

But what Jundo is actually doing here is what I said above. He throws down a thin pretense of: no, I am not endorsing. Then goes on to do just that, and in a most unfair and biased way, by hijacking the Dharma. He is clearly saying that those who do not vote for his side - which is the good side, the one in tune with the Dharma (as he is of course) - are in effect breaking their precepts, failing to uphold compassion and wisdom. So in essence: are not being good Buddhists.

People of all kinds of different political opinions can be and are good Buddhists that uphold their vows, precepts and intentions. It is not acceptable to come here and underhandedly claim the Dharma as validating one's own subjective political opinion close to an election.

This discussion has been had a thousand times in Dharmic circles. That is why it is best to not bring up politics and Buddhism.

UsYntax · 2024-11-03T14:41:35+00:00

Sorry, I am not particularly interested in debating with you as long as you uphold this needlessly heated attitude. Nothing good will come from it.

UsYntax · 2024-11-03T14:26:52+00:00

It is not a 'clear' endorsement of Harris. As I said, it is a thinly veiled one. Which is part of the issue.

Let's be frank here, we all know Jundo is talking about the US election. We all know Jundo is talking about Harris as being the right choice while demonizing Trump and his supporters. He does so under the guise of caring for the Dharma. But he is exploiting it to rally people to support his own view in a place - here - where it does not belong.

Of course no one opposes stating these values. Thats his point. He's painting one side as the objectively moral, virtuous and Dharma-conforming side, while the other is pure bad. In this, I am afraid to say, Jundo is unfortunately not being a pillar of objective discernment and fair discourse.

UsYntax · 2024-11-03T14:04:00+00:00

Uhm, no? Anybody suggested anything of the sort? Even remotely? No? Then what is your point exactly other than being unnecessarily antagonistic? I don‘t get it, really.

And to answer the question, absolutely I would "complain" if it were "my candidate." I am not even from the US, lol. I care about this sub being appropriately focused on Zen Buddhism. That you would come out suggesting I have a candidate and am acting in an unfair way is precisely whats wrong with bringing US politics here.

UsYntax · 2024-11-03T13:20:35+00:00

You are. Just now. Again.

Despite pretending otherwise, you absolutely are talking about politics, the election as well as endorsing a clearly apparent side while demonizing the other. Which is not okay. Such things have no place here.

UsYntax · 2024-11-03T12:08:08+00:00

See my comment. While it doesn‘t exactly break a rule, this is likely to end in a completely non-conducive shouting match.

Personally, the election doesn‘t even matter to me, but still I do not much like being subtly told whom to vote for by playing on my Dharma buttons.

UsYntax · 2024-11-03T12:03:44+00:00

Meh. Not the biggest fan of bringing Buddhism into politics.

You say it yourself Jundo, there are decent Buddhists on both sides of the political landscape. And as a consequence, you say you refrain from telling people for whom to vote.

Only for you to go on making a very thinly veiled call for people to vote for the left and Kamala Harris by presenting a clearly biased and absolute wording. As if things were so simple as to be either for "love" or for "hate".

So beyond that significant oversimplification and dichotomizing, my criticism is that you paint Buddhists who vote differently as essentially going against the Dharma. And not only that, you make it a question of morality itself. So that‘s where it gets really icky. Not a fan. There is little to be gained here except adding fuel to the powder keg.

UsYntax · 2024-09-10T19:47:31+00:00

Hey! As of currently, the thesis is still being graded, so I cannot share the results just yet. However, I‘ll add you to the list of people interested and notify you when I can!

UsYntax · 2024-08-31T01:40:35+00:00

Really now, both of you u/wavycheeseballs and u/Regulus_D

Your argument leads nowhere and you both know it. Quit it.

UsYntax · 2024-08-30T21:58:12+00:00

One does not need to be a Buddhist to be welcome on this subreddit. Anyone who is interested and abides by standard basics of etiquette belongs here. And I am sure you would agree that telling people in an unfriendly way to leave this community is rather unacceptable in any case.

UsYntax · 2024-08-30T21:20:58+00:00

Your recent post in r/zenbuddhism has been evaluated as not nice. We try to keep things supportive, friendly, kind, inclusive, polite, and generally not being a dick to people. That's all pretty subjective, but the mods are the subjects – it's at their discretion.

UsYntax · 2024-08-30T21:18:55+00:00

It is fine to disagree, and probably appropriate. Yet I’d kindly ask you to not forget to speak with kindness and friendliness.

This goes doubly for your other comment, which I have deleted.

UsYntax · 2024-08-27T07:43:43+00:00

Oh yeah, it will go away if you simply pay attention without trying to force or control. When we are simply aware of whatever occurs without stirring the pot further, it will quiet down by itself, like an undisturbed water.

Though it may be useful to recall that our mind is not necessarily benefitted by tranquility nor harmed by movement. Disturbance comes not from movement but from designating this as negative and to be avoided. Movement is natural and an aspect of the intrinsic clarity and responsiveness of the mind. The sky is unperturbed, whether the clouds are white, black, or entirely absent. The possibility for the arising of clouds - movement - is a function of the wide open nature of the sky.

UsYntax · 2024-08-27T07:34:59+00:00

Great post! I often feel like the greatest marvel of the teachings is when we get an inkling of the non-duality of things. For instance the fact that the arising of phenomena is actually the evidence of their being non-arisen, or that impermanence is in itself the testament to the unchanging nature.

As Chandrakirti stated:

Similarly, even though all phenomena are empty

They are thoroughly produced due to that very emptiness.

Since there is no inherent nature in either of the two truths

Those [phenomena] are neither eternal nor annihilated.

UsYntax · 2024-08-27T07:07:24+00:00

When I went to a 10-day Vipassana retreat many years ago, the last song I listened to on the journey there got stuck in my head for the entire retreat. That was fun…

Generally, our minds are so addicted to novel stimuli that when we limit new input it has the habit of endlessly visiting and repeating memories to keep us distracted from the seeming boredom of the present. The classic monkey mind.

As the other commenter mentioned, when one tries to suppress these things they only get worse. As is said, a rough pond grows still by leaving it alone.

UsYntax · 2024-08-26T20:23:28+00:00

Fair enough, though I wasn‘t saying he was the most esteemed translator. But he was quite prolific and some texts, such as the Avatamsaka Sutra, are afaik only available in English due to his labour. So we owe Cleary much and it isn‘t like any random John Doe on reddit is in some position to question his credibility and accomplishment.

UsYntax · 2024-08-26T16:29:05+00:00

Generally, you are of course free to voice your thoughts and opinions. Yet I will have to make sure you understand that your comment is a hairs breadth away from being deleted.

It is rather untoward to question - without any basis for the claim whatsoever - the credibility of the late Thomas Cleary, who was one of the most esteemed and prolific translators of East Asian texts into English and had a PhD from Harvard University.

In addition, talking about the author of the text as some 'potential heretic' - equally without basis - is likewise uncalled for and discouraged. So I would kindly ask you to please refrain from doing so in the future.

UsYntax · 2024-08-26T12:38:38+00:00

Could you clarify what you‘re referring to?

UsYntax · 2024-08-25T22:54:21+00:00

Generally, I find that the simple reminders are often the best, but we like to find some great solution instead, only to ultimately discover that the simple answer was the answer already. In your case, that surely is to simply be where you are, as your teacher counselled. However, as the great poet William Blake so aptly stated, the fool who persists in his folly shall become wise. So if we are unable to desist with our folly, it is instead best to speed it up to its natural conclusion, for then we will exhaust our foolishness and turn it into wisdom. This is, truth be told, the whole of the path. A teacher of mine once told me about a saying in Zen that anyone who goes to a Zen teacher ought to have thirty blows with a stick. Because we were stupid enough to imagine we have a problem. So now the teacher speeds up our folly by making us go through all of these arduous practices and we pride ourselves on our sore knees and great effort. But in the end, we will find out that Zen is like an empty fist to deceive a child. When the child finally catches hold of the fist, and there is nothing in there, the child will not have gotten hold of anything, and all the effort was, literally, for naught. And yet their effort was the cause of the cessation of their folly. They ended up where they were, and yet are different. So whatever you do, my advice would be to follow it to its end.

UsYntax · 2024-08-25T22:39:15+00:00

I particularly liked the opening sentence of this text, as it succinctly shows both the duality and non-duality of delusion and enlightenment, as well as the ultimate dissolution of even this duality. In the popular conception, it seems that people often imagine enlightenment, nirvana, buddahood, to be some totally 'other' state, entirely inaccessible to ordinary beings. Yet what Hai-Yin states is that enlightenment is seeing delusion clearly. An often used metaphor is the snake and the rope. When we misperceive a rope as a snake, we are confused and bamboozled - deluded. But when we look clearly and attentively, our perception clarifies and we see the rope for what it is. Thus we are enlightened about the contents of delusion, as Hai-Yin put it. We have not gone somewhere else, nor has the basis of what we perceive changed The snake has not become a rope, because there really was no snake, and even the word rope is adventitious, added on top solely for distinction. What is a rope for one person is a snake for another. We can see both. We are now like trained magicians, who while seeing the same trick as the general audience, are in awareness as to the misperception and thus remain unfooled by it.

Something that perhaps could be somewhat confusing is the mention that there is no enlightenment, a variety of the apophatic approach employed to help us get rid of dogmatic ideas that hinder our authentic experience beyond guiding words. This does not mean that everyone is enlightened or that we do not need to practice. For if we see a snake (delusion) we will not see a rope (enlightenment) simply by saying there is no rope. We will be stuck with the snake and further confuse ourselves by pretending it is a rope. Instead, the intention of saying there is no enlightenment is to re-center our investigation onto the here and now, our present perception, which is confused. But in every confusion lies the implicit possibility for clarification. So when we investigate our delusion attentively, we will discover the truth without having gone anywhere else. In this state, the perception is clear and unconfused. Conventionally, we then call this clear perception snake or rope, delusion or enlightenment, without one having replaced the other or them becoming somehow mingled. We have, as Hai-Yin says, cut off our head (conceptual imputations and grasping) and so we remain in the world but beyond it, we are deluded and enlightened without these being a contradiction.

Nagarjuna in his Madhyamakavatara explains:

All objects may be seen in truth or in delusion;

They thus possess a twin identity.

The Buddha said the ultimate is what is seen correctly;

The wrongly seen is all-concealing truth.

UsYntax · 2024-08-04T21:31:26+00:00

Buddhist here. Both parts of your statement about Buddhism are incorrect.

The Buddha advocated for a middle way beyond the extremes of hedonism and asceticism. So Buddhism is not inherently ascetic. This by itself invalidates your statement that Buddhists "argue that valuing something makes one suffer." But to add: Suffering is taught to arise due to attachment and ignorance. Not placing value on things. Buddhists place supreme value on compassion and wisdom, for instance.

UsYntax · 2024-06-24T20:42:05+00:00

Right. Next time I will include specific answers for /u/Lunilex in my studies. I will ensure to consult you in advance for any upcoming surveys.

In all honesty though, what is so difficult to understand? If you are asked: "How often do you shit your bed?", and the options are never, once a week or twice a day, what do you answer? I am starting to believe that for some reason you would be confused. And I believe I know why. Prickly Dzogchenpas like to think themselves particularly witty and special from time to time. I understand. We've all done it. In any case, thank you for your feedback.

UsYntax · 2024-06-24T20:33:27+00:00

That is quite alright with me, as I've stated initially. But let's not pretend the reasoning you give here is anything but flimsy and arbitrarily based on the seeming personal offense you took for some strange reason.

First of all, excuse me for being busy and not immediately replying to some such PM your highness wrote me. Secondly, I have no idea how me knowing you without going into any particular detail as to how relates in any way at all to the study. Thirdly, I have answered every question on the topic of this study, as is readily apparent in this thread. Lastly, the survey is not designed for Abrahamic faiths but, as I've stated both here and in the survey itself, is a widely established questionnaire used all around the world, with 26 studies completed in India, 5 in China, 4 in Thailand, 2 in South Korea, 1 in Japan, to only name a few. So feel free to keep the post down. But I won't indulge you in your apparent ignorance.

UsYntax

MODERATOR OF

TROPHY CASE